Constructive ideas to improve the PGA Tour

[tatertot]

29 minutes ago, Jwin323 said:

I’d like to see one event, maybe the TofC where the tour pays all expenses for the players and families and caddies for the week in exchange for a say $10 mill winner take all. That would add some pucker on the Sunday back nine.

Have you seen the back 9 of most tournaments? Do we want more pucker?

[tatertot]

2 hours ago, betarhoalphadelta said:

 

Well, the question isn't "how to get pro golfers more money". The question is what does the PGA Tour need to do for its long-term health in order to continue providing their product--tournament golf with the best players in the world?

 

By definition we want more golf on our TVs, and better golf, for that matter. That's why we're in the "Tour Talk" subforum at GolfWRX!

 

The question is how do we get that? And more money might be one of the answers... I'm looking for as many others as we all can come up with, though. 

More golf? We get almost unlimited coverage now ... what exactly is wrong with the PGA? The top players are never going to play 42 weeks a year.

[HappyGilmoresBoots]

I've mentioned this before and nearly got laughed off the site:

Unlimited class golf!

For one day per event, or maybe one full event per year,let's see the pros hit nonconforming clubs and balls, let's let them wager mulligans or buy a gimme rope; I wanna see 500cc drivers or 54" shafts, long-drive style...show me razor-sharp modified iron and wedge grooves hitting something like a Polara ball.

Edited June 3, 2022 by HappyGilmoresBoots

[tw_focus]

I think it's worthwhile to try a few things, I'm not saying all of these will work out but it's worth a try. LIV is going to do whatever it takes to succeed, the PGAT needs to evolve and find something that works better if they want to win.

 

- Shotgun starts. It means more highlights, and you can watch the entire tournament in ~4 hours.

- Shot clock for players that audibly buzzes. Players might hate this, maybe viewers will love it though.

- Variety commentators / audio streams. Definitely get Payton Manning (of The Match fame) to do some, also get Phil in the booth for some of these.

- Caddie challenges. Give bonus money / charity based on caddies getting closest to the hole on one par 3, or longest drive on some hole.

 

This is just a start, the game is evolving whether the PGAT likes it or not.

[tatertot]

9 minutes ago, tw_focus said:

I think it's worthwhile to try a few things, I'm not saying all of these will work out but it's worth a try. LIV is going to do whatever it takes to succeed, the PGAT needs to evolve and find something that works better if they want to win.

 

- Shotgun starts. It means more highlights, and you can watch the entire tournament in ~4 hours.

- Shot clock for players that audibly buzzes. Players might hate this, maybe viewers will love it though.

- Variety commentators / audio streams. Definitely get Payton Manning (of The Match fame) to do some, also get Phil in the booth for some of these.

- Caddie challenges. Give bonus money / charity based on caddies getting closest to the hole on one par 3, or longest drive on some hole.

 

This is just a start, the game is evolving whether the PGAT likes it or not.

Yup.

[So_Cal]

Hold events at much better courses.  There are many in the US.  Avoid most TPC courses.  In order for that to work you have to roll back the ball.  That makes the round much, much faster. Wait, maybe rollback isn’t so bad after all.  😉

[me05501]

I think they need to eliminate the weak field events or relegate them to the secondary tour. There shouldn’t be so many “second class” events on the world’s premier golf tour. 

[farmer]

End the PIP.  Bad idea, poorly executed.  End the wrap-around season.  Have a tournament where the season starts, and a tournament where the season ends.  I like the idea of the KF winner exempted into the next Tour event.  Do something with the FedEx, it's stupid and keeping up with it is impossible.  Now that it's in May, play the PGA at least occasionally in the SW.  Greyhawk looked suitably tough, or Whisper Rock.

