Here's what irks me about golf....

[bladehunter]

Golf instruction is contradictory because humans are contradictory. If there was one way to play this game or swing a club you’d have a point.

 

How about putting it back on the user and saying “ own your own swing and stop blaming others for your short comings “. As in it’s user error 99.9 % of the time , not instructors fault. Personally I think a reasonably athletic person can teach themselves to play this game to a decent level using the many online free resources . And a non athletic person cannot learn to be a good player if they had a free Butch Harmon for 10 years.

[lowheel]

> @bladehunter said:

> Golf instruction is contradictory because humans are contradictory. If there was one way to play this game or swing a club you’d have a point.

>

> How about putting it back on the user and saying “ own your own swing and stop blaming others for your short comings “. As in it’s user error 99.9 % of the time , not instructors fault. Personally I think a reasonably athletic person can teach themselves to play this game to a decent level using the many online free resources . And a non athletic person cannot learn to be a good player if they had a free Butch Harmon for 10 years.

 

Amen!! I cant tell you how many students of mine after 3 lessons tell me "why am i not better yet? i have a work tournament coming up and want to show how good i got". Some people have a ceiling of a 20 handicap because they have zero athletic ability or coordination yet think they can get to scratch.

[lowheel]

> @Maximilian said:

> I like this thread and would like to join in. I’m not sure what to say or who’s side I’m on, I just really want to be a part of it.

>

> Hope that doesn’t offend anyone.

 

 

[Titleist_PT23]

Regulating golf instruction would be a disaster. Obozo probably would have mandated that I swing lefthanded. On the otherhand, maybe he would have rolled-out a "free equipment for all" program!

[BNGL]

> @bladehunter said:

> Golf instruction is contradictory because humans are contradictory. If there was one way to play this game or swing a club you’d have a point.

>

> How about putting it back on the user and saying “ own your own swing and stop blaming others for your short comings “. As in it’s user error 99.9 % of the time , not instructors fault. Personally I think a reasonably athletic person can teach themselves to play this game to a decent level using the many online free resources . And a non athletic person cannot learn to be a good player if they had a free Butch Harmon for 10 years.

 

I agree it’s on the user. I have always said this, if you go back through and look through posts I’m sure I’ve said it before, but instructors all try to get you to the same place. They just speak a different language, and like learning a new language it’s all on the student to practice the new skills or else they falter from lack of repetition.

[mosesgolf]

Go Tony!!!!!!!

[MattyO1984]

> @Vindog said:

> > @MattyO1984 said:

> > “One of those wins is the Puerto Rico Open” as if that is the lesser win of his two?! Haha.

>

> I bet he won more finishing second to Xander than he got for winning the PRO.

 

Almost definitely!! I was just finding the humour in the PRO being the one that was mocked when the other win was on the Web.

[DavePelz4]

> @Titleist99 said:

> > @DavePelz4 said:

> > > @nichho said:

> > > This thread is a disaster. 44 posts and nearly 50% of them are from the OP.

> >

> > Does that irk you?

> Does that irk you?

>

 

Nope. I'm un-irkable.

[Santiago Golf]

> @bladehunter said:

> Golf instruction is contradictory because humans are contradictory. If there was one way to play this game or swing a club you’d have a point.

>

> How about putting it back on the user and saying “ own your own swing and stop blaming others for your short comings “. As in it’s user error 99.9 % of the time , not instructors fault. Personally I think a reasonably athletic person can teach themselves to play this game to a decent level using the many online free resources . And a non athletic person cannot learn to be a good player if they had a free Butch Harmon for 10 years.

 

>

 

I mean you teach someone to be atheltic and learn how use their body properly and feel the club but it takes time. Most golfers (100+) are type that would take 10 shots off that best round in 3 months over 1 shot off their best every month for the rest of their life.

[Santiago Golf]

> @"Santiago Golf" said:

> > @bladehunter said:

> > Golf instruction is contradictory because humans are contradictory. If there was one way to play this game or swing a club you’d have a point.

> >

> > How about putting it back on the user and saying “ own your own swing and stop blaming others for your short comings “. As in it’s user error 99.9 % of the time , not instructors fault. Personally I think a reasonably athletic person can teach themselves to play this game to a decent level using the many online free resources . And a non athletic person cannot learn to be a good player if they had a free Butch Harmon for 10 years.

