Bushnell Launch Pro Device with Foresight

[WallysWorld]

4 minutes ago, cwilk said:

I was hoping the alleged $3k price would include ball and 1 dot club data.  It's sounding like maybe it will just be ball data.  If that's the case I'm not sure it will be worth $3k when I can spend $20 to go to PGA Tour Superstore and use a GC2 for $30 minutes to an hour to get the average launch/spin/carry for a new club/set of clubs.  The club data is what makes it a useful training/improvement tool in my eyes.    

I mean for a one time fee sure. But you can do this with ST/ M+ for the data that you are looking for. 
 

For club data , the market doesn’t align with that price point at the moment. This can always change but it would have to be a new company breaking ground in the LM market. 

[Thats two thus far Shooter]

What’s the difference between GC3 and Bushnell Launch Pro? Are they the same? 

[jcrews5508]

Exact same hardware, exact same unit. The big difference will be with price where one will be fully unlocked  and one will be subscription-based. At least that’s the word being passed around.

[Indygolf21]

I’ve never followed a more annoying product release in my life. They announced the product in July and sent out demos to instructors and other VIPs in early August. They send multiple teaser emails over the course of 2 months. And then here we are in late September and they’ve sent more units out, even to third party reviewers, but they still have a gag order on everybody?

 

It’s like they’re *trying* to annoy everyone. 

 

[Thats two thus far Shooter]

I don’t know thst it’s the same hardware… it looks to explicitly say Bushnell on one of them. 
 

Maybe subscription for the software? 
 

Also regarding the market question being around 15,000 people or so… that’s my biggest complaint. THEY SET THE MARKET. This is $300-$400 tops in hardware costs and the rest is operational software costs to run their business. Them selling these units for what they do is a failing business model. It’s like selling an Xbox for 5 grand. 
 

Get this down to $2k a unit, make the software free to only include driving range, and we pay $500 to add a course that we want. The adoption would be insane. 

[Indygolf21]

4 minutes ago, Thats two thus far Shooter said:

I don’t know thst it’s the same hardware… it looks to explicitly say Bushnell on one of them. 
 

 

It’s the same hardware. That’s about the only thing useful that came out of the HP first look video. 

[Ilgolfer]

1 hour ago, WallysWorld said:

The market will be rocked with this GC3/BLP but there are two other products that will come out later this year or by the time the PGA show is set next year. 

 

Can you tell us what those are? I know there was a rumor of a floor unit from Uneekor, but nothing that I could see confirmed.

[Thats two thus far Shooter]

3 minutes ago, Indygolf21 said:

It’s the same hardware. That’s about the only thing useful that came out of the HP first look video. 

Hmmm ok. Just out of curiosity then, why wouldn’t I always just buy the Bushnell launch pro then instead? Does it not work with a sim software maybe and only GC3 does? 
 

again you might not know but it just sounds kinda dumb to have two floating in the wild, especially if GC4 is the enterprise version and the rest are supposed to be commercial. 
 

Im getting an Xbox Series X vs S vibe…

[Ilgolfer]

1 hour ago, Stosheu said:

I'm in the same boat as you. I'm looking to build out the 3rd garage stall this winter for practice and some sim fun. I really like what the Mevo+ offers in terms of abilities, software (Awesome golf is great and doesn't take a tank of a PC to run), and accuracy. However there are so many little things I don't like about radar that a camera system like the Bushnell cleans up like condensing the space required, which will bring my net requirements down. No ball dots (not a big deal but still.) No need to move a vehicle to set up. Also, I worry about how interference will play with the system. I plan to have heaters in the winter to take the edge off of the cold as well as have tvs/laptop for running and displaying the sim. Interference issues would really hamper where I can place these things with the radar unit and I haven't seen these as issues with camera systems.

 

Ideally the Bushnell works out price-wise and gives me and my family something fun to play with as well as allow me to work on my game in the winter. However, if it's not really comparable on price with a Mevo+, then I guess I'll deal with the minor hassles to save the cash.

I am in almost the exact same situation haha. Even down to the ball dots. It isn't a big deal but at the same time I really don't want to have to deal with it. I looked at the Uneekor systems because I found them very interesting. The QED requires ball dots and for $4K more their top of the line monitor does not. That alone made me sit there and wonder if that would be worth it haha which I don't think it is. More for convenience. I definitely want accuracy, but it doesn't have to be crazy. My friends and I have played on an optishot system at one bar and the other has About Golf. The Optishot to us was unplayable. There were times we would be 5 yards from the green and our chips would register 120 yards. A few times but still very annoying. The About Golf are super accurate and correspondingly super expensive. I need something if I am going to practice and play in the winter/occasionally in the summer that is good enough. 

[radiman]

15 minutes ago, Thats two thus far Shooter said:

I don’t know thst it’s the same hardware… it looks to explicitly say Bushnell on one of them. 
 

Maybe subscription for the software? 
 

