A rant from an OEM fitter...why I no longer work for a golf company

[Birddog2]

That's corporate...I say Rat 'em out.

WXRs' can't do anything w/o pictures... who was it??

[gioguy21]

That's corporate...I say Rat 'em out.

WXRs' can't do anything w/o pictures... who was it??

i'd still rather not.

[Brunzy]

So any advise on how to find a real fitter who only cares about me and what does best for me? Regardless of price/OEM name on club?

[gioguy21]

So any advise on how to find a real fitter who only cares about me and what does best for me? Regardless of price/OEM name on club?

my guess is finding someone non-OEM specific. think, truespec, coolclubs, club champion, etc.

[GLF4EVR]

First gioguy21 I would like to thank you for being a human that cares about what they do. The unfortunate thing is everything is all about the almighty dollar. I have spent 27 years in the VA. Years ago a vet could come in.....see 3 different specialty doctors in one day....get several tests done...get scheduled for what the doctors had ordered during their visit with the proper prep instructions...then drive back home.

 

Now most of this has to be done outside of the VA. It will take a few months to get things done, if they can get done in that time. During this time the vet usually does not know all of what is going on because things are not told or explained to them. Then they eventually get back to the VA with problems from what was done on the outside.....so they start the process over again.

 

So the VA spends tons of money on this.....then another couple of tons for new equipment for the VA.....but do not hire the people to run it or the doctors to even order things. Then they get on their high horse about how they are doing everything they can for the veteran & are trying to improve things. Were most of this comes back to the dollar. Many in the VA hierarchy are hell bent on privatizing the VA to get that government money into the outside world.

 

Thank you for the opportunity to vent that one. Hope the VA does not see this. Only have 2 years to retirement. Gioguy21 I hope you can make it as an independent club builder because if I ever visit one.....I sure hope they are like you.

[Warrick]

This world needs more people like you man. It takes effort to give a sh!t about what you do. most could care less.

[fillwelix]

Good on you man, best of luck moving forward!

[Awainer1]

Unfortunately thats the nature of the beast. Oem's need to make money. Thats why there is a new club every single year touting new features. I've given up on OEM's and I'm playing wishon clubs. At least if they come out with a new product I can buy the head only and all specs are known. And they build all their clubs to the same BBGM so you can swap out anytime.

[J13]

Gio hang in there. You did the right thing and unfortunately as others have said middle management creates a lot of problems. The pro sounds like a spineless coward who will no doubt be on the receiving end of the same treatment.

 

I'm met my fair share of people in the golf business and it's not unlike any other industry. You have some great people and some leeches. Can't escape it.

[Cwebb]

So any advise on how to find a real fitter who only cares about me and what does best for me? Regardless of price/OEM name on club?

 

Your best odds are with an "independent" shop that is running their own show. They are scattered around the country and you can find them if you dig a bit

[mizuno player]

I know in my business if I were on company time and made money on the side I would no longer have that job. If I couldn't provide the right product to a customer I would be honest and say so. I have done this several times.

 

However, I do understand you wanting to do what's best for the customer. Customer service is a lost art today. Sounds as though you need to work for yourself or someone that will go to great lengths to satisfy the customer.

[JonnyKrasnodar]

It's a sad reflection of the world we now live in, that manners, respect, saying to someone's face and being honest are by and large a distant memory.

 

If you're being honest where can you go for anything these days without the company or individual trying to mug you off to make an extra few bucks?

 

Garages red lining parts of the service (most popularly tyres) to say X is not road legal and needs changed. The majority who know nothing about cars agree and there's another hundred or so out the wallet.

 

I mentioned it in the MC shaft threads because I don't even trust that people going for golf lessons are getting the same level of coaching as they used to. It's hard being in the industry so if you can tweak a swing to make it slightly worse but convince them they're on the right track then that's what happens. It's guaranteed 6-10 lessons paid up front after which if it doesn't work then the golfer didn't try hard enough.

 

It's cynical but there's really nothing you can get without a con somewhere along the line.