>

> >

>

> I mean you teach someone to be atheltic and learn how use their body properly and feel the club but it takes time. Most golfers (100+) are type that would take 10 shots off that best round in 3 months over 1 shot off their best every month for the rest of their life.

 

Im an instructor and ill be honest, for the most part all instruction is good, though most instructors are bad at what they are trying to get accross. Alot people teach what they do or explain things like they would go a very good player not a typical golfer. Most golfers think the reason they hit the ball to the right is their alignment, not that their face is widr open at impact

[Warrior42111]

> @"Santiago Golf" said:

> > @"Santiago Golf" said:

> > > @bladehunter said:

> > > Golf instruction is contradictory because humans are contradictory. If there was one way to play this game or swing a club you’d have a point.

> > >

> > > How about putting it back on the user and saying “ own your own swing and stop blaming others for your short comings “. As in it’s user error 99.9 % of the time , not instructors fault. Personally I think a reasonably athletic person can teach themselves to play this game to a decent level using the many online free resources . And a non athletic person cannot learn to be a good player if they had a free Butch Harmon for 10 years.

> >

> > >

> >

> > I mean you teach someone to be atheltic and learn how use their body properly and feel the club but it takes time. Most golfers (100+) are type that would take 10 shots off that best round in 3 months over 1 shot off their best every month for the rest of their life.

>

> Im an instructor and ill be honest, for the most part all instruction is good, though most instructors are bad at what they are trying to get accross. Alot people teach what they do or explain things like they would go a very good player not a typical golfer. Most golfers think the reason they hit the ball to the right is their alignment, not that their face is widr open at impact

 

I think this is difference between an OK instructor and a good to great instructor. A good instructor will know a few ways to get a message across that clicks with that particular student. Some people are more visual, and other more technical, some are for feel. Took me a couple teachers to find one who could relate things best to be me and it paid off.

[Loki]

> @jholz said:

> Golf instruction is already regulated by the PGA.

 

LOL, you ever read a golf rag? You wouldn't say that. Read an article about a certain part of the swing and turn the page to see the contradiction.

[Ferguson]

> @lowheel said:

> > @bladehunter said:

> > Golf instruction is contradictory because humans are contradictory. If there was one way to play this game or swing a club you’d have a point.

> >

> > How about putting it back on the user and saying “ own your own swing and stop blaming others for your short comings “. As in it’s user error 99.9 % of the time , not instructors fault. Personally I think a reasonably athletic person can teach themselves to play this game to a decent level using the many online free resources . And a non athletic person cannot learn to be a good player if they had a free Butch Harmon for 10 years.

>

> Amen!! I cant tell you how many students of mine after 3 lessons tell me "why am i not better yet? i have a work tournament coming up and want to show how good i got". Some people have a ceiling of a 20 handicap because they have zero athletic ability or coordination yet think they can get to scratch.

 

 

I second that AMEN.

 

 

Re: I can be a manager!!

I have found (having managed several hundred direct reports over the years) that direct and honest feedback, based on clear and regular communication with a solid time frame attached prevents pie in sky expectations with "most" people. It's best delivered quickly and upfront.

 

For example: Did I get the promotion?

No, the opportunity went to someone else, but if you work on these 6 things and put them to practice while gaining some additional time in the position, I feel you will be poised for a shot at another opportunity in the future.

 

 

In your case:

During lesson # 1 do you ask what the student expects from the lessons in a best case and worst case scenario?

Do you share the best case and worst case scenario?

Do you ask what their expectations are for 30-60-90 days after the 3rd lesson?

 

 

Sometimes dampening a lofty expectation with a heavy dose of reality upfront can help the student or employee understand that advancement in anything moves at a pace that is directly related to their natural skill, drive and most importantly their willingness to practice.

[jholz]

> @Loki said:

> > @jholz said:

> > Golf instruction is already regulated by the PGA.

>

> LOL, you ever read a golf rag? You wouldn't say that. Read an article about a certain part of the swing and turn the page to see the contradiction.

 

I'm not sure how one regulates a difference of opinion. Are you suggesting that a regulatory body should identify and prescribe a single, "proper" way to instruct golf? I'm not sure such a thing is possible.

[bladehunter]

> @Ferguson said:

> > @lowheel said:

> > > @bladehunter said:

> > > Golf instruction is contradictory because humans are contradictory. If there was one way to play this game or swing a club you’d have a point.

