Masters Ticket Scalpers

[golfortennis]

On 2/24/2022 at 9:56 AM, BlackDiamondPar5 said:

That sounds way too professional and legit. I suggest Ticket Vermin. 

 

You know, I'm not so sure I agree.  There is obviously a market for tickets at those prices.  Is the fact they get x% above face value really a criticism on them, or are the event organizers mispricing their tickets?

 

I will agree that the "systems" that go in and scoop up a whole bunch of tickets ahead of time and then charge exorbitant prices after effectively locking everyone else out need to be dealt with if they haven't already.  But if people had the same opportunity to buy tickets initially, and it sells out quickly and still has people willing to pay any price, who is really the bad guy?  And is it any different than if you or I had a pair of tickets and sold them for more because you could?

 

There is also risk involved.  I once bought tickets for a group to a football game.  I ended up eating 2/3s of the price of the last ticket because I trusted someone to buy it rather than get cash up front.  Now, the amount didn't break me, but these guys can get stuck with tickets that they sell at a loss.  It's not always pure profit in the three and four digit percentage range.

[dmbolp]

Practice round you're can watch 3-5 guys all putting multiple balls at the same time, on the same hole, from different positions, to quickly see all the breaks/speeds possible.  You get to bring a camera in.  Course is WAY less crowded on a practice round vs a tournament round.  All merch is still available.  Course is in it's best shape before crowd wears out the walking paths.

 

Even during a tournament round you're only seeing <5% of the action at any given time, so it's not like you're see the "whole game" anyway.

 

Practice Round > Tournament Round

[thatoneguy]

My dad and I are flying in from California on Saturday, the weekend before the tournament begins, for our first Masters trip. We plan on buying along Washington for Monday and Tuesday practice rounds. May opt to purchase through Stubhub the night before if the prices drop low enough. Would love to be lining up at the gates first thing in the morning instead of haggling with brokers for a couple of hours, but we're prepared for the latter. Can't wait. 

[dmbolp]

Let's move to daily updates; tickets have to be arriving soon, and then we should see some movement on prices:

 

	MON		TUE		WED
	#	Low	#	Low	#	Low
3/1	144	38 @ 1,100-1,250	235	53 @ 1,350-1,500	188	34 @ 1,750-2,000

Edited March 1, 2022 by dmbolp

[BlackDiamondPar5]

14 hours ago, golfortennis said:

 

You know, I'm not so sure I agree.  There is obviously a market for tickets at those prices.  Is the fact they get x% above face value really a criticism on them, or are the event organizers mispricing their tickets?

 

I will agree that the "systems" that go in and scoop up a whole bunch of tickets ahead of time and then charge exorbitant prices after effectively locking everyone else out need to be dealt with if they haven't already.  But if people had the same opportunity to buy tickets initially, and it sells out quickly and still has people willing to pay any price, who is really the bad guy?  And is it any different than if you or I had a pair of tickets and sold them for more because you could?

 

There is also risk involved.  I once bought tickets for a group to a football game.  I ended up eating 2/3s of the price of the last ticket because I trusted someone to buy it rather than get cash up front.  Now, the amount didn't break me, but these guys can get stuck with tickets that they sell at a loss.  It's not always pure profit in the three and four digit percentage range.

I'm not talking about the person that buys for an event and can't attend so they sell. I'm talking about businesses and people that scoop tickets with no intention of ever attending. They are simply a non-value add entity inserting themselves in the supply chain, artificially reducing supply and therefore driving up the ticket cost. They are Ticket Vermin.

 

I've simply had too many infuriating experiences trying to buy concert tickets on i.e. Ticketmaster only to be sold out quickly because of electronic and human bots working to scoop up the supply so they can be sold on reseller websites at multiples above face value.  I always ask myself, how the heck do these ticket resellers have front row seats selling at 5-10x face value even BEFORE the tickets go on sale? 

 

As for The Masters tickets specifically, they've done a lot to check back this process but it's still a significant activity for Ticket Vermin.  If The Masters hosts intended their tickets to be sold at higher prices then they'd set that price for themselves, but that's not how the want their product to be sold.  Same for their food/drink, they could charge normal high PGA Tournament prices but they don't. 

