What are your thoughts on Brooks Koepka swing?

[bladestriker]

It's not a matter of believing that playing with the face less open is wrong. It's the absurd statement that they are keeping the face square to the path the entire swing. Literally everyone opens it in the backswing. LITERALLY EVERYONE. Brooks koepka opens the clubface. It is less open than some other players but it is still open.

I agree with that. Just like there is no absolutes in life nor in golf.

 

How can you agree with that while the entire thread you e argued that it literally stays square to the path the entire time?

Ok fine. Most of the time. You win. RBImGuy says hi to you too. ;)

 

It’s not square to the path most of the time either. Get better at trolling

The trollers always seem to catch you too. Seems too me you get very argumentative, always needing to be right or the smartest guy in the room.

[Swingman420]

Forcing the club square to the path means you are not swinging you are forcing and manipulating and fighting physics.

Maybe someone has one of those seemore putter videos that shows what clubs do when swing without any torque on the grip.

This is clearly a high cap troll job. Trolling wise maybe can’t break a hundo!

[Range Pro]

I guarantee you that this not a troll job and I am going to finish the latest "Better Call Saul" now.

[Weetbix]

The AMG guys did a video and 1 of the guys was amazingly close to keeping it square

 

Like has been mentioned here no one keeps it exactly square but frankly worrying about a few degrees here or there across the whole backswing and downswing motion is getting a bit picky

 

The guy that AMG measured was very close and I think that that swing could reasonably be termed square to the arc from a practical (if not a minutely measurable) perspective

[Krt22]

The AMG guys did a video and 1 of the guys was amazingly close to keeping it square

 

Like has been mentioned here no one keeps it exactly square but frankly worrying about a few degrees here or there across the whole backswing and downswing motion is getting a bit picky

 

The guy that AMG measured was very close and I think that that swing could reasonably be termed square to the arc from a practical (if not a minutely measurable) perspective

 

I posted that exact video, and they only trace the last segment of the swing coming into impact. If they added the full backswing you would see it open and close to the path significantly

[wmblake2000]

Sometimes I really appreciate not understanding the details of the swing, like when I read threads like this.

 

The more I learn about my golf swing the more I believe in simplicity.

 

For example I have no idea about what ‘square to path’ means. What I know is when I make a balanced swing with good tempo and rhythm the face is square at impact. It is clear to me for this to happen I need to rotate the face open going back so I can get everything in shape to be aggressive in downswing. It’s key for me to get r arm rotated open so I’m not way ott, for example.

 

But squaring the face happens has a consequence of doing other things well - especially the sequencing and timing.

 

I guess my point is: I’m just an avid amateur. I know a helluva lot more about golf than most ams. Some of these debates just seem silly like people want to show off their esoteric knowledge that frankly has almost no practical application. And which finally a few really talented teachers come in and bust them for.

 

I keep wondering what motivates this... the need for attention?

[wmblake2000]

PS: my thought of Koepka’s swing, the original topic.

 

Sweet Jeezus it is amazing.

[Milkers]

Is he really that steep? Like in the band of steepness amongst the tour, is he steep?

 

Looks steep to me. Here's his hand path:

 

 

 

His right arm/elbow position is incredible.

[glk]

Sometimes I really appreciate not understanding the details of the swing, like when I read threads like this.

 

The more I learn about my golf swing the more I believe in simplicity.

 

For example I have no idea about what ‘square to path’ means. What I know is when I make a balanced swing with good tempo and rhythm the face is square at impact. It is clear to me for this to happen I need to rotate the face open going back so I can get everything in shape to be aggressive in downswing. It’s key for me to get r arm rotated open so I’m not way ott, for example.

 

But squaring the face happens has a consequence of doing other things well - especially the sequencing and timing.

 

I guess my point is: I’m just an avid amateur. I know a helluva lot more about golf than most ams. Some of these debates just seem silly like people want to show off their esoteric knowledge that frankly has almost no practical application. And which finally a few really talented teachers come in and bust them for.

 

I keep wondering what motivates this... the need for attention?

Unfortunately incorrect info such as keeping the face square to the path through out the swing gets passed along and some unlucky soul tries to do it.

[newportbeach]

From what I recall Jim Furyk had a pretty steep take away too - but I'd take Koepka's swing over Furyk's any day.

[dlygrisse]

It's a swing built to win majors.

