Azinger calls out Koepka on his Ryder Cup comments

[david.c.w]

2 hours ago, Oldboy said:

I think that's the point.  Ryder Cup on Jack's CV is nowhere near the top.  Its an afterthought

 

But if Jack was 9-0-1 people would talk about how great he was at International match play.

 

[oikos1]

2 hours ago, BNGL said:

True. 
 

one of the reasons I get kinda fired up about this is a few years ago Paul got roughed up over his comments about the Euro Tour and winning on the PGA Tour. Poulter responded with something along the lines of a Ryder Cup record recently… which maybe is important to him and should be he’s a fine player. But if I was player, I’d be a little miffed if people only remembered me for my Ryder Cup abilities because that means I sucked (relative to my peers) and didn’t win enough. 

I'm not a Poulter fan, but I had to look.  Total wins 17.  Career earnings European Tour: € 25,020,031, 8th all time.  Career earnings PGA Tour:  $27,672,528, 53rd all time. 

 

Combine those earnings and he's flirting with Top Ten all time career earnings.  That's quite impressive.

 

 

[ShowMe]

1 hour ago, NJBigFish22 said:

All these athletes take naps.  But not being able to see your team is an issue, what if Brooks, Tiger or anyone else wasn’t allowed to see their physical therapist or masseuse prior to a round, which in a normal week they do to get ready.  Brooks made a comment that caddies aren’t in the team rooms, kind of excluded, that is a negative as well.  Caddie/player are more of a team than the players on the Ryder Cup Team, and the players are more likely to listen to them than the captain.  

 

Ok, you've changed my mind.  Stricker should change everything to accommodate Brooksie's needs. 

 

Wait a minute.  What about the 11 other guys on the team and their needs?  Shouldn't everybody else's needs also be fulfilled?  And if so, how?  What if Brooks likes to take a nap at 3pm, but Bryson likes to nap at 2pm and DJ likes to nap at 4pm?  How do you accommodate everybody's needs when there are 12 people involved?  Sounds like a logistical nightmare to me.

 

I think Brooksie needs to put on his big-boy pants and just suck it up.  Make a few sacrifices for the team.  It's only one week every two years.  That, or withdraw and let somebody else play who is willing to make the sacrifices.

[J13]

I don't think Azinger read the interview.  Nothing BK said was offensive or screamed "I hate the Ryder Cup".   

[NJBigFish22]

4 minutes ago, ShowMe said:

 

Ok, you've changed my mind.  Stricker should change everything to accommodate Brooksie's needs. 

 

Wait a minute.  What about the 11 other guys on the team and their needs?  Shouldn't everybody else's needs also be fulfilled?  And if so, how?  What if Brooks likes to take a nap at 3pm, but Bryson likes to nap at 2pm and DJ likes to nap at 4pm?  How do you accommodate everybody's needs when there are 12 people involved?  Sounds like a logistical nightmare to me.

 

I think Brooksie needs to put on his big-boy pants and just suck it up.  Make a few sacrifices for the team.  It's only one week every two years.  That, or withdraw and let somebody else play who is willing to make the sacrifices.

Maybe make it more like a normal week on tour.  These guys don’t need to be secluded in a hotel with the vice captains and there wives doing “team building” as individuals.  Like I mentioned in another post, maybe include the caddies as part of the team.  

[Mcgeeno]

The US team is just a group of 12 mercenaries coming together hoping to play good for a few days. For one week you have to change your routine, schedule, practice routine, meeting habits and friendships and attempt to play for something other than an individual trophy. Brooks is saying what a bunch of them probably believe whether they admit it or not. I appreciated the candor.

 

Its always been this way. The Euro squad is tighter, it means more to them. It is what it is. Guys like Colsaerts have said it plenty that the Euro tour dudes all hang out together, have close friendships, play practice rounds for fun on off days and have deep and strong friendships travelling each week. The US team is 12 guys all with their own PR staff and private jets, with trainers and coaches all over you telling you to play as a team for 3-4 rounds every couple of years. You don't get to fake it out there unfortunately.

I personally believe the US would be better off picking all 12 guys and having a say in who goes or who wants to be there.

 

Koepka should give his spot up though citing injury. Its clear the Ryder Cup isnt a big deal for him and we will never get his best. Give it to a dude who wants to be there. 

