HELP: Need a lower launching lower spinning iron shaft

Redbird · June 25, 2017

Been having issues with ballooning with my KBS Tour FLT, especially into the wind. I can hit a tee shot pick up the tee, get in the cart, and the ball still hasn't landed. I know the obvious choice is C-taper but the bending tips concerns me as I don't do my own club work aside from grip installs. My 6i SS is around 90 that goes 185. X100, PX 6.0, ???? Anything I'm missing.

phatchrisrules · June 25, 2017

Been having issues with ballooning with my KBS Tour FLT, especially into the wind. I can hit a tee shot pick up the tee, get in the cart, and the ball still hasn't landed. I know the obvious choice is C-taper but the bending tips concerns me as I don't do my own club work aside from grip installs. My 6i SS is around 90 that goes 185. X100, PX 6.0, ???? Anything I'm missing.

This is a re-posting of a post I made from another website, but the main issue is virtually the same. It's a longish read but I hope you find it informative.

I have been leading you all astray when I was touting the shaft as the engine of the golf club. This is not the case at all. Shaft actually influences ball flight very little for most people, and is entirely player dependent. There is no such thing as a low spin low launch shaft, just as there is no such thing as a high launch high spin shaft. Down at Callaway, which was an eye opening experience we were hit with the bomb that shafts don't matter in the least, strike matters, shaft not so much. While I took it the best of the bunch, there were a few in my group that seemed ready to riot, we eventually all came home with the realization that we were placing far too much emphasis on a shaft when in reality strike point (and to a degree the head) is the single most important factor.

I know I am going to get some flak for this as being the "shaft guy" forever, and for even contradicting myself here after I made several posts saying shaft was key, I am now fully going to admit I was wrong and I hope I can explain why.

Shaft doesn't matter insomuch that we don't really know what a shaft will perform like, as opposed to it doesn't matter. Sure it matters, but not for the reasons you think it does. You don't need a C-Taper or Dynamic Gold to help you get your launch and spin down, just like you don't need a Nippon 950 or a 70g graphite shaft to help you get the ball up in the air with more spin. Shaft matters only in the sense that it ensures that it feels good to you during your swing. When it feels good to you, chances are you are going to deliver the club back to the impact position "better"...if that makes sense. That is all a shaft is supposed to do. It is not to control ball flight, in fact, the ball has no idea if the shaft weighs 150g or 20g, it has no idea if it has T1100 wires running down the shaft, whether the shaft has been Pure'd, or whether you are playing with a plastic kid's golf club that has been tipped and then re-glued. In the same vein, as we have been discussing already, shaft "flex" really doesn't mean a whole heck of a lot, either. As Nick Taylor has shown, you can play a ladies' flex golf club or an X-flex club and it won't follow the general thought processes many of us have (ladies is erratic, X is powerful, etc.).

What I am going to argue is that you need to find the shaft weight that feels best to you, and that is all that matters. For instance, I have detailed that I am a high-launch, high-spin guy, so all things point to me using a PX HZRDUS in my driver and C-Tapers or Dynamic Golds in my irons, right? Then why in the world do I hit HZRDUS shafts and C-Tapers and Dynamic Golds higher, with more spin than I do C-Taper Lites, which are coincidentally supposed to be one of the highest launching, spinniest shafts available? When I mentioned that in another thread it was not met with the best reaction. 110g steel shafts with moderate torque *feel* the best to me in my irons, and coincidentally, I hit them the best. My 3 best shafts I have ever hit are a Dynamic Gold SL, KBS C-Taper Lite, and the PXi...all of which are between 108-113g. For a driver, the best shaft I have ever used is my Ping Tour 65 or a V2 66, which coincidentally, happen to both be almost identical weights and torque ratings. Further, the combinations in both drivers with the different shafts and the 3 iron sets with the different shafts have all been my longest, straightest, and best feeling irons I have ever used. Hmmm....

