Your most unpopular Golf opinions?

[mshills]

16 hours ago, WesternRacing said:

…I’d challenge any foursome who can’t walk a course in 3.5 hours to explain why they couldn’t do so.

Blanket statements are always inappropriate. Walking foursome at my place consistently in 3.5h is not realistic.

[Nard_S]

23 hours ago, WesternRacing said:

This doesn’t surprise me much at all, if you’re talking 100% walking, though I’d challenge any foursome who can’t walk a course in 3.5 hours to explain why they couldn’t do so.

Because 18 holes is 5.5 mile walk on my course. At 2.5 mph, over 2,2 hours alone. that leaves 1.3 hours for say 320 shots. Which demands less than 15 sec per shot to do assessment, decision & execution. Yeah, pretty unrealistic.

 

I used to do 3:15 to 3:30 walking w/ one guy at sunrise tee off. That was years ago, 4 guys walking, no way that happens. I still carry, if pace is 4:00 or 4:45, i could care less.  

 

Edited June 8 by Nard_S

[klebs01]

1 hour ago, Nard_S said:

Because 18 holes is 5.5 mile walk on my course. At 2.5 mph, over 2,2 hours alone. that leaves 1.3 hours for say 320 shots. Which demands less than 15 sec per shot to do assessment, decision & execution. Yeah, pretty unrealistic.

 

I used to do 3:15 to 3:30 walking w/ one guy at sunrise tee off. That was years ago, 4 guys walking, no way that happens. I still carry, if pace is 4:00 or 4:45, i could care less.  

 

2.5mph is really slow. Bump that to 3 which isn’t quick and it’s down to 3:10 pace. Bump that to 4mph which is still in the normal range and it’s down to 2:46. 

[Nard_S]

2 minutes ago, klebs01 said:

2.5mph is really slow. Bump that to 3 which isn’t quick and it’s down to 3:10 pace. Bump that to 4mph which is still in the normal range and it’s down to 2:46. 

The group is starting & stopping at least 55X, you cannot average 3 to 4 mph doing that. Impossible.

[Bad9]

I’m always amazed at the number of posters who fixed/overhauled their swings after a few range sessions. No you didn’t. It probably looks the same withe the same on course results as it did before.

[retch10]

On 6/6/2025 at 11:08 AM, parbung said:

high handicappers with Scotty's are coming after you with their pitchforks right now haha.
 

oh..I know.  Its a topic/conversation that will have people who will agree with me 100% and people who will tell me I'm 100% wrong and want to fight to defend their investments in their bag.  Very few in-between.  (the reality IS probably in-between...IS in-between)

 

[IneverDothis]

Are most of the anti cart guys playing north of the mason dixon?

 

Texas for example, if you’re not out before 10am, that’s a brutal walk from June-September. Some days the heat is completely inescapable. 

[Warrior42111]

Club fitting works, just not the way most people think it does, or how companies advertise it.

 

It mainly helps reel in the mishit shot. That of the toe shot may be just short of the green instead of 30 yards behind. That 'power fade' on driver is now in the right rough instead of OB. Get a club with an adjusted length or lie angle for example, it just allows for less variables for the golfer to make in their swing. Less variables means more consistent, more consistent means more golfers playing shots to their ability shape and getting the expected results. 

 

Companies can't really market that as most people don't see the stroke savings vs 20 more yards and hit 4 more fairways etc. 

[Nard_S]

On 6/9/2025 at 9:25 AM, IneverDothis said:

Are most of the anti cart guys playing north of the mason dixon?

 

Texas for example, if you’re not out before 10am, that’s a brutal walk from June-September. Some days the heat is completely inescapable. 

I'm not anti-cart, but might come a day where getting myself to the toilet might be an issue, just trying to avoid that, lol.

[mongoosegolfer]

On 6/5/2025 at 7:57 AM, BallHooker said:

Some annoying players use them for every shot 

So you want that same guy walking around and searching for a sprinkler head and walking off the yardage to his ball every shot instead? If someone is that obsessive over yardages, they're going to get them one way or another. Rangefinders save a ton of time compared to how we used to have to get distances.

[knock it close]

21 minutes ago, mongoosegolfer said:

So you want that same guy walking around and searching for a sprinkler head and walking off the yardage to his ball every shot instead? If someone is that obsessive over yardages, they're going to get them one way or another. Rangefinders save a ton of time compared to how we used to have to get distances.