[So_Cal]

3 minutes ago, farmer said:

End the PIP.  Bad idea, poorly executed.  End the wrap-around season.  Have a tournament where the season starts, and a tournament where the season ends.  I like the idea of the KF winner exempted into the next Tour event.  Do something with the FedEx, it's stupid and keeping up with it is impossible.  Now that it's in May, play the PGA at least occasionally in the SW.  Greyhawk looked suitably tough, or Whisper Rock.

Good call on FedEx.  I watch golf frequently and I still don’t know what the hell the FedEx cup is.  Seems like the modern money list but they shove it down our throats nonstop.   
 

I also dislike how there are no US majors after June.  That’s way too early.  The PGA could be in August maybe every other year.  This would allow the PGA serious flexibility, going south in May and north in August.  

Edited June 3, 2022 by So_Cal

[me05501]

How can anyone watch pro golf all the time and not understand what the FedEx Cup is? It’s been around a long time. 

[grm24]

4 hours ago, me05501 said:

How can anyone watch pro golf all the time and not understand what the FedEx Cup is? It’s been around a long time. 

Ignorance, Indifference or apathy. 🤣😅

[grm24]

5 hours ago, farmer said:

Now that it's in May, play the PGA at least occasionally in the SW.  Greyhawk looked suitably tough, or Whisper Rock.

Do the courses you mention above have the internal infrastructure to handle all that a major requires? It's really easy to simply list courses it would be "nice" to have a major at. The stark reality is that many of those courses don't have the room to do so. So they stand no chance of ever hosting a major. Regardless of how worthy a course might be. 

Edited June 3, 2022 by grm24

[grm24]

16 hours ago, blackbdmillsaps said:

 I love the Stephen Alker story but I assume most people are not tuning in to watch Stephen Alker and Brian Gay beat up everyone. Could be wrong. 

You are. Brian Gay isn't beating up anybody on the Champions Tour. Alker is.

[kmbean]

I just want to ensure something is done so all these guys secure generational wealth for their families.

[SE Gamer]

33 minutes ago, grm24 said:

Do the courses you mention above have the internal infrastructure to handle all that a major requires? It's really easy to simply list courses it would be "nice" to have a major at. The stark reality is that many of those courses don't have the room to do so. So they stand no chance of ever hosting a major. Regardless of how worthy a course might be. 

 

This is a really good callout. The course I most often play could host a tour event. Maybe even a major. It's long, challenging, and is kept in great condition. But the minute you start thinking about crowds and the necessary infrastructure, it'd quickly be off the list. At best could maybe host a min-tour event. It's got a nice range and facilities. But nothing close to the sprawling layout a tour event requires. 

 

As far as the OP's intent for this thread, I almost think the PGA should do nothing. If players want to jump ship, let them go. But if they take the leap, they're out for good. Some still will. Most won't. Because money can't replace the history and prestige of competing for majors. 

 

I frankly think the LIV will be a flash in the pan. I've been in love with the game since I was 5. Regularly watch the tour, but have absolutely zero interest in tuning into the LIV. Regardless of who's headlining. Heck, I never even had any interest in watching European tour events. The whole idea of the LIV for me just has an arena football vibe. And I know I'm not alone with that general perception. 

[SE Gamer]

29 minutes ago, kmbean said:

I just want to ensure something is done so all these guys secure generational wealth for their families.

 

So you don't want to secure generational wealth for your own family? 

[SurfDuffer]

Clone Tiger Woods.

[betarhoalphadelta]

11 hours ago, tw_focus said:

I think it's worthwhile to try a few things, I'm not saying all of these will work out but it's worth a try. LIV is going to do whatever it takes to succeed, the PGAT needs to evolve and find something that works better if they want to win.

 

- Shotgun starts. It means more highlights, and you can watch the entire tournament in ~4 hours.

- Shot clock for players that audibly buzzes. Players might hate this, maybe viewers will love it though.

- Variety commentators / audio streams. Definitely get Payton Manning (of The Match fame) to do some, also get Phil in the booth for some of these.

- Caddie challenges. Give bonus money / charity based on caddies getting closest to the hole on one par 3, or longest drive on some hole.

