What is the slope of a typical PGA tour event course?

[Benzo]

Obviously, they are set up harder for the tour then when its just members (IE turning par 5's to 4's and such)

 

but what would you say is the average slope week to week?

 

140+?

[dunn]

Good question....Curious myself

[MountainKing]

I would probably guessed they're maxed out to 155 on most occasions. I think slope takes in account the tees so assuming the golfer is playing from the same tees the pros use that would be a pretty rough setup for an average golfer.

[MountainKing]

So I took a quick look at this last weekends course for the Travelers which is one of the easier courses on tour under normal conditions it has a slope of 131 - so I'm probably incorrect in assuming they're all at max, this one would probably fall at 140+ under tournament conditions if they were to measure that. So I'd bet most would probably get up close to the max if they were to measure it. I think the problem is the slope is partly based off of a bogey golfer and no bogey golfer would play a course at 7200-7300 yards.

[hbear]

Course rating would be more relevant....as mentioned slope is more geared to the bogey golfer while course rating is more of the indicator for the scratch player.

[Jasonic]

[quote name='MountainKing' timestamp='1435599783' post='11855922']
So I took a quick look at this last weekends course for the Travelers which is one of the easier courses on tour under normal conditions it has a slope of 131 - so I'm probably incorrect in assuming they're all at max, this one would probably fall at 140+ under tournament conditions if they were to measure that. So I'd bet most would probably get up close to the max if they were to measure it. I think the problem is the slope is partly based off of a bogey golfer and no bogey golfer would play a course at 7200-7300 yards.
[/quote]

You are quite wrong about no bogey golfer playing from the tips!!

[HoffTTM]

[quote name='Jasonic' timestamp='1435636538' post='11860134']
[quote name='MountainKing' timestamp='1435599783' post='11855922']
So I took a quick look at this last weekends course for the Travelers which is one of the easier courses on tour under normal conditions it has a slope of 131 - so I'm probably incorrect in assuming they're all at max, this one would probably fall at 140+ under tournament conditions if they were to measure that. So I'd bet most would probably get up close to the max if they were to measure it. I think the problem is the slope is partly based off of a bogey golfer and no bogey golfer would play a course at 7200-7300 yards.
[/quote]

You are quite wrong about no bogey golfer playing from the tips!!
[/quote]

"I paid my 200 dollars to play at TPC generic blah and therefore am entitled to play all of it. I also enjoy driving my Subaru WRX at WRC speeds on forest trails and if it means I stuff it into the trees my spinal cord injuries are part of the experience."

Very common train of thought amongst golfers.

TPC Boston 77.0/152, Innisbrook 76.8/144, Harbour Town 75.6/147

I think all this means in reality is that there is more lost ball gunch at TPC Boston

[rafal]

Travelers was like 68/115 from what I saw on TV.

[Benzo]

Thanks for the input guys! Very appreciated

[pickerjohn]

You can take a stab at it by knowing the player is a plus
5 to 7 ftom the tips at his home course and factoring in
the winning score for the tournament. Something for a rainy day,
but just know, nothing is exact about this.

[MtlJeff]

I think ratings mostly in the 74-76 range and slopes in the 145-149 range for usual stops. US open type courses can be 77/150 ish.

[youngwaldo]

Tour officials make the course tougher than what the normal score cards indicates. I think I would be accurate to say the slope would be around 150 and rating close to 75.

Wk

[Lodestone]

When you guys refer to "maxing out" at 150, are you saying that is the highest slope possible?

[JRS]

you could make a flat easy course with a bunch of 300 yard par 4 fours and 200 yard forced carries of water. easy course - very high slope. it's not a difficulty rating but to account for that fact that handicap golfers will shoot more over their handicaps on some types of course than others.

[HoffTTM]

[quote name='Lodestone' timestamp='1435832613' post='11874800']
When you guys refer to "maxing out" at 150, are you saying that is the highest slope possible?
[/quote]

Maximum would be 155 to my knowledge, Sawgrass gets to that (because of all the water/holes a 18-20 handicapper would ESC on), not because it is the hardest golf course ever

[Lodestone]

thanks for the clarification. I did not understand that about slope.

[cspin]

Factors (aside from tons of talent and practice) that go into tour pros being able to shoot well on tour courses:
[list=1]
[*]Tour pros have perfect greens (sans Chambers Bay) to putt on
[*]Tour pros have exact charts and yardages
[*]Tour pros have professional caddies
[*]Tour pros have human backstops and grandstands that at times give them good breaks
[*]Tour pros rarely ever lose a ball unless they rinse it or blow it OB off the course
[*]Tour pros have professional caddies
[/list]

Now, this does not change the course rating but it does allow them to go lower than we could ever do just showing up and playing the track. I really think that if a tour pro were to show up on one of the newer style public courses that have decent greens, water hazards, long grasses, less than perfect bunkers, forests, etc. that they would:
[list]
[*]Still go very low
[*]Make less putts
[*]Get up and down less
[*]Lose a ball once in a while
[*]etc.
[/list]
This would result in them not being able to go as low as often as they do on tour if they were to play a top level public track, or even the courses they play on tour without 1 - 6 above. I am a single digit hdcp and truly believe that I would be able to score better on the courses they play if I had 1 - 6 above going for me. I would also do better on the courses I typically play if I had 1 - 6 all the time. I am not including factors like pressure of being on TV, in front of fans, playing for paycheck, etc. because it is difficult to quantify and I actually believe that most tour pros need that to get their juices going. I guess the best example of this in action would be to play in a pro-am, with a tour caddie, and keep your wits about you.

[cardoustie]

We used to have the Canadian Tour championship at my club. We are 74/144. But, good lord, grow in the rough and get the greens running 12 and we'd be 76 / 150 for sure

Even Gary Player said our greens are too severe. And he hasn't said a bad word about a course in 50 years

PS A young Mike Weir won it the last time at -4

[Shilgy]

[quote name='cardoustie' timestamp='1435869354' post='11878102']
We used to have the Canadian Tour championship at my club. We are 74/144. But, good lord, grow in the rough and get the greens running 12 and we'd be 76 / 150 for sure

Even Gary Player said our greens are too severe. And he hasn't said a bad word about a course in 50 years

PS A young Mike Weir won it the last time at -4
[/quote]Need to fix that-Player "hadn't" said a bad word about a course until he trashed Chambers Bay and the USGA. Unless my sarcasm meter is broken then carry on lol.

[playa]

Don't know enough about slopes to pick a number, but I would say it would be at least 5-10 strokes harder than normal for good players, and upwards of 20 for hackers. I know that sounds like a lot, but if you break it down that's a little o er a shot a hole, which is probably a little conservative when you consider hiw many extra shots they would take just around the greens, never mind the extra length.