[me05501]

17 minutes ago, BlackDiamondPar5 said:

I'm not talking about the person that buys for an event and can't attend so they sell. I'm talking about businesses and people that scoop tickets with no intention of ever attending. They are simply a non-value add entity inserting themselves in the supply chain, artificially reducing supply and therefore driving up the ticket cost. They are Ticket Vermin.

 

I've simply had too many infuriating experiences trying to buy concert tickets on i.e. Ticketmaster only to be sold out quickly because of electronic and human bots working to scoop up the supply so they can be sold on reseller websites at multiples above face value.  I always ask myself, how the heck do these ticket resellers have front row seats selling at 5-10x face value even BEFORE the tickets go on sale? 

 

As for The Masters tickets specifically, they've done a lot to check back this process but it's still a significant activity for Ticket Vermin.  If The Masters hosts intended their tickets to be sold at higher prices then they'd set that price for themselves, but that's not how the want their product to be sold.  Same for their food/drink, they could charge normal high PGA Tournament prices but they don't. 

Some online ticket vendors are predatory for sure. 
 

Around here you have to be really careful to make sure you’re buying directly from the venue when tickets first go on sale, especially for a show that will sell out. If you just google “Stones tickets” your results will be mostly resellers who don’t yet own the tickets and are expecting to get a big resale premium. If you’re lazy you can easily overpay even when tickets are still available from the venue at face value. 

[bladehunter]

38 minutes ago, BlackDiamondPar5 said:

I'm not talking about the person that buys for an event and can't attend so they sell. I'm talking about businesses and people that scoop tickets with no intention of ever attending. They are simply a non-value add entity inserting themselves in the supply chain, artificially reducing supply and therefore driving up the ticket cost. They are Ticket Vermin.

 

I've simply had too many infuriating experiences trying to buy concert tickets on i.e. Ticketmaster only to be sold out quickly because of electronic and human bots working to scoop up the supply so they can be sold on reseller websites at multiples above face value.  I always ask myself, how the heck do these ticket resellers have front row seats selling at 5-10x face value even BEFORE the tickets go on sale? 

 

As for The Masters tickets specifically, they've done a lot to check back this process but it's still a significant activity for Ticket Vermin.  If The Masters hosts intended their tickets to be sold at higher prices then they'd set that price for themselves, but that's not how the want their product to be sold.  Same for their food/drink, they could charge normal high PGA Tournament prices but they don't. 

Amen.    Not to mention those who enter the lottery here just to flip on the BST.  No intention of going.  It’s a false demand. Those of us who’ve been in the lottery for years and never picked , statistically are much less likely to get picked  because of these guys.  
 

id be curious to know the number of practice round tickets that are actually used vs the amount sold through the lottery ?  It’s been said here many times that the practice rounds are less crowded.  So one has to assume that it’s much less than sell out level. And yet , you can’t get a ticket.     Scalpers are holding some of them it seems to keep prices up.  

[dcmidnight]

1 hour ago, bladehunter said:

It’s been said here many times that the practice rounds are less crowded.  So one has to assume that it’s much less than sell out level. 

 

Actually, I wouldn't assume that at all, I'm not sure that practice rounds are less crowded because...people aren't using tickets/its not a sellout. I'd lean more towards ANGC keeping the available numbers lower on practice round days to...among other things...make the experience more enjoyable? Keeps demand as high as possible, keeps the lottery getting bigger and bigger every year.

 

Couple facts I think we know for sure - one, we're just guessing on this because ANGC will never release specifics so we could be completely wrong and two, no matter how many tickets they make available, they could sell 10x that amount.

Edited March 1, 2022 by dcmidnight

[bladehunter]

1 hour ago, dcmidnight said:

 

Actually, I wouldn't assume that at all, I'm not sure that practice rounds are less crowded because...people aren't using tickets/its not a sellout. I'd lean more towards ANGC keeping the available numbers lower on practice round days to...among other things...make the experience more enjoyable? Keeps demand as high as possible, keeps the lottery getting bigger and bigger every year.

 

Couple facts I think we know for sure - one, we're just guessing on this because ANGC will never release specifics so we could be completely wrong and two, no matter how many tickets they make available, they could sell 10x that amount.