 

This is just a start, the game is evolving whether the PGAT likes it or not.

 

I like it. A few notes:

 

• Shotgun starts: IMHO do this only on Thursday/Friday. Have some groups play as foursomes. That should allow you to get all the players on the course in both a morning and an afternoon wave, so you maintain the alternating morning/afternoon system, so Thursday players in the morning play Friday afternoon, and vice versa. Saturday/Sunday return to traditional start times with the leaders later in the day. 
• Shot Clock: Yeah, slow play timers need to be enforced, and they also need to be visible to the TV viewers. Agree with having some sort of communication/warning between the on-course timing personnel and they player, i.e. when the player is 20 seconds from timer expiring they get a verbal or auditory cue so they know they have to hurry the F up. 
• Commentary: Agreed that they need to vary this, but I don't think Buck and Collins worked. Need someone funny. 
• Caddie Challenges: This could be fun, and I think this is also a good Thursday/Friday thing to generate more interest in the tournament in the early pre-cut days. I do think this one will get the most push-back from the traditionalists... 

[So_Cal]

9 hours ago, me05501 said:

How can anyone watch pro golf all the time and not understand what the FedEx Cup is? It’s been around a long time. 

I ignore it.  The majors and the Ryder cup are the only events that really get the juices flowing. 

[So_Cal]

5 hours ago, grm24 said:

Do the courses you mention above have the internal infrastructure to handle all that a major requires? It's really easy to simply list courses it would be "nice" to have a major at. The stark reality is that many of those courses don't have the room to do so. So they stand no chance of ever hosting a major. Regardless of how worthy a course might be. 

This is going to sound harsh but Arizona doesn’t have any courses good enough to host a major.  I don’t want to see one there.  Give me the blue blood coastal courses with a few in the Midwest scattered in. 

[r0scoe]

So what is it we are trying to improve? Is it the "future of the tour"? How do we define that? If you want to "grow the game" then making it a little more affordable for the guys trying to make the tour would be where I would start. I get it, the korn ferry tour probably doesn't make any money, but it sounds like it's a massive struggle to try and make it as a pro unless you are an absolute phenom or have money backing you somewhere (family, etc)

[me05501]

3 minutes ago, So_Cal said:

I ignore it.  The majors and the Ryder cup are the only events that really get the juices flowing. 

 

 

This definitely points to how hard it is for the Tour to roll out anything new and interesting for fans.

 

They create this end of season playoff format with strong fields and huge purses leading up to the 30-man Tour Championship where the winner receives an annuity worth 7-8x a major win, and fans say "meh...it ain't The Masters." 

[vandyfan]

7 minutes ago, me05501 said:

This definitely points to how hard it is for the Tour to roll out anything new and interesting for fans.

 

A good example of this is when they turned Zurich into a team event. I remember being like "that should be fun" and then I watched it for a few days and thought, "this actually is somehow worse than a normal tournament." I think I would like to see a mixed LPGA/PGA event like they do in Australia but, then again, I remember how the Zurich experiment went. 

 

For me, the TV product is still lacking. And I don't know how to fix it because it is really hard to cover a golf tournament. Shot tracer has helped. Wind direction helps but when there is a crowded leaderboard, a billion commercials, and useless segments it is so hard to stay in the flow of the tournament. Again, I don't have a solution there but watching pro golf can be frustrating. Even down to how some of these courses have a ton of movement that you don't get to see from towers and you really need a handheld camera to see the slopes and angles most of the time. 

[jonsnow]

12 hours ago, tatertot said:

Have you seen the back 9 of most tournaments? Do we want more pucker?

"I got a fever and the only prescription is more pucker!"

[dmecca2]

Love ending the PIP and allocating appearance fees based on Fedex cup or world rank. What the best players want is to be paid more, but play less. And the best few have arguably earned it.