[Cwebb]

Maybe one additional takeaway from this, is try not to rely on texting for a situation or deal like this, when we're working in person with someone. Some people just do not get across what they're actually thinking and feeling with the written word

[gioguy21]

Maybe one additional takeaway from this, is try not to rely on texting for a situation or deal like this, when we're working in person with someone. Some people just do not get across what they're actually thinking and feeling with the written word

In the fitting biz tho, on the fly, that's what we have to work with since as fitters we dont have OEM email tags, or business cards. Most email is from the head pro/shop and the regional rep...almost never from pro to tech rep

[Cwebb]

Maybe one additional takeaway from this, is try not to rely on texting for a situation or deal like this, when we're working in person with someone. Some people just do not get across what they're actually thinking and feeling with the written word

In the fitting biz tho, on the fly, that's what we have to work with since as fitters we dont have OEM email tags, or business cards. Most email is from the head pro/shop and the regional rep...almost never from pro to tech rep

 

Right, I understand. As you probably have experienced, some of those who grew up and were adults for a long while before texting became common, don't always do "as well" with it. They do much better with an actual phone call, where voice inflection and emotion can come across clearly. Some things "get lost" with the written word, at times

[Nessism]

Has the USGA ruled on cotton inside a driver head? Seems to me it can move which would render the club nonconforming. Maybe ticky tack but without express agreement from the OEM I would not have offered up this option.

 

And no disrespect since I understand you were trying to help, but pulling a shaft out of your car and working some side deal with the kids dad just sounds like a bad way to conduct business since you work for an OEM. It's one thing to let the kid try the shaft "for sh*t and giggles" but it's something else to try to arrange an outside deal.

 

Sounds like you would be better off working for some independent club fitting company.

[trhode]

Has the USGA ruled on cotton inside a driver head? Seems to me it can move which would render the club nonconforming. Maybe ticky tack but without express agreement from the OEM I would not have offered up this option.

 

And no disrespect since I understand you were trying to help, but pulling a shaft out of your car and working some side deal with the kids dad just sounds like a bad way to conduct business since you work for an OEM. It's one thing to let the kid try the shaft "for sh*t and giggles" but it's something else to try to arrange an outside deal.

 

Sounds like you would be better off working for some independent club fitting company.

 

Caught that too. Since when do you put poly fill in a club and call it good?

[gioguy21]

For you guys talking bout the fill - the member was NOT a competitive golfer. I told him he could have it hotmelted by club champion and he said he didn't understand and couldn't/wouldn't buy the club if he had to take it somewhere else.

 

Under no circumstances would he be using the club for a usga/r&a event.

 

That was not an issue.

[RobotDoctor]

Most golfers don't play in tournaments where USGA rules govern the rules of play. Furthermore, a great many players play with equipment that might not comply with the new groove rules as well. At the end of the day does it really matter what a non-tournament player plays with? I seem to recall when Arnold Palmer endorsed the Callaway ERC driver even though it exceeded the maximum COR allowed by the USGA. Mr. Palmer endorsed it for the common non-tournament player seeking enjoyment of the game.

[Golfrnut]

Has the USGA ruled on cotton inside a driver head? Seems to me it can move which would render the club nonconforming. Maybe ticky tack but without express agreement from the OEM I would not have offered up this option.

 

And no disrespect since I understand you were trying to help, but pulling a shaft out of your car and working some side deal with the kids dad just sounds like a bad way to conduct business since you work for an OEM. It's one thing to let the kid try the shaft "for sh*t and giggles" but it's something else to try to arrange an outside deal.

 

Sounds like you would be better off working for some independent club fitting company.

 

Caught that too. Since when do you put poly fill in a club and call it good?

 

Gotta agree...for both that and the grip change to alter swingweight. Two wrongs really don’t make a right here.

 

I get the intent, but neither would be acceptable IMO.