> > >

> > > How about putting it back on the user and saying “ own your own swing and stop blaming others for your short comings “. As in it’s user error 99.9 % of the time , not instructors fault. Personally I think a reasonably athletic person can teach themselves to play this game to a decent level using the many online free resources . And a non athletic person cannot learn to be a good player if they had a free Butch Harmon for 10 years.

> >

> > Amen!! I cant tell you how many students of mine after 3 lessons tell me "why am i not better yet? i have a work tournament coming up and want to show how good i got". Some people have a ceiling of a 20 handicap because they have zero athletic ability or coordination yet think they can get to scratch.

>

>

> I second that AMEN.

>

>

> Re: I can be a manager!!

> I have found (having managed several hundred direct reports over the years) that direct and honest feedback, based on clear and regular communication with a solid time frame attached prevents pie in sky expectations with "most" people. It's best delivered quickly and upfront.

>

> For example: Did I get the promotion?

> No, the opportunity went to someone else, but if you work on these 6 things and put them to practice while gaining some additional time in the position, I feel you will be poised for a shot at another opportunity in the future.

>

>

> In your case:

> During lesson # 1 do you ask what the student expects from the lessons in a best case and worst case scenario?

> Do you share the best case and worst case scenario?

> Do you ask what their expectations are for 30-60-90 days after the 3rd lesson?

>

>

> Sometimes dampening a lofty expectation with a heavy dose of reality upfront can help the student or employee understand that advancement in anything moves at a pace that is directly related to their natural skill, drive and most importantly their willingness to practice.

 

Very true. I use that very tactic to shoot down the outrageous goals of perspective clients all the time . I ask their time frame expectations and cost. And then quickly shoot them down. Sounds harsh. But it works. Randomly lose someone here or there. But I’ve found that weeding those out makes a healthier bottom line in the long run. You cannot please everybody and blunt reality is a better practice to live under than unrealistic expectations and the shuck and jive act it takes to appease them.

[SkiSchoolPro]

Maybe Finau is on to something. .Before winning his first US Open, BK had 1 PGA Tour win with good results in the majors (12 straight made cuts and 4 top 10s). Finau seems similiar...1 PGA Tour win, made 9 of last 10 major cuts w/ 5 top 10s. Of course, BK had more world-wide wins, so more experience closing the deal.

[Titleist99]

> @SkiSchoolPro said:

> Maybe Finau is on to something. .Before winning his first US Open, BK had 1 PGA Tour win with good results in the majors (12 straight made cuts and 4 top 10s). Finau seems similiar...1 PGA Tour win, made 9 of last 10 major cuts w/ 5 top 10s. Of course, BK had more world-wide wins, so more experience closing the deal.

 

Maybe, just maybe Brooks Keopka set the tone and the new formula for winning Major Tournaments. Guess Tony Finau says to himself ….. If it work for Brooks, why not me.

[Titleist99]

> @Ferguson said:

> > @lowheel said:

> > > @bladehunter said:

> > > Golf instruction is contradictory because humans are contradictory. If there was one way to play this game or swing a club you’d have a point.

> > >

> > > How about putting it back on the user and saying “ own your own swing and stop blaming others for your short comings “. As in it’s user error 99.9 % of the time , not instructors fault. Personally I think a reasonably athletic person can teach themselves to play this game to a decent level using the many online free resources . And a non athletic person cannot learn to be a good player if they had a free Butch Harmon for 10 years.

> >

> > Amen!! I cant tell you how many students of mine after 3 lessons tell me "why am i not better yet? i have a work tournament coming up and want to show how good i got". Some people have a ceiling of a 20 handicap because they have zero athletic ability or coordination yet think they can get to scratch.

>

>

> I second that AMEN.

>

>

> Re: I can be a manager!!

> I have found (having managed several hundred direct reports over the years) that direct and honest feedback, based on clear and regular communication with a solid time frame attached prevents pie in sky expectations with "most" people. It's best delivered quickly and upfront.

>

> For example: Did I get the promotion?

> No, the opportunity went to someone else, but if you work on these 6 things and put them to practice while gaining some additional time in the position, I feel you will be poised for a shot at another opportunity in the future.

>

>

> In your case:

> During lesson # 1 do you ask what the student expects from the lessons in a best case and worst case scenario?

> Do you share the best case and worst case scenario?

> Do you ask what their expectations are for 30-60-90 days after the 3rd lesson?

