Monte's No-Turn > Cast Drill...

[FredPo]

[quote name='MonteScheinblum' timestamp='1436110178' post='11890802']It doesn't work as well for most. Let the feel filter up.[/quote]

Understood. Thank you

[oldschoolrocker]

Thanks for putting this is the forefront. Turned my "bulb" on again. How we forget over time and slip into our old habits.

[FatReed]

The more I see EA Tischler instructional videos, the more I like him.

Anyway, came across what I believe is a relatively recent video I thought was relevant and well done. Specifically, as I interpret Monte's 'cast' portion of the drill, he is getting to the point that - if done properly - one cannot 'release' the club too early.

I think EA does a great job of giving Monte's cast concept some complimentary structure - in fact, what Monte describes as 'cast' is actually 'release.' The attempt to cast is effectively descriptive, nonetheless, there must still be structure to the process.

As EA describes quite well, the release must be directed 'on plane,' which is quite easy to visualize through his demonstration. Under plane and over plane clearly non-effective.

Do not underestimate the role of the pivot in this process.

http://youtu.be/RggLEzq0PWg

[Hawkeye77]

[quote name='FatReed' timestamp='1442261004' post='12312828']
The more I see EA Tischler instructional videos, the more I like him.

Anyway, came across what I believe is a relatively recent video I thought was relevant and well done. Specifically, as I interpret Monte's 'cast' portion of the drill, he is getting to the point that - if done properly - one cannot 'release' the club too early.

I think EA does a great job of giving Monte's cast concept some complimentary structure - in fact, what Monte describes as 'cast' is actually 'release.' The attempt to cast is effectively descriptive, nonetheless, there must still be structure to the process.

As EA describes quite well, the release must be directed 'on plane,' which is quite easy to visualize through his demonstration. Under plane and over plane clearly non-effective.

Do not underestimate the role of the pivot in this process.

http://youtu.be/RggLEzq0PWg
[/quote]

I'd have to disagree. His convoluted explanation, stop short casting motion then talking separately about then thinking about turning seems the polar opposite in approach of the fairly simple concept in the No Turn/Cast drill. It's all a personal reaction and this guy may speak a lot of folks' language but he had my head hurting a little.

In Monte's drill, the pivot is the reaction to the arms speeding up, not a separate "thought number two" as this guy describes (and he isn't trying to get the arms to speed up, he wants the swoosh at the top then turn without really explaining why or how those combat a pivot stall or anything else, for example). It's more a demonstration of his interpretation of what Nicklaus said than a recipe or drill for getting us average guys to stop casting.

I'd suggest Monte's plane and release by feel or other vids on release (there are some more recent) would be excellent complements to the drill this thread is about.

[Cwing]

Great drill but it scares me a touch. I'm concerned I'll overdue it or mess something up.

[slantsflood]

Damm! He has some serious power behind that ball. That looks like a very different kind of swing. A lot of different ways to skin a cat.

[Beastmode Broker]

THANK you to whoever bumped this thread
I have been really struggling w some consistent ball striking this year
I watched this video, took it to the range and IMMEDIATELY noticed a difference

im a 2 ish index and ball striking is my weakness
I have a short game that keeps my scores relatively low
Really hoping I can bring this to the course and start seeing some scores under par more often

and of course, THANK YOU Monte for this video - my game thanks you

[Triple Putt]

I've really been working on setting the wrist early because I have a tendency to take it inside instantly from my take away. I'll try the casting on the downswing and maybe that will help. I freaking hate pulling shots!!! I would rather push one right all day long.

[rainkingjr]

Monte's no turn cast drill and the EA Tischler drive home the same point for me. I also remember hearing Monte quote Dan Carraher (iTeach) as saying something to the effect of he tries to get a student to speed up the things that are too slow rather than slow down things that are too fast. That though in and of itself is brilliant.

I've never been one to consciously try to hold lag;however, it seems that is exactly what's been wrong with my swing. I play with a really strong grip and always felt like if I just let things go freely it would be hook city. Today, I had one of those Aha moments that I'm going to hold onto forever. Frustrated as ever with my inconsistencies, I remembered reading this thread last night and seeing the Tischler video included. The things that stood out to me was him referencing Jack and Hogan saying they felt like they couldn't release the club too early. I said the heck with. Take a back swing and just let it go from the top as soon as possible. All I can say is that the results were unreal. No steering the club. No feeling like the body needed to slow down for the arms to catch up. The best part was no crazy hooks even with the strong grip. Baby draws were the norm. The best part is after today, I'm done with chasing positions. It doesn't have to look pretty. It just has to work. Great stuff Monte, EA, and Dan. Choose you poison guys, but please stop arguing over to-may-to vs to-mah-to. Nonsense.

[MooreMikeA]

Has anyone worked on the drill for awhile and start to hit push fades? I have been working on the no turn cast drill and at the same time working on not getting the club as much behind me on the backswing. Early on the results were amazing but as time goes on my miss starts right and then keep going right.