Buddies just a FIGJAM don't worry about him

[BallHooker]

36 minutes ago, mongoosegolfer said:

So you want that same guy walking around and searching for a sprinkler head and walking off the yardage to his ball every shot instead? If someone is that obsessive over yardages, they're going to get them one way or another. Rangefinders save a ton of time compared to how we used to have to get distances.

No. A player can literally pick a club just by looking at the flag in most cases. The devices have taken away that ability it seems? I’ve undrstood that the best snipers on the planet have the ability to estimate a distance accurately withing 300 m with a +/-1 m margin.

 

In reality, the temperature or humidity or amount of wind impact the shots more than the very exact range people seek to get. It is close to pointless to get the info if a distance is 132 or 141, for most casual golfers that is. We are talking about players who don’t even know how much their ball rolls on the greens. Range finders are used to waste the time of everyone on the course. 

[mongoosegolfer]

1 hour ago, BallHooker said:

No. A player can literally pick a club just by looking at the flag in most cases. The devices have taken away that ability it seems? I’ve undrstood that the best snipers on the planet have the ability to estimate a distance accurately withing 300 m with a +/-1 m margin.

 

In reality, the temperature or humidity or amount of wind impact the shots more than the very exact range people seek to get. It is close to pointless to get the info if a distance is 132 or 141, for most casual golfers that is. We are talking about players who don’t even know how much their ball rolls on the greens. Range finders are used to waste the time of everyone on the course. 

Ok yeah you cannot be serious. You think players should just guess how far out they are? I don't know if you played before range finders and GPS became prevalent but golfers always needed yardages, it was just more time consuming to figure out back then. Complaining about something that actually speeds the game up is an odd take. 

[BallHooker]

42 minutes ago, mongoosegolfer said:

Ok yeah you cannot be serious. You think players should just guess how far out they are? I don't know if you played before range finders and GPS became prevalent but golfers always needed yardages, it was just more time consuming to figure out back then. Complaining about something that actually speeds the game up is an odd take. 

It’s not guessing. For countless decades golfers played without range finders and now they cannot? There are certain markers on courses and those tend to be more than sufficient.
 

I’ve played for close to 30 years and never had issues figuring out the club to hit. Maybe around half of this time was before range finders became a thing. As stated earlier, I personally use a range finder maybe once a round. This is pretty much without exception when I’m somewhere in a weird spot and not on the fairway. Even green elevations matter more than the exact yardage. 

[mongoosegolfer]

25 minutes ago, BallHooker said:

For countless decades golfers played without range finders and now they cannot?

Sure we could easily go back to playing without rangefinders but then we will have to go back to using 100/150/200 markers and/or sprinkler heads to figure out yardages, which will take longer than the rangefinders. Eliminating rangefinders doesn't get rid of the fact that players want to know how far out they are before selecting a club.

I'm just not sure where you're getting the idea that players never needed or cared for exact yardages before rangefinders came along.

[BallHooker]

15 minutes ago, mongoosegolfer said:

Sure we could easily go back to playing without rangefinders but then we will have to go back to using 100/150/200 markers and/or sprinkler heads to figure out yardages, which will take longer than the rangefinders. Eliminating rangefinders doesn't get rid of the fact that players want to know how far out they are before selecting a club.

I'm just not sure where you're getting the idea that players never needed or cared for exact yardages before rangefinders came along.

Because 90% of the time a player can easily pick the right club while walking to his/her ball from the previous spot. For short shots you don’t even need to know the yardage. Once you visualize your shot, you have already figured out what to do. It’s like throwing a ball… You don’t need to know how many yards. Basketball players manage well without knowing the exact distance all the time. 
 

I’ve seen player getting distances for chip shots with range finders and it drives me insane. I hope range finders are banned some day soon. 🙂

Edited June 11 by BallHooker

[mongoosegolfer]

12 minutes ago, BallHooker said:

Basketball players manage well without knowing the exact distance all the time. 

Have you seen the lines on a basketball court?

14 minutes ago, BallHooker said:

I hope range finders are banned some day soon.

We're really just going in circles. If they're banned, the guy who is using them around the green will count steps to the green/flag instead and take way longer.

[357MAGNOLE]

4 hours ago, BallHooker said:

I’ve undrstood that the best snipers on the planet have the ability to estimate a distance accurately withing 300 m with a +/-1 m margin.