[gioguy21]

Has the USGA ruled on cotton inside a driver head? Seems to me it can move which would render the club nonconforming. Maybe ticky tack but without express agreement from the OEM I would not have offered up this option.

 

And no disrespect since I understand you were trying to help, but pulling a shaft out of your car and working some side deal with the kids dad just sounds like a bad way to conduct business since you work for an OEM. It's one thing to let the kid try the shaft "for sh*t and giggles" but it's something else to try to arrange an outside deal.

 

Sounds like you would be better off working for some independent club fitting company.

 

Caught that too. Since when do you put poly fill in a club and call it good?

 

Gotta agree...for both that and the grip change to alter swingweight. Two wrongs really don’t make a right here.

 

I get the intent, but neither would be acceptable IMO.

The grip he wanted was heavier and countered the polyfill which was only 4g in the first place. See yourselves out. This isn't a thread discussing USGA rules for conformance, or debating whether or not the MEMBER wanted it that way. They were swingweighted the exact same as he got fitted for, if only a grand total of roughly 14g of total club weight.

 

Smh.

[Golfrnut]

Has the USGA ruled on cotton inside a driver head? Seems to me it can move which would render the club nonconforming. Maybe ticky tack but without express agreement from the OEM I would not have offered up this option.

 

And no disrespect since I understand you were trying to help, but pulling a shaft out of your car and working some side deal with the kids dad just sounds like a bad way to conduct business since you work for an OEM. It's one thing to let the kid try the shaft "for sh*t and giggles" but it's something else to try to arrange an outside deal.

 

Sounds like you would be better off working for some independent club fitting company.

 

Caught that too. Since when do you put poly fill in a club and call it good?

 

Gotta agree...for both that and the grip change to alter swingweight. Two wrongs really don’t make a right here.

 

I get the intent, but neither would be acceptable IMO.

The grip he wanted was heavier and countered the polyfill which was only 4g in the first place. See yourselves out. This isn't a thread discussing USGA rules for conformance, or debating whether or not the MEMBER wanted it that way. They were swingweighted the exact same as he got fitted for, if only a grand total of roughly 14g of total club weight.

 

Smh.

 

You did make an attenpt to go the extra mile to make a sale, but, from another perspective other than yours, you made an OEMs club potentially non-conforming to USGA rules because you lacked the proper equipment to make the change and keep the club within the rules...in order to make that sale instead of being honest and saying that you could not properly render the service. If I was an OEM, I wouldn’t be that happy with you either.

[gioguy21]

Has the USGA ruled on cotton inside a driver head? Seems to me it can move which would render the club nonconforming. Maybe ticky tack but without express agreement from the OEM I would not have offered up this option.

 

And no disrespect since I understand you were trying to help, but pulling a shaft out of your car and working some side deal with the kids dad just sounds like a bad way to conduct business since you work for an OEM. It's one thing to let the kid try the shaft "for sh*t and giggles" but it's something else to try to arrange an outside deal.

 

Sounds like you would be better off working for some independent club fitting company.

 

Caught that too. Since when do you put poly fill in a club and call it good?

 

Gotta agree...for both that and the grip change to alter swingweight. Two wrongs really dont make a right here.

 

I get the intent, but neither would be acceptable IMO.

The grip he wanted was heavier and countered the polyfill which was only 4g in the first place. See yourselves out. This isn't a thread discussing USGA rules for conformance, or debating whether or not the MEMBER wanted it that way. They were swingweighted the exact same as he got fitted for, if only a grand total of roughly 14g of total club weight.

 

Smh.

 

You did make an attenpt to go the extra mile to make a sale, but, from another perspective other than yours, you made an OEMs club potentially non-conforming to USGA rules because you lacked the proper equipment to make the change and keep the club within the rules...in order to make that sale instead of being honest and saying that you could not properly render the service. If I was an OEM, I wouldnt be that happy with you either.

So scenario a) I tell the member send it to club champion for hot melt (which he said he wouldn't do) and/or b) lose the entire sale including clubs for he and his wife?

 

Which one would the OEM be more pissed bout??.

