WRXers Scratch Amateur Tournaments Thread: Commitments, Results, etc....

[Obee]

Yeah, I do not have it. Read a bunch about it. Follow Fawcett. Have realized it's just a really solid "game plan" system. I do this for every course/round I play that's important (if I have the time). For approaches, it basically amounts to scoring various missing zones and then targeting your approach accordingly, using your own, personal shot pattern.

 

I will eventually buy it because I'm curious to see if it's much more than that, but I'm pretty sure it's not.

 

That kind of thing ("smart" play to the "correct" targets based on one's own game) has always been a strength of mine. What I lack is clubhead speed and a swing that can elevate the ball (which is needed at many tough tournament set-ups to be able to attack many pins).

 

The differnce in watching a guy like Tom Pernice, Jr. play a round of golf versus a young, bomber pro (who has yet to do much, if anything) is amazing. COMPLETELY different shot targets/shapes on some holes. Not all young bombers are like this, of course.

 

> @Spongeb0b said:

> > @Obee said:

> > I've used it my whole life. Before it existed. LOL

> >

> > > @Spongeb0b said:

> > > > @Obee said:

> > > > > @"rich s" said:

> > > > > Obee, curious on your thoughts. Last night I hit 9/9 greens in reg. Closest putt was 6' which I made. Next closest was 10' and most were 15-20. I had 18 putts. Now this is not typical but my GIR % lately is very good. If a person could hit every green, what do you think is a good target # of putts on difficult greens. These greens are also HUGE. I think that plays a part in the GIR for me but also hurts the total # of putts.

> > > >

> > > > It's not at all uncommon for miss every single one of your 15 - 20 foot putts in a round -- even if you have a bunch of them. That's just golf and the percentages of putting. Let's say you have 10 of them in a round AND you also tend to slightly underestimate the distance of your putts. So you estimate that you have putts of these lengths:

> > > >

> > > > 18

> > > > 20

> > > > 17

> > > > 16

> > > > 19

> > > > 20

> > > > 20

> > > > 15

> > > > 17

> > > > 18

> > > >

> > > > But in reality, they are:

> > > >

> > > > 19

> > > > 21

> > > > 18.5

> > > > 18

> > > > 20

> > > > 22

> > > > 16

> > > > 19

> > > > 19

> > > >

> > > > Then your average make percentage is somewhere around 12%(?). And that's IF you are as good a putter as the average PGA Tour pro. And of course, you could take a chance at something with a 12% probability of occurring and have it NOT occur ten times in a row. Plenty of times.

> > > >

> > > > For the rest of the stuff, read GioGuy above. Good stuff. Very "Decade" by Scott Fawcett (which is just the right way to play golf, IMHO).

> > > >

> > > > The only really way to know how well you putt compared to the best putters in the world is to be meticulous about your putting stats -- which includes being meticulous (and quite accurate) about estimating your putt lengths.

> > > >

> > > > Most people miss a lot of 4.5 to 6-foot putts that IN THEIR MIND are 3-footers. 3 feet, when you really put the ball down and use a measuring stick feels like a gimme when you're putting well. I'm not talking about YOU, necessarily, just about putting, in general. :-)

> > >

> > > Do you use Decade actively? The regular version or elite?

> >

> >

>

> So no? I've thought about signing up but never have.

 

 

[Ty_Webb]

> @Obee said:

> > @"rich s" said:

> > Obee, curious on your thoughts. Last night I hit 9/9 greens in reg. Closest putt was 6' which I made. Next closest was 10' and most were 15-20. I had 18 putts. Now this is not typical but my GIR % lately is very good. If a person could hit every green, what do you think is a good target # of putts on difficult greens. These greens are also HUGE. I think that plays a part in the GIR for me but also hurts the total # of putts.

>

> It's not at all uncommon for miss every single one of your 15 - 20 foot putts in a round -- even if you have a bunch of them. That's just golf and the percentages of putting. Let's say you have 10 of them in a round AND you also tend to slightly underestimate the distance of your putts. So you estimate that you have putts of these lengths:

>

> 18

> 20

> 17

> 16

> 19

> 20

> 20

> 15

> 17

> 18

>

> But in reality, they are:

>

> 19

> 21

> 18.5

> 18

> 20

> 22

> 16

> 19

> 19

>

> Then your average make percentage is somewhere around 12%(?). And that's IF you are as good a putter as the average PGA Tour pro. And of course, you could take a chance at something with a 12% probability of occurring and have it NOT occur ten times in a row. Plenty of times.

>

> For the rest of the stuff, read GioGuy above. Good stuff. Very "Decade" by Scott Fawcett (which is just the right way to play golf, IMHO).

>

> The only really way to know how well you putt compared to the best putters in the world is to be meticulous about your putting stats -- which includes being meticulous (and quite accurate) about estimating your putt lengths.

>

> Most people miss a lot of 4.5 to 6-foot putts that IN THEIR MIND are 3-footers. 3 feet, when you really put the ball down and use a measuring stick feels like a gimme when you're putting well. I'm not talking about YOU, necessarily, just about putting, in general. :-)

 

Exactly this. It's possible to play a round, have 25 putts and lose strokes to the field (not easy, but possible). Likewise, it's possible to have 36 putts and gain strokes on the field, so total putts isn't really a good thing to keep track of, certainly not over 1 round. Much better to keep track of what putts you're actually hitting and make note of it all. Mark Broadie's book has the average putts from each distance in it. You can use that to compare yourself with the PGA Tour players. But, it's imperative that if you want to have that be accurate, you need to figure out how long the putts are that you have. Pace them off if you need to. You're going to walk up to the hole after you've hit it anyway, so count your steps when you do. Write it down on your card and then compare with expectation later. If you do that for all your putts you can figure out if it's short putts or long putts that are your problem. Quick tip - if short putts are the problem, then you need to work on your start line. If long putts are the problem, then you need to work on your speed.

[rich_s2]

Thanks Obee, I will do some actual measurements and see how close reality and perception is. Seems like real stats are the next step for me. I will track things better. Appreciate your time

[deaux]

I’ve spent entirely too much time reading through this thread but it’s a great read!

