Wayward shot liability

[RmoorePE]

I lived at a house 175y out from a tee box on the right (a rental). Perfect location for a weak slice, or a wicked sidewinder. A ball landed in our property 1x per day on average about 15% hit the house. I could easily tell from my bed or easy chair if it was a deck, roof, wall, or window strike. The owners had 4' eaves built along the back so most hits were roof hits.

 

90% of golfers blow right by head down, and if you ask they - "don't know who's ball it was". The others stop in to ask if everything is ok. I am in the 10% who ask, not because I believe it the right thing to do, but very afraid of bad golf Karma. I suck bad enough as-is. I hit a ball in a back yard yesterday and walked all the way around the pond I missed to get it into the yard and went down to the fence to see if I caused any damage, but they just waved me off from the dining room table.

 

Legalities aside. If I broke something, I should pay for it. If I live on a golf course and my house gets damaged, I should remember that I moved onto a golf course and golf balls may hit my house. This is the social contract between golfers and golf course homeowners that will always work for the benefit of all.

 

So far I never have paid for anything, but have been offered a beer and given my ball back enough times it is always worth the effort. Also had plenty of head shakes, side eye and angry exchanges. One time my buddy rattled a ball around a deck with some people on it and they were steamed. We went over there and the guy said we had dented the front panel on the BBQ grill. So buddy exchanged information, and told the guy to send a link to the replacement piece, or a quote from company and he would buy it and have it sent to his house. Of course by the time that conversation is had, and the apology is made plus the willingness to rectify is shown, the passion for the damaged item is largely dissipated.

[Ferguson]

2 hours ago, nsxguy said:

 

Alrighty then, so they're lying. What can I tell ya ?

 

But you didn't read far enough if you only got the course being liable.

 

And while I already said I wouldn't discuss it any further, to correct you, I guess I had to.

 

But now, I won't respond to you any further here. You get the last word. You're welcome. Enjoy. 👍

 

 

 

Mr. NSXGUY,

 

I have LeoLeo99 on retainer for circumstances such as this.   

 

Good day, sir. 

 

 

 

[Ferguson]

Wayward golf shots?

 

 

Edited February 8, 2021 by Ferguson

[Ferguson]

Liability?  

 

 

 

Edited February 8, 2021 by Ferguson

[Krt22]

56 minutes ago, GHIN n Juice said:

That’s what I thought.  You’re not impressing anyone by lying about your “friends” and your “right from wrong” bs.  Go peddle your fortune cookie life lessons somewhere else.

Respect. 

[596]

For me, if I did it I'll pay for it.  It's the right thing to do.

 

All we ever hear about is the respect of the game, how golf is a reflection of life, how we act on the course is how we act off the course, blah, blah, blah.

 

But if we damage something at our own fault.... It must be the home owners fault!  And nothing says I have to pay! 🙄

 

Com'On Man!!

 

[Exactice808]

There is a discussion here as well

 

Posted  This

 

 

Many layers to this questions, and I mean layers.......  There is no direct answer,  Its not a simple answer.

 

You want a simple answer?

 

Option 1

You make a wayward shot, you can do the moral thing. Go find that house knock on the door, give them your personal information and go from there,  If you dont know, Call the pro Shop let the pro shop know the details,  date, time, hole and approximate location.  Hope they dont call you and move on with your life.

 

 

Option 2

 

Move on with your live finish your 18 holes and have a beer.

 

 

 

Other than that you can tear apart my prior post..... Property Damage claims under $1,000..... then add in a Homeowners or Auto Deductible thats likely $500.... yeah having a pissing contest on a golf course..... I rather get stuck in a trap.

 

[LukeDonaldsTiger]

8 hours ago, Shankyouverymuch said:

Little known fact..If you damage something when hitting a tee shot you can claim it on your auto insurance.

.

.

.

.

.Because you are a bad driver.😂😂

Underrated 

[soregongolfer]

On 2/7/2021 at 8:40 AM, Proam1 said:

Is a player responsible to pay for damages if your wayward shot hits a house, a parked car, or causes any sort of damage??

 

asking for a friend...

The simple answer is it depends on the state.  Have your "friend" look up case law for his/her state.  

Edited February 9, 2021 by soregongolfer

[soregongolfer]

On 2/8/2021 at 11:11 AM, Pepperturbo said:

The answer to your question depends on your character or lack thereof.  If I damage someone's property I am responsible.  Oh, and I can't stand weasels that don't know wrong from right or reject accepting responsibility. 

 

As far as the law is concerned, it depends on how the laws are written in the county you live in and where the golf course is located.  I am acquainted with a few judges that will throw your AZZ in the poky for night or two if you don't cover the cost of your golf ball.  I am good with that...

Ask those two judges if they have the lawful authority to throw a golfer into jail for a wayward shot and I'm sure their answer will be quite different.  My guess is words like "intent," "knowingly," "willingly," "intentionally," "recklessly," will be used while explaining they do not have the legal authority to do so.  Otherwise we're talking about a civil case and there's no jail penalty for a civil case.  