No, they either use a range finder, spotting scope or they have a built in reticle within their scope they use to measure the size of objects and then determine the range with some simple math. Maybe 75+ years ago guys had to completely guess, but I'd venture to say they took a lot more shots as well while walking it in or they had DOPE to support the engagement and had known ranges established before engaging targets. 

 

But I do get what you are saying with the picking a club. Back in the day I would guestimate the distance, grab roughly the right club and adjust the swing speed a little if I felt it needed it. Now I can dial in within 10 yards without fail as long as I don't hit a fat or thin shot. 

[The Pearl]

On 6/11/2025 at 9:48 AM, BallHooker said:

No. A player can literally pick a club just by looking at the flag in most cases. The devices have taken away that ability it seems? I’ve undrstood that the best snipers on the planet have the ability to estimate a distance accurately withing 300 m with a +/-1 m margin.

 

In reality, the temperature or humidity or amount of wind impact the shots more than the very exact range people seek to get. It is close to pointless to get the info if a distance is 132 or 141, for most casual golfers that is. We are talking about players who don’t even know how much their ball rolls on the greens. Range finders are used to waste the time of everyone on the course. 

Come on now.  Many golfers have visual issues ranging from basic poor eyesight due to hereditary factors or from aging. Many like myself, have severe depth perception problems.  If you play the same course 100x a year that is one thing, but many courses will have flags either surrounded by trees making it very difficult to determine depth or in situations like a links course, all alone with no back drop or maybe even just being able to see the top half of the stick.

 

Not to mention, the last thing anybody wants to see is Joe Idiot pacing off sprinkler heads all round. 

 

In terms of slow play, rangefinder usage is about 15th on the list of issues.

 

[avrag]

On 6/8/2025 at 1:15 AM, WesternRacing said:

On 6/7/2025 at 8:44 PM, Brokensticks said:

American?

 

In Europe where there is a walking culture and carts is pretty much only ”for fun” or immobile seniors a round without waiting is 4h. 

4.5h with seniors walking and 5h if you are trailing a tournament. 
 

3hrs is single walking without hurrying. 

Expand  

 

This doesn’t surprise me much at all, if you’re talking 100% walking, though I’d challenge any foursome who can’t walk a course in 3.5 hours to explain why they couldn’t do so.

 

In the U.S., where carts are prevalent, those times are ridiculous IMO.  But that’s life here and complaining about it is akin to spitting into the wind.  You’re not going to change the disrespectful golfer who doesn’t understand the meaning of ready golf, particularly post COVID when they’ve multiplied like cockroaches.  You just have to work around them.  Private club, early tee times, etc.

It's not so much about walking vs "riding". 
The real reason that golf is faster in Europe on average is the fact that you need to prove that you can play to a certain level, before you can get out on a golf course. Whenever I played golf in the US, I always found that the main culprits for slow play were young athletic men, who simply had never learned how to play golf.
Yes, they could hit it enormous distances, when they made contact.
If they made contact. 
But "reloading" off the tee was common, chunked irons off from the fairway were common, bladed pitches over greens were common. And all of this while lasering every single shot. Rounds like that, which are 120 strokes minimum, will take a long time.   

[mshills]

1 hour ago, avrag said:

It's not so much about walking vs "riding". 
The real reason that golf is faster in Europe on average is the fact that you need to prove that you can play to a certain level, before you can get out on a golf course. Whenever I played golf in the US, I always found that the main culprits for slow play were young athletic men, who simply had never learned how to play golf.
Yes, they could hit it enormous distances, when they made contact.
If they made contact. 
But "reloading" off the tee was common, chunked irons off from the fairway were common, bladed pitches over greens were common. And all of this while lasering every single shot. Rounds like that, which are 120 strokes minimum, will take a long time.   

Lol come on man. Golfers are no different just based on the country they are in. The difference is the golf course. The layout and the terrain cause the pace of play differences. 

[Double Mocha Man]

2 hours ago, avrag said:

The real reason that golf is faster in Europe on average is the fact that you need to prove that you can play to a certain level, before you can get out on a golf course

 

How do they have you prove that? Just curious.

[Brokensticks]

2 hours ago, Double Mocha Man said:

 

How do they have you prove that? Just curious.

