Good podcast on Ben Hogan

[Talldog]

I listened to an interesting podcast. Episode 26 of "TalkinGolf History: They Myths of Ben Hogan". It's close to 2 hours long, but well worth your time if you are a Hogan fan.

 

It featured a guy named Jeff Martin (Thinking About Golf) who retired in 2004 and has spent much time documenting golf history. He made some points early in the podcast that I thought would make for a great discussion on this forum.

 

• Hogan turned pro at 17 in 1930.
• Hogan struggled for years.
• McGregor custom made a black driver (with black face) for Byron Nelson; he rejected it and gave it to Hogan in March of 1940.
• That driver changed Hogan's fortunes, turning him into what a golf magazine called "the most accurate driver on tour".
• Hogan won 30 tournaments from 1940 to 1947 (which included a gap for the military).
• He broke the black driver in January of 1947.
• Hogan's game regressed after breaking the black driver.
• He tried 31 drivers in an attempt to replace the black driver; none worked for him.
• Hogan took a break from golf, went back to Texas, and rebuilt his swing.
• When Hogan returned he started winning--big.
• Hogan told Joe Novack (president of the PGA) at the November 1947 Ryder Cup: I finally learned how to play golf, I decided to adopt a fade.
• In a December 1947 Associated Press article, Hogan said: I found that playing a draw was too taxing; as I get tired, it's more and more difficult to control; I've implemented a swing change that produces a fade.
• In 1948, he won the US Open, the PGA Championship, was the tour's leading money winner, and was named player of the year.
• This is also the time the rumors of Hogan having a "secret" started to circulate.

 

I found this interesting, because of the implications it has for Hogan's "secret".

 

If he had not broken the black driver, there would probably have been no secret. Hogan was winning with it and had no reason to change his swing.

 

Hogan's swing secret probably had nothing to do with swing mechanics, but rather was a mental change. He had always played a draw. He mentally changed to a guy that played a fade, then implemented the swing changes needed to make that a reality.

 

The secret: Hogan started playing a fade. It's not any more complicated than that.

Edited May 5, 2021 by Talldog

[moehogan]

20 hours ago, Talldog said:

I listened to an interesting podcast. Episode 26 of "TalkinGolf History: They Myths of Ben Hogan". It's close to 2 hours long, but well worth your time if you are a Hogan fan.

 

It featured a guy named Jeff Martin (Thinking About Golf) who retired in 2004 and has spent much time documenting golf history. He made some points early in the podcast that I thought would make for a great discussion on this forum.

 

• Hogan turned pro at 17 in 1930.
• Hogan struggled for years.
• McGregor custom made a black driver (with black face) for Byron Nelson; he rejected it and gave it to Hogan in March of 1940.
• That driver changed Hogan's fortunes, turning him into what a golf magazine called "the most accurate driver on tour".
• Hogan won 30 tournaments from 1940 to 1947 (which included a gap for the military).
• He broke the black driver in January of 1947.
• Hogan's game regressed after breaking the black driver.
• He tried 31 drivers in an attempt to replace the black driver; none worked for him.
• Hogan took a break from golf, went back to Texas, and rebuilt his swing.
• When Hogan returned he started winning--big.
• Hogan told Joe Novack (president of the PGA) at the November 1947 Ryder Cup: I finally learned how to play golf, I decided to adopt a fade.
• In a December 1947 Associated Press article, Hogan said: I found that playing a draw was too taxing; as I get tired, it's more and more difficult to control; I've implemented a swing change that produces a fade.
• In 1948, he won the US Open, the PGA Championship, was the tour's leading money winner, and was named player of the year.
• This is also the time the rumors of Hogan having a "secret" started to circulate.

 

I found this interesting, because of the implications it has for Hogan's "secret".

 

If he had not broken the black driver, there would probably have been no secret. Hogan was winning with it and had no reason to change his swing.

 

Hogan's swing secret probably had nothing to do with swing mechanics, but rather was a mental change. He had always played a draw. He mentally changed to a guy that played a fade, then implemented the swing changes needed to make that a reality.

 

The secret: Hogan started playing a fade. It's not any more complicated than that.