My hips tend to fire fast and spin out. Could my old habits be taking over and my hips are outrunning my hands and arms or am I over cooking the drill and my hands are arms are getting ahead of my hip turn?

[Millbrook]

I'd say old habits kicking in. I get the same push when my hips get too far ahead instead of getting secondary tilt. The arms are left behind and I come into the ball with the face open.

Check out the Mike Malasky - getting the hands in front of you - thread.

[FatReed]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h_DVuuStY3Q

[MooreMikeA]

Thanks for the posts. I hit some shots yesterday working on Monte's zipper away drill and Mike's pushing away from the ball feel and the push fade went away.

[Triple Putt]

[quote name='MooreMikeA' timestamp='1442847464' post='12344060']Has anyone worked on the drill for awhile and start to hit push fades? I have been working on the no turn cast drill and at the same time working on not getting the club as much behind me on the backswing. Early on the results were amazing but as time goes on my miss starts right and then keep going right.

My hips tend to fire fast and spin out. Could my old habits be taking over and my hips are outrunning my hands and arms or am I over cooking the drill and my hands are arms are getting ahead of my hip turn?[/quote]

I had the same result. I think I tend to fire my hips early and cause the club to lag and come from the inside and leaves the club face open. I'll take a push fade over a duck hook any day lol.

[Mr Robot]

I started using this drill to correct for a swing that was too flat, with my hands and the club way behind me on both backswing and downswing. It's working wonders with my irons and even my fairway woods. I'm literally hitting every iron/wedge 10-20 yards farther, which has kinda blown my mind. But my driver is still a mess with two-way misses. I know Monte has said that this isn't really meant for the driver, and to let the feel filter up to that club, but is there anything anyone knows that's more concrete than that? Like this same philosophy but maybe with a twist? Or just anything in general to correct for an overly flat/laid off swing, with the driver specifically? Open to anything at this point.

[SirJoseppi]

Hi guys....New on here. I'm a fairly new golfer, and recently discovered Monte's no turn/cast drill.

 

The no turn part I get and makes perfect sense to keep the backswing on the correct plane.

 

The cast part is not working for me however...when I attempt to do so, I usually shank the ball (topping it more often than not).

 

So I have some questions on this to make sure I am doing the drill correctly...

 

1). Should the cast feel begin your downswing?

 

2). If not, where should the cast feel take place?

 

3). The casting should just be the left wrist bending back, and the right wrist flattening (for a right handed golfer), correct?

 

Any other tips or suggestions for executing this correctly? Sorry no swing video...I will try to upload one this week.

 

Any input greatly appreciated!

[golfing_penguin]

Hi guys....New on here. I'm a fairly new golfer, and recently discovered Monte's no turn/cast drill.

 

The no turn part I get and makes perfect sense to keep the backswing on the correct plane.

 

The cast part is not working for me however...when I attempt to do so, I usually shank the ball (topping it more often than not).

 

So I have some questions on this to make sure I am doing the drill correctly...

 

1). Should the cast feel begin your downswing?

 

2). If not, where should the cast feel take place?

 

3). The casting should just be the left wrist bending back, and the right wrist flattening (for a right handed golfer), correct?

 

Any other tips or suggestions for executing this correctly? Sorry no swing video...I will try to upload one this week.

 

Any input greatly appreciated!

 

Welcome aboard! What might help is to imagine you´re going fishing - The right arm draws the rod back over the shoulder, ready to cast forward. Well, from there you don´t simply throw the wrists at it or the line won´t go anywhere. The cast is a tiny elbow move forward, then the forearm goes, then the wrist. Its that elbow move that´s wanted.

 

So a follow on with that is to take a lofted wedge and hit one-armed shots with your right hand. Put your left hand to your right arm for moral support, and imagine the club is a fishing rod - right hand takes it away wide, and then you ´cast´ into the back of the ball

[Your-away!]

for me this simple drill changed my game, i hear about stuff like this all the time and think to myself yeah whatever, but this really worked, so well i find it hard to fathom!

 

I always think to myself what Ben Hogan said about doing the opposite of what you think, i struggled from early releasing and casting, so what do i do, i purposely cast the club! and the fact it works so well still baffles me, but it really does, and the harder/faster i try to cast on purpose the better the strike, well with me anyway.

 

To the poster above this one who is struggling with shanks when doing this, i started doing this for 1 range session and was baffled, simple cure, for me, was flattening my left wrist and feeling like the top part of my right arm stays connected to my side, sounds more complicated than it is.

[SirJoseppi]

Hi guys....New on here. I'm a fairly new golfer, and recently discovered Monte's no turn/cast drill.

 

The no turn part I get and makes perfect sense to keep the backswing on the correct plane.

 

The cast part is not working for me however...when I attempt to do so, I usually shank the ball (topping it more often than not).

 

So I have some questions on this to make sure I am doing the drill correctly...

 

1). Should the cast feel begin your downswing?

 

2). If not, where should the cast feel take place?

 

3). The casting should just be the left wrist bending back, and the right wrist flattening (for a right handed golfer), correct?