 

Im not experienced in how it works in America but lets say for instance in Sweden, we have "pay n play" courses where anyway can go out and play. The next level is getting a "golf certificate" where you basicly train with a pro for a few group lessons and you take a test for golf rules & etiquette and you get a 36 handicap, now you are allowed to play at regular golf clubs. If we go back in time lets say 20 years, you got 54 hcp and had to play with a more experienced player down to 36hcp before you could go yourself. 

 

Some courses enforce a max handicap per ball so you simply cant put 4x 36hcps together. If we travel to some nice resort courses in southern Europe, you are not allowed to play there if you cant prove your hcp is 20-25ish.

 

In reality it doesnt really change anything as you dont have to register rounds and can walk most places as a 36 hcp, even if you shoot 130.

Edited June 14 by Brokensticks

[PedronNiall]

16 hours ago, mshills said:

Lol come on man. Golfers are no different just based on the country they are in. The difference is the golf course. The layout and the terrain cause the pace of play differences. 

 

Guys have talked about it here previously and the guy you replied to went into some detail about it after. There are a number of EU countries where you have to prove the level you're capable of playing to before you can go out, same way licensing for vehicles and many other things are much more stringent in much of the EU than The States.

[PuffyC]

On 6/8/2025 at 7:00 PM, klebs01 said:

2.5mph is really slow. Bump that to 3 which isn’t quick and it’s down to 3:10 pace. Bump that to 4mph which is still in the normal range and it’s down to 2:46. 

I’ve never had a twosome in a cart play faster than me walking but 4mph is not normal. That’s the beginning stage of power walking. Depends on gate, age, weather, sex, etc but for the avg person 3mph on cement is fairly quick. I used to walk about 25 miles a week just for fun and averaging 3mph on cement took intent. Add in clubs, grass, occasional breaks for water, uneven terrain, etc and your normal average would be a lot closer to 2. That said, by the time you walk to your ball you should already know what you’re going to hit and what your strategy is going to be. Just pull a club, hit, and move on.

[avrag]

On 6/9/2025 at 3:32 AM, Bad9 said:

I’m always amazed at the number of posters who fixed/overhauled their swings after a few range sessions. No you didn’t. It probably looks the same withe the same on course results as it did before.

 

The comments to Youtube videos by popular instructors are the same. 
"Once again a great tip coming from you. I tried this at the range today, and it completely changed the way I strike the ball"

[WesternRacing]

On 6/14/2025 at 10:14 AM, murdoc613 said:

I use mine on every shot from off the green. It has made me a lot better

 

What’s your index and when you say ‘every shot’, what’s the minimum distance you shoot the flag from?

[WesternRacing]

On 6/11/2025 at 11:46 AM, mongoosegolfer said:

Sure we could easily go back to playing without rangefinders but then we will have to go back to using 100/150/200 markers and/or sprinkler heads to figure out yardages, which will take longer than the rangefinders.

 

Sorry, but no.  Courses that have yardage markers every 25 yards from 225 down to 75 yards negate the need for rangefinders, as you can estimate yardage pretty accurately just stepping off from the nearest marker.  Our course had them until recently and it was awesome.  It didn’t take longer than pulling out a rangefinder and shooting a flag.  I would know my yardage by the time I arrived at my ball just by finding the nearest marker and estimating where I was between the two nearest markers.

 

I have no problem with range finders, except in the hands of golfers who can’t hit consistent yardages anyway, yet continue to shoot the flag on every shot, even if they’re laying 7 in the fairway and they’re 40 yards from the flag.  Honestly, if you can’t consistently hit your irons within five yards of your stock yardage for that club, the range finder should stay at home.

 

 

 

Edited June 16 by WesternRacing

[jpgolfs04]

Unpopular opinion: Birdies only count if someone actually saw them. Triples, though? Oh, they always count — even if you blacked out from rage halfway through the hole. Graphite irons aren’t ruining golf, but my 45-yard slice probably is. And if golf ads are so worthless, then why do I have a $600 putter sitting in my bag that promised to fix both my short game and my marriage?

[avrag]

Judging by the reactions of other members of my club, my most unpopular golf opinion is that our course should be dry, hard, and fast in the summer. 
It was designed, built and is still promoted as a "links style" course. But whenever there is a little bit of brown on the fairways, the membership is all up in arms. 
And when I argue against that, the reply I get most often is: "I want it soft, because my hands hurt too much, when the ground is hard."