Maybe so.  At face value for sure.  But I’m just not convinced at $2k a pop.  Or near that.  Tv quality is too good . At any rate. I still hope to get picked one day and see the place.  At this point I have a sneaking suspicion that it will be a letdown anyway. With this much buildup , I’d be shocked if it left me satisfied.  But I’d be happy to be wrong.  At any rate. I’m not paying scalpers prices to find out , especially in today’s economy.  

[dmbolp]

I think part of the reason Practice at least seems less crowded than THUR-SUN; people are probably more incline to just do partial days for Practice rounds...some come early and leave early, some come late and leave late, whereas for a Tournament round most everyone gets in early and stays late.

[aenemated]

5 hours ago, BlackDiamondPar5 said:

I'm not talking about the person that buys for an event and can't attend so they sell. I'm talking about businesses and people that scoop tickets with no intention of ever attending. They are simply a non-value add entity inserting themselves in the supply chain, artificially reducing supply and therefore driving up the ticket cost. They are Ticket Vermin.

 

💯💯💯

 

[thatoneguy]

6 hours ago, dmbolp said:

Let's move to daily updates; tickets have to be arriving soon, and then we should see some movement on prices:

 

	MON		TUE		WED
	#	Low	#	Low	#	Low
3/1	144	38 @ 1,100-1,250	235	53 @ 1,350-1,500	188	34 @ 1,750-2,000

 

This is great knowledge to have. Realistically though, no-one would be paying $1,100 out of pocket if they purchased a Monday ticket today. With Stub fees and tax it comes to $1481 per ticket. $266 service fee, $5.25 fulfillment fee, $110 tax.

Side note, there are $1k tickets for Monday now available.

 

[dmbolp]

9 minutes ago, thatoneguy said:

 

This is great knowledge to have. Realistically though, no-one would be paying $1,100 out of pocket if they purchased a Monday ticket today. With Stub fees and tax it comes to $1481 per ticket. $266 service fee, $5.25 fulfillment fee, $110 tax.

Side note, there are $1k tickets for Monday now available.

 

 

Yeah, it ain't cheap!!! 🙂  

 

And my numbers are just a single, daily point in time.  Who knows, maybe someone has listed tickets at face, and brokers or other buyers refreshing constantly has grabbed them.

[exit47]

Dont kid yourselves.   ANGC loves that corporate $$ coming through the gates and into Augusta.   Those high prices on the secondary market also keep the event more exclusive to the "elite" on tournament days.   That's exactly how they want it and who they want at the tournament.   If they wanted to stop the badge resell, they couldve done it years ago.    They stop the secondary market, the city of Augusta loses.   That city lives off The Masters. 

[manku]

38 years ago I worked at a big record store in NYC.  Springsteen announced a run of shows at Brendan Byrne Arena.  Morning of on sale, there was a line around the block.  
 

Management spent the first 20 minutes printing out tickets for their own use/resale.  
 

Needless to say, those in the line got crappy seats or none at all.  
 

I could tell you dozens of other stories about insiders scooping up tickets to resell.  
 

This has been going on forever, and always will.  

[BlackDiamondPar5]

7 minutes ago, manku said:

38 years ago I worked at a big record store in NYC.  Springsteen announced a run of shows at Brendan Byrne Arena.  Morning of on sale, there was a line around the block.  
 

Management spent the first 20 minutes printing out tickets for their own use/resale.  
 

Needless to say, those in the line got crappy seats or none at all.  
 

I could tell you dozens of other stories about insiders scooping up tickets to resell.  
 

This has been going on forever, and always will.  

Easy solution, make it illegal  to sell tickets above face value. That would put an end to mass exploitation under the guise of "legitimate" web sites. It used to be illegal in many localities until the government got their cut (taxes).    

Edited March 1, 2022 by BlackDiamondPar5

[TwistedSister]

Did AGNC change the long standing policy of not allowing the transfer of tickets?

[golfortennis]

41 minutes ago, BlackDiamondPar5 said:

Easy solution, make it illegal  to sell tickets above face value. That would put an end to mass exploitation under the guise of "legitimate" web sites. It used to be illegal in many localities until the government got their cut (taxes).    

 

Funny how everything is "dangerous" until the tribute is paid, and then it's ok.

 

Although you need to be careful what you wish for.  Face value will go up quite a bit.  You are already seeing it with teams and their dynamic pricing initiatives.  Which I'm fine with.  The promoters/teams/whoever are mispricing their product apparently.  If they want to leave money on the table.....