[Shades234]

 

> @deaux said:

> I’ve spent entirely too much time reading through this thread but it’s a great read!

 

Now you're caught up so it will be easy to follow :relieved:

[Shades234]

> @bladehunter said:

> > @Shades234 said:

> > > Just found this. Good stuff from Sabrina Naccarato: (source: https://www.golftec.com/blog/2017/09/golf-stats-pga-tour-putting-averages/)

> >

> > I like that 3-putt game in the video. I'm going to play that tomorrow.

> >

> > To address BH's question about categorizing your game into a WoW style class of plodder, aggressive, etc... I don't think that's very productive. I have never given it much thought before today and I don't see any benefit from assigning yourself a class. If you want to be a [night elf mohawk](

"night elf mohawk"), go ahead, but that doesn't change the fact that you still have to put your ball on that tee peg and make a good strike. Thinking of yourself of aggressive or passive shouldn't effect the cost benefit analysis that you have to make every time you pull a club for your next shot. That decision should be driven by experience and results, not whether you're feeling particularly frisky that morning. If I haven't been driving the ball well in practice, I'm not taking driver when there's trouble right (my miss is a push fade w/ driver). I'll lay back with a 3w and have a mid iron into the green and take my 2-putt par.

> >

> > That being said, practice rounds are different than competitive rounds. If you're out there by yourself and working on something, you should be pushing your limits and trying different shots. However, when I play a tournament, I've started forcing myself to not try shots that I haven't tried before or worked on in practice. Sometimes I can't avoid it, but the best example right for me right now is on par 3's. If the pin is set on the right side in a perfect spot to fade the ball in, I'll aim at the flag and play my draw. I don't have enough reps in practice to hit that fade with any certainty. I'll accept middle or left side of the green and 2 putt rather than stand over my ball subconsciously thinking, "I hope this works."

> >

> > As far as putting goes, I'm also not sure how important it is to strive for the magic 30 putts per round number. I agree that it's a good general number to compare yourself to, but it doesn't factor in your round as a whole. I like to look at my birdie conversion percentage from inside of 10' and number of 3-putts. If I'm converting > 50% of those birdie looks and have a 0 or 1 in the 3-putt column I'm generally happy with my putting that day.

>

>

> And I’d agree with that last part for sure. If I could count on 50% makes from 10 ft and on and had a 0 or 1 for 3 putts. We wouldn’t be discussing this. Lol. And I might have qualified or missed by 1.

>

> Issue is. I score most rounds by 2 putt birdies on par 5s and hitting short irons and wedges tight. I get 4-5 birdies a round this way. When that doesn’t come we see what Happens. What I want to know is which is normal. And by your statement I assume making putts is the normal route. Not scoring the way I’ve been having to do it.

 

10 ft and *in*. I think 50% is a difficult but fair goal. I like to play a game that my friend told me about. You place 6 tees in a circle around the hole at 3'. You repeat for 6' and 9'. This is your 18 hole "course." Your par is 27. Play the course starting from the 3 footers, then 6 footers and finally the 9's. Keep score. The better you get at putting from this distance, the closer to par you will get and eventually surpass. This doesn't quite replicate putting for birdie on the course because you'll have the knowledge of what your 3 and 6' putts did, but it's good because it gives you a score to keep and reference back to over time. The first time I played the game I shot 25. I haven't broken 30 in the dozen or so times I've played after.

 

Also, I think hitting par 5's in 2 is the easiest way to make birdies, but it isn't always possible. I used to play Torrey Pines a lot and in the summer from the back tees that they set out, every par 5 except for one (13 South) is reachable for me. When I played the SD City Am last year, they moved almost all of the par 5 tee boxes back to where the pros play from and every par 5 became either unreachable or a driver + 3w.

 

I think that you're half right though. Hitting scoring clubs close to the hole is half of the equation to scoring. The other half is putting. Making a handful of 6-10 footers. Some of these will be for birdies, some for pars, and some for bogey. Also 3-putt avoidance. I love a stress-free tap-in par. My putting isn't there yet, but it's what I'm striving for. I played the 3-putt game for an hour this morning. My best score was 8. My average score was around 3. Our practice green is difficult, but that scoreline is still very underwhelming. lol

 

Relating back to your prior comment, I wonder how much local knowledge you use in your club events vs actual green reading. If you are using a lot of past knowledge when you're "reading" greens, maybe your pace of play isn't actually sustainable at less familiar courses under competition.

[bladehunter]

> @Shades234 said:

> > @bladehunter said:

> > > @Shades234 said:

> > > > Just found this. Good stuff from Sabrina Naccarato: (source: https://www.golftec.com/blog/2017/09/golf-stats-pga-tour-putting-averages/)

> > >

> > > I like that 3-putt game in the video. I'm going to play that tomorrow.

> > >

> > > To address BH's question about categorizing your game into a WoW style class of plodder, aggressive, etc... I don't think that's very productive. I have never given it much thought before today and I don't see any benefit from assigning yourself a class. If you want to be a [night elf mohawk](

"night elf mohawk"), go ahead, but that doesn't change the fact that you still have to put your ball on that tee peg and make a good strike. Thinking of yourself of aggressive or passive shouldn't effect the cost benefit analysis that you have to make every time you pull a club for your next shot. That decision should be driven by experience and results, not whether you're feeling particularly frisky that morning. If I haven't been driving the ball well in practice, I'm not taking driver when there's trouble right (my miss is a push fade w/ driver). I'll lay back with a 3w and have a mid iron into the green and take my 2-putt par.

> > >

> > > That being said, practice rounds are different than competitive rounds. If you're out there by yourself and working on something, you should be pushing your limits and trying different shots. However, when I play a tournament, I've started forcing myself to not try shots that I haven't tried before or worked on in practice. Sometimes I can't avoid it, but the best example right for me right now is on par 3's. If the pin is set on the right side in a perfect spot to fade the ball in, I'll aim at the flag and play my draw. I don't have enough reps in practice to hit that fade with any certainty. I'll accept middle or left side of the green and 2 putt rather than stand over my ball subconsciously thinking, "I hope this works."

