Value of hitting off grass range rather than mats?

[betarhoalphadelta]

I hear a lot of talk about hitting off grass being a much better experience than hitting off range mats. More concerningly, I've heard people state that hitting off mats can end up being "more forgiving", or otherwise perhaps provide poor feedback because it doesn't really replicate actual turf conditions. 

 

It's probably anecdotal, and as a 19.7 index, the variance in my game probably outweighs any mat influence, but it has sometimes seemed like when I hit the range a few days before playing, and hit off mats, my ballstriking is even worse than normal the next round. And the few times I've hit off real turf at the range, it's seemed like my ballstriking is worse than when I hit off mats. 

 

My local 9-hole exec course & practice facility has a membership which allows a free bucket of balls every day. In order to hit off real grass, available 4 days a week (to minimize turf damage and allow regrowth) is only $2 extra. Conditions on the turf range can sometimes be a little softer than typical SoCal course conditions, because they need to water more frequently to ensure regrowth. But at least it's real grass. 

 

So I'm wondering... How much extra value is there in hitting off real grass? What are the REAL dangers of practicing all the time off mats and how much can it affect your game vs practicing on turf? 

 

I'm pretty sure everyone will tell me that $2/session is MORE than worth it... I think I'm going to start using the turf range instead. But I added the poll question to see exactly how much people would be willing to add to their normal range session cost, if given the choice between mats and turf, to hit off turf.

[Paddy_2_Iron]

Grass ranges are overrated but provide a small amount of value.  Mats are worthless and depending on your swing profile can damage you causing more downtime and even the potential of an injury sidelining you indefinitely.  

Edited February 7, 2022 by Paddy_2_Iron

[bortass]

I didn't vote because I avoid mats like the plague. I'll hit off them if I have no other option but have never been presented with a financial reason to choose one over the other. 

 

For me the problem with mats is they are forgiving. I can hit the ball slightly fat but because the club doesn't dig, I get a nice high ball flight that I expect from a well struck ball. I can't tell it was fat based on contact or ball flight and there's no divot to look at either. On grass it's obvious. The divot is there and the ball will not go as far.

 

So driver is fine off matts for me but that's it. Anything else and I'm not sure just how good I'm really doing since low point control is something I am not good with....

 

We play on grass, so the more practice you can do on grass the better. I recommend it highly unless there's a significant time or cost element. Not sure if I'd drive an extra 30 minutes to hit off grass but that would mean I'm probably not practicing much at all because of it.

 

I have read people complain about joint issues related to mats but i have no personal experience with it.

[vandyfan]

Your typical, crappy mat with give you perfect lies and allow you to skip through fat shots. Typically you can feel it if you hit ground first and I feel like this is minimized a bit (but still present) for long irons and woods where you are sweeping the ball more. Wedges off mats, to me, are useless. Thankfully, you don't need a ton of room to practice wedges so you can do that on a sports field somewhere with a shag bag. I am not so hardcore as to say hitting of a mat is worse than doing nothing at all but I do agree it can hide some faults. Doing a wedge or iron fitting off of mats, to me, is absurd. Turf interaction matters. 

 

One of my favorite checks to see if I am hitting the ball well with my short to mid irons, that I cannot do off a mat, is to hit full shots off of bare lies at the range. And uneven lies (hard to find these at the range). All that said, I have a mat that I hit off of into a net behind my house. For that I use primarily long irons and often some old blades that give me the most feedback on my strike location. 

[PoeKingShankspeare]

I don't mind practicing on mats. From full shots to flop shots over the net in my garage hitting bay/simulator. I have another mat with artificial rough and fluffier turf that grabs the sole of the club if you hit fat. But, I use my 5 x 5 commercial mat most of the time. I haven't developed any physical pain and I've been using mats since I picked up the sport back in 93'. The only thing I don't like about the mats, I have to periodically check the lie angles on my irons and bend them back flat. 