Hogan was on Mac's staff in 1947, so I wonder why he just didn't make a phone call and ask them to make a couple more drivers just like the one given to him by Nelson? Or he could have hopped a flight to Cincy and brought the broken driver with him?

 

But the master swing tinkerer actually decided just to "will" a fade?

 

Hilarious, thanks for the laugh!

Edited May 6, 2021 by moehogan

[powerfade66]

1 hour ago, moehogan said:

Hogan was on Mac's staff in 1947, so I wonder why he just didn't make a phone call and ask them to make a couple more drivers just like the one given to him by Nelson? Or he could have hopped a flight to Cincy and brought the broken driver with him?

 

But the master swing tinkerer actually decided just to "will" a fade?

 

Hilarious, thanks for the laugh!

Yes if only it were that simple. I also don’t think that magic black driver made as much of a difference as Jeffy would like to have people believe. 

[The Mighty Atom]

On 5/6/2021 at 1:57 PM, moehogan said:

Hogan was on Mac's staff in 1947, so I wonder why he just didn't make a phone call and ask them to make a couple more drivers just like the one given to him by Nelson? Or he could have hopped a flight to Cincy and brought the broken driver with him?

 

But the master swing tinkerer actually decided just to "will" a fade?

 

Hilarious, thanks for the laugh!

After he got the driver from Nelson, Hogan had 26 replacements made by MacGregor before he found one he liked, and put it away, anticipating that someday the Nelson driver would break. But, when he put the 26th in play in 1947, it wasn't quite the same as his favorite, and he struggled while searching for the perfect replacement, even borrowing a driver from Herman Keiser. He was complaining about his predicament in the locker room at the 1947 US Open, and his peers were all smiles (see attached).

In September 1947, Hogan left the tour to try to find a swing change solution. Hogan didn't "will" the fade, he made specific swing changes that he discussed, briefly, in one of his newspaper columns in February 1948 (Hogan talks about this experience in the Ken Venturi interview from 1983). But by April, he clammed up, saying the swing changes were a "secret so important I won't even tell my wife," and he stuck to that story until 1955, when, in the August 8, 1955 issue of Life magazine, he revealed the swing changes a second time.

 

BTW, he continued to use the 26th duplicate after discovering the "secret," and in the hospital in El Paso was relieved it wasn't damaged in the accident (also attached). 

 

Edited April 29, 2022 by The Mighty Atom

[The Mighty Atom]

On 5/6/2021 at 3:04 PM, powerfade66 said:

Yes if only it were that simple. I also don’t think that magic black driver made as much of a difference as Jeffy would like to have people believe. 

This is what was reported when Hogan first got it:

[The Mighty Atom]

On 5/6/2021 at 3:04 PM, powerfade66 said:

Yes if only it were that simple. I also don’t think that magic black driver made as much of a difference as Jeffy would like to have people believe. 

Just a few months after getting the Nelson driver, Hogan was being called "the greatest driver in the world."

[tthomasgolfer605]

Ben Hogan rebuilt his swing way before 1947. 

[The Mighty Atom]

2 hours ago, tthomasgolfer605 said:

Ben Hogan rebuilt his swing way before 1947. 

When did he ever "rebuild" his swing? He shortened his left thumb during WWII, then made the the changes in 1947 he outlined in the "This Is My Secret" article. What else? 

[The Mighty Atom]

3 hours ago, tthomasgolfer605 said:

Ben Hogan rebuilt his swing way before 1947. 

On 5/5/2021 at 5:47 PM, Talldog said:

 

• Hogan took a break from golf, went back to Texas, and rebuilt his swing.

 

"rebuilt his swing" is not what was said in the podcast. He only took off two weeks!

[CROUSE99]

The amazing thing about Hogan wasn't that he changed his swing.  It was that he was able to control his swing to a degree no pro before him had.  I remember a Golf Digest from 25 years ago or more with a cover story on Hogan's swing.  They asked a number of players and instructors to say what they thought the secret of his swing was.  There wasn't any agreement.  Venturi said Hogan's secret was his mind (I'm paraphrasing) and I think that was right.  It is extraordinarily difficult to make the same swing over and over again but Hogan had the discipline and physical awareness to do it.