> > >

> > > As far as putting goes, I'm also not sure how important it is to strive for the magic 30 putts per round number. I agree that it's a good general number to compare yourself to, but it doesn't factor in your round as a whole. I like to look at my birdie conversion percentage from inside of 10' and number of 3-putts. If I'm converting > 50% of those birdie looks and have a 0 or 1 in the 3-putt column I'm generally happy with my putting that day.

> >

> >

> > And I’d agree with that last part for sure. If I could count on 50% makes from 10 ft and on and had a 0 or 1 for 3 putts. We wouldn’t be discussing this. Lol. And I might have qualified or missed by 1.

> >

> > Issue is. I score most rounds by 2 putt birdies on par 5s and hitting short irons and wedges tight. I get 4-5 birdies a round this way. When that doesn’t come we see what Happens. What I want to know is which is normal. And by your statement I assume making putts is the normal route. Not scoring the way I’ve been having to do it.

>

> 10 ft and *in*. I think 50% is a difficult but fair goal. I like to play a game that my friend told me about. You place 6 tees in a circle around the hole at 3'. You repeat for 6' and 9'. This is your 18 hole "course." Your par is 27. Play the course starting from the 3 footers, then 6 footers and finally the 9's. Keep score. The better you get at putting from this distance, the closer to par you will get and eventually surpass. This doesn't quite replicate putting for birdie on the course because you'll have the knowledge of what your 3 and 6' putts did, but it's good because it gives you a score to keep and reference back to over time. The first time I played the game I shot 25. I haven't broken 30 in the dozen or so times I've played after.

>

> Also, I think hitting par 5's in 2 is the easiest way to make birdies, but it isn't always possible. I used to play Torrey Pines a lot and in the summer from the back tees that they set out, every par 5 except for one (13 South) is reachable for me. When I played the SD City Am last year, they moved almost all of the par 5 tee boxes back to where the pros play from and every par 5 became either unreachable or a driver + 3w.

>

> I think that you're half right though. Hitting scoring clubs close to the hole is half of the equation to scoring. The other half is putting. Making a handful of 6-10 footers. Some of these will be for birdies, some for pars, and some for bogey. Also 3-putt avoidance. I love a stress-free tap-in par. My putting isn't there yet, but it's what I'm striving for. I played the 3-putt game for an hour this morning. My best score was 8. My average score was around 3. Our practice green is difficult, but that scoreline is still very underwhelming. lol

>

> Relating back to your prior comment, I wonder how much local knowledge you use in your club events vs actual green reading. If you are using a lot of past knowledge when you're "reading" greens, maybe your pace of play isn't actually sustainable at less familiar courses under competition.

 

Yep. As I reflect more today I’d say you hit the nail on the head. I probably do have most putts memorized at home. Even though they are very slopy and hard greens to make putts on. I agree with prettt much everything you , Obee and Thinking plus said. And I appreciate you guys and gal listening to me gripe ( whine).

 

That being said. I flipped the switch today. I’m over Monday and looking ahead. Next weekend is my 3 day county Am , which is one of my favorite events of the year. Average winning score is - 8 over last 4 years. With a couple years that went into double digits under par. So my realistic goals are to play 3 focused rounds , and get into a late tee time Sunday. Anything after noon will be in the mix with the best players. I’d like to feel a little heat for trying to climb the board against my group instead of the early times where it feels like a consolation round with no real shot to move much. I’ve done that enough to know. There are some invite spots open to top 15 finishers etc for some team events later in the year etc. so good incentives to place well other than the obvious confidence boost.

 

 

 

 

[Obee]

Can't wait to see the results!

 

Enjoy, and play for the love of the game/challenge and for yourself.

 

> @bladehunter said:

> > @Shades234 said:

> > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > @Shades234 said:

> > > > > Just found this. Good stuff from Sabrina Naccarato: (source: https://www.golftec.com/blog/2017/09/golf-stats-pga-tour-putting-averages/)

> > > >

> > > > I like that 3-putt game in the video. I'm going to play that tomorrow.

> > > >

> > > > To address BH's question about categorizing your game into a WoW style class of plodder, aggressive, etc... I don't think that's very productive. I have never given it much thought before today and I don't see any benefit from assigning yourself a class. If you want to be a [night elf mohawk](

"night elf mohawk"), go ahead, but that doesn't change the fact that you still have to put your ball on that tee peg and make a good strike. Thinking of yourself of aggressive or passive shouldn't effect the cost benefit analysis that you have to make every time you pull a club for your next shot. That decision should be driven by experience and results, not whether you're feeling particularly frisky that morning. If I haven't been driving the ball well in practice, I'm not taking driver when there's trouble right (my miss is a push fade w/ driver). I'll lay back with a 3w and have a mid iron into the green and take my 2-putt par.

> > > >

> > > > That being said, practice rounds are different than competitive rounds. If you're out there by yourself and working on something, you should be pushing your limits and trying different shots. However, when I play a tournament, I've started forcing myself to not try shots that I haven't tried before or worked on in practice. Sometimes I can't avoid it, but the best example right for me right now is on par 3's. If the pin is set on the right side in a perfect spot to fade the ball in, I'll aim at the flag and play my draw. I don't have enough reps in practice to hit that fade with any certainty. I'll accept middle or left side of the green and 2 putt rather than stand over my ball subconsciously thinking, "I hope this works."

> > > >

> > > > As far as putting goes, I'm also not sure how important it is to strive for the magic 30 putts per round number. I agree that it's a good general number to compare yourself to, but it doesn't factor in your round as a whole. I like to look at my birdie conversion percentage from inside of 10' and number of 3-putts. If I'm converting > 50% of those birdie looks and have a 0 or 1 in the 3-putt column I'm generally happy with my putting that day.

> > >

> > >

> > > And I’d agree with that last part for sure. If I could count on 50% makes from 10 ft and on and had a 0 or 1 for 3 putts. We wouldn’t be discussing this. Lol. And I might have qualified or missed by 1.

> > >

> > > Issue is. I score most rounds by 2 putt birdies on par 5s and hitting short irons and wedges tight. I get 4-5 birdies a round this way. When that doesn’t come we see what Happens. What I want to know is which is normal. And by your statement I assume making putts is the normal route. Not scoring the way I’ve been having to do it.