[golfortennis]

9 hours ago, bladehunter said:

Amen.    Not to mention those who enter the lottery here just to flip on the BST.  No intention of going.  It’s a false demand. Those of us who’ve been in the lottery for years and never picked , statistically are much less likely to get picked  because of these guys.  
 

id be curious to know the number of practice round tickets that are actually used vs the amount sold through the lottery ?  It’s been said here many times that the practice rounds are less crowded.  So one has to assume that it’s much less than sell out level. And yet , you can’t get a ticket.     Scalpers are holding some of them it seems to keep prices up.  

 

 

So you would be ok if ANGC started selling them at $2k a pop, since that would become face value?  I'm thinking more people than you think would pony up.

 

Although ANGC is one of those rare birds in that they control something of almost incalculable value, and yet they have no need to maximize it.  

 

But take the Springsteen concert someone mentioned.  If the scalper can get $2,000 for a $350 face value ticket, that is bad, but if Springsteen prices it at $2k that would be ok?  

 

I agree about the bots etc. that get in there and gather them before you can even do anything(didn't ticketmaster or stubhub have a major scandal over that?), but much as you may dislike it, scalpers provide a service.  For one reason or another access is limited to events.  They make access available, but it comes at a price.  

[aenemated]

2 hours ago, golfortennis said:

But take the Springsteen concert someone mentioned.  If the scalper can get $2,000 for a $350 face value ticket, that is bad, but if Springsteen prices it at $2k that would be ok?

 

Yep. Because Bruce and all the folks who work to put on the event would get the money and not some scumbag that created a false scarcity and created nothing of value. 

 

Scalpers represent everything I hate about humanity. Ethically and morally bankrupt scumbags that deserve every bit of derision they get. 

Edited March 2, 2022 by aenemated

[manku]

3 hours ago, BlackDiamondPar5 said:

Easy solution, make it illegal  to sell tickets above face value. That would put an end to mass exploitation under the guise of "legitimate" web sites. It used to be illegal in many localities until the government got their cut (taxes).    

Ticket scalping or resales was illegal in NYC at the time.  
 

Made no difference.  
 

[bladehunter]

4 hours ago, golfortennis said:

 

 

So you would be ok if ANGC started selling them at $2k a pop, since that would become face value?  I'm thinking more people than you think would pony up.

 

Although ANGC is one of those rare birds in that they control something of almost incalculable value, and yet they have no need to maximize it.  

 

But take the Springsteen concert someone mentioned.  If the scalper can get $2,000 for a $350 face value ticket, that is bad, but if Springsteen prices it at $2k that would be ok?  

 

I agree about the bots etc. that get in there and gather them before you can even do anything(didn't ticketmaster or stubhub have a major scandal over that?), but much as you may dislike it, scalpers provide a service.  For one reason or another access is limited to events.  They make access available, but it comes at a price.  

Honest answer. ?  Yes. I’d rather see Augusta get the $ than the scalpers.   
 

it’s no different than Nike shoe flippers.  The bots and flippers drive the price up artificially.  Then sell all they can at the inflated price. Then sit on the rest until they are discontinued , then drive the price up more for “ rarity “.     
 

nothing is more off putting than opening the bst here and seeing the lottery won tickets being flipped . It’s a finger  in the face of us who never get picked. 
 

i don’t agree with the last part. They provide no service. There’s x number of tickets.  After they scoop up and resell , the same number exists.  If you put them all in a sack and threw them in the river , there’d be the same number of Augusta tickets on the market.  

Edited March 2, 2022 by bladehunter

[dmbolp]

Very little change 3/1 AM to 3/2 AM...where are the tickets?!?!?

 

	MON		TUE		WED
	#	Low	#	Low	#	Low
3/1	144	38 @ 1,100-1,250	235	53 @ 1,350-1,500	188	34 @ 1,750-2,000
3/2	141	37 @ 1,100-1,250	243	49 @ 1,300-1,500	189	32 @ 1,750-2,000

[dcmidnight]

Clearly they haven't been mailed out yet.

[Vespar]

Just a random question, How does one sell a single master ticket? How would you go about it, stub hub, ebay?