>

>

> Sometimes dampening a lofty expectation with a heavy dose of reality upfront can help the student or employee understand that advancement in anything moves at a pace that is directly related to their natural skill, drive and most importantly their willingness to practice.

 

Your input alone brings value to the conversation and is worthy of additional thought on this subject.

[Titleist99]

> @MattyO1984 said:

> > @Vindog said:

> > > @MattyO1984 said:

> > > “One of those wins is the Puerto Rico Open” as if that is the lesser win of his two?! Haha.

> >

> > I bet he won more finishing second to Xander than he got for winning the PRO.

>

> Almost definitely!! I was just finding the humour in the PRO being the one that was mocked when the other win was on the Web.

My objective was not to mock the PRO....a win is a win. I still think that Tiger's three Junior Amateurs and three Amateur Championships is the most impressive...

[lowheel]

> @Ferguson said:

> > @lowheel said:

> > > @bladehunter said:

> > > Golf instruction is contradictory because humans are contradictory. If there was one way to play this game or swing a club you’d have a point.

> > >

> > > How about putting it back on the user and saying “ own your own swing and stop blaming others for your short comings “. As in it’s user error 99.9 % of the time , not instructors fault. Personally I think a reasonably athletic person can teach themselves to play this game to a decent level using the many online free resources . And a non athletic person cannot learn to be a good player if they had a free Butch Harmon for 10 years.

> >

> > Amen!! I cant tell you how many students of mine after 3 lessons tell me "why am i not better yet? i have a work tournament coming up and want to show how good i got". Some people have a ceiling of a 20 handicap because they have zero athletic ability or coordination yet think they can get to scratch.

>

>

> I second that AMEN.

>

>

> Re: I can be a manager!!

> I have found (having managed several hundred direct reports over the years) that direct and honest feedback, based on clear and regular communication with a solid time frame attached prevents pie in sky expectations with "most" people. It's best delivered quickly and upfront.

>

> For example: Did I get the promotion?

> No, the opportunity went to someone else, but if you work on these 6 things and put them to practice while gaining some additional time in the position, I feel you will be poised for a shot at another opportunity in the future.

>

>

> In your case:

> During lesson # 1 do you ask what the student expects from the lessons in a best case and worst case scenario?

> Do you share the best case and worst case scenario?

> Do you ask what their expectations are for 30-60-90 days after the 3rd lesson?

>

>

> Sometimes dampening a lofty expectation with a heavy dose of reality upfront can help the student or employee understand that advancement in anything moves at a pace that is directly related to their natural skill, drive and most importantly their willingness to practice.

 

I absolutely do all 3 and still this happens. its human nature. Some people just cant allow their ego to handle the reality. I do a 30 minute interview prior to anyone starting lessons and it still happens. Millennials are the worst in this regard but not the millenial women.they are the best students. They do their exercises and drills and see huge changes in 60 days. They love structure in my experience.

The playing lessons are the best because their true self comes out on the course.

[lowheel]

> @bladehunter said:

> > @Ferguson said:

> > > @lowheel said:

> > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > Golf instruction is contradictory because humans are contradictory. If there was one way to play this game or swing a club you’d have a point.

> > > >

> > > > How about putting it back on the user and saying “ own your own swing and stop blaming others for your short comings “. As in it’s user error 99.9 % of the time , not instructors fault. Personally I think a reasonably athletic person can teach themselves to play this game to a decent level using the many online free resources . And a non athletic person cannot learn to be a good player if they had a free Butch Harmon for 10 years.

> > >

> > > Amen!! I cant tell you how many students of mine after 3 lessons tell me "why am i not better yet? i have a work tournament coming up and want to show how good i got". Some people have a ceiling of a 20 handicap because they have zero athletic ability or coordination yet think they can get to scratch.

> >

> >

> > I second that AMEN.

> >

> >

> > Re: I can be a manager!!

> > I have found (having managed several hundred direct reports over the years) that direct and honest feedback, based on clear and regular communication with a solid time frame attached prevents pie in sky expectations with "most" people. It's best delivered quickly and upfront.

> >

> > For example: Did I get the promotion?

> > No, the opportunity went to someone else, but if you work on these 6 things and put them to practice while gaining some additional time in the position, I feel you will be poised for a shot at another opportunity in the future.

> >

> >

> > In your case:

> > During lesson # 1 do you ask what the student expects from the lessons in a best case and worst case scenario?