> >

> > 10 ft and *in*. I think 50% is a difficult but fair goal. I like to play a game that my friend told me about. You place 6 tees in a circle around the hole at 3'. You repeat for 6' and 9'. This is your 18 hole "course." Your par is 27. Play the course starting from the 3 footers, then 6 footers and finally the 9's. Keep score. The better you get at putting from this distance, the closer to par you will get and eventually surpass. This doesn't quite replicate putting for birdie on the course because you'll have the knowledge of what your 3 and 6' putts did, but it's good because it gives you a score to keep and reference back to over time. The first time I played the game I shot 25. I haven't broken 30 in the dozen or so times I've played after.

> >

> > Also, I think hitting par 5's in 2 is the easiest way to make birdies, but it isn't always possible. I used to play Torrey Pines a lot and in the summer from the back tees that they set out, every par 5 except for one (13 South) is reachable for me. When I played the SD City Am last year, they moved almost all of the par 5 tee boxes back to where the pros play from and every par 5 became either unreachable or a driver + 3w.

> >

> > I think that you're half right though. Hitting scoring clubs close to the hole is half of the equation to scoring. The other half is putting. Making a handful of 6-10 footers. Some of these will be for birdies, some for pars, and some for bogey. Also 3-putt avoidance. I love a stress-free tap-in par. My putting isn't there yet, but it's what I'm striving for. I played the 3-putt game for an hour this morning. My best score was 8. My average score was around 3. Our practice green is difficult, but that scoreline is still very underwhelming. lol

> >

> > Relating back to your prior comment, I wonder how much local knowledge you use in your club events vs actual green reading. If you are using a lot of past knowledge when you're "reading" greens, maybe your pace of play isn't actually sustainable at less familiar courses under competition.

>

> Yep. As I reflect more today I’d say you hit the nail on the head. I probably do have most putts memorized at home. Even though they are very slopy and hard greens to make putts on. I agree with prettt much everything you , Obee and Thinking plus said. And I appreciate you guys and gal listening to me gripe ( whine).

>

> That being said. I flipped the switch today. I’m over Monday and looking ahead. Next weekend is my 3 day county Am , which is one of my favorite events of the year. Average winning score is - 8 over last 4 years. With a couple years that went into double digits under par. So my realistic goals are to play 3 focused rounds , and get into a late tee time Sunday. Anything after noon will be in the mix with the best players. I’d like to feel a little heat for trying to climb the board against my group instead of the early times where it feels like a consolation round with no real shot to move much. I’ve done that enough to know. There are some invite spots open to top 15 finishers etc for some team events later in the year etc. so good incentives to place well other than the obvious confidence boost.

>

>

>

>

 

 

[Obee]

I'm in the finals of my club's Match Play Club Championship tomorrow.

Won my first three matches:

 

5&3 (even at the time)

4&2 (1-under at the time)

19th Hole (2-under)

 

Playing very consistent golf right now, but my opponent is a very, very good player (here's his last 20):

 

* H 6/19 69 71.3/129 -2.0

* H 6/19 70 71.3/129 -1.1

* H 6/19 67 71.3/129 -3.8

* H 6/19 70 71.3/129 -1.1

* H 6/19 68 71.3/129 -2.9

H 6/19 71 71.3/129 -0.3

H 6/19 79 71.3/129 6.7

* H 6/19 66 71.3/129 -4.6

H 6/19 72 71.3/129 0.6

H 5/19 70 71.3/129 -1.1

* H 5/19 69 71.3/129 -2.0

H 5/19 72 71.3/129 0.6

H 5/19 70 71.3/129 -1.1

* H 5/19 69 71.3/129 -2.0

H 5/19 74 71.3/129 2.4

H 5/19 72 71.3/129 0.6

* H 5/19 67 71.3/129 -3.8

* H 5/19 66 71.3/129 -4.6

H 5/19 71 71.3/129 -0.3

H 5/19 71 71.3/129 -0.3

 

I will need to play a solid round of golf to beat him. He's 40ish and hits the ball 50 - 60 past me. Four of our last five holes are par 5's, so I need to be 1 or 2 up going into 14. He just dominates them with his length. He's got a bit of chipping yips going right now, but I'm not going to count on that. Need to play my game and if it's good enough, it's good enough. Minimum 2-under is probably what I need to shoot to give myself a good chance of beating him.

[Ty_Webb]

> @Obee said:

> I'm in the finals of my club's Match Play Club Championship tomorrow.

> Won my first three matches:

>

> 5&3 (even at the time)

> 4&2 (1-under at the time)

> 19th Hole (2-under)

>

> Playing very consistent golf right now, but my opponent is a very, very good player (here's his last 20):

>

> * H 6/19 69 71.3/129 -2.0

> * H 6/19 70 71.3/129 -1.1

> * H 6/19 67 71.3/129 -3.8

> * H 6/19 70 71.3/129 -1.1

> * H 6/19 68 71.3/129 -2.9

> H 6/19 71 71.3/129 -0.3

> H 6/19 79 71.3/129 6.7

> * H 6/19 66 71.3/129 -4.6

> H 6/19 72 71.3/129 0.6

> H 5/19 70 71.3/129 -1.1

> * H 5/19 69 71.3/129 -2.0

> H 5/19 72 71.3/129 0.6

> H 5/19 70 71.3/129 -1.1

> * H 5/19 69 71.3/129 -2.0

> H 5/19 74 71.3/129 2.4

> H 5/19 72 71.3/129 0.6

> * H 5/19 67 71.3/129 -3.8

> * H 5/19 66 71.3/129 -4.6

> H 5/19 71 71.3/129 -0.3

> H 5/19 71 71.3/129 -0.3

>

> I will need to play a solid round of golf to beat him. He's 40ish and hits the ball 50 - 60 past me. Four of our last five holes are par 5's, so I need to be 1 or 2 up going into 14. He just dominates them with his length. He's got a bit of chipping yips going right now, but I'm not going to count on that. Need to play my game and if it's good enough, it's good enough. Minimum 2-under is probably what I need to shoot to give myself a good chance of beating him.