It's a swing you had better not try to copy unless you are built like him

[Krt22]

It's a swing built to win majors.

It's a swing you had better not try to copy unless you are built like him

 

Why do you have to be built like him?

[juststeve]

My impression is that his swing produces great ball flight and repeats. Nothing else matters.

 

Steve

[SomedayScratch]

Better than mine.

[bladehunter]

It's a swing built to win majors.

It's a swing you had better not try to copy unless you are built like him

 

Why do you have to be built like him?

 

Wouldn’t you need to be pretty strong to turn hard enough to fade it with that shut face ? At least a hook is what I got when trying that much left wrist flextion. ( or whatever the word is )

[oz dee cee]

I’m pretty sure Brooks is a predominant fader...

[GungHoGolf]

I’m pretty sure Brooks is a predominant fader...

 

Seems to be a common paradox... the guys with the strongest grips, most bowed lead wrists, and most shut club faces during the downswing are typically faders, and guys with weaker grips and open faces are drawers.

[johnrobison]

I'm pretty sure Brooks is a predominant fader...

 

Seems to be a common paradox... the guys with the strongest grips, most bowed lead wrists, and most shut club faces during the downswing are typically faders, and guys with weaker grips and open faces are drawers.

A fade swing with a weak grip is probably a recipe for right-to-right misses

[Nard_S]

Another vertical swinger, piling up majors. Who would have thought?

 

Never picked up on hip restriction thing the way it's easily seen in Day (wince). Guy has solid swing in my book, keeps fingers under club on back swing in nice fashion, very little re-direct or compensations.........good stuff.

[5UnderPar]

I never realized how shut and outside of his hands the club face is when his arms are horizontal to ground in backswing. Most teaching calls for club face in line with hands and matching spine angle. Lots of ways to get it done!

[BiggErn]

Years ago before I ever went to a pga event you hear all the guys on tv talk about this guy drawing the ball and this guy fading the ball. After I went and witnessed in person I found they hit most everything pretty straight. Their movement one way or the other is minute for the most part. I watched Duval in his hay day and all I heard was how he hit a fade. Everything I saw him hit was dead straight or had a tiny hint of a draw. TV over embellishes everything. When I saw Brooks at Quail Hollow his shots looked pretty straight as well. Their fades and draws aren’t like the average golfers.

[dpb5031]

Years ago before I ever went to a pga event you hear all the guys on tv talk about this guy drawing the ball and this guy fading the ball. After I went and witnessed in person I found they hit most everything pretty straight. Their movement one way or the other is minute for the most part. I watched Duval in his hay day and all I heard was how he hit a fade. Everything I saw him hit was dead straight or had a tiny hint of a draw. TV over embellishes everything. When I saw Brooks at Quail Hollow his shots looked pretty straight as well. Their fades and draws aren’t like the average golfers.

 

Except for Bubba lol!

[BiggErn]

Years ago before I ever went to a pga event you hear all the guys on tv talk about this guy drawing the ball and this guy fading the ball. After I went and witnessed in person I found they hit most everything pretty straight. Their movement one way or the other is minute for the most part. I watched Duval in his hay day and all I heard was how he hit a fade. Everything I saw him hit was dead straight or had a tiny hint of a draw. TV over embellishes everything. When I saw Brooks at Quail Hollow his shots looked pretty straight as well. Their fades and draws arent like the average golfers.

 

Except for Bubba lol!

 

Maybe an exception.

[blehnhard]

Unless you stand behind directly behind player, your view is distorted. Facing player face on 10'away, a 5 yd fade will look like a draw to you.

[dpb5031]

Years ago before I ever went to a pga event you hear all the guys on tv talk about this guy drawing the ball and this guy fading the ball. After I went and witnessed in person I found they hit most everything pretty straight. Their movement one way or the other is minute for the most part. I watched Duval in his hay day and all I heard was how he hit a fade. Everything I saw him hit was dead straight or had a tiny hint of a draw. TV over embellishes everything. When I saw Brooks at Quail Hollow his shots looked pretty straight as well. Their fades and draws aren’t like the average golfers.

 

Except for Bubba lol!

 

Maybe an exception.