> > Do you share the best case and worst case scenario?

> > Do you ask what their expectations are for 30-60-90 days after the 3rd lesson?

> >

> >

> > Sometimes dampening a lofty expectation with a heavy dose of reality upfront can help the student or employee understand that advancement in anything moves at a pace that is directly related to their natural skill, drive and most importantly their willingness to practice.

>

> Very true. I use that very tactic to shoot down the outrageous goals of perspective clients all the time . I ask their time frame expectations and cost. And then quickly shoot them down. Sounds harsh. But it works. Randomly lose someone here or there. But I’ve found that weeding those out makes a healthier bottom line in the long run. You cannot please everybody and blunt reality is a better practice to live under than unrealistic expectations and the shuck and jive act it takes to appease them.

 

Exactly, well said. I recently refunded a student who purchased 6 lessons and after lesson 3 he was simply whining and complaining for 45 minutes about the lack of improvement in his scores after we specifically discussed how unrealistic his goal was in the time frame he wanted. Hes never broken 95 and wanted to break 80 within 30 days.I laughed and told him its not going to happen ( of course prior to him signing up) he laughed and said im kidding but id eventually like to get there. I stone cold told him pick another goal thats attainable in the next 60 days. he said id like to break 100 every single time.i told him thats very doable but there will be outliers until you start hitting the ball more squarely and solidly. After lesson 3 he looks at me and says "im hitting the ball so much better and longer but my scores still suck, why cant you fix that?"

I told him thats golf. We start hitting the ball better in a more consistent/predictable pattern and then we learn to score from there.it takes time. youve only been playing for 6 months and when you came to me you were skulling 2/3rds of your chips and pitches and never getting out of bunkers. he then verbatim said maybe I need another set of eyes who can fix me quicker

[orbless]

My guess is that his schedule has a heck of a lot to do with family life, he has what, like 8 kids? I guess he wants time to be around for that. As a parent to one toddler, if I had that many kids to deal with, I would be playing more events than Sungjae Im!

[OrangeGravy]

> @"Santiago Golf" said:

> > @bladehunter said:

> > Golf instruction is contradictory because humans are contradictory. If there was one way to play this game or swing a club you’d have a point.

> >

> > How about putting it back on the user and saying “ own your own swing and stop blaming others for your short comings “. As in it’s user error 99.9 % of the time , not instructors fault. Personally I think a reasonably athletic person can teach themselves to play this game to a decent level using the many online free resources . And a non athletic person cannot learn to be a good player if they had a free Butch Harmon for 10 years.

>

> >

>

> I mean you teach someone to be atheltic and learn how use their body properly and feel the club but it takes time. Most golfers (100+) are type that would take 10 shots off that best round in 3 months over 1 shot off their best every month for the rest of their life.

 

How do you teach someone that isn't athletic how to be athletic?

[Golfjack]

> @OrangeGravy said:

> > @"Santiago Golf" said:

> > > @bladehunter said:

> > > Golf instruction is contradictory because humans are contradictory. If there was one way to play this game or swing a club you’d have a point.

> > >

> > > How about putting it back on the user and saying “ own your own swing and stop blaming others for your short comings “. As in it’s user error 99.9 % of the time , not instructors fault. Personally I think a reasonably athletic person can teach themselves to play this game to a decent level using the many online free resources . And a non athletic person cannot learn to be a good player if they had a free Butch Harmon for 10 years.

> >

> > >

> >

> > I mean you teach someone to be atheltic and learn how use their body properly and feel the club but it takes time. Most golfers (100+) are type that would take 10 shots off that best round in 3 months over 1 shot off their best every month for the rest of their life.

>

> How do you teach someone that isn't athletic how to be athletic?

 

He just means making a more athletic swing (ie more efficient and not bobbling about like most amateurs do anyway). I watch amateurs play, and very little have shaft lean at impact. It's not like you do the lean and then you're a pro, but amateurs don't do the swing to make the lean happen. It's not easy to change at all. My game has suffered big time and going up and down trying to change it because it's a completely different concept compared to what I was doing. I feel that's why it's so hard to be an instructor, so hard for students to change, and why most of us suck at golf LOL.

[ray9898]

Cool outrage.....edgy.

