Where are you playing tomorrow - Chicago (Round 3)

[Argonne69]

I've played both. WS is in my Top 10. I don't think Arcadia cracks the Top 50. I know both courses are basically manufactured links-style courses, but IMHO Arcadia was overdone. I thought some of the greens were cartoonish with the slopes. 'Only thing missing was a clown and an outhouse. I do need to play it again to see if my initial experience was simply a one off.

[RobertPaulson]

It's much further for us, but I think Arcadia is head and shoulders above straits. Not sure it's worth the extra drive though. Equidistant, I would play Arcadia 20 times before I played straits.

As with all opinions, reasonable people can disagree.

[dhartmann34]

Thanks! I don't know how you remember with all the courses you've played. ? Have you played the South Course at Arcadia?

[chisag]

... I am not crossing state lines and going to another state to play golf, especially Indiana, Iowa or Wisconsin. There are myriad of reasons but the most relevant for me is my courses are closed and I am under a Stay At Home order. There is a pandemic and we are requested too stay at home to stop the spread, so crossing the border is me not doing my part. If I can make that justification for golf, I have to accept someone else's justification for crossing the state line to come to my neighborhood and bring their kids to my park or neighbors house for a big party or any other reason I personally don't agree with but makes perfect sense to them. As a lifelong hippie I am not a rules guy and have distrusted the establishment my entire life, certainly more now than ever before. But this thing is different and all those fighting Covid deserve respect for doing their part. We know anywhere from 25% - 75% of those with Covid have zero symptoms which explains how this spread so fast and so far. Stay at home means stay at home, not drive to another state and play golf or go to a party or buy/sell guns or ... I could go on and on of course.

... ALL those on the front line are risking their lives as well as working in the most stressful conditions and they certainly deserve that I play by the rules for this short time period we are under a Stay At Home order. Not only the heroically* brave health care workers, but all those keeping genuinely essential business's open from truck drivers to stock clerks to cashiers and many more. If my local course opens in the near future and I can pay by CC, walk with my remote cart and touch nothing but my clubs and ball, get some exercise and some very badly needed enrichment for my soul, I will play. But I am not crossing a border and putting more pressure on a system that needs continuity and most importantly, needs people following the rules. Ymmv ...

 

a word thrown around carelessly but on the money with Covid.

[mci711]

I have played both. I think Arcadia is more fun/dramatic. I think the views are better. I think Whistling is more challenging and penal, probably the better overall layout. It's a great walk, Arcadia is cart golf. They are really close for me. I think sitting on 18 after your round, enjoying a drink and watching the sunset on 18 at Arcadia is the best spot in golf. If that stuff matters to you I rank the setting of Arcadia better than just about anywhere.

*bias i shot 2 under at Arcadia (best round) and got engaged there lol.

 

Also I apologize for getting in between something if there is more there.

[mci711]

This really surprises me. I know we thought the opposite about the castle course and kingsbarns. If I remember correctly you really liked Castle. The castle course to me was the UK version of Arcadia, just crazier. And Kingsbarns was more similar to Straits. Weird we each kind of flipped on that.

[B-Man]

Sounds like my Harbor Shores experience.

[mci711]

I have a goal to play Whistling Straits as the sun rises over lake Michigan and Arcadia as it sets, on the same day.

[chisag]

 

... You and I see golf courses so differently. I followed all your Phoenix reviews and while they were thoughtful and well done, I just feel differently about almost every one. I played 107 out of 117 days last winter there (I know you are wondering why I squandered 10 days LOL) and really loved a bunch of courses, some were average and found quite a few so bad I would never play twice if the second round was free. I was renting a house on Ahwatukee and other than hitting some irons at dark on the hole I lived on, after walking it once I would not play that course if they paid me to do so. And you gave it a similar rating with courses I enjoyed. But what got me is how many courses I loved or at least really liked you gave a 3.5-4.5 on a scale of 10. I would give Aguila around an 8 considering condition, lay out, challenge, wildlife and the fact that it cost $17 to walk at twilite. I probably played it 40 times and met some really good p[eople there, a few I played more rounds with. Cost certainly enters into my equations. I would rather play Aguila 10 times than pay $170 once at Wickenburg Ranch. But if I constantly played courses that gave me a less than 50% enjoyment rate, I would stop playing. Again, I love your pictures and enjoy your descriptions and obviously ym does v.