 

The grass conditions at the local ranges are not the same as the tight flat fairways I play on. Even the rough isn't the same as the grass range. Likewise, some of the grass range are very "sandy" and scratches up the face of the club too much. The only grass I practice on is at the short game area. But I don't have time to drive out there, so most of my chipping and pitching are done at home (sim). Make due with what I have.  

 

Everyone has their opinions about mats, but if you can recognize when you hit thin, fat, or poor ball contact, I don't see anything wrong with mats - getting injuries, then you should avoid mats. One easy way to see if you're hitting fat, just put a coin few inches behind your ball, or use chalk. Hit the coin before the ball, mat or grass, you need to move your low point in front of the ball. 

 
with that said.... if I was a high handicap player I'd practice on both grass and mats. I wouldn't be so picky. 

 

[Pepperturbo]

Your range ball cost proposals don't seem realistic, least here in SOCA where I play golf.  Grass ranges cost a great deal more to maintain plus problematic when the range gets a lot of traffic.  Typically, a range has alternating grass lines, let's say 5 or 6 from back mat line to end of grass range.  That turf area needs time to grow back in, so a well managed range moves people back to mat line to get the turf time to grow-back-in. 

 

I used to practice at three ranges like that, didn't hit buckets, but 250 ball baskets, and about 1100-1300 balls per week.  Did that for near five years.  Most ranges like that charge a few dollars more per bucket for turf as opposed to hitting off mat.  Cost has everything to do with where you are, and related range cost's in that area.

Edited February 7, 2022 by Pepperturbo

[milesgiles]

5 hours ago, Paddy_2_Iron said:

Grass ranges are overrated but provide a small amount of value.  Mats are worthless and depending on your swing profile can damage you causing more downtime and even the potential of an injury sidelining you indefinitely.  

 

so dont practise at all then?

[Paddy_2_Iron]

1 hour ago, milesgiles said:

 

so dont practise at all then?

 

Practice holes.  I live in a golfing community and sometimes I'll walk over to a par 5 behind my neighbors house across the street and hit ball into a green.  That actually makes you better because you are on an actual course hitting into greens.  

 

I also am a firm believer in chipping and putting.   Most professionals (playing and teaching) emphasize short game.  This is where most golfers should spend most of their time.  

 

Only time I would even consider a driving range is when you are driving the ball.  That's why they call it a "driving" range.  

[MelloYello]

8 hours ago, bortass said:

I didn't vote because I avoid mats like the plague. I'll hit off them if I have no other option but have never been presented with a financial reason to choose one over the other. 

 

For me the problem with mats is they are forgiving. I can hit the ball slightly fat but because the club doesn't dig, I get a nice high ball flight that I expect from a well struck ball. I can't tell it was fat based on contact or ball flight and there's no divot to look at either. On grass it's obvious. The divot is there and the ball will not go as far.

 

So driver is fine off matts for me but that's it. Anything else and I'm not sure just how good I'm really doing since low point control is something I am not good with....

 

We play on grass, so the more practice you can do on grass the better. I recommend it highly unless there's a significant time or cost element. Not sure if I'd drive an extra 30 minutes to hit off grass but that would mean I'm probably not practicing much at all because of it.

 

I have read people complain about joint issues related to mats but i have no personal experience with it.

 

This times 1-million!

 

I literally just started a similar thread about this very topic before seeing this one. Mats make me feel like Tiger Woods. If I had 2-3 extended range sessions on mats I know I'll be fighting some contact issue as soon as I return to real grass. It screws me up 100%. And it's so addictive, too. 

[milesgiles]

7 hours ago, Paddy_2_Iron said:

 

Practice holes.  I live in a golfing community and sometimes I'll walk over to a par 5 behind my neighbors house across the street and hit ball into a green.  That actually makes you better because you are on an actual course hitting into greens.  

 

I also am a firm believer in chipping and putting.   Most professionals (playing and teaching) emphasize short game.  This is where most golfers should spend most of their time.  

 

Only time I would even consider a driving range is when you are driving the ball.  That's why they call it a "driving" range.  

 

how is this working out for you?

[hammersia]

All mats are different

[Paddy_2_Iron]

4 hours ago, milesgiles said:

 

how is this working out for you?