 

Next the two people i know that have been selected for masters tickets seem to have one thing in common they are well connected and wealthy. I've been trying for decades, I'm not poor by any means. Augusta claims its not a lottery but a "selection process".

 

What do you suppose the selection process looks like?

[bladehunter]

1 minute ago, Vespar said:

Just a random question, How does one sell a single master ticket? How would you go about it, stub hub, ebay?

 

Next the two people i know that have been selected for masters tickets seem to have one thing in common they are well connected and wealthy. I've been trying for decades, I'm not poor by any means. Augusta claims its not a lottery but a "selection process".

 

What do you suppose the selection process looks like?

I’m convinced they choose people from farther  away first.  I’m close by , no dice.  But if you’re in the northeast it seems to be easier.  I guess they’re bringing the tourist $ in on purpose. I can sleep in my bed and drive back and forth easy.  So not much $ to gain.  

[dcmidnight]

14 minutes ago, bladehunter said:

I’m convinced they choose people from farther  away first.  I’m close by , no dice.  But if you’re in the northeast it seems to be easier.  I guess they’re bringing the tourist $ in on purpose. I can sleep in my bed and drive back and forth easy.  So not much $ to gain.  

 

I live in the mid-atlantic, this is my first time in 30+ years trying. I have a buddy that lives outside of St Simons, about a 3 hour drive, this will be his third trip in the last five years.

 

I think we all - probably - drastically underestimate how many people apply every year.

[BlackDiamondPar5]

3 minutes ago, bladehunter said:

I’m convinced they choose people from farther  away first.  I’m close by , no dice.  But if you’re in the northeast it seems to be easier.  I guess they’re bringing the tourist $ in on purpose. I can sleep in my bed and drive back and forth easy.  So not much $ to gain.  

I honestly think it has way more to do with the population density of the North East thus driving more lottery participants.

Kinda the same way I used to think to myself "why does it seem the state money lottery winners are always from the greater NYC area?" Because they have way more people and sell way more tickets there than the rest of the NY state.  

 

13 hours ago, golfortennis said:

 

 

So you would be ok if ANGC started selling them at $2k a pop, since that would become face value?  I'm thinking more people than you think would pony up.

 

Although ANGC is one of those rare birds in that they control something of almost incalculable value, and yet they have no need to maximize it.  

 

But take the Springsteen concert someone mentioned.  If the scalper can get $2,000 for a $350 face value ticket, that is bad, but if Springsteen prices it at $2k that would be ok?  

 

I agree about the bots etc. that get in there and gather them before you can even do anything(didn't ticketmaster or stubhub have a major scandal over that?), but much as you may dislike it, scalpers provide a service.  For one reason or another access is limited to events.  They make access available, but it comes at a price.  

No the scalpers do not provide a service. They simply have inserted themselves into the supply chain. They gather as much inventory as possible, reduce supply and then drive up the price.  The people running the show should determine what the price is, not some scalpers that have manipulated the supply chain.  Make it illegal to sell a ticket above face value.  Sure this would not eliminate back ally sales above face value, but it would put an end to the mass secondary market practice of pricing above face value such as on Stubhub, Vivid seats etc.  

 

I would bet the $350 Springsteen seat that sells on stubhub for $2,000 would never sell anywhere close to that price if not for the ability of Ticket Vermin to manipulate the supply chain.  Make tickets non-transferable, must be registered to the holder, like airline tickets.  Heck even demand pricing from the organizer and lets see what they sell for. Regardless at least the additional monies would be going to organizers and band.  

 

Thankfully airlines make it virtually impossible to transfer tickets to another, otherwise we'd have people buying up seats and then reselling them.   

 

It's a disgusting practice that needs to be put to an end. 

[dcmidnight]

Yeah Masters aside - I just disagree. I am happy to have the option to pay the StubHub price if I get shutout of a game or concert that I want to go to. Even if you remove the autobot-scalpers from the equation, there's always going to be small clubs that sell out or games that sell out that I still want to go to. If I want to pay 10x the face value to go - thats on me. I've done this for a couple of Red Sox World Series games at Fenway and dont regret it at all.

[dmbolp]

Someone smarter than me on these boards has said that having an Atlanta zip code is very helpful.  I have that, and have received MON basically every-other year for the past 20 years.