 

Do you get shots or is it flat? That’s some impressive scoring right there. Either way good luck and have fun out there. I will say the chip yips suck but if you hit enough greens you can get away with it.

[Whiskey_fire]

I’m predicting you make a bomb on 18 to win 1 up.

 

> @Obee said:

> I'm in the finals of my club's Match Play Club Championship tomorrow.

> Won my first three matches:

>

> 5&3 (even at the time)

> 4&2 (1-under at the time)

> 19th Hole (2-under)

>

> Playing very consistent golf right now, but my opponent is a very, very good player (here's his last 20):

>

> * H 6/19 69 71.3/129 -2.0

> * H 6/19 70 71.3/129 -1.1

> * H 6/19 67 71.3/129 -3.8

> * H 6/19 70 71.3/129 -1.1

> * H 6/19 68 71.3/129 -2.9

> H 6/19 71 71.3/129 -0.3

> H 6/19 79 71.3/129 6.7

> * H 6/19 66 71.3/129 -4.6

> H 6/19 72 71.3/129 0.6

> H 5/19 70 71.3/129 -1.1

> * H 5/19 69 71.3/129 -2.0

> H 5/19 72 71.3/129 0.6

> H 5/19 70 71.3/129 -1.1

> * H 5/19 69 71.3/129 -2.0

> H 5/19 74 71.3/129 2.4

> H 5/19 72 71.3/129 0.6

> * H 5/19 67 71.3/129 -3.8

> * H 5/19 66 71.3/129 -4.6

> H 5/19 71 71.3/129 -0.3

> H 5/19 71 71.3/129 -0.3

>

> I will need to play a solid round of golf to beat him. He's 40ish and hits the ball 50 - 60 past me. Four of our last five holes are par 5's, so I need to be 1 or 2 up going into 14. He just dominates them with his length. He's got a bit of chipping yips going right now, but I'm not going to count on that. Need to play my game and if it's good enough, it's good enough. Minimum 2-under is probably what I need to shoot to give myself a good chance of beating him.

 

 

[Obee]

Not shots. He's currently a +3. I'm a +1.

 

My scores at the club:

 

H 6/29/2019 72 71.3/129 0.6 Victoria Club

 

H 6/28/2019 72 71.3/129 0.6 Victoria Club

 

H 6/23/2019 72 71.3/129 0.6 Victoria Club

 

H 6/22/2019 69 71.3/129 -2.0 Victoria Club

 

H 6/21/2019 71 71.3/129 -0.3 Victoria Club

 

H 6/16/2019 73 71.3/129 1.5 Victoria Club

 

H 6/15/2019 73 71.3/129 1.5 Victoria Club

 

H 5/17/2019 70 71.3/129 -1.1 Victoria Club

 

H 5/15/2019 75 71.3/129 3.2 Victoria Club

 

H 5/11/2019 73 71.3/129 1.5 Victoria Club

 

H 5/10/2019 75 71.3/129 3.2 Victoria Club

 

H 5/5/2019 71 71.3/129 -0.3 Victoria Club

 

H 5/4/2019 67 71.3/129 -3.8 Victoria Club

 

H 5/3/2019 72 71.3/129 0.6 Victoria Club

 

H 4/21/2019 69 71.3/129 -2.0 Victoria Club

 

H 4/20/2019 74 71.3/129 2.4 Victoria Club

 

H 4/19/2019 72 71.3/129 0.6 Victoria Club

 

H 4/14/2019 69 71.3/129 -2.0 Victoria Club

 

H 4/13/2019 71 70.2/126 0.7 Victoria Club White Tees - Vic

 

> @Ty_Webb said:

> > @Obee said:

> > I'm in the finals of my club's Match Play Club Championship tomorrow.

> > Won my first three matches:

> >

> > 5&3 (even at the time)

> > 4&2 (1-under at the time)

> > 19th Hole (2-under)

> >

> > Playing very consistent golf right now, but my opponent is a very, very good player (here's his last 20):

> >

> > * H 6/19 69 71.3/129 -2.0

> > * H 6/19 70 71.3/129 -1.1

> > * H 6/19 67 71.3/129 -3.8

> > * H 6/19 70 71.3/129 -1.1

> > * H 6/19 68 71.3/129 -2.9

> > H 6/19 71 71.3/129 -0.3

> > H 6/19 79 71.3/129 6.7

> > * H 6/19 66 71.3/129 -4.6

> > H 6/19 72 71.3/129 0.6

> > H 5/19 70 71.3/129 -1.1

> > * H 5/19 69 71.3/129 -2.0

> > H 5/19 72 71.3/129 0.6

> > H 5/19 70 71.3/129 -1.1

> > * H 5/19 69 71.3/129 -2.0

> > H 5/19 74 71.3/129 2.4

> > H 5/19 72 71.3/129 0.6

> > * H 5/19 67 71.3/129 -3.8

> > * H 5/19 66 71.3/129 -4.6

> > H 5/19 71 71.3/129 -0.3

> > H 5/19 71 71.3/129 -0.3

> >

> > I will need to play a solid round of golf to beat him. He's 40ish and hits the ball 50 - 60 past me. Four of our last five holes are par 5's, so I need to be 1 or 2 up going into 14. He just dominates them with his length. He's got a bit of chipping yips going right now, but I'm not going to count on that. Need to play my game and if it's good enough, it's good enough. Minimum 2-under is probably what I need to shoot to give myself a good chance of beating him.

>

> Do you get shots or is it flat? That’s some impressive scoring right there. Either way good luck and have fun out there. I will say the chip yips suck but if you hit enough greens you can get away with it.

 

 

[Obee]

> @Whiskey_fire said:

> I’m predicting you make a bomb on 18 to win 1 up.