[Golfrnut]

So scenario a) I tell the member send it to club champion for hot melt (which he said he wouldn't do) and/or b) lose the entire sale including clubs for he and his wife?

 

Which one would the OEM be more pissed bout??.

 

Did you ask them? No. You made that determination for yourself. That ended up backfiring. Live and learn man, but not all the blame falls on the shop/OEM on that one IMO. You made a decision with the customer that hurt your relationship with your employer. Obviously, at some point, they didn’t like the decision you made if they started asking you not to return. The deal now falls through and the club is stuck, if they’re honest, with a club they can no longer sell to anyone else because you made a decision to use an alternative method to add material to the club. This is exactly why sometimes, if you can’t provide a service, you are better off being honest about it. i know we’ll probably never agree on it, but that’s my opinion on the situation.

[gioguy21]

So scenario a) I tell the member send it to club champion for hot melt (which he said he wouldn't do) and/or b) lose the entire sale including clubs for he and his wife?

 

Which one would the OEM be more pissed bout??.

 

Did you ask them? No. You made that determination for yourself. That ended up backfiring. Live and learn man, but not all the blame falls on the shop/OEM on that one IMO. You made a decision with the customer that hurt your relationship with your employer. Obviously, at some point, they didnt like the decision you made if they started asking you not to return. The deal now falls through and the club is stuck, if theyre honest, with a club they can no longer sell to anyone else because you made a decision to use an alternative method to add material to the club. This is exactly why sometimes, if you cant provide a service, you are better off being honest about it. i know well probably never agree on it, but thats my opinion on the situation.

Ask who?? The member? Yes. I did.

 

Ask my boss? Yes. I did. "As long as he buys the club first - let him know it cannot be returned"...which I did.

 

Did the member agree to the service? Yes.

 

Did the member after the fact go against the fact I did what he requested, and the price as discussed beforehand? Yes.

 

 

Please, jump to more conclusions.

[Golfrnut]

So scenario a) I tell the member send it to club champion for hot melt (which he said he wouldn't do) and/or b) lose the entire sale including clubs for he and his wife?

 

Which one would the OEM be more pissed bout??.

 

Did you ask them? No. You made that determination for yourself. That ended up backfiring. Live and learn man, but not all the blame falls on the shop/OEM on that one IMO. You made a decision with the customer that hurt your relationship with your employer. Obviously, at some point, they didn’t like the decision you made if they started asking you not to return. The deal now falls through and the club is stuck, if they’re honest, with a club they can no longer sell to anyone else because you made a decision to use an alternative method to add material to the club. This is exactly why sometimes, if you can’t provide a service, you are better off being honest about it. i know we’ll probably never agree on it, but that’s my opinion on the situation.

Ask who?? The member? Yes. I did.

 

Ask my boss? Yes. I did. "As long as he buys the club first - let him know it cannot be returned"...which I did.

 

Did the member agree to the service? Yes.

 

Did the member after the fact go against the fact I did what he requested, and the price as discussed beforehand? Yes.

 

 

Please, jump to more conclusions.

 

What was the end result? Did the cistomer end up purchasing? I am assuming no?

 

If not, then it sounds like it ended up exactly where I thought it did. The sale never happened and the shop now has a club they can’t sell. Instead of being short the money for your services, they are now in the negative for the price of a driver.

 

The extra mile you were going to make a sale ended up costing the shop money and put them in the negative. In the end, that’s the result. They could have potentially resold a driver if it was done properly, now they can’t, and that’s where it pretty much ends.

 

Again, lots of mistakes made by multiple people...but not all blame is on the shop/OEM in this case IMO.

[gioguy21]

 

 

So scenario a) I tell the member send it to club champion for hot melt (which he said he wouldn't do) and/or b) lose the entire sale including clubs for he and his wife?

 

Which one would the OEM be more pissed bout??.