I am not saying we all need to go out and buy 40g senior or ladies' flex shafts. If you want to increase your swing speed, sure it'll work, and you won't change your launch and spin very much at all, if at all. However, the decrease in weight could lead to it being erratic because it feels wrong to you. I just sold a PX Handcrafted 54g to a member on here that I tried. I consistently got the best numbers with it I have ever seen in recent years (fastest swing speed, penetrating flight, good spin), but it just *felt* too light and while I was enjoying the extra club in distance on the monitor, the on-course results were erratic, at best. Also, similar shafts can and will do different things for different people. Why does KGeorge hit a dynamic gold low/low, while I hit it high/high...it doesn't make sense. Subconsciously something feels different to us and we are attacking the ball differently with the club leading to this discrepancy in shot pattern.

I know some of you are probably going to roll your eyes or not believe me, so in addition to my own data, here is some from multiple fittings I have done over the past month since I got back.

Player 1 ---- 84mph swing speed, consistently slight toe hits with a driver. Was playing an F6+ with a stiff 67g Black Tie at 9.5*. After trying a few shots I gave him a regular and a senior flex Red Tie 60g shaft and tuned his head to 9*. Suddenly his shots were more middle, his swing speed spiked to 88mph, he gained about 8 yards of carry while maintaining his spin and launch from before. He chose the senior flex route because he liked the kick. He has told me multiple times now how much further he is hitting the ball.

Player 2 --- 103mph swing speed, hits centre most of the time. Has an Epic SZ at 8* weight forward and was fit for a Fujikura Speeder Platinum 6x at one of the two high-end fitting studios our forum knows well. This shaft is the bees knees according to him, stability T1100 wires, low launch, mid-low spin, tremendous stability and kick, etc. He is a regular at my store so we got to talking and I told him about what I had learned, he says show me. So I grab a Recoil 450 stiff (the supposedly complete opposite of this other shaft, btw) and even though he was swinging the 450 a little slower, at about 101, the launch went down a hair, spin went down about 150 RPMs and carry was within 1 yard of his $600+ shaft (255 for the recoil vs. 256 for the Fuji).

Player 3 --- 89mph swing speed with an iron. Was interested in the AP1 with an XP90 stiff. He liked it and just offhandedly mentioned that he also liked the JPX900 HM. After a few shots with the stock in the JPX (Modus 105) it is quite clear that this is the club for him. He asks me to fit him for a shaft, and based on his swing speed and tempo I told him common knowledge should be to go heavier and with less torque due to his speed. So I put in a PX LZ 6.0 (120g) and he couldn't hit it to save his life, his launch went to pot as did his spin. Put back the light-mid weight Nippon and he was back to carrying the 7i roughly 180.

So I hope this illustrates that our preconceived notions of what a shaft should and shouldn't do is not always the case. As consumers, we should rely less on an exotic upgrade shaft to do the work and more so on the club just working for us. No shaft is going to turn a dog head into a magical fairway finder. Focus more on the clubhead and strike position and you will be amazed at how much more you will get out of your clubs. It makes it a lot easier when picking clubs too, just find the head that works for you, and then a shaft that feels nice. No need to worry about trying whether the XP95 vs. the KBS 90 vs. the KBS Tour 105 vs. the Recoil 95 is going to react better to your swing. If you like the feel of that weight range, pick one and don't worry about it. Shaft kick point varies at most 2 inches from the "lowest" to the "highest" launching shafts available, which will in turn, effect spin roughly 300 RPMs. Not so amazing now are they? You can control 300 RPMs of spin by lofting your driver up/down one degree. Hit the ball too high (14+*)? Try an 8* driver, not a Graphite Design BB-whatever. Hit it too low with no spin, try a 12+* driver, don't immediately jump to a Veylix or a Fuji-whatchamacallit.

Makes our lives a lot more simple and allows us to go out and enjoy the game more. I know it sure has made my fittings a lot more effective and speedy since I learned this. The customer is also a lot more relieved since there is less pressure to pick "the perfect" shaft...which in reality doesn't exist.

Thanks for reading.