 

Any other tips or suggestions for executing this correctly? Sorry no swing video...I will try to upload one this week.

 

Any input greatly appreciated!

 

Welcome aboard! What might help is to imagine you´re going fishing - The right arm draws the rod back over the shoulder, ready to cast forward. Well, from there you don´t simply throw the wrists at it or the line won´t go anywhere. The cast is a tiny elbow move forward, then the forearm goes, then the wrist. Its that elbow move that´s wanted.

 

So a follow on with that is to take a lofted wedge and hit one-armed shots with your right hand. Put your left hand to your right arm for moral support, and imagine the club is a fishing rod - right hand takes it away wide, and then you ´cast´ into the back of the ball

Many thanks for the feedback. That clarifies a lot! So by a move of the elbow forward, you mean towards the ball right? Thanks again.

[golfing_penguin]

Hi guys....New on here. I'm a fairly new golfer, and recently discovered Monte's no turn/cast drill.

 

The no turn part I get and makes perfect sense to keep the backswing on the correct plane.

 

The cast part is not working for me however...when I attempt to do so, I usually shank the ball (topping it more often than not).

 

So I have some questions on this to make sure I am doing the drill correctly...

 

1). Should the cast feel begin your downswing?

 

2). If not, where should the cast feel take place?

 

3). The casting should just be the left wrist bending back, and the right wrist flattening (for a right handed golfer), correct?

 

Any other tips or suggestions for executing this correctly? Sorry no swing video...I will try to upload one this week.

 

Any input greatly appreciated!

 

Welcome aboard! What might help is to imagine you´re going fishing - The right arm draws the rod back over the shoulder, ready to cast forward. Well, from there you don´t simply throw the wrists at it or the line won´t go anywhere. The cast is a tiny elbow move forward, then the forearm goes, then the wrist. Its that elbow move that´s wanted.

 

So a follow on with that is to take a lofted wedge and hit one-armed shots with your right hand. Put your left hand to your right arm for moral support, and imagine the club is a fishing rod - right hand takes it away wide, and then you ´cast´ into the back of the ball

Many thanks for the feedback. That clarifies a lot! So by a move of the elbow forward, you mean towards the ball right? Thanks again.

 

You´re welcome! Belly button would be a bit closer to home

[WILDTHING]

Strange but this is exactly what Tom Tomasello and Peter Croker advocated many years ago. See Tom's earlier videos where he demonstrates an early wrist set , the right arm cocking while extensor action keeps the inert left arm straight. As the left arm is lifted into the backswing , the body turns in reaction.

 

From the end of the early downswing, he then mentions swinging 'down and out' on the inclined plane like a karate chop with the right hand into the ball . It's all summarised quite well in his later 2 videos below.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DJWellhmAuA

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y8RtxlDVK3I

[slantsflood]

I don't know wildthing, I think they feel very different. Monte's videos seem very balanced, make things match, speed up what's slow. I'm not trying to speak for Monte, but I would guess if someone's left side is very dormant, the video would be backhand tennis feels or intents.

 

A lot of right sided throwing, hitting styles seem left arm rope/noodle/along for the ride.

 

Monte has a lot of left arm and shoulder content that doesn't feel like croker, blake or tomasello would acknowledge.

 

 

 

[WILDTHING]

I don't know wildthing, I think they feel very different. Monte's videos seem very balanced, make things match, speed up what's slow. I'm not trying to speak for Monte, but I would guess if someone's left side is very dormant, the video would be backhand tennis feels or intents.

 

A lot of right sided throwing, hitting styles seem left arm rope/noodle/along for the ride.

 

Monte has a lot of left arm and shoulder content that doesn't feel like croker, blake or tomasello would acknowledge.

 

Yes , I think there isn't such a thing as an inert left arm (or for that matter, left arm dominant and right arm going for a ride) type golf swing. They are both used to some extent and some people work better with different feels like you've mentioned.

[slantsflood]

Well said. Agreed wildthing

[lunkerking]

Shot my best round ever two years ago using this. I don't know why I ever got away from it. It works and I'm no longer snap hooking or push fades. Hitting bullets now.

[mrbojanglezs]

Is this drill appropriate for someone who has 110 mph driver speed hits it well but misses with push rights or overdraws because of quick hips on the downswing and/or too much hand in the release

[bph7]

Is this drill appropriate for someone who has 110 mph driver speed hits it well but misses with push rights or overdraws because of quick hips on the downswing and/or too much hand in the release

 

Sure, give it a try, I bet it would help get your arms more in front of you.

[Oldnavycdr]

Thanks for reposting this drill. I had gotten away from it but I'm ba-a-a-a-ck and it is awesome! Thank you Monte!

[Cwing]

Drill works for me. Sometimes I hook. I'm guessing me body stalls and my cast turns into a flip but I'm not sure.

[Boomer3]

This drill sounds similar to the MDLT philosophy, at least from what I've read in that thread.

 

I took a lesson today and got some similar advice, really just focusing on throwing the club head, and amazingly I got some shaft lean on a few.