 

Did you ask them? No. You made that determination for yourself. That ended up backfiring. Live and learn man, but not all the blame falls on the shop/OEM on that one IMO. You made a decision with the customer that hurt your relationship with your employer. Obviously, at some point, they didnt like the decision you made if they started asking you not to return. The deal now falls through and the club is stuck, if theyre honest, with a club they can no longer sell to anyone else because you made a decision to use an alternative method to add material to the club. This is exactly why sometimes, if you cant provide a service, you are better off being honest about it. i know well probably never agree on it, but thats my opinion on the situation.

Ask who?? The member? Yes. I did.

 

Ask my boss? Yes. I did. "As long as he buys the club first - let him know it cannot be returned"...which I did.

 

Did the member agree to the service? Yes.

 

Did the member after the fact go against the fact I did what he requested, and the price as discussed beforehand? Yes.

 

 

Please, jump to more conclusions.

 

What was the end result? Did the cistomer end up purchasing? I am assuming no?

 

If not, then it sounds like it ended up exactly where I thought it did. The sale never happened and the shop now has a club they cant sell. Instead of being short the money for your services, they are now in the negative for the price of a driver.

 

The extra mile you were going to make a sale ended up costing the shop money and put them in the negative. In the end, thats the result. They could have potentially resold a driver if it was done properly, now they cant, and thats where it pretty much ends.

 

Again, lots of mistakes made by multiple people...but not all blame is on the shop/ORm in this case IMO.

 

Is it your job, in your mind to be negative in people's threads?

 

Again, you're assumptions are making you the...and not me.

 

The member bought his wifes clubs - but the club gave him the $50 back.

 

Please, kindly leave.

[Golfrnut]

 

 

So scenario a) I tell the member send it to club champion for hot melt (which he said he wouldn't do) and/or b) lose the entire sale including clubs for he and his wife?

 

Which one would the OEM be more pissed bout??.

 

Did you ask them? No. You made that determination for yourself. That ended up backfiring. Live and learn man, but not all the blame falls on the shop/OEM on that one IMO. You made a decision with the customer that hurt your relationship with your employer. Obviously, at some point, they didn’t like the decision you made if they started asking you not to return. The deal now falls through and the club is stuck, if they’re honest, with a club they can no longer sell to anyone else because you made a decision to use an alternative method to add material to the club. This is exactly why sometimes, if you can’t provide a service, you are better off being honest about it. i know we’ll probably never agree on it, but that’s my opinion on the situation.

Ask who?? The member? Yes. I did.

 

Ask my boss? Yes. I did. "As long as he buys the club first - let him know it cannot be returned"...which I did.

 

Did the member agree to the service? Yes.

 

Did the member after the fact go against the fact I did what he requested, and the price as discussed beforehand? Yes.

 

 

Please, jump to more conclusions.

 

What was the end result? Did the cistomer end up purchasing? I am assuming no?

 

If not, then it sounds like it ended up exactly where I thought it did. The sale never happened and the shop now has a club they can’t sell. Instead of being short the money for your services, they are now in the negative for the price of a driver.

 

The extra mile you were going to make a sale ended up costing the shop money and put them in the negative. In the end, that’s the result. They could have potentially resold a driver if it was done properly, now they can’t, and that’s where it pretty much ends.

 

Again, lots of mistakes made by multiple people...but not all blame is on the shop/ORm in this case IMO.

 

Is it your job, in your mind to be negative in people's threads?

 

Again, you're assumptions are making you the...and not me.

 

The member bought his wifes clubs - but the club gave him the $50 back.

 

Please, kindly leave.

 

Negative? No. Share my opinion? Yes. Sounds like some of my assumptions were correct.

 

Everyone does love to play the victim though.

[gioguy21]

Wow man.

[TollBros]

So any advise on how to find a real fitter who only cares about me and what does best for me? Regardless of price/OEM name on club?

my guess is finding someone non-OEM specific. think, truespec, coolclubs, club champion, etc.

 

Even then you're pushed into offering "services" that are nothing more than ways to pad the bill. Maybe not all, but in my experience, even some of those.