 

Couple things I would add:

1. Eliminate Champions Tour. Allocate that money to the up and comers, not the has beens.

2. Eliminate opposite field events and the bottom, say, 10% of pga tour events. This will result in a couple weeks a year where there is no PGA tour event. Give these guys weeks off.

3. During those off weeks, you hold the premier KFT events and LPGA events. Give these tours all the air time. Let people get to know the names of these guys coming up so that when they make it, people know who they are.

[tatertot]

26 minutes ago, me05501 said:

 

 

This definitely points to how hard it is for the Tour to roll out anything new and interesting for fans.

 

They create this end of season playoff format with strong fields and huge purses leading up to the 30-man Tour Championship where the winner receives an annuity worth 7-8x a major win, and fans say "meh...it ain't The Masters." 

Don't forget the WGC events and Presidents Cup (which people don't really care about) ... The majors and Ryder Cup are special BECAUSE they aren't an every week occurance. You can't have the Super Bowl week after week.

[me05501]

16 minutes ago, blackbdmillsaps said:

 

A good example of this is when they turned Zurich into a team event. I remember being like "that should be fun" and then I watched it for a few days and thought, "this actually is somehow worse than a normal tournament." I think I would like to see a mixed LPGA/PGA event like they do in Australia but, then again, I remember how the Zurich experiment went. 

 

For me, the TV product is still lacking. And I don't know how to fix it because it is really hard to cover a golf tournament. Shot tracer has helped. Wind direction helps but when there is a crowded leaderboard, a billion commercials, and useless segments it is so hard to stay in the flow of the tournament. Again, I don't have a solution there but watching pro golf can be frustrating. Even down to how some of these courses have a ton of movement that you don't get to see from towers and you really need a handheld camera to see the slopes and angles most of the time. 

 

Agree on the TV. They're trying to innovate but the core audience is quite old and traditional. 

 

For better or worse I think we'll probably see more "VR" overlays like TopTracer, the ideal putting line graphic, etc.

 

If they use these tools wisely it can make it a better viewing experience for everyone, but especially for non-typical golf fans.

 

A golfer sees a different product on the screen than someone who doesn't play. We pick up cues from where the players are aimed, what club they're holding, etc. If my wife is watching she just wants to know who's winning. 

[tatertot]

6 hours ago, grm24 said:

Ignorance, Indifference or apathy. 🤣😅

I don't know, it doesn't matter and I don't care.

[me05501]

8 minutes ago, dmecca2 said:

Love ending the PIP and allocating appearance fees based on Fedex cup or world rank. What the best players want is to be paid more, but play less. And the best few have arguably earned it.

 

Couple things I would add:

1. Eliminate Champions Tour. Allocate that money to the up and comers, not the has beens.

2. Eliminate opposite field events and the bottom, say, 10% of pga tour events. This will result in a couple weeks a year where there is no PGA tour event. Give these guys weeks off.

3. During those off weeks, you hold the premier KFT events and LPGA events. Give these tours all the air time. Let people get to know the names of these guys coming up so that when they make it, people know who they are.

 

Agree on points 2 and 3. Point 1 will never happen as long as there's a network willing to buy the TV rights. 

[bladehunter]

Demolish pip.  Even the acronym, is cringe worthy if you know any historical slang.  
 

 

but I can’t go along with guaranteed money.  Let them kill what they eat.  We already have too much parity.  Making last place profitable will just finish killing the sport 

 

 

if they want to improve the sport on tv.  Eliminate commercials.  Sell a once an hour ad to someone big and say “ brought to you commercial free by Roman , Get your quicker picker upper at Roman “.  
 

To me it’s unwatchable now live.  I have to record in order to fast forward.  This means I watch less. Once I know who wins I’m less in retested.  And I’m a guy who will watch any golf. I’m not bored by golf or it’s speed of action.  I’m bored by commercials.   Who in this day buys because of a commercial anyway ?  Nobody with a brain.  

Edited June 3, 2022 by bladehunter