Is Cost A Detriment To The Game! Or Is Just The Lack Of Time? * Poll Inside *

[jewofgolf]

If someone really wanted to take this game up and they actually talked to a regular golfer, the cost isn't the issue. You can very easily get started for $300 on equipment and play for $20 a week. People probably spend more than that on beer in a week.

I don't know that time is even an issue, either. I think more than anything golf is hard and the tiger boom era is over...so the people on the edge of being serious about golf are falling away and playing less rounds. Maybe I'm a total die-hard, but I'm playing my weekly round no matter what (and I have 2 little kids). My wife has her free time, and I have mine. Maybe that's unusual...I'm not sure how it works in other families.

[dhogan13]

I played alot when I was in college because we had a uni course with $5 green fees and $10 cart, days in the summer when I wasn't working I would walk 36, then ride 18 to finish the day. now that I'm out of school the cheapest round is 25, which isn't a deal breaker, but its also 5 times more expensive than just walking a course as many times as possible in one day, which is what I was used to. so cost for me is definitely my biggest hindrance right now

EDIT: in reference to the above poster, yes $20 isn't alot, and most of my friends did spend more than that a week on booze in college, but that was the difference maker for people my age, if you wanted to play golf, you had to pinch pennies, and for a sport that requires hard work to be successful its just not that appealing right out the gate for most people.

[enduro]

I guess it depends where you live , but cost is easily the biggest factor in dissuading a lot of people from even trying golf . Most courses start at about $50 weekdays and probably average $75 weekends in my area. $20 gets maybe 2 medium buckets of balls.

Seniors on fixed incomes, young middle class families and students are all being priced out of the game. Pretty much anyone who doesn't have $300-$400 / month disposable income can't afford to golf here.

[Snufles]

[quote name='JJ2210' timestamp='1394246904' post='8823453']
Keep the riff raff out.

Honestly I don't think it's a huge hurdle anymore. Obviously it's not like basketball or soccer, but quality equipment can be had for cheap nowadays. I'd say it's like getting into hockey. Amirite Canada?! God forbid your kid is a goalie...

The biggest commitment is time.
[/quote]

God forbid he is a really good goalie. AAA hockey is ridiculously expensive.

[stage1350]

A lot of the issue here is the supposed need to require the latest, greatest, and most expensive. And the need to keep up with the Joneses.

You can buy last year's Nike Covert Tour with a good shaft on the BST for $175 all day long.
A good set of forged Mizunos with shafts galore for $300.
A used set of conforming Vokeys or Clevelands for $200, premium grinds for $300.

If I wanted to produce a lean bag, I could do so for under $1500 easily including the bag.

Price is dependant on where you want to play. If you want to play Pebble, you are going to pay. But I have a dozen courses that I can get on within an hour's drive for less than $75.

There was a post above where they were looking at an auto, and a phone, and clubs for their child. If you wish to spoil your kids, that is your call. But, you can also teach them the value of that dollar by letting them earn it. I bought my own clubs once I was working and have paid for my own phone since I felt the need to start carrying one.

The time issue is bigger. Again, do you have to do all the things you are trying to squeeze into a 24 hour day? My time on the course is my break from the rest of the world. My phone is turned off or on silent. But I ensure that I have those 5-6 hours free by getting the rest of my work and obligations done so that my golf time is undisturbed.

We have had this discussion before and in most cases, you have people trying to live the filet mignon life on a Big Mac budget.

[martinbns]

For me in my lifetime it's been both.

When my kids were young and I wasn't making much money it was 80% money and 20% time. When I was in my 20's & 30's, I kept my clubs for 10 years average, I played whatever balls I could get for free and didn't become a member anywhere until my company started paying the $600 fee when I was 36. Then I played maybe 15 rounds a year and then pretty much only when I got a coupon.

Late 30's until low 40's, I became better off financially, but my kids were still young and it was less about money and more about time, it just wasn't fair to my wife for me to play 50+ rounds a year while she was at home with the kids.

It all started to change in my mid 40's, my daughter was old enough to stay home by herself, I got my wife to start playing, we were doing well financially, bingo 60 rounds a year.