[Titleist99]

Last week a teacher came on the Golf Channel and proclaimed that he could help any amateur today with one lesson. He proceeded to give the lesson that he required the high handicapper to do at the first Tee. I'm trying to remember his name but it eludes me at this moment....he speaks with a monotone voice. He's a relatively new teacher that give tips....If anyone can recall the teacher post it .

[smashdn]

> @Loki said:

> > @jholz said:

> > Golf instruction is already regulated by the PGA.

>

> LOL, you ever read a golf rag? You wouldn't say that. Read an article about a certain part of the swing and turn the page to see the contradiction.

 

I automatically skip over all the instruction intended to fix a slice. Doesn't mean that it is not useful for someone else though.

[physasst]

> @lowheel said:

> > @bladehunter said:

> > > @Ferguson said:

> > > > @lowheel said:

> > > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > Golf instruction is contradictory because humans are contradictory. If there was one way to play this game or swing a club you’d have a point.

> > > > >

> > > > > How about putting it back on the user and saying “ own your own swing and stop blaming others for your short comings “. As in it’s user error 99.9 % of the time , not instructors fault. Personally I think a reasonably athletic person can teach themselves to play this game to a decent level using the many online free resources . And a non athletic person cannot learn to be a good player if they had a free Butch Harmon for 10 years.

> > > >

> > > > Amen!! I cant tell you how many students of mine after 3 lessons tell me "why am i not better yet? i have a work tournament coming up and want to show how good i got". Some people have a ceiling of a 20 handicap because they have zero athletic ability or coordination yet think they can get to scratch.

> > >

> > >

> > > I second that AMEN.

> > >

> > >

> > > Re: I can be a manager!!

> > > I have found (having managed several hundred direct reports over the years) that direct and honest feedback, based on clear and regular communication with a solid time frame attached prevents pie in sky expectations with "most" people. It's best delivered quickly and upfront.

> > >

> > > For example: Did I get the promotion?

> > > No, the opportunity went to someone else, but if you work on these 6 things and put them to practice while gaining some additional time in the position, I feel you will be poised for a shot at another opportunity in the future.

> > >

> > >

> > > In your case:

> > > During lesson # 1 do you ask what the student expects from the lessons in a best case and worst case scenario?

> > > Do you share the best case and worst case scenario?

> > > Do you ask what their expectations are for 30-60-90 days after the 3rd lesson?

> > >

> > >

> > > Sometimes dampening a lofty expectation with a heavy dose of reality upfront can help the student or employee understand that advancement in anything moves at a pace that is directly related to their natural skill, drive and most importantly their willingness to practice.

> >

> > Very true. I use that very tactic to shoot down the outrageous goals of perspective clients all the time . I ask their time frame expectations and cost. And then quickly shoot them down. Sounds harsh. But it works. Randomly lose someone here or there. But I’ve found that weeding those out makes a healthier bottom line in the long run. You cannot please everybody and blunt reality is a better practice to live under than unrealistic expectations and the shuck and jive act it takes to appease them.

>

> Exactly, well said. I recently refunded a student who purchased 6 lessons and after lesson 3 he was simply whining and complaining for 45 minutes about the lack of improvement in his scores after we specifically discussed how unrealistic his goal was in the time frame he wanted. Hes never broken 95 and wanted to break 80 within 30 days.I laughed and told him its not going to happen ( of course prior to him signing up) he laughed and said im kidding but id eventually like to get there. I stone cold told him pick another goal thats attainable in the next 60 days. he said id like to break 100 every single time.i told him thats very doable but there will be outliers until you start hitting the ball more squarely and solidly. After lesson 3 he looks at me and says "im hitting the ball so much better and longer but my scores still suck, why cant you fix that?"

> I told him thats golf. We start hitting the ball better in a more consistent/predictable pattern and then we learn to score from there.it takes time. youve only been playing for 6 months and when you came to me you were skulling 2/3rds of your chips and pitches and never getting out of bunkers. he then verbatim said maybe I need another set of eyes who can fix me quicker

 

Exactly, it is frustrating, but that's the game of golf. I went from being decent in my early 20s when I had lots of time to play to being a mid 20s cap. This year, I got tired of sucking, and I took lessons. My ball striking has gotten so, SO much better, but my scoring is still not what I want it to be. Instead of being upset, I know that that is simply the way things go. I might not see the benefits of all of this practice and lessons for a year or two. I would never blame my coach. Down to a 15 cap at the moment, so have dropped almost 10 strokes this season.