 

I hope I don't have to make a bomb! It's a 3-shot par 5 with a cross-hazard running in front of the green. Should be inside 15 feet in 3. :-)

[Shades234]

> @Obee said:

> Playing very consistent golf right now, but my opponent is a very, very good player (here's his last 20):

>

> * H 6/19 69 71.3/129 -2.0

> * H 6/19 70 71.3/129 -1.1

> * H 6/19 67 71.3/129 -3.8

> * H 6/19 70 71.3/129 -1.1

> * H 6/19 68 71.3/129 -2.9

> H 6/19 71 71.3/129 -0.3

> H 6/19 79 71.3/129 6.7

> * H 6/19 66 71.3/129 -4.6

> H 6/19 72 71.3/129 0.6

> H 5/19 70 71.3/129 -1.1

> * H 5/19 69 71.3/129 -2.0

> H 5/19 72 71.3/129 0.6

> H 5/19 70 71.3/129 -1.1

> * H 5/19 69 71.3/129 -2.0

> H 5/19 74 71.3/129 2.4

> H 5/19 72 71.3/129 0.6

> * H 5/19 67 71.3/129 -3.8

> * H 5/19 66 71.3/129 -4.6

> H 5/19 71 71.3/129 -0.3

> H 5/19 71 71.3/129 -0.3

 

I don't see an "T" rounds in his last 20. You got him.

 

[Ty_Webb]

> @Shades234 said:

> > @Obee said:

> > Playing very consistent golf right now, but my opponent is a very, very good player (here's his last 20):

> >

> > * H 6/19 69 71.3/129 -2.0

> > * H 6/19 70 71.3/129 -1.1

> > * H 6/19 67 71.3/129 -3.8

> > * H 6/19 70 71.3/129 -1.1

> > * H 6/19 68 71.3/129 -2.9

> > H 6/19 71 71.3/129 -0.3

> > H 6/19 79 71.3/129 6.7

> > * H 6/19 66 71.3/129 -4.6

> > H 6/19 72 71.3/129 0.6

> > H 5/19 70 71.3/129 -1.1

> > * H 5/19 69 71.3/129 -2.0

> > H 5/19 72 71.3/129 0.6

> > H 5/19 70 71.3/129 -1.1

> > * H 5/19 69 71.3/129 -2.0

> > H 5/19 74 71.3/129 2.4

> > H 5/19 72 71.3/129 0.6

> > * H 5/19 67 71.3/129 -3.8

> > * H 5/19 66 71.3/129 -4.6

> > H 5/19 71 71.3/129 -0.3

> > H 5/19 71 71.3/129 -0.3

>

> I don't see an "T" rounds in his last 20. You got him.

>

 

I’m also seeing all 20 rounds in the last two months. Excluding one week, that’s more rounds than I have in the last 12 months. And all of them at their club. Child’s play! Though I note Obee is only just behind on that count

[Shades234]

> @Ty_Webb said:

> > @Shades234 said:

> > > @Obee said:

> > > Playing very consistent golf right now, but my opponent is a very, very good player (here's his last 20):

> > >

> > > * H 6/19 69 71.3/129 -2.0

> > > * H 6/19 70 71.3/129 -1.1

> > > * H 6/19 67 71.3/129 -3.8

> > > * H 6/19 70 71.3/129 -1.1

> > > * H 6/19 68 71.3/129 -2.9

> > > H 6/19 71 71.3/129 -0.3

> > > H 6/19 79 71.3/129 6.7

> > > * H 6/19 66 71.3/129 -4.6

> > > H 6/19 72 71.3/129 0.6

> > > H 5/19 70 71.3/129 -1.1

> > > * H 5/19 69 71.3/129 -2.0

> > > H 5/19 72 71.3/129 0.6

> > > H 5/19 70 71.3/129 -1.1

> > > * H 5/19 69 71.3/129 -2.0

> > > H 5/19 74 71.3/129 2.4

> > > H 5/19 72 71.3/129 0.6

> > > * H 5/19 67 71.3/129 -3.8

> > > * H 5/19 66 71.3/129 -4.6

> > > H 5/19 71 71.3/129 -0.3

> > > H 5/19 71 71.3/129 -0.3

> >

> > I don't see an "T" rounds in his last 20. You got him.

> >

>

> I’m also seeing all 20 rounds in the last two months. Excluding one week, that’s more rounds than I have in the last 12 months. And all of them at their club. Child’s play! Though I note Obee is only just behind on that count

 

Dude is on the grind. I respect it. I think I played 11x last month, but 4 of those rounds were last weekend.

[Obee]

Boom!!!

 

Got it done!!! 20 holes!!!!

[Obee]

 

[CDLgolf]

Isnt the distance on the tour for making a put 50% of the time 7'8" ? If thats the distance for the best in the world I'm not sure how low to scratch guys are going to to do much better than that in tournament conditions. Maybe expectations are a little high.

[Obee]

Yes, expectations are, indeed, key.

 

But I absolutely use "middle of the tour' putting stats as my goal. My 3-putt avoidance is right there in the middle of the tour, for instance. Ditto my putts per round.

 

I know plenty of top mid-ams and senior ams who putt it as well as mid-level Tour putters, for instance. But they do NOT have total package, obviously, or they would be on Tour.

 

 

> @CDLgolf said:

> Isnt the distance on the tour for making a put 50% of the time 7'8" ? If thats the distance for the best in the world I'm not sure how low to scratch guys are going to to do much better than that in tournament conditions. Maybe expectations are a little high.

 

 

[bladehunter]

> @Obee said:

>

>

 

Good looking card big man !! I bet that was a good match to watch. ! Great to hear it !

[CDLgolf]

> @Obee said:

> Yes, expectations are, indeed, key.

>

> But I absolutely use "middle of the tour' putting stats as my goal. My 3-putt avoidance is right there in the middle of the tour, for instance. Ditto my putts per round.

>

> I know plenty of top mid-ams and senior ams who putt it as well as mid-level Tour putters, for instance. But they do NOT have total package, obviously, or they would be on Tour.

>

>

> > @CDLgolf said:

> > Isnt the distance on the tour for making a put 50% of the time 7'8" ? If thats the distance for the best in the world I'm not sure how low to scratch guys are going to to do much better than that in tournament conditions. Maybe expectations are a little high.

>

>

 

Sure I understand that and it seems like a realistic goal but seeing goals of 50 % for 10' and someone who makes every 6' to 10' putt they look at are unrealistic goals and may cause un needed frustration. Just trying to look at it from another point of view

[Obee]

 

Agree completely.