Also regarding the market question being around 15,000 people or so… that’s my biggest complaint. THEY SET THE MARKET. This is $300-$400 tops in hardware costs and the rest is operational software costs to run their business. Them selling these units for what they do is a failing business model. It’s like selling an Xbox for 5 grand. 
 

Get this down to $2k a unit, make the software free to only include driving range, and we pay $500 to add a course that we want. The adoption would be insane. 

I’d hardly call what they’re doing a failing business model. And as far as adoption, I’d wager that if you’re not in on the initial launch it’ll be damn near impossible to get your hands on one for a while.  Even at $3k with a subscription on top. 

[Cactus Jack]

Well this is new, 3 Dot mode.

[radiman]

Just now, Cactus Jack said:

Well this is new, 3 Dot mode.

I admittedly know nothing about the quads putting analysis. Is 3 dot different than the current setup they have?

[cwilk]

51 minutes ago, WallysWorld said:

I mean for a one time fee sure. But you can do this with ST/ M+ for the data that you are looking for. 
 

For club data , the market doesn’t align with that price point at the moment. This can always change but it would have to be a new company breaking ground in the LM market. 

Neither of the two products you mention provide accurate data. They don’t belong in any discussion involving actual training/improvement IMO. 

[Cactus Jack]

4 minutes ago, radiman said:

I admittedly know nothing about the quads putting analysis. Is 3 dot different than the current setup they have?

 

Quad putting uses 3 dots. I might be reading into the post, but it certainly implies a feature related to the GC3 launch. 

 

Is it possible their technology has advanced to a point that the 4th camera is no longer needed? 

[WallysWorld]

10 minutes ago, Cactus Jack said:

Well this is new, 3 Dot mode.

lol, this is not new. Drew is using a Quad. 

Edited September 23, 2021 by WallysWorld

[jcrews5508]

37 minutes ago, Thats two thus far Shooter said:

I don’t know thst it’s the same hardware… it looks to explicitly say Bushnell on one of them. 
 

Maybe subscription for the software? 
 

Also regarding the market question being around 15,000 people or so… that’s my biggest complaint. THEY SET THE MARKET. This is $300-$400 tops in hardware costs and the rest is operational software costs to run their business. Them selling these units for what they do is a failing business model. It’s like selling an Xbox for 5 grand. 
 

Get this down to $2k a unit, make the software free to only include driving range, and we pay $500 to add a course that we want. The adoption would be insane. 

I would hardly call a company that has probably made $250 million in 10 years Which was just sold for 450 million failing at anything. You could argue they could sell more volume but the volume doesn’t always equate to more profit, sometimes it does sometimes it doesn’t. I think many people really overestimate the size of the launch monitor market. If they drop this to 3K or 4K there will be more demand of course but they can only make X units a year and will probably have long waits and get more headaches while increasing their profit margin only a minimal amount.

[Cactus Jack]

Just now, WallysWorld said:

lol, this is not new

 

It's not new for the Quad, but hasn't been mentioned regarding the GC3. Again, I might be reading into the post, but "next weeks special occasion" seems to be GC3 related. 

[radiman]

4 minutes ago, Cactus Jack said:

 

Quad putting uses 3 dots. I might be reading into the post, but it certainly implies a feature related to the GC3 launch. 

 

Is it possible their technology has advanced to a point that the 4th camera is no longer needed? 

Just looking at the unit and the fact that all 3 cameras are facing straight forward unlike the angled cameras on the quad, I would think that the unit will be limited on what it can capture based on that alone.  If it can't see it, it can't measure it.  

 

But, obviously a lot of unknowns out there.  And, just speculation on my part. 

Edited September 23, 2021 by radiman

[Cactus Jack]

21 minutes ago, radiman said:

Just looking at the unit and the fact that all 3 cameras are facing straight forward unlike the angled cameras on the quad, I would think that the unit will be limited on what it can capture based on that alone.  If it can't see it, it can't measure it.  

 

But, obviously a lot of unknowns out there.  And, just speculation on my part. 

I wonder why you couldn’t put a dot or strip on the toe side of the club facing the camera. It seems like it could work in conjunction with a dot on the face and give you all the parameters, and possibly require one less camera. Obviously Foresight has found that it doesn’t work, but to a simpleton, it seems like it could. 

[radiman]

2 minutes ago, Cactus Jack said:

I wonder why you couldn’t put a dot or strip on the toe side of the club facing the camera. It seems like it could work in conjunction with a dot on the face and give you all the parameters, and possibly require one less camera. Obviously Foresight has found that it doesn’t work, but to a simpleton, it seems like it could. 

I would think that they're looking to measure the face as it's the major constant that everything is based on when it comes to what the club is doing.  Clubs come in different shapes and sizes and I think would be difficult to accommodate all of the different designs out there.  Even a few mm different angle could completely change how the unit reads.  

[WallysWorld]

39 minutes ago, Cactus Jack said:

 

Quad putting uses 3 dots. I might be reading into the post, but it certainly implies a feature related to the GC3 launch. 