 

Excellent just switched up about 6 months ago.  Pros with this change.  

 

Note started this journey in conjunction with @MonteScheinblum no cast 5-6 part series.  

 

In regards to mats

Elbow pain gone

Wrist numbness gone

Glute pain gone

Handicap has dropped 10 points in 6 months and steadily declining

 

What really has helped the most (stat tracking half baked) has been the chipping and putting.  I have more time to spend on this part of the game.  My lag putting has improved greatly and probably is the biggest culprit of my improvement.  

 

My approach game has improved as well.  I understand how the ball reacts off my club and what it's capable of doing.  You lose that on the range.  When I hit a 9 iron 130 and it release ever so slightly I learn for 135 yards that might be the play.  Each iron and how it respond has a different personality and you don't get any of that on the range.  You do on the course especially practice a course you play.   I learn so much on how the ball reacts once it hits the ground and what it does. 

 

A acquaintance of mine through a good friend who played college golf and is scratch recommended my strategy.  He said get out and play more than practice and practice like you play.  He is right.  

 

Side note the par 3 9 hole is a fantastic way to improve.  I love it.  I drop one ball down on the ground and one slightly tee'd.  I do this for each hole and my par 3 par has really improved a lot.  Those 4 holes I used to dread I actually look forward too.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited February 8, 2022 by Paddy_2_Iron

[bortass]

I'll add an additional comment based on @MelloYello's thread were some people love them. The range mats I have hit off were not high quality. My course has a strip that is just a matt for when it's too wet for us to hit off the grass. It's just one long strip of mats that's sitting in the weather year round. It doesn't have the little holes for the rubber tees, so you can't actually tee a ball on them. I would not call them high quality but I'm no expert in that area either.

 

The range in Maine that had mats had individual matts but again it was exposed to the weather year round and you needed to remember to bring your own rubber tee thing for them, lol. They also were an octagon shape, so stance was always a bit fun.

 

 

[jholz]

Mats freakin' suck, but for many of us, that's the only option.

 

In Alabama/Georgia, even the crappiest dirt track had a grass range. In Colorado and Maryland, you've gotta belong to a pretty special club to have a grass range.

 

In Colorado I can understand this. In Maryland, it makes no sense whatsoever. Grass grows like weeds around here.

 

But, I'm still hitting off mats. I'm not a fan.

[bladehunter]

Contact your local muni course. Most have range memberships.  Mine is $300 a calendar year for unlimited balls.  You can hit 5 buckets a day if you want. ( heck 20 , it’s no questions  asked ). All on a grass range.  With putting green etc. 

Edited February 8, 2022 by bladehunter

[bladehunter]

31 minutes ago, jholz said:

Mats freakin' suck, but for many of us, that's the only option.

 

In Alabama/Georgia, even the crappiest dirt track had a grass range. In Colorado and Maryland, you've gotta belong to a pretty special club to have a grass range.

 

In Colorado I can understand this. In Maryland, it makes no sense whatsoever. Grass grows like weeds around here.

 

But, I'm still hitting off mats. I'm not a fan.

Agree. Range upkeep isn’t hard. Sand and seed.  Move it daily.  You just need a big enough spot to let the Bermuda grow.  Mine puts rye on it for the winter.  

[LeftyMatt24]

Definitely would pay extra privileges to always be on grass. I find it helps my short game the most. 30-120 yard shots 

[gripANDrip1983]

It’s absolutely true that hitting off of a mat can damage your game. Simply because one doesn’t get the correct feedback from hitting shots fat.. the club head will slide right through the ball and sometimes it can create a really nice high ball flight as to where if you hit the exact same shot off of grass, your gonna miss your target by 25+ yards.. just my two cents on the matter.

[MelloYello]

26 minutes ago, bladehunter said:

Agree. Range upkeep isn’t hard. Sand and seed.  Move it daily.  You just need a big enough spot to let the Bermuda grow.  Mine puts rye on it for the winter.  