The last few years, I have been promoted a couple of times, money really doesn't matter to my choices on golf anymore but it's hard to find the time to play except in weekends, my round count has declined to say 45-50 max.

It's all about priorities, it's hard to be a mono-hobbiest (great new word). I hunted hard in the fall from the late 90's until a few years ago and I have lost interest to some degree, golf got bigger, now I am living in Atlantic salmon country and I am feeling a new obsession of flyfishing coming on, so who knows in the future.

[Justmuckit]

[quote name='DirecTVTechGuy' timestamp='1394248529' post='8823615']
[quote name='MtlJeff' timestamp='1394247827' post='8823531']
[quote name='DirecTVTechGuy' timestamp='1394247565' post='8823511']
[quote name='MtlJeff' timestamp='1394247041' post='8823467']
I've said this before but i don't think golf needs to worry about being the "popular" sport

It's the same thing as business, there are many successful businesses out there that don't do 10B in sales. You can do 30M and be very profitable, have less employees, and make a ton of money. Just like conversely you can do 10B in sales and have hardly any profit

Golf is more expensive then say, basketball. Or Soccer....but who cares? Less golfers isn't bad. The golf market will adjust to the amount of golfers there is. Some courses will close, and condos will be built...but other ones will remain and we'll be able to play

My wife is a horseback rider and competes in the hunter. They aren't worried about "growing the game". If you can't afford it, there are plenty of other sports to play. Golf is the same. There are enough people that play. I think 25M or so in the US....so it can't be that bad
[/quote]

But if it becomes less and less popular... Won't that give us less and more expensive options?

Thanks for participating man... I appreciate it!
[/quote]

I don't think so, if there's too many golfers and courses gouge people, new courses will be built. There's no golf monopoly so the laws of supply and demand should hold true. Right now golf is cheap because golf overexpanded and the bubble done popped. Golf may get more expensive when some courses shut down, but not much more expensive. If that's what happens i buy the 17$ wines instead of the 25$ ones, and i'm set
[/quote]

Good point... That's also my point.. If it declines... Some people may decide that 25$ tastes that much better than 17$... Not a lot... But a few...

Here's the deal where I'm at.... Peak Season... Saturday morning... You CANT spend more than 60.00 for a round of golf.... There isn't a course within local distance than even charges that much...

Banbury Golf Course... In Eagle, ID... Is about the most costly place around here.... And you can ride it on Sat/Sun for about 60.00 bucks.

Crazy!
[/quote]

I'd like to be where you are then.

The decent courses in my area are charging upwards of $55 - and those are "winter rates". The zoyzia fairways are still dormant, and it's going to be 43 degrees today. By the end of this month, those rates will jump to $70+, and the course will still be in winter condition.

If it wasn't for GolfNow and their HotRate times, my playing partner and I would rarely get to play.

[Matty T]

I voted both, but right now time is my biggest problem. Or I should say it is a problem for my wife. Every time I play (and I mean without fail) I get a phone call somewhere around the 13th or 14th hole. after that the game goes in the crapper. because I know she is being driven crazy by our 3yr old daughter and our 6mo old son. I even asked her the other day to please not call me and ask what hole I'm on (I took the kids 2 days in a row all day so she could have time to herself) and she still couldn't resist. blows my mind
I think part of the problem is my wife doesn't have a go to hobby or something to do when she has time. she watches tv, has a friend over or shops "because it was on sale"

[resnor]

When I was single, I played golf 3-5 times a week, driving range almost every day, money was no issue. Now, married, two kids, college loans, car payment, mortgage, and other bills, money is definitely an issue. The cheapest "decent" course to me is $45 for 18 during the week. Of course, this is New Hampshire. There's a course down the street from me, Owl's Nest, that is really nice, and is like $85 weekend, with mandatory cart. Played a course in little Pickens, SC a couple years ago, and they were $25 for 18, with a cart, on a Saturday...and that course was every bit as nice as Owl's Nest. People that live where you can golf year round don't get the price disparity, I don't think.

[SoCalTitleist]

These days people have multiple hobbies that are expensive you just have to pick and choose what means more.