 

Is it possible their technology has advanced to a point that the 4th camera is no longer needed? 

Confirmed with Drew- not testing it. 

[jcrews5508]

10 minutes ago, WallysWorld said:

Confirmed with Drew- not testing it. 

Does that mean it is or is not in gc3? 

[WallysWorld]

Just now, jcrews5508 said:

Does that mean it is or is not in gc3? 

I don't know if putting analysis is available. I'm just stopping the rumor that he is testing the GC3. 

[Karazy]

1 hour ago, Thats two thus far Shooter said:

I don’t know thst it’s the same hardware… it looks to explicitly say Bushnell on one of them. 
 

Maybe subscription for the software? 
 

Also regarding the market question being around 15,000 people or so… that’s my biggest complaint. THEY SET THE MARKET. This is $300-$400 tops in hardware costs and the rest is operational software costs to run their business. Them selling these units for what they do is a failing business model. It’s like selling an Xbox for 5 grand. 
 

Get this down to $2k a unit, make the software free to only include driving range, and we pay $500 to add a course that we want. The adoption would be insane. 

I think you’re quite low on the cost to make these. Sure there’s definitely a margin but high speed cameras this specialized aren’t exactly readily available. The Quad uses “up to 10,000 frames per second” and it’s been claimed the GC3 is the same hardware. There’s probably somewhere around $2500 in parts here. think that $3k number is as low as they will comfortably go to still make a little bit of profit on the unit itself. 
 

For example this is somewhat similar.

https://www.ifm.com/us/en/product/O3D303?pcc_keyword=&gclid=CjwKCAjwy7CKBhBMEiwA0Eb7as4T5TqiON6FcHb4pQsCakTlobEPpJ0J6L1bf-He5RheEdWnTd1T9BoCuIUQAvD_BwE

[DinoSpumoni228]

1 hour ago, jcrews5508 said:

I would hardly call a company that has probably made $250 million in 10 years Which was just sold for 450 million failing at anything. You could argue they could sell more volume but the volume doesn’t always equate to more profit, sometimes it does sometimes it doesn’t. I think many people really overestimate the size of the launch monitor market. If they drop this to 3K or 4K there will be more demand of course but they can only make X units a year and will probably have long waits and get more headaches while increasing their profit margin only a minimal amount.

 

I completely agree with this statement. 

 

If they want more people to buy it and want to make their money through volume instead, guess what they are going to have to do? Increase advertising. 

 

Now you are gambling that your increased advertising expense is going to be outweighed by increased amount of unit sales.

 

I don't think the amount of people willing to pay $2000 but not $3000 for a launch monitor is significant at all.

 

If you have $2,000 to spend on golf, you also probably have it in your budget to swing $3,000. If not you could always finance the last $1,000 at practically 0% interest these days.

 

It's dumb to try to make money through volume on a high tech product like this.

 

The freaking thing is taking pictures of a golf ball being hit with an object moving potentially 120+ mph and predicting what the golf balls flight would have been within a few yards of what would have actually happened, yet you expect it to cost the same amount as a new mattress?

 

 

 

 

Edited September 23, 2021 by DinoSpumoni228

[DinoSpumoni228]

3 hours ago, WallysWorld said:

The market will be rocked with this GC3/BLP but there are two other products that will come out later this year or by the time the PGA show is set next year. 

 

What are they (srs question)?

 

Full swing is pretty much completely untrustworthy and I have doubts that they will even stick around as a company in general.

 

They seem to have gone the exact opposite direction of foresight.

 

They invest all their money in promoting the product, and in turn have no money left to actually invest in the product itself.

 

 

[WallysWorld]

Just now, DinoSpumoni228 said:

What are they (srs question)?

ol

Full swing is pretty much completely untrustworthy and I have doubts that they will even stick around as a company in general.

 

They seem to have gone the exact opposite direction of foresight.

 

They invest all their money in promoting the product, and in turn have no money left to actually invest in the product itself.

 

 

lol, yeah the company that is supported by a PE and Tiger will go under. Good one. 

[DinoSpumoni228]

10 minutes ago, WallysWorld said:

lol, yeah the company that is supported by a PE and Tiger will go under. Good one. 

Tiger has also has been sponsored by MusclePharm and they literally have not made a dollar during any given year in the last 10 years.

 

Them paying tiger a couple mil a year to say he uses their launch monitor doesn't mean he "supports them".

 

It's also not uncommon for private equity backed companies to go bankrupt at all. Most private equity firms put a bunch of debt on the company's balance sheet to try to grow the company as quickly as possible to either resell it or take it public.

 

Edited September 23, 2021 by DinoSpumoni228

[WallysWorld]

Tiger and TGE are partners meaning they own part of the company😂 

[jcrews5508]

24 minutes ago, games said:

MEVO+ is plenty accurate

Nothing against mevo but its not as accurate as foresight, this is not debatable. Its good for the price. Its also requires 16 feet of space. Camera systems are just better as a whole.