Edited February 13, 2021 by soregongolfer

[jordan2240]

My son-in-law once pushed a ball way right over some large pines toward some houses.  We didn't hear it hit anything.  He took a 'breakfast ball', and also pushed it right, but not nearly as far.  As we headed down toward his 2nd shot, a woman emerged from the trees asking if the ball she was holding belonged to one of us.  She was nice about it, and noted that it had hit her roof then dropped down onto her boyfriend's car.  She took SIL's info contact info, and said she'd be in touch if necessary.  He never heard anything from them, but I wondered who would actually pay any damage - her homeowners, auto insurance, or the SIL - or a combo of them.  Honestly, I don't know why anyone would want to live along a fairway, but seems to me if you do, your homeowners insurance would take that into account.

[Dpavs]

If anyone has not figured it out by now, most of the legal advice you will get in the GolfWRX forums is worth slightly less than what you paid for it.

[curt_jr]

i can tell you with absolute surety that if there are damages caused by a wayward shot to a house, and the homeowner wants the damage to be repaired, the reparations will have to be paid for. 

[Dpavs]

2 hours ago, curt_jr said:

i can tell you with absolute surety that if there are damages caused by a wayward shot to a house, and the homeowner wants the damage to be repaired, the reparations will have to be paid for. 

 

Is this a    test ?

 

So, while I agree to an extent that if the homeowner wants to have someone repair the damage caused by a wayward shot, it will have to be paid for in almost all cases, there are some charitable or other exceptions where the repairs themselves are not actually paid for by anyone ... so your statement is not really 100% absolute.

 

Did I pass?  🙃

 

 

Edited February 12, 2021 by Dpavs

[soregongolfer]

As I stated above, it depends on your state.  

 

ILLINOIS

THE MERE FACT THAT A GOLF BALL DID NOT TRAVEL IN THE INTENDED DIRECTION DOES NOT ESTABLISH A VIABLE NEGLIGENCE CLAIM

Heiden v. Cummings, 786 N.E.2d 240, 271 Ill.Dec. 982, 337 Ill. App.3d 584 (Ill. App., 2003)            March 13, 2003

 

Since “even the best professional golfers cannot avoid an occasional `hook’ or `slice'”‘ [citation], it cannot be said that the risk of a mishit golf ball is a fully preventable occurrence. To the contrary, even with the utmost concentration and `tedious preparation’ that often accompanies a golfer’s shot [citation], there is no guarantee that the ball will be lofted onto the correct path. For that reason, we have held that the mere fact that a golf ball did not travel in the intended direction does not establish a viable negligence claim [citation]. To provide an actionable theory of liability, a person injured by a mishit golf ball must affirmatively show that the golfer failed to exercise due care by adducing proof, for example, that the golfer `aimed so inaccurately as to unreasonably increase the risk of harm’ [citation].” (Emphasis in original.) Rinaldo, 78 N.Y.2d at 733, 587 N.E.2d at 267, 579 N.Y.S.2d at 629; Benjamin v. Nernberg, 102 Pa.Super. 471, 476, 157 A. 10, 11 (1931) (“It is common knowledge, at least among players, that many bad shots must result although every stroke is delivered with the best possible intention and without any negligence whatever”).

 

 In this case, there is no evidence of anything more than a bad shot. Contrary to plaintiff’s argument, defendant never admitted that any particular factors contributed to his tee shot veering from its intended path. Defendant identified a few common errors with golf swings but had no knowledge whether he made any of those errors.

 

A lot of states view errant shots in the same way.  

 

https://lawreader.com/?p=17679#NEWYORK

[curt_jr]

7 hours ago, Dpavs said:

 

Is this a    test ?

 

So, while I agree to an extent that if the homeowner wants to have someone repair the damage caused by a wayward shot, it will have to be paid for in almost all cases, there are some charitable or other exceptions where the repairs themselves are not actually paid for by anyone ... so your statement is not really 100% absolute.

 

Did I pass?  🙃

 

 

with flying colors 😂😂

[Rob G 89]

There is a course in Reno wolf run it has multiple signs on it that golfers are responsible for damage to homes. A couple holes I didn’t even play because I was so rattled. I don’t go there anymore because of those signs.

 

[stickfish]

While playing the Old Course my Caddy simply stated people shouldn’t park there when I asked about blowing one way right on 18, states the Hotel on 17 covers any incidentals as well.  FWIW I played off the path on 18 but still appreciated the common sense application of the letter of the law.

[elwhippy]

I hope not. I sprayed one a few years back and knocked a roof tile off a house in Portugal. I lost my ball but found a new V1 while searching. 

[Dpavs]

14 hours ago, elwhippy said:

I hope not. I sprayed one a few years back and knocked a roof tile off a house in Portugal. I lost my ball but found a new V1 while searching. 

 

That's an impressive drive! Were you teeing off on #18 at Kiawah at the time?  😆

[just_steveu]

On 2/8/2021 at 2:22 PM, Abh159 said:

My personal opinion is that when you buy a house on a golf course you understand the risk. I'd never buy a house on a course for this very reason. That being said the laws vary drastically state to state with some favoring the homeowner and some the golfer.