[CommerceTiger]

Yeah I live in Georgia and I can golf year around for less than 20 bucks any day if the week. Definitely helps!

[Sean2]

I don't think so. I live in a middle class town on the ocean. I can't believe how many people have boats. When you factor the cost of the boat, a slip, storage in the winter, the club (if you belong to one), that can't be cheap. Plus, going out in the summer, maintenance, gas, etc.

[mikeharris23]

I think it is a HUGE factor in the amount of new people that play the game.

As a younger kid you have to dedicate lots of time and your parents money to get into the game of golf, where as other sports (soccer, basketball, football, baseball) you grab the required ball and can go play in a backyard or park anywhere.

Golf is never going to compete with the big 4 sports in US, but there needs to be a way to appeal to the younger community to get them started in the game.

[sbjinx]

For me it's the time. Now that I found a buddy to play with first tee time in the am, I'm playing more golf than ever. Most people I talk to its the time. Is it expensive, yes but so are most other hobbies but time is what makes it hard for people to play regularly, especially if you are the weekend type.

[OUZO Power]

[quote name='Matty T' timestamp='1394293749' post='8825955']
I voted both, but right now time is my biggest problem. Or I should say it is a problem for my wife. Every time I play (and I mean without fail) I get a phone call somewhere around the 13th or 14th hole. after that the game goes in the crapper. because I know she is being driven crazy by our 3yr old daughter and our 6mo old son. I even asked her the other day to please not call me and ask what hole I'm on (I took the kids 2 days in a row all day so she could have time to herself) and she still couldn't resist. blows my mind
I think part of the problem is my wife doesn't have a go to hobby or something to do when she has time. she watches tv, has a friend over or shops "because it was on sale"
[/quote]dude that's exactly what I'm dealing with. But with 4 boys under 5 I can't really complain about her calling.

[Skyjunky]

I vote cost. Specifically the recurring costs. Upfront cost for equipment is manageable. Some of the public course green fees can be stout, not even talking about private. It can be difficult to justify the weekly expense on just yourself over the family.

[richard t]

I seriously read all these posts. I'm 67 years old. Started playing when I was 12. ( Had lessons from a wonderful uncle who paid for them). Had hand me down clubs. WTF did I know or better yet care. You know, hit it, go get it, hit it again... Today I'm semi-retired and I belong to a semi-private club. Four 9 hole courses, each different. Another luxury is I can play Monday-Thursday and do not have to put up with the 'posers' ( no one in the short grass from back tees) on the weekends or go after 3/4 PM.
I have the clubs I need/want and play with the folks I want.
Not always so. For 30+ years I was coaching/teaching, raising a son, and making the wonderful person who put up with me happy.
For most of that time I had a set of Hogan Apex and a set of Eye2 irons, couple good drivers and an old 8802 putter. ( Thrift, my friends, saved every nickle I could). Truth is I was as happy with those clubs as I am with the ones I have today, relatively speaking. Green fees at the Muni were OK too. Plus I had summers (DST) when the wife got home.
I am not an elitist, far from it, but I think if you love the game, enjoy the friendship it offers and REALLY want to play golf, not just acquire clubs and play only at high end course you can make it work.
Just my $0.02 worth.

[Matty T]

[quote name='OUZO Power' timestamp='1394309317' post='8827369']
[quote name='Matty T' timestamp='1394293749' post='8825955']
I voted both, but right now time is my biggest problem. Or I should say it is a problem for my wife. Every time I play (and I mean without fail) I get a phone call somewhere around the 13th or 14th hole. after that the game goes in the crapper. because I know she is being driven crazy by our 3yr old daughter and our 6mo old son. I even asked her the other day to please not call me and ask what hole I'm on (I took the kids 2 days in a row all day so she could have time to herself) and she still couldn't resist. blows my mind
I think part of the problem is my wife doesn't have a go to hobby or something to do when she has time. she watches tv, has a friend over or shops "because it was on sale"
[/quote]dude that's exactly what I'm dealing with. But with 4 boys under 5 I can't really complain about her calling.
[/quote]

I know what you mean. But we have to dream of the day! right? haha

[SatelliteGuy]

Great input so far Fellas!