> @CDLgolf said:

> > @Obee said:

> > Yes, expectations are, indeed, key.

> >

> > But I absolutely use "middle of the tour' putting stats as my goal. My 3-putt avoidance is right there in the middle of the tour, for instance. Ditto my putts per round.

> >

> > I know plenty of top mid-ams and senior ams who putt it as well as mid-level Tour putters, for instance. But they do NOT have total package, obviously, or they would be on Tour.

> >

> >

> > > @CDLgolf said:

> > > Isnt the distance on the tour for making a put 50% of the time 7'8" ? If thats the distance for the best in the world I'm not sure how low to scratch guys are going to to do much better than that in tournament conditions. Maybe expectations are a little high.

> >

> >

>

> Sure I understand that and it seems like a realistic goal but seeing goals of 50 % for 10' and someone who makes every 6' to 10' putt they look at are unrealistic goals and may cause un needed frustration. Just trying to look at it from another point of view

 

 

[golfortennis]

So I hesitated in posting here. Canadian who doesn't go south for the winter, so having decent handicap is only part of the equation. Having to work off rust is a concern, considering our mid-am qualifying is in May. (The Canadian system is qualify for provincial, then top finishers at provincial make national....which I have a few issues with, but early qualifying is a big one).

 

Anyway, I had entered qualifying, thinking my 3.5 handicap gave me a shot to get through. Typically if you shoot 80 or better you get through. Partly due to weather, the preparation was not where I would have wanted it to be. It had rained so much that our course was closed as many days as it was open. Come qualifying day, we tee off in a downpour that lasted 8 holes. My first tee shot goes left into some trees, coming to rest in a hole under a root. So an unplayable right off the tee. Hither and yon, led to a smooth 89. Although I did have a birdie and 8 or nine pars, but I also had a couple triples and a quad. I wasn't last but I sure as heck wasn't qualifying. While weather had something to do with it, I had shot a 77 on the same course the day before. Tournaments are a whole different game.

 

I read this thread, and one post really stuck out: tournament golf requires a brutally honest assessment of your game. A friend of mine who was a former pro had caddied for me in the qualifier so I asked him if I was dreaming in trying to qualify with my current game. He said yes I was. I was one-dimensional, and I don't have shots. Which really stung me because I always liked to think of myself as a shotmaker. But he was right. As was said, a brutally honest assessment. So I have played another tournament in the meantime, with no much better results(actually had a lost ball off the first tee, although this one was unreal that it could not be found), but I did have a few shots where I was able to start doing something more than just hit it high and far. My pro is in Florida so it will be a while before I can work with him, but when I told him I wanted to learn to hit a few shots, he said "that's my favorite kind of teaching." So there will be something to look forward to there. I have been trying to think a bit differently on the course, and am seeing a few things start to change.

 

Not sure if I will have anymore tournaments this season, but will want to try to keep things going. Thanks for reading. hopefully I have some good news next season.

[Obee]

So glad you posted. That's what this thread is all about. And that was I who mentioned the "brutal honesty" thing. Glad you took that as intended. It's not meant to be a downer, it's meant to get people in the right frame of reference going forward : If you want to compete at the regional level, you can't have more than probably one true weakness in your game. And that's in the many, many "sub-areas" of the game.

 

Figure out where you suck. Own it. Improve it. :-)

 

Best of luck to you!!

 

> @Bluefan75 said:

> So I hesitated in posting here. Canadian who doesn't go south for the winter, so having decent handicap is only part of the equation. Having to work off rust is a concern, considering our mid-am qualifying is in May. (The Canadian system is qualify for provincial, then top finishers at provincial make national....which I have a few issues with, but early qualifying is a big one).

>

> Anyway, I had entered qualifying, thinking my 3.5 handicap gave me a shot to get through. Typically if you shoot 80 or better you get through. Partly due to weather, the preparation was not where I would have wanted it to be. It had rained so much that our course was closed as many days as it was open. Come qualifying day, we tee off in a downpour that lasted 8 holes. My first tee shot goes left into some trees, coming to rest in a hole under a root. So an unplayable right off the tee. Hither and yon, led to a smooth 89. Although I did have a birdie and 8 or nine pars, but I also had a couple triples and a quad. I wasn't last but I sure as heck wasn't qualifying. While weather had something to do with it, I had shot a 77 on the same course the day before. Tournaments are a whole different game.

>

> I read this thread, and one post really stuck out: tournament golf requires a brutally honest assessment of your game. A friend of mine who was a former pro had caddied for me in the qualifier so I asked him if I was dreaming in trying to qualify with my current game. He said yes I was. I was one-dimensional, and I don't have shots. Which really stung me because I always liked to think of myself as a shotmaker. But he was right. As was said, a brutally honest assessment. So I have played another tournament in the meantime, with no much better results(actually had a lost ball off the first tee, although this one was unreal that it could not be found), but I did have a few shots where I was able to start doing something more than just hit it high and far. My pro is in Florida so it will be a while before I can work with him, but when I told him I wanted to learn to hit a few shots, he said "that's my favorite kind of teaching." So there will be something to look forward to there. I have been trying to think a bit differently on the course, and am seeing a few things start to change.

>

> Not sure if I will have anymore tournaments this season, but will want to try to keep things going. Thanks for reading. hopefully I have some good news next season.

 

 

[ThinkingPlus]

> @Obee said:

>

>

 

Nice win. Looks like your opponent finally cracked on the last although you buried him anyway.

[Ty_Webb]

> @Obee said:

>

> Agree completely.

> > @CDLgolf said:

> > > @Obee said:

> > > Yes, expectations are, indeed, key.

> > >

> > > But I absolutely use "middle of the tour' putting stats as my goal. My 3-putt avoidance is right there in the middle of the tour, for instance. Ditto my putts per round.

> > >

> > > I know plenty of top mid-ams and senior ams who putt it as well as mid-level Tour putters, for instance. But they do NOT have total package, obviously, or they would be on Tour.