Edited September 16, 2021 by Mcgeeno

[CasualLie]

4 hours ago, ShowMe said:

 

Sure, but it's all relative.  Anybody who plays on the PGA or European Tour is, by statistical definition, one the very best golfers in the world.  In the 99.99999th percentile.  Same thing with any of the other major sports.  I'd take that in a heartbeat, even if I never won a tournament.  I'm guessing that you would, too.

 

It always gets me when people say that so-and-so is horrible.  No, they're not horrible.  They're one of the best golfers/baseball players/basketball players/football players/tennis players/hockey players/etc. that has ever walked the face of the Earth.  They may not be quite as good as their peers, but they're better than 99.99999% of any other human will ever be.  Very few people ever get to claim that in sports, medicine, business, academia, etc.

 

Pretty sure most people (not all!) are relatively speaking when calling a top class athlete "horrible".  You can call Zalatoris a horrible putter and it is implied it is relative to the rest of the field, but we all know he is one of the best putters in the world.  Ok...maybe that's a bad example!  Let me start over.  Rickie Fowler is a terrible iron player!

Edited September 16, 2021 by CasualLie

[CasualLie]

3 hours ago, BNGL said:

You’re correct and I think if you go back and look through all of my posts you’ll see that I take that viewpoint? Look at my profile and go through some posts. You’ll see I’ve defended players when other guys have said so and so isn’t very good. I’ve also gone in on players who others have exalted and said look at x y and z. 
 

But relative to other PGA Tour players Ian Poulter is not a great player in my opinion. Sergio I will back off a little bit on he did pick up a Players and ANGC so he’s up there but I don’t think either of them are great players. 

 

Don't sell Poulter short; he is a tremendous slouch. 😉

 

You are correct about Poulter.  But give him his due, in and of himself, he is quite an overachiever.

 

 

[wy3134]

is the ryder cup fun to watch? yes. is it an exhibition? 100%. all this media drummed up "patriotism" is just to make the corporate sponsors and media millions off the event. i agree with the few who say lets put all those hidden profits that are made on this event to a good cause and not in the blood sucking media and corporate guys pocket. 

 

golf is an individual sport, even playing on the high school team, you knew your score counted but it was only 1 of 4 that count, with 5 playing in most situations, so even if you lit it up, you might have individual success but the team might still suck as a whole and that gets depressing quick. i 100% get where brooks is coming from and agree completely. i know quite a few guys who transferred around high schools just to get off crappy high school teams to better all around teams to give them better daily competition or to play on a better course. (and at the time thought it was a crappy move, looking back it was right move to not hurt their future prospects as some now play professionally)

 

i dont know why everyone has their panties all in a bunch over this, the USA team has to play every year between RC and PC...that gets old especially when the PC gets played all over the world. Of course its easy for arm chair quarterbacks who cant break 90 to think these guys should be happy and willing to play these events every year...ignoring they just grinded out a wrap around pga tour season that is more of a grind than ever now between the condensed major season and then right into the fedex cup. sure the guys making the RC/PC teams have had success during the year, but the miles and wear n tear still add up for the best over the course of 8-10 months of a pretty much non-stop tour schedule

Edited September 16, 2021 by wy3134

[Naptime]

The Dirty Dozen Ryder Cup party game.  We can give each player a movie star avatar

 

Here they are from Wiki.  I'll start with Steve Stricker as Lee Marvin.

 

Actor	Role	Notes
Lee Marvin	Major John Reisman
Charles Bronson	Joseph Wladislaw	number 9: death by hanging
Jim Brown	Robert T. Jefferson	number 3: death by hanging
John Cassavetes	Victor R. Franko	number 11: death by hanging
Trini Lopez	J. Pedro Jimenez	number 10: 20 years' hard labor
Telly Savalas	Archer J. Maggott	number 8: death by hanging
Donald Sutherland	Vernon L. Pinkley	number 2: 30 years' imprisonment
Clint Walker	Samson Posey	number 1: death by hanging
Tom Busby	Milo Vladek	number 6: 30 years' hard labor
Ben Carruthers	S. Glenn Gilpin	number 4: 30 years' hard labor
Stuart Cooper	Roscoe Lever	number 5: 20 years' imprisonment
Colin Maitland	Seth K. Sawyer	number 7: 20 years' hard labor
Al Mancini	Tassos R. Bravos	number 12: 20 years' hard labor

 

[Naptime]

Double post deleted

 

 

 

Edited September 16, 2021 by Naptime
Double post

[BNGL]

2 hours ago, oikos1 said:

I'm not a Poulter fan, but I had to look.  Total wins 17.  Career earnings European Tour: € 25,020,031, 8th all time.  Career earnings PGA Tour:  $27,672,528, 53rd all time. 