 

Yeah, I can't complain about our range. At my club we do everything you listed above. Overall, we do a good job but it gets SO MUCH use it's not even funny. As is the case with many private clubs we've got High School golfers with membership who practice. They're always out there. Every. Single. Day. And the members that use it, God bless 'em, aren't leaving the prettiest divot patterns, LOL. 

 

There's only so much practice a range can handle. 

My plan for next year is to try and do more on-course practice and spend more time at the short game area. Again, I'm blessed to have a lot of options but the range rat life, as addictive as it is, only takes you so far. Doing the range rat thing on mats seems to be downright harmful for me. 

 

.

Edited February 8, 2022 by MelloYello

[betarhoalphadelta]

Sounds like I might as well make the switch to grass. And especially with the feedback in @MelloYello's thread, I already sometimes have issues with golfer's elbow. It's worst after hitting 100 balls off the mats. 

 

2 hours ago, Paddy_2_Iron said:

 

Side note the par 3 9 hole is a fantastic way to improve.  I love it.  I drop one ball down on the ground and one slightly tee'd.  I do this for each hole and my par 3 par has really improved a lot.  Those 4 holes I used to dread I actually look forward too.  

 

 

This is another one for me. Right now short game and putting is the weakest part of my game, but something about using the short game practice area at my practice facility just can't mentally get me into a groove. So I'm going to start playing the exec course at that facility more often. 7 of 9 holes are short par 3s, and so I don't even tee a ball up on those holes. I figure I'm trying to simulate hitting a wedge off the turf as I would from a fairway lie, not make things easier on myself with a tee. 

 

I still miss the green often enough on those holes to work short game lol.

[Paddy_2_Iron]

1 hour ago, betarhoalphadelta said:

Sounds like I might as well make the switch to grass. And especially with the feedback in @MelloYello's thread, I already sometimes have issues with golfer's elbow. It's worst after hitting 100 balls off the mats. 

 

 

This is another one for me. Right now short game and putting is the weakest part of my game, but something about using the short game practice area at my practice facility just can't mentally get me into a groove. So I'm going to start playing the exec course at that facility more often. 7 of 9 holes are short par 3s, and so I don't even tee a ball up on those holes. I figure I'm trying to simulate hitting a wedge off the turf as I would from a fairway lie, not make things easier on myself with a tee. 

 

I still miss the green often enough on those holes to work short game lol.

 

I did just the turf for a while and lost my skill to hit irons off the tee.  I highly recommend (if you can swing it) doing both on each hole.  One tee'd as you would on the tee box and like you said off the turf.  Just my two cents.  

[betarhoalphadelta]

16 minutes ago, Paddy_2_Iron said:

 

I did just the turf for a while and lost my skill to hit irons off the tee.  I highly recommend (if you can swing it) doing both on each hole.  One tee'd as you would on the tee box and like you said off the turf.  Just my two cents.  

 

I can't get away with that if I'm there with my son on a weekend, but if I go out for a weekday morning round I can probably hit two balls as I'm usually alone for at least half the round before I catch anyone... So I might give that a try. Distance-wise there isn't a par 3 on that course that takes more than my 48* wedge to reach (and only one like that), though, so it's not like I'm hitting distances similar to a typical par 3 often. 

 

I've also been considering hitting two balls, one with a sand wedge (a few of the holes are perfect for an 80-90% 56* wedge), and then one with a partial 52* (which would usually go long if hit "full"). 

[MelloYello]

Something I started doing a few years back as I became a member with regular course access was to play 9-holes from the red tees. 

 

You can play 1 ball and go for low score. You can do irons-only for ball-striking practice. There are many options. 

 

What I'd often do was to play 3 balls. I'd hit mid- or long-irons from the red tees out into the fairway. They'd all land near each other and it wouldn't take long to walk to where they ended up. Then I'd hit 3 shots into the green, either from one or multiple distances.

 

Whether I was putting out or not it was more meaningful (and relaxing) practice versus beating balls on the range. Got some exercise out of it, too, not to mention the fact the red tees are usually is pristine shape! 🙂

 

.