[farmer]

I have cousins who live in major urban areas, and for them, it is the time. One of those cousins, however, had two kids who were doing every single activity you can think of. So, his weekends were scheduled to such an extent that he had no time for himself. His kids are grown, but he just has no interest anymore. My other urban cousin tells me that it takes about an hour to get to a course, get fees paid, a little warm up, then 4-5 hours to play, a little time for a beer after the round, 30-40 minutes to get home. Our kids are grown, it takes about 10 minutes to get to the course, and it is so cheap it's like stealing. Where I live, roping is a big deal, and it's like Jeff described. Insanely expensive, you can easily spend 100K just to get a good start. Not a good pro start, just a good jackpot start.

[arnold palmtree]

[quote name='resnor' timestamp='1394297428' post='8826273']
When I was single, I played golf 3-5 times a week, driving range almost every day, money was no issue. Now, married, two kids, college loans, car payment, mortgage, and other bills, money is definitely an issue. The cheapest "decent" course to me is $45 for 18 during the week. Of course, this is New Hampshire. There's a course down the street from me, Owl's Nest, that is really nice, and is like $85 weekend, with mandatory cart. Played a course in little Pickens, SC a couple years ago, and they were $25 for 18, with a cart, on a Saturday...and that course was every bit as nice as Owl's Nest. People that live where you can golf year round don't get the price disparity, I don't think.
[/quote]

Yeah. I can walk 18 for $13 and ride for $23 on the course I play most. I play another course for a Sunday game every other week for $20 for riding, and it's only been $15 over the winter. I don't think I would justify playing as much as I do if I was paying $45 a round.

Playing less would definitely hurt my interest in the sport.

[PeanutsDaddy]

I think cost and time are issues for the masses. As much as I'd like to see the game grow I think these two factors will continue to limit participation. I think 'time for 9" campaigns are a step in the right direction.

I'm blessed to have a well paying career that affords me the time to play, reasonable course fees ($25 - $45 range), and a supportive spouse. I just wish Mother Nature would cooperate.

[PlatinumNike]

Time for me, need more time! DS helps

I've been getting my goods on Ebay for the past 10 years so cost is not too bad

Not everyone needs to play with $1000 + Miura irons ect.

[The Pearl]

Women and kids have killed more golf games than time and cash, by a very wide margin.

[nickb98]

[quote name='DirecTVTechGuy' timestamp='1394246508' post='8823409']
[quote name='Petethreeput' timestamp='1394246224' post='8823381']
The price of golf is cheaper now than it has ever been.

On the other hand, people are by and large poorer than they were.

So the cost is prohibitive. But is it expensive? I don't think so.

That is my opinion anyway.
[/quote]

Pushing 300.00 for Shoes... 500.00 for a Driver... 1100.00 for a set of irons...

Not sure I can agree it's cheaper now....

And I realize buying used saves money..,

But imagine someone who knows nothing.... Says to himself... " Let's hit GG and take up a new hobby "

Good god he could be a few thousand deep before ever having struck a ball...

That's my basis for my opinion...
Thanks for participating man! Appreciate the input!
[/quote]OK, tell me when you paid $300 for shoes. When did the majority of even the newest drivers become $500. Finally, you can pay $1100 for an iron set, but the vast majority is less than that. And you could honestly make yourself a very nice set of used, older generation of clubs for between $300 and $500 dollars...

[SatelliteGuy]

[quote name='nickb98' timestamp='1394409481' post='8835397']
[quote name='DirecTVTechGuy' timestamp='1394246508' post='8823409']
[quote name='Petethreeput' timestamp='1394246224' post='8823381']
The price of golf is cheaper now than it has ever been.

On the other hand, people are by and large poorer than they were.

So the cost is prohibitive. But is it expensive? I don't think so.

That is my opinion anyway.
[/quote]

Pushing 300.00 for Shoes... 500.00 for a Driver... 1100.00 for a set of irons...

Not sure I can agree it's cheaper now....

And I realize buying used saves money..,

But imagine someone who knows nothing.... Says to himself... " Let's hit GG and take up a new hobby "

Good god he could be a few thousand deep before ever having struck a ball...