> > >

> > >

> > > > @CDLgolf said:

> > > > Isnt the distance on the tour for making a put 50% of the time 7'8" ? If thats the distance for the best in the world I'm not sure how low to scratch guys are going to to do much better than that in tournament conditions. Maybe expectations are a little high.

> > >

> > >

> >

> > Sure I understand that and it seems like a realistic goal but seeing goals of 50 % for 10' and someone who makes every 6' to 10' putt they look at are unrealistic goals and may cause un needed frustration. Just trying to look at it from another point of view

>

>

 

Likewise. I would add two thoughts. One the pga tour players are playing on pristine greens week in week out. I used to play in a putting tournament. It was 8 teams of 4 players. You play an 18 hole putting match against each other player with the same number in the team as you. By the time you’re playing your 6th or 7th match on a green that is basically perfect, the 6 footers feel like 3 footers. Great fun. That’s basically what the pros are doing all the time.

 

The other thing is I think it’s highly unlikely that the best putters in the world are on the pga tour. Conversely I think it’s highly unlikely that the best iron players and drivers are not on the pga tour. Anyone can be a great putter. There are physical limitations to being a world class long game player. No such limitation for putting or short game.

[SandPiper]

Well said. Tournament golf is about dropping putts for sure. Tired of gettn under the gun and not burying the 3-6’ to keep momentum

> @Ty_Webb said:

> > @Obee said:

> >

> > Agree completely.

> > > @CDLgolf said:

> > > > @Obee said:

> > > > Yes, expectations are, indeed, key.

> > > >

> > > > But I absolutely use "middle of the tour' putting stats as my goal. My 3-putt avoidance is right there in the middle of the tour, for instance. Ditto my putts per round.

> > > >

> > > > I know plenty of top mid-ams and senior ams who putt it as well as mid-level Tour putters, for instance. But they do NOT have total package, obviously, or they would be on Tour.

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > > @CDLgolf said:

> > > > > Isnt the distance on the tour for making a put 50% of the time 7'8" ? If thats the distance for the best in the world I'm not sure how low to scratch guys are going to to do much better than that in tournament conditions. Maybe expectations are a little high.

> > > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > Sure I understand that and it seems like a realistic goal but seeing goals of 50 % for 10' and someone who makes every 6' to 10' putt they look at are unrealistic goals and may cause un needed frustration. Just trying to look at it from another point of view

> >

> >

>

> Likewise. I would add two thoughts. One the pga tour players are playing on pristine greens week in week out. I used to play in a putting tournament. It was 8 teams of 4 players. You play an 18 hole putting match against each other player with the same number in the team as you. By the time you’re playing your 6th or 7th match on a green that is basically perfect, the 6 footers feel like 3 footers. Great fun. That’s basically what the pros are doing all the time.

>

> The other thing is I think it’s highly unlikely that the best putters in the world are on the pga tour. Conversely I think it’s highly unlikely that the best iron players and drivers are not on the pga tour. Anyone can be a great putter. There are physical limitations to being a world class long game player. No such limitation for putting or short game.

 

 

[Ray Jackson]

> @Ty_Webb said:

> > @Obee said:

> > > @"rich s" said:

> > > Obee, curious on your thoughts. Last night I hit 9/9 greens in reg. Closest putt was 6' which I made. Next closest was 10' and most were 15-20. I had 18 putts. Now this is not typical but my GIR % lately is very good. If a person could hit every green, what do you think is a good target # of putts on difficult greens. These greens are also HUGE. I think that plays a part in the GIR for me but also hurts the total # of putts.

> >

> > It's not at all uncommon for miss every single one of your 15 - 20 foot putts in a round -- even if you have a bunch of them. That's just golf and the percentages of putting. Let's say you have 10 of them in a round AND you also tend to slightly underestimate the distance of your putts. So you estimate that you have putts of these lengths:

> >

> > 18

> > 20

> > 17

> > 16

> > 19

> > 20

> > 20

> > 15

> > 17

> > 18

> >

> > But in reality, they are:

> >

> > 19

> > 21

> > 18.5

> > 18

> > 20

> > 22

> > 16

> > 19

> > 19

> >

> > Then your average make percentage is somewhere around 12%(?). And that's IF you are as good a putter as the average PGA Tour pro. And of course, you could take a chance at something with a 12% probability of occurring and have it NOT occur ten times in a row. Plenty of times.

> >

> > For the rest of the stuff, read GioGuy above. Good stuff. Very "Decade" by Scott Fawcett (which is just the right way to play golf, IMHO).

> >

> > The only really way to know how well you putt compared to the best putters in the world is to be meticulous about your putting stats -- which includes being meticulous (and quite accurate) about estimating your putt lengths.

> >

> > Most people miss a lot of 4.5 to 6-foot putts that IN THEIR MIND are 3-footers. 3 feet, when you really put the ball down and use a measuring stick feels like a gimme when you're putting well. I'm not talking about YOU, necessarily, just about putting, in general. :-)

>

> Exactly this. It's possible to play a round, have 25 putts and lose strokes to the field (not easy, but possible). Likewise, it's possible to have 36 putts and gain strokes on the field, so total putts isn't really a good thing to keep track of, certainly not over 1 round. Much better to keep track of what putts you're actually hitting and make note of it all. Mark Broadie's book has the average putts from each distance in it. You can use that to compare yourself with the PGA Tour players. But, it's imperative that if you want to have that be accurate, you need to figure out how long the putts are that you have. Pace them off if you need to. You're going to walk up to the hole after you've hit it anyway, so count your steps when you do. Write it down on your card and then compare with expectation later. If you do that for all your putts you can figure out if it's short putts or long putts that are your problem. Quick tip - if short putts are the problem, then you need to work on your start line. If long putts are the problem, then you need to work on your speed.

Measuring off the putts (pacing them) and recording your yardage on your second shot into the green (you used a scope for the distance) enables you to track proximity as well. Maybe you dont hit it any closer from 130 yds than you do 140-150 so perhaps you can take a more conservative club off the tee, or you need to work on your proximity with wedges etc. You have all the info and its easy to write on the score card.

 

[SandPiper]

I need some good putting games. That 27 hole deal is good but I done have 27 tees to lay around a practice green. They would shew me away to the funny farm