 

 

Edited February 8, 2022 by MelloYello

[ShortGolfer]

A local driving range offers a membership with access to grass for $75 a year plus the cost of balls.

[betarhoalphadelta]

4 minutes ago, ShortGolfer said:

A local driving range offers a membership with access to grass for $75 a year plus the cost of balls.

Yeah, my local exec course & practice facility has a membership. It just went up to $47/mo.

 

The par-29, 1115 yard 9 hole course is typically $17 weekday and $19 weekend for non-members, but it's $7 any day for members and they throw in a beverage (usually Gatorade for weekday mornings, but it includes macro beer if it's later in the day lol).

 

A large bucket is something like $17 normally, and it's 1 included free per day with the membership. It's an extra $2 for members to hit off the grass per session though. They have a short game practice area with grass, slopes, multiple bunkers, hitting to flags placed in the grass but not to greens. And they have a putting green but no chipping allowed. 

 

It's not the nicest place, and the range gets closed for 2-3 days after any hard rain because it's a storm runoff collection area, but it doesn't rain here often, so no big deal. But it's basically around the corner from my house (~1.2 mi away), so it's convenient.

 

 

 

[BB28403]

My elbow, wrist and other tendon’s damage just isn’t worth the wear and tear I have experienced on horrible cheap mats.

 

go with grass, your body will thank you.  

[milesgiles]

7 hours ago, Paddy_2_Iron said:

 

Excellent just switched up about 6 months ago.  Pros with this change.  

 

Note started this journey in conjunction with @MonteScheinblum no cast 5-6 part series.  

 

In regards to mats

Elbow pain gone

Wrist numbness gone

Glute pain gone

Handicap has dropped 10 points in 6 months and steadily declining

 

What really has helped the most (stat tracking half baked) has been the chipping and putting.  I have more time to spend on this part of the game.  My lag putting has improved greatly and probably is the biggest culprit of my improvement.  

 

My approach game has improved as well.  I understand how the ball reacts off my club and what it's capable of doing.  You lose that on the range.  When I hit a 9 iron 130 and it release ever so slightly I learn for 135 yards that might be the play.  Each iron and how it respond has a different personality and you don't get any of that on the range.  You do on the course especially practice a course you play.   I learn so much on how the ball reacts once it hits the ground and what it does. 

 

A acquaintance of mine through a good friend who played college golf and is scratch recommended my strategy.  He said get out and play more than practice and practice like you play.  He is right.  

 

Side note the par 3 9 hole is a fantastic way to improve.  I love it.  I drop one ball down on the ground and one slightly tee'd.  I do this for each hole and my par 3 par has really improved a lot.  Those 4 holes I used to dread I actually look forward too.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

the ntc part.. you aren't hitting balls at all? How good do you expect to get without improving your ball striking? 

Edited February 8, 2022 by milesgiles

[Paddy_2_Iron]

1 minute ago, milesgiles said:

 

the ntc part.. you aren't hitting balls at all? How good do you expect to get without improving your ball striking?

 

I just play a lot and work on my ball striking on the course.  I also play this PAR 3 a lot and hit quite a few balls per hole.  Sometimes, 7 or 8 if no one is behind me.  I am actually firing into greens from a tee box.  I like that better.  

[milesgiles]

12 minutes ago, Paddy_2_Iron said:

 

I just play a lot and work on my ball striking on the course.  I also play this PAR 3 a lot and hit quite a few balls per hole.  Sometimes, 7 or 8 if no one is behind me.  I am actually firing into greens from a tee box.  I like that better.  

 

 

thats just treating the course as a range though isnt it.. and making  a load of unnecessary pitchmarks

[Paddy_2_Iron]

9 minutes ago, milesgiles said:

 

 

thats just treating the course as a range though isnt it.. and making  a load of unnecessary pitchmarks

 

No, not if you know what you are doing.  Hit them in strips the Super doesn't care.  Just don't hit them spotted or in large patches.  Grass takes forever to grow when the divot formations are in those patterns.