That's my basis for my opinion...
Thanks for participating man! Appreciate the input!
[/quote]OK, tell me when you paid $300 for shoes. When did the majority of even the newest drivers become $500. Finally, you can pay $1100 for an iron set, but the vast majority is less than that. And you could honestly make yourself a very nice set of used, older generation of clubs for between $300 and $500 dollars...
[/quote]

The newest stuff to hit shelves in the driver department are 400-500.... The newest shoes are 200-300... The newest iron sets are around 1,000

As I said before... I realize it's cheaper than that if your bargain shopping.... Buying used.... Etc, etc...

But as companies initial price points rise, so will the cost of used and bargain equipment...

It's just one example...

But think of it like this...

Johnny Shopper works are ABC Corporation..... He's new... Wants to start his climb up the Corporate Ladder... Notices the Office " Weekly "...

Everyone who's anyone gets together twice a month for a semi competitive round of golf and socializing...

He's in Dicks with his Wife because she needs a higher strength resistance band for the zoomba classes she's taking...

He wanders over to Golf...

Big Bertha Driver - 400.00
Taylormade Stage 2 (3)(5) Fairways - 250.00 for both... ( of course they are on sale! )
Taylormade SpeedBladez - 800.00
Cleveland Wedges x 2 - 130.00 a piece or 260.00
Odyssey putter - 350.00
Bag - 200.00
Shoes - 100.00
Balls - 30.00
Clothes - 100.00

Now... Can Johnny Shopper find better deals.... Can he go for the Adams Box Set for 699.99.... Of course he can..

My opinion is just that Golf is declining in participation numbers.... And costs are increasing...

Increased Costs do nothing to attract new players to the game!

Thanks for participating man! I agree it can be had for cheaper but that really wasn't what I was attempting to drive home!

Awesome Stuff!

[Maksimus]

This is good stuff!

For me, it's money. Not money to spend on clubs because, well, I rarely buy anything unless it's on sale (thanks to my mother on that one). But, it is the greens fees. Courses around me typically charge $45 for 18 and a cart on the weekends. Even my local course on weekdays is $20 for 18 and a cart. I like to get out and play as often as I can and that's usually around 2-3 times a week. Twice a month on weekends when friends have time. So that's $150-ish a week. Give or take.

That's a lot of money when you're trying make ends meet and save for a wedding or a new car or pay down debt. Which I feel is most of America at this point. So that's where the conflict lies in a lot of peoples lives. I mean, you have to spend the money to get the clubs, and then spend more money just to use the things and in some parts of the country, it's a lot of money for what could, potentially, be a very frustrating 6 hours on a nice Saturday afternoon.

Which is where the downwards spiral starts. After that, it's lessons because people don't like being frustrated when the game is supposed to be enjoyable. So there's even more money and at this point time becomes a factor.

To me, it's pretty clear why the game isn't growing right now. It's just not justifiable for people when you add it all up. Which is sad considering how awesome this game is and can be. But it's not instant gratification so no one wants any part of it.

That's how I see it.

[stage1350]

I didn't even pay $300 for FootJoy Classics.

To pay more than $150 for a plastic molded sole shoe is criminal.

[enduro]

With the glut of used equipment out there, the initial costs of starting golf isn't much of a factor for anyone that truly wants to golf. I could put together a great set of clubs for less than 2 or 3 rounds of weekend golf would cost.

Play a weekend round in my area, its rare that there will be anyone under 30 in your foursome. Most of the membership at the private clubs are 50+ years old. The only young people you'll see are juniors in heavily subsidized programs, most of whom stop playing when they have to pay full rate.

I'm sure for many here on Golfrwrx, time might be the biggest detriment to playing. But for most , cost is the biggest factor. If rates were $25 and I'd bet the golfing demographic would be entirely different.

[SatelliteGuy]

[quote name='stage1350' timestamp='1394469626' post='8840155']
I didn't even pay $300 for FootJoy Classics.

To pay more than $150 for a plastic molded sole shoe is criminal.
[/quote]

I don't buy any model shoe until after the next version.... I might spend 80/90...

I want a pair of Claytons.... Bad....

Next year I'll get a pair.