[lowheel]

> @physasst said:

> > @lowheel said:

> > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > @Ferguson said:

> > > > > @lowheel said:

> > > > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > > Golf instruction is contradictory because humans are contradictory. If there was one way to play this game or swing a club you’d have a point.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > How about putting it back on the user and saying “ own your own swing and stop blaming others for your short comings “. As in it’s user error 99.9 % of the time , not instructors fault. Personally I think a reasonably athletic person can teach themselves to play this game to a decent level using the many online free resources . And a non athletic person cannot learn to be a good player if they had a free Butch Harmon for 10 years.

> > > > >

> > > > > Amen!! I cant tell you how many students of mine after 3 lessons tell me "why am i not better yet? i have a work tournament coming up and want to show how good i got". Some people have a ceiling of a 20 handicap because they have zero athletic ability or coordination yet think they can get to scratch.

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > I second that AMEN.

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Re: I can be a manager!!

> > > > I have found (having managed several hundred direct reports over the years) that direct and honest feedback, based on clear and regular communication with a solid time frame attached prevents pie in sky expectations with "most" people. It's best delivered quickly and upfront.

> > > >

> > > > For example: Did I get the promotion?

> > > > No, the opportunity went to someone else, but if you work on these 6 things and put them to practice while gaining some additional time in the position, I feel you will be poised for a shot at another opportunity in the future.

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > In your case:

> > > > During lesson # 1 do you ask what the student expects from the lessons in a best case and worst case scenario?

> > > > Do you share the best case and worst case scenario?

> > > > Do you ask what their expectations are for 30-60-90 days after the 3rd lesson?

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Sometimes dampening a lofty expectation with a heavy dose of reality upfront can help the student or employee understand that advancement in anything moves at a pace that is directly related to their natural skill, drive and most importantly their willingness to practice.

> > >

> > > Very true. I use that very tactic to shoot down the outrageous goals of perspective clients all the time . I ask their time frame expectations and cost. And then quickly shoot them down. Sounds harsh. But it works. Randomly lose someone here or there. But I’ve found that weeding those out makes a healthier bottom line in the long run. You cannot please everybody and blunt reality is a better practice to live under than unrealistic expectations and the shuck and jive act it takes to appease them.

> >

> > Exactly, well said. I recently refunded a student who purchased 6 lessons and after lesson 3 he was simply whining and complaining for 45 minutes about the lack of improvement in his scores after we specifically discussed how unrealistic his goal was in the time frame he wanted. Hes never broken 95 and wanted to break 80 within 30 days.I laughed and told him its not going to happen ( of course prior to him signing up) he laughed and said im kidding but id eventually like to get there. I stone cold told him pick another goal thats attainable in the next 60 days. he said id like to break 100 every single time.i told him thats very doable but there will be outliers until you start hitting the ball more squarely and solidly. After lesson 3 he looks at me and says "im hitting the ball so much better and longer but my scores still suck, why cant you fix that?"

> > I told him thats golf. We start hitting the ball better in a more consistent/predictable pattern and then we learn to score from there.it takes time. youve only been playing for 6 months and when you came to me you were skulling 2/3rds of your chips and pitches and never getting out of bunkers. he then verbatim said maybe I need another set of eyes who can fix me quicker

>

> Exactly, it is frustrating, but that's the game of golf. I went from being decent in my early 20s when I had lots of time to play to being a mid 20s cap. This year, I got tired of sucking, and I took lessons. My ball striking has gotten so, SO much better, but my scoring is still not what I want it to be. Instead of being upset, I know that that is simply the way things go. I might not see the benefits of all of this practice and lessons for a year or two. I would never blame my coach. Down to a 15 cap at the moment, so have dropped almost 10 strokes this season.

 

thats fantastic and you have a great attitude. Golf IQ and course management costs alot of my students 8-12 shots a round. If youre commited the scores will come down but its a slow process for most. i move alot of my students up 2 sets of tees to put 10 wedges in their hands per round so they learn how to score. their scores drop dramatically and they slowly build confidence. They have 6-7 birdie chances a round and theyve never felt that before, its a different kind of pressure.Youre tricking your mind by giving it so many chances.

Keep up the great work and enjoy the journey

[A.Princey]

All this commotion about a person that none of us knows personally, why so serious???? Who cares what Finau chooses to do, if a recipe for the HOF(which BK is already cemented in btw....) makes players care less about small tour stops, then so be it. There truly is no country for old men....