 

Combine those earnings and he's flirting with Top Ten all time career earnings.  That's quite impressive.

 

 

Sure earnings are great it really is about the cash. But you can make bank being a good player playing every week racking up good finishes. Where are the wins? 17 wins worldwide 3/4 PGA Tour wins? It’s all about the W’s for me, PGA Tour wins.

Edited September 16, 2021 by BNGL

[bscinstnct]

49 minutes ago, Naptime said:

The Dirty Dozen Ryder Cup party game.  We can give each player a movie star avatar

 

Here they are from Wiki.  I'll start with Steve Stricker as Lee Marvin.

 

Actor	Role	Notes
Lee Marvin	Major John Reisman
Charles Bronson	Joseph Wladislaw	number 9: death by hanging
Jim Brown	Robert T. Jefferson	number 3: death by hanging
John Cassavetes	Victor R. Franko	number 11: death by hanging
Trini Lopez	J. Pedro Jimenez	number 10: 20 years' hard labor
Telly Savalas	Archer J. Maggott	number 8: death by hanging
Donald Sutherland	Vernon L. Pinkley	number 2: 30 years' imprisonment
Clint Walker	Samson Posey	number 1: death by hanging
Tom Busby	Milo Vladek	number 6: 30 years' hard labor
Ben Carruthers	S. Glenn Gilpin	number 4: 30 years' hard labor
Stuart Cooper	Roscoe Lever	number 5: 20 years' imprisonment
Colin Maitland	Seth K. Sawyer	number 7: 20 years' hard labor
Al Mancini	Tassos R. Bravos	number 12: 20 years' hard labor

 

 

Whaaaa? DD were cool. 
 

These guys more like

 

🤣

 

 

[Shilgy]

5 hours ago, BNGL said:

You’re correct and I think if you go back and look through all of my posts you’ll see that I take that viewpoint? Look at my profile and go through some posts. You’ll see I’ve defended players when other guys have said so and so isn’t very good. I’ve also gone in on players who others have exalted and said look at x y and z. 
 

But relative to other PGA Tour players Ian Poulter is not a great player in my opinion. Sergio I will back off a little bit on he did pick up a Players and ANGC so he’s up there but I don’t think either of them are great players. 

I started to reply to @ShowMebut the dang iPad glitched and I lost it.

What too many folks forget is even #126 on tour would be the equivalent of the 4th or 5th best player on a MLB or NFL team.  So perhaps not am All Star but certainly one of the best in his sport. So even a Poulter is pretty much an All Star or Pro Bowl player in his own right 

So we agree. A guy like Poulter is a very good but not the great level in comparison to the other elite players.

 

 

Back to the thread ……

Back in the day Tom Weiskopf skipped a Ryder Cup to go hunting.  I think it was big horn sheep but could be mistaken on that. And he was much maligned for the choice but it really didn’t matter much back them as the US won relatively easily.

Koepka should do the same.  Go take a nap or dip in the pool.  If you don’t want to be there skip it!  It would be good for Brooks and the team.

[miamistomp]

 Stricker couldn't be a pimple on Lee Marvin's azz

 

 

[oikos1]

54 minutes ago, BNGL said:

Sure earnings are great it really is about the cash. But you can make bank being a good player playing every week racking up good finishes. Where are the wins? 17 wins worldwide 3/4 PGA Tour wins? It’s all about the W’s for me, PGA Tour wins.

As far as creme de la creme, I'll agree, wins really are everything (especially majors).  I'm sure if Poulter had a major, this conversation would be much different.  However, the money along with a 25 year professional career puts him in some rarefied air.  Add the 6 Ryder Cups and a 14-6-2 record (he's waned a bit in his last two Ryder Cups), and he clearly is a slayer of team USA.  All I can say is some people just get juiced up for different reasons. 

[bubbagump]

3 hours ago, J13 said:

I don't think Azinger read the interview.  Nothing BK said was offensive or screamed "I hate the Ryder Cup".   