 

BTW, Duval was awesome to watch. He'd just bust his chest open with no hesitation. I remember mostly staight"ish" iron shots to even the slightest draws with mid and short irons, and straight"ish" drivers and long clubs with the tiniest of fades. Cool thing about the fades he hit with driver was how powerfully they were struck. They landed hot and took off running more like most ams would expect from a draw.

[kermitm]

I love his swing. Every time I see him swing I think it looks like Pete Cowan has had an influence on his full swing. Cowen talks a lot about using the right hand to put pressure on the ball and Brooks does this move perfectly. I know that Cowen is his short game coach but have always wondered if he helped Brooks with his full swing.

[Forged4ever]

Is this a trick question?

 

 

 

Cheers?

RP

[Forged4ever]

Years ago before I ever went to a pga event you hear all the guys on tv talk about this guy drawing the ball and this guy fading the ball. After I went and witnessed in person I found they hit most everything pretty straight. Their movement one way or the other is minute for the most part. I watched Duval in his hay day and all I heard was how he hit a fade. Everything I saw him hit was dead straight or had a tiny hint of a draw. TV over embellishes everything. When I saw Brooks at Quail Hollow his shots looked pretty straight as well. Their fades and draws aren’t like the average golfers.

 

Except for Bubba lol!

 

Maybe an exception.

 

BTW, Duval was awesome to watch. He'd just bust his chest open with no hesitation. I remember mostly staight"ish" iron shots to even the slightest draws with mid and short irons, and straight"ish" drivers and long clubs with the tiniest of fades. Cool thing about the fades he hit with driver was how powerfully they were struck. They landed hot and took off running more like most ams would expect from a draw.

Absolutely!!

 

David, JD & Jack hit the “strongest” fades I’ve ever seen though I never saw Tiger up close.

 

David really busted it??

 

Have a nice weekend Bro?

 

My Best,

RP

[BiggErn]

Years ago before I ever went to a pga event you hear all the guys on tv talk about this guy drawing the ball and this guy fading the ball. After I went and witnessed in person I found they hit most everything pretty straight. Their movement one way or the other is minute for the most part. I watched Duval in his hay day and all I heard was how he hit a fade. Everything I saw him hit was dead straight or had a tiny hint of a draw. TV over embellishes everything. When I saw Brooks at Quail Hollow his shots looked pretty straight as well. Their fades and draws arent like the average golfers.

 

Except for Bubba lol!

 

Maybe an exception.

 

BTW, Duval was awesome to watch. He'd just bust his chest open with no hesitation. I remember mostly staight"ish" iron shots to even the slightest draws with mid and short irons, and straight"ish" drivers and long clubs with the tiniest of fades. Cool thing about the fades he hit with driver was how powerfully they were struck. They landed hot and took off running more like most ams would expect from a draw.

 

I also remember him dropping a ball on the tee box with no tee and pounding a 3 wood about as far as you could see. I believe it was hole 12 at Sugarloaf.

[trapsmv15]

Except that literally doesn't happen in anyone ever measured. The clubface is not staying square to the arc in Brooks swing or any full swing

 

Watch it again closely. The clubface is square to path of the clubhead the entire time.

 

Because she is actively manipulating the face to be “square” to the path. There is no magic bullet here when it comes to “timing” a golf swing. Your arms and pivot need to be in sync. There’s no way to avoid that and be consistently successful.

 

If you want to make your swing “easier to time” you need to remove excess, unnecessary movement...

 

... one of which would be actively manipulating the club face to speciously create a “no-timing” swing.

 

There are two ways for right wrist to move during the take away. In order for the clubface to stay square to its path, the left wrist action is the only way to achieve it. Both Brooks and Dustin are doing the action on the left. Modern teachings advocate the right wrist action. For me, there is less timeing involved with the left.

 

 

I’d say you have no clue what “modern teaching” advocates. And again nobody keeps the clubface square to the path through the entire swing. Nobody. And it’s not close.

Exactly right (not that you of all people need me to say that).

 

I like to read golf books -- old and new -- just for fun, and, if anything, the right picture is what 'classic' instruction used to advocate: it was a key piece of Merrins' swing the handle book, it was very present in Toski and Flick books (and shows up in their old GD video series chapters too), and I think it was emphasized in the book Love did with Toski, too.

 

The only non-modern teaching I can think of that taught the left picture is Dante's Four Moves, but I certainly haven't read everything.

 

Regardless, there's way more to this whole thing than just bend your wrist one way and voila.