[dhartmann34]

I think that Arcadia experience sounds great. I'm hoping to do it near the end of summer. I wasn't able to get a time last year so I played the South, which I truly enjoyed. Although I hope the greens hold a bit better the next time I play it.

I'm contemplating WS but I'm not sure carrying that course is on the list of things I want to do.

It's funny how different people's views and thoughts on courses are. I wonder how different tour pro thoughts on tour stops are. You hear them talk about favorite places, but never have I heard "I hate that place". Maybe because they can create a schedule around that scenario?

[RobertPaulson]

Epic idea.

[Argonne69]

The top courses are fairly easy to remember, even when one didn't have a grand time.

No, haven't been there in years. When I manage to get my RV, I'm definitely going to do a loop around Lake Michigan, and hit the courses I haven't managed to play, e.g. Forest Dunes.

[Argonne69]

Are you rating the courses based on comparisons to Phoenix area courses, only, or nationwide/worldwide? Aguila was a bargain for sure, and certainly worthy of repeat plays for locals, but it's not an 8.5 course to me compared to the top 50 courses in the U.S.

[jcook10]

@dhartmann34 I was lucky enough to do both last summer. Whistling first 2 rounds and 1 night stay (work event) and Arcadia for 5 rounds 2 nights. For me Arcadia is undeniably a better experience. The golf is on 2 perfectly conditioned golf courses set on opposite sides of the lake so it’s really just your preference. The thing that set Arcadia over the top for me was the hospitality and relaxed setting. Whistling is a major event hosting/ Ryder cup hosting venue that knows it and you can feel it being there. The president of operations at Arcadia came down to the adirondack chairs on 18 while we were there and bought us a beer and talked with us for 30 minutes about our stay and etc. I asked for his honest opinion on the difference between the two and the reason Arcadia is 50% cheaper and he said the PGA notoriety was the only reason they charge more and have the rep they do. In the end they are two really really fun golf courses and a weekend at either is the perfect thing to do once this is all over.

[chisag]

 

... My personal ratings would be courses I have played. But even then, there are some courses I would not even rate like Olympia Fields and Erin Hills. Private or no push cart policies put them in their own categories, at least for me. I know some here disagree but I would rate Prairie Bluff and 8 because my rating system is based on enjoyment. I love PB's layout, conditions, the wildlife, the challenge and always the cost plays a huge roll in my ratings. And I would play PB over Seven Bridges every time because I do not like 7B back 9 layout and I find it way over priced. Probably my favorite course in Phoenix, again all things considered, is Verrado Founders. I loved Quintero and was mesmerized by the views, but as you said not sure how I would feel playing it multiple times. CB Ambiante was another favorite but like many in Phoenix waaaaay over priced in the winter. But that is me, ymmv

[St Jimmy]

 

I'm in a unique situation.

I live exactly seven miles from the Wisconsin state line. The company I work for is just over the state line in Wisconsin and has been deemed essential. I haven't stopped going so I'm crossing over everyday.

 

I guess my question for you is if you feel that I shouldn't cross over to play when the courses open up next week?

I'm just looking for an honest opinion, not an argument.

 

 

Maybe a justification to go if I decide to do so?

[chisag]

..,. I was just talking to me wife about this. And since you are just asking for my opinion, not my approval I would say if courses that are across the border and they are courses you play with any regularity in normal times, I think it is perfectly OK to play them now. My objections is about making special trips to places you don't normally play in these extremely difficult times. In your caae you have no choice but to cross over because of essential work, so anything you do there that is allowed by local rules would apply to you and that includes playing golf. And that is just my own moral code, clearly dhartman has a different moral code and I am not saying either of us is correct or incorrect and would not under these circumstances even suggest to him he should not cross state lines to play golf. Life is filled with moral choices and big problems occur when you start expecting others to conform to yours. So thanks for providing essential services and enjoy playing!

[chisag]

... Since we getting philosophical today let me expand on the above moral code. I was shooting a commercial for Johnsons Baby Shampoo and the director was an a$$ from NYC. We went into overtime and they were going to order pizza's. One of the younger actresses said she could not eat pizza because she was a vegetarian. The director jumped all over her saying that was a stupid arbitrary line to draw because man and the entire animal kingdom is an eat or be eaten world. Another actress came to her defense and said she was also a vegetarian but ate seafood and the director said she was even stupider, his exact words. I told him I have no problem eating grass fed, free range animals and I know my farmer has all the respect in the world for his animals but I won't eat the young. No veal or lamb. Of course he scoffed at that too. I asked him if he ate people and he responded what do you mean "people?" and I said other human beings and he replied "don't be ridiculous, of course I don't eat people and that has nothing to do with this conversation"

... I replied "Of course it does because we are talking about individual moral codes. Jen won't eat any meat, Janice eats seafood and I won't eat the young and you won't eat people, although there are cannibals that do eat people. We each have a moral line we don't want to cross and you are just too ignorant to see it."