 

Either way unless a homeowner could somehow prove without a doubt that a specific golfer damaged his/her property (which seems very difficult to prove) I have a hard time believing a judge or jury would side with the homeowner.

 

 

I know a few guys that play only one ball but use a found ball on certain holes.... when they play courses with houses too close they don't ID mark a ball until immediately before they put it on the tee.

 

On a side note, the course I belonged to last year has a long par 5, a par 3 and two par 4's with houses the entire length of one side of the hole.

Edited February 14, 2021 by just_steveu

[Mustard_Tiger]

On 2/12/2021 at 8:29 PM, soregongolfer said:

As I stated above, it depends on your state.  

 

ILLINOIS

THE MERE FACT THAT A GOLF BALL DID NOT TRAVEL IN THE INTENDED DIRECTION DOES NOT ESTABLISH A VIABLE NEGLIGENCE CLAIM

Heiden v. Cummings, 786 N.E.2d 240, 271 Ill.Dec. 982, 337 Ill. App.3d 584 (Ill. App., 2003)            March 13, 2003

 

Since “even the best professional golfers cannot avoid an occasional `hook’ or `slice'”‘ [citation], it cannot be said that the risk of a mishit golf ball is a fully preventable occurrence. To the contrary, even with the utmost concentration and `tedious preparation’ that often accompanies a golfer’s shot [citation], there is no guarantee that the ball will be lofted onto the correct path. For that reason, we have held that the mere fact that a golf ball did not travel in the intended direction does not establish a viable negligence claim [citation]. To provide an actionable theory of liability, a person injured by a mishit golf ball must affirmatively show that the golfer failed to exercise due care by adducing proof, for example, that the golfer `aimed so inaccurately as to unreasonably increase the risk of harm’ [citation].” (Emphasis in original.) Rinaldo, 78 N.Y.2d at 733, 587 N.E.2d at 267, 579 N.Y.S.2d at 629; Benjamin v. Nernberg, 102 Pa.Super. 471, 476, 157 A. 10, 11 (1931) (“It is common knowledge, at least among players, that many bad shots must result although every stroke is delivered with the best possible intention and without any negligence whatever”).

 

 In this case, there is no evidence of anything more than a bad shot. Contrary to plaintiff’s argument, defendant never admitted that any particular factors contributed to his tee shot veering from its intended path. Defendant identified a few common errors with golf swings but had no knowledge whether he made any of those errors.

 

A lot of states view errant shots in the same way.  

 

https://lawreader.com/?p=17679#NEWYORK

 

 

Jordan Fades Back...Swish....And that's the game!

 

 

 

[Kjboisen]

On 2/7/2021 at 3:06 PM, nsxguy said:

There are all sorts of laws, local and state.

 

But in general, a golfer is responsible for where his/her ball goes.

At baseball events if someone hits a homer outside the park and hits a car is the batter reliable for any damages? IMO it is assumed risk especially if someones home lies on the course

[dugue4]

4 hours ago, Kjboisen said:

At baseball events if someone hits a homer outside the park and hits a car is the batter reliable for any damages? IMO it is assumed risk especially if someones home lies on the course

No, the pitcher is for throwing a terrible pitch. 😁

Edited February 15, 2021 by dugue4

[Justsomeguy]

Look up "the baseball rule," and "duty risk analysis."

Outside of that, like someone above said, everywhere is different.

But generally no.

The short version is just how effed off the shot was.

Hit a fairway adjacent house? No.

Nail the guy at the next tee box bc you pulled driver on a 150 yard par 3? Damn right.

How much did your conduct deviate from the expected norm.

Being on the course doesn't entitle you to turn 90 degrees on the box and take dead aim at the neighbor's cat.

But if you're within normal activity there's little culpability.

[Orion12521]

Another possibility that hasn't been brought up... The course might be liable  and have insurance (or self insure) to cover any damages caused by golfers.  Some of the considerations would be if the  golf course was there first or the houses.  If the houses were built around the golf course after it existed or were built concurrently, it would be very different circumstances if the golf course were constructed next to existing homes.  The only thing I'm certain of is there is no one correct answer to this question.  Circumstances and laws vary too much to answer anything other than, "It depends."

[eagles1]

On 2/7/2021 at 6:06 PM, nsxguy said:

There are all sorts of laws, local and state.

 

But in general, a golfer is responsible for where his/her ball goes.

The Opposite [Seinfeld S05E22] - Bing video

[Skhacker]

I take every shot with the assumption that I am responsible for where the ball or club or tee or divot ends up. But I’m so old school about golf being an honourable gentleman’s game that it’s laughable to some people. 

[straightshot7]

I once hit a terrible drive into a road that runs parallel to this par 4.

 

it hit directly in the middle of this poor guy’s windshield as he was driving probably 45 mph.

 

I swear it went 300 yards but it was definitely wayward

 

anyways my car insurance actually paid for his windshield to be replaced 

 

Thank God he didn’t crash or something.

 

the bottom line is: learn to hit the ball straight

Edited December 30, 2021 by straightshot7