 

This 100.  Some choice people are using this to continue their anti brooks rant from the other 5 threads, but there wasn't a word that Brooks said when answering questions for an interview that was offensive, likely not true, or probs shared by a bunch of other players.  Nor did Brooks say hell sleep walk through his matches, or wouldn't participate in functions. 

 

But nah, tell us more about playing bball with Billy, and coaches kids.....and back in my dayy.....   

 

Edited September 17, 2021 by bubbagump

[bscinstnct]

32 minutes ago, bubbagump said:

 

This 100.  Some choice people are using this to continue their anti brooks rant from the other 5 threads, but there wasn't a word that Brooks said when answering questions for an interview that was offensive, likely not true, or probs shared by a bunch of other players.  Nor did Brooks say hell sleep walk through his matches, or wouldn't participate in functions. 

 

But nah, tell us more about playing bball with Billy, and coaches kids.....and back in my dayy.....   

 

 

Bubba!

 

Its just that BK whines a lot for a guy who’s done squat for 2 years. 
 

But seems like he’s content to complain, show zero interest in being there, much less say anything positive.

Id actually respect him if he said,

 

“This sucks, I’d rather be home napping but gotta give my sponsors some air time”

 

But, He’s dropped from #1 to #10 in a year so maybe people are thinking

 

as they would say “back in my dayy” ; )…

 

Just shut up and play. 

 

 

 

[straightshot7]

Only Koepka is capable of making me like Azinger. 

[PZero]

Every time Brooks talks something stupid comes out and he sounds like an egomaniac.

[bubbagump]

55 minutes ago, bscinstnct said:

 

Bubba!

 

Its just that BK whines a lot for a guy who’s done squat for 2 years. 
 

But seems like he’s content to complain, show zero interest in being there, much less say anything positive.

Id actually respect him if he said,

 

“This sucks, I’d rather be home napping but gotta give my sponsors some air time”

 

But, He’s dropped from #1 to #10 in a year so maybe people are thinking

 

as they would say “back in my dayy” ; )…

 

Just shut up and play. 

 

 

 

That’s going to be up to each persons existing view of him.  I didn’t take his answers in the interview as whining, just how he feels. Personally I also recognize it’s fully normal to have feels on something, but can still carry out the duties at hand regardless.   A huge portion of the human workforce does that daily lol.  

 

Plus much like Bryson, Brooks moves the needle, so the coverage continues to hammer home on them.   Can’t fault them for responding to interview requests, and then answering in their own schtick. 

Edited September 17, 2021 by bubbagump

[bscinstnct]

6 minutes ago, bubbagump said:

That’s going to be up to each persons existing view of him.  I didn’t take his answers in the interview as whining, just how he feels. Personally I also recognize it’s fully normal to have feels on something, but can still carry out the duties at hand regardless.   A huge portion of the human workforce does that daily lol.  

 

Plus much like Bryson, Brooks moves the needle, so the coverage continues to hammer home on them.   Can’t fault them for responding to interview requests, and then answering in their own schtick. 

 

I don’t doubt he will get into the zone and play to win out there. Who knows, maybe he’ll catch real spirit of camaraderie and leadership. 

 

And I hear you carrying out duties with total professionalism while you’re thinking…

 

Man, I wish I could tell this person what a total dumb jack@ss he is ; )

 

 

[bladehunter]

Interesting video on this.  But look at the comments below.  People aren’t in favor  of Brooks playing. 
 

 

 

[bladehunter]

2 hours ago, bubbagump said:

 

This 100.  Some choice people are using this to continue their anti brooks rant from the other 5 threads, but there wasn't a word that Brooks said when answering questions for an interview that was offensive, likely not true, or probs shared by a bunch of other players.  Nor did Brooks say hell sleep walk through his matches, or wouldn't participate in functions. 

 

But nah, tell us more about playing bball with Billy, and coaches kids.....and back in my dayy.....   

 

Lol.   It’ll be ok.  
 

but seriously.  I didn’t change anybody’s mind here.  Brooks did it for me.    He goes out of his way to prove he’s too cool  for golf.  And it’s off putting. And the hilarious part is , he’s also wrong.   It’s that simple.  

Edited September 17, 2021 by bladehunter

[Hawkeye77]

5 hours ago, J13 said:

I don't think Azinger read the interview.  Nothing BK said was offensive or screamed "I hate the Ryder Cup".   