[St Jimmy]

 

 

That's part of my internal dilemma. I hit Spring Valley during the winter months when other courses are closed and Hawk's View a few times a year.

And although I've played most of the southeastern Wi courses, I rarely play them.

I have the yearly membership to Oak Grove and mostly stick to McHenry and western Lake County courses.

 

 

It's pretty crazy that the majority of the places I play are right on the state line, but on the Illinois side: Oak Grove, Fox Lake, Antioch, and Chapel Hill are all in my after work/walk nine holes rotation.

 

Right now, I'm leaning towards waiting to see if Pritzer reopens our courses at the end of April.

If he extends it another month, I'll start playing Spring Valley starting May.

Taking all of the precautions. I really don't have any regular playing partners so social distancing on the course won't be anything new to me.

lol

 

Thank you for your opinion and I welcome everyone else to chime in.

 

 

 

 

[St Jimmy]

Then there's the fact I'm a total hypocrite.

I want to play the southeastern WI courses, but the thought of an army of FIBs flooding my little community with their Chicago/Naperville Covid cooties burns me up.

 

half joking.

 

 

Anyway, here's to hoping they open our courses in May.

What does everyone think the requirements should be?

 

Pay onlineWalking onlyCups raisedSpace tee times adequatelyClub houses closedLimit to groups of two. No foursomes! Maybe even singles only?No ball washer or benches

What am I missing?

[mci711]

Pretty much hit it for me. I love limiting groups to 2. I don't think that will happen, is that something you have seen elsewhere? I think it is a great idea. I'd also be full on board with you can only play with housemates, but also something that won't happen and almost impossible to check with no contact.

[St Jimmy]

 

I haven't seen that anywhere. It's something my wife mentioned to me a few minutes ago. She said "Singles only" and I liked the idea.

[mci711]

As someone who goes out alone a ton in the evenings, I'd selfishly be all for it. If there was a twosome limit, walking only and spaced tee times it may be some of the best golf playing of our lives, and something I am sure I would miss when we are back to 5 hour + rounds flooded with drunk 4somes.

[chisag]

 

... A friend of mine in Kansas made a tee time for a 4 some a few weekends ago, and the other 2 didn't show up so they played as a couple. After the round the pro shop was looking fir them and informed them in the future they would be paired up with 2 others. He didn't like the fact that there were a ton of people on the practice green and standing around waiting to play and the group behind them were slapping 5. People are cooped up and can't wait to get out, and that includes the morons that think this thing is a hoax. Sad but real.

[psygolf]

this is pretty much the m.o. in the playbook being put together by the IPGA to be presented to the Gov. Private clubs might restrict 4-somes to family members.

[psygolf]

The question would be whether or not the 2 friends that did not show up were still charged, they should’ve been.

In that case, there would be no way I’d allow the pro shop to double-dip the time and throw another odd two-some with me.

[@_the_crook]

I'm squeamish as heck about this bug and in the high risk group. my golf partner and I are also early bird players.

once the courses open up, whatever the distancing plans are, I'll pay extra if necessary just to be a twosome.

him , I trust, but strangers - NO. people lie their a$$es off about almost anything these days.

one of our group from the Crook is hospitalized with Covid now. likely got it from someone at work breathing on him.

guy just recovered from leukemia last year. he didn't deserve it.

 

 

[dhartmann34]

Anyone ever play Glen Erin in Janesville? I've heard good things, but have never made it up there.

 

[geochitown]

lddchristopher has posted that he likes Glen Erin.

I too have heard good things

[SpeedKills7]

Played it and did not enjoy it at all. We were on our way up to our annual trip and pick a new place each time on the way up. Weather was crap that day, but I don’t think I would have enjoyed it anyways. Range was far as hell from the club house and first tee. Back to back 200 yard par 3s that we’re basically the same hole right next to eachother. Some other weird things out there that I’m forgetting.