He probably watched all the crap on Golf Channel overhyping it all. 

[Soloman1]

I'm sorry, but I've decided that I really don't care about the Ryder Cup anymore. It's like all team sports now... who cares? Is anyone going to pay me something if they win? Nope.

Edited September 17, 2021 by Soloman1

[oikos1]

1 hour ago, Soloman1 said:

I'm sorry, but I've decided that I really don't about the Ryder Cup anymore. It's like all team sports now... who cares? Is anyone going to pay me something if they win? Nope.

Maybe you'll get paid if you place a bet, baby!

 

[OrangeGravy]

16 hours ago, bladehunter said:

I see what you’re saying. But. Huge but.  
 

what Brooks is describing is a non team player. Snd that’s okay.  It’s ok that he’s not one. But.  Here’s that huge BUT.  He shouldn’t be on a team if he doesn’t want to be part of a team.  The meetings. The taking ownership of your partners shots , that’s how a team works.  He can’t sit and claim to want to be there , and yet call out someone for hitting a bad shot in partners matches.  That person didn’t hit a bad shot.   WE hit a bad shot.  Or else there is no team.  

I think the guys that feel similar to BK about the RC are more afraid of what will be said about them and their marketability if they were to openly opt out of the RC all together. I can easily see their "team" saying you gotta play if you qualify or are chosen. It would damage their brand for sure much more than playing and losing.

 

I'm also pretty confident that they all want to win it, but not all if them care if they lose it. Every athlete wants to win when they okay, but the really good/great one's hate to lose more than wanting to win

[OrangeGravy]

14 hours ago, bladehunter said:

I suppose at least he’s voiced the idea of an effort. 
 

 

it’s just that I’ve played team sports from age 5 to 25 mostly basketball as far as team went.  You learn to spot this guy early and easily.   Usually it’s the coaches kid or a rich kid etc.  and it goes something like this.  
 

big game comes up , you practice as a team. And you come out of the gate flat.  Go into halftime and the previously mentioned jerk was will announce something like “  get the ball out to me on the wing , Billy is missing too many inside “.  The reality of that is that Billy is working the block down low and has been double teamed all game due to the wing not moving without the ball to draw the 2nd defender out.  His a** is standing at the top yelling for the ball.  So Billy does all he can and shoot each time with 2 hands in his face.  So the jerk is double wrong usually.  He’s helping cause the missed shots either through attitude or actions , and in top of it he’s calling out his big guy at halftime for having a poor percentage.  I’ve seen fist fights over this very thing in the locker room. All it takes is one guy playing for himself.  The rare exceptions are like MJ or Bird.  They are talented enough to beat most teams 5 on 1. But if you look very closely. They almost alwasy do the other team fundamentals well. Even if it’s for selfish reasons to get themselves open.  
 

I see team golf as the same. Don’t apologize for a bad result as long as you’re grinding alll you can.  And never blame a guy for  a bad result. Ever.  Always help him shoulder it.  Next time it maybe your turn to get that mental help.    I’m not meaning this shot at you.  I just see this as being the disconnect between the European team and the USA.  The euros get this concept.  

 

15 hours ago, smashdn said:

 

Exactly.  There very rarely is the "yeah, but" argument when it comes to Jack where the Ryder Cup record is brought up.  I have neve heard, "Yeah, he is the best golfer but his Ryder Cup record is not that good so..."

 

So the converse shouldn't be accepted.  "Yeah Sergio/Poulter don't have that many wins or major wins but they have a really good Ryder Cup record." 

 

It's a match play exhibition.  I like it.  I watch it.  It entertains me.  But, like you, I don't use it as a barometer to measure a player's career. 

You can go down as a legend in euro tour circles if you bring results like Sergio/Poulter in the RC. There is no such tier on the US side. Even if someone performed as well over so many RC's, no one here considers it a legit piece of a player's career resume. It will only garner praise from a tiny group of golf fans. Even the golf media will only refer to it in the run up to future cups. There is nothing to gain "career" wise for a US golfer that would activate the selfish/ego part of their brain that drives them the other 51 weeks a year.

[Soloman1]

2 hours ago, oikos1 said:

Maybe you'll get paid if you place a bet, baby!

 

 

I bet you're right.