Simple Move to stop 10 years of hooking irons

[MichMan123]

Moved Ball off front foot - equal or just inside.

 

Open face on takeaway toe pointing up.

 

Turn and hit.  High Straight shots.  

Life changing.

 

 

[naj959]

Seems frowned upon by modern instruction but I've found getting the club more toe up at P2 helps me to be square at impact instead of a closed face. I tend to take the club back hooded so feeling the toe open probably gets me closer to neutral. 

[phizzy30]

Just now, naj959 said:

Seems frowned upon by modern instruction but I've found getting the club more toe up at P2 helps me to be square at impact instead of a closed face. I tend to take the club back hooded so feeling the toe open probably gets me closer to neutral. 

Same here.  I take the club back hooded as well.  Hell, I hooked about 5 shots with my irons today.  I've tried opening the face/toe on the takeaway and it feels wrong, lol.  Always been this way.  Time to go the range and start opening the face on the takeaway to get my muscle memory going.  It can't hurt to try.  Sigh........

[Gamble Gamble]

1 hour ago, tigerfan23 said:

Moved Ball off front foot - equal or just inside.

 

Open face on takeaway toe pointing up.

 

Turn and hit.  High Straight shots.  

Life changing.

 

 

 I tried that as a band-aid and it worked until it didn’t.  Then the dreaded two way miss with an occasional shank from too open of a face.  
 

I later learned that if I focus on pivoting my left hip down and around to start the downswing it was almost impossible to hook the ball but my dynamic loft suffered.  High shots that sometimes went a little left but definitely felt inefficient for distance.  

Now I do that hip turn down/weight shift move slightly less but I made my right hand grip a little more neutral which allows me to release the club rather than drag the handle to hold off the release.   
 

More power, more penetrating flight, less curve.  Joy.  
 

 

 

 

Edited July 2, 2022 by Gamble Gamble

[Nels55]

5 hours ago, phizzy30 said:

Same here.  I take the club back hooded as well.  Hell, I hooked about 5 shots with my irons today.  I've tried opening the face/toe on the takeaway and it feels wrong, lol.  Always been this way.  Time to go the range and start opening the face on the takeaway to get my muscle memory going.  It can't hurt to try.  Sigh........

Opening the face more on the backswing usually causes me to hook it more.  What opens up has to close down ymmv.  As mentioned above I have also noticed that some hook fixes seem to last a bit longer then others. 

 

One thing that works well for me is to keep my head just a little more centered as advised by Dr. Kwon.  My trail side forms sort of straight line at the top with the hips in good position back into the trail hip joint and the head centered better.  Dr. Kwon shows this as a triangle formed by the head and hips when demoing his drills.  When my head goes back on my backswing I tend to hook a lot.  LOL could be just the opposite for someone else I suppose.

 

Also do you feel anything different in your hands particularly your trail hand when you hook the ball?  A passive release really seems to mitigate the hook tendency for me.  When I hit the big hook I can often feel my trail hand take over in the downswing.  Don't know why the stupid hand does that!  It seems to have a mind  of it's own at times.

[phizzy30]

7 hours ago, Nels55 said:

Opening the face more on the backswing usually causes me to hook it more.  What opens up has to close down ymmv.  As mentioned above I have also noticed that some hook fixes seem to last a bit longer then others. 

 

One thing that works well for me is to keep my head just a little more centered as advised by Dr. Kwon.  My trail side forms sort of straight line at the top with the hips in good position back into the trail hip joint and the head centered better.  Dr. Kwon shows this as a triangle formed by the head and hips when demoing his drills.  When my head goes back on my backswing I tend to hook a lot.  LOL could be just the opposite for someone else I suppose.

 

Also do you feel anything different in your hands particularly your trail hand when you hook the ball?  A passive release really seems to mitigate the hook tendency for me.  When I hit the big hook I can often feel my trail hand take over in the downswing.  Don't know why the stupid hand does that!  It seems to have a mind  of it's own at times.

I literally have to hold off the finish with my irons(helicopter) to keep it from hooking at times depending on how flippy my hands get for any given day. 

[cwilk]

According the gears golf averages taken from tour players, the ball should always be forward in your stance, the face should open on the backswing, and it closes rapidly a foot or so behind the ball to a foot or so after impact. 
 

https://www.instagram.com/p/CfRFBhJlAyM/?igshid=MDJmNzVkMjY=

[Nels55]

14 minutes ago, phizzy30 said:

I literally have to hold off the finish with my irons(helicopter) to keep it from hooking at times depending on how flippy my hands get for any given day. 

I have done that also, I don't think that it is a real good way to play though.  In general the more open the body especially the hips are at impact the less tendency to turn the hands over too soon.  Getting the body way out in front is not necessarily a good idea for back health though.  

 

It can be valuable to practice slicing the ball in order to figure out how to control the hook.  The golf swing is a blend and there are no easy answers.

[MichMan123]

33 minutes ago, Nels55 said:

I have done that also, I don't think that it is a real good way to play though.  In general the more open the body especially the hips are at impact the less tendency to turn the hands over too soon.  Getting the body way out in front is not necessarily a good idea for back health though.  

 

It can be valuable to practice slicing the ball in order to figure out how to control the hook.  The golf swing is a blend and there are no easy answers.

 

that too.  I've opened my body just a smidge and it helps.

 

 

[phizzy30]

15 minutes ago, Nels55 said:

I have done that also, I don't think that it is a real good way to play though.  In general the more open the body especially the hips are at impact the less tendency to turn the hands over too soon.  Getting the body way out in front is not necessarily a good idea for back health though.  

 

It can be valuable to practice slicing the ball in order to figure out how to control the hook.  The golf swing is a blend and there are no easy answers.

My stock shot is a draw that starts off straight then turns over 5 to 20 yards on a good day, 30+yards on a bad one.  I've always been in to out and going the other way feels really bizarre to me.  As a result, when I wanna fade the ball, I usually play the push cut where the face is slightly open at impact.  This means I mean fire my hips even faster through the zone on the down swing.  Problem with this is that if I don't time it right, I usually hit a big block out to the right OB.  I agree that hitting a fade for me isn't good for my back as I already have 3 herniated discs, lol. 

Edited July 2, 2022 by phizzy30

[naj959]

IMO the best way to really cure a hook is to get the path more neutral. I drunk the shallowing kool aid and worked on it for a few years....to the point that my path gets crazy in to out and I start hitting pushes, snap hooks and fat shots. I can tell you firsthand that being excessively in to out is just as detrimental as cutting across the ball. Now I'm trying to get the trail shoulder drop/dumped under out of my swing. When I can hit a little pull cut on command I know my swings is in a good place. 

[phizzy30]

1 hour ago, naj959 said:

IMO the best way to really cure a hook is to get the path more neutral. I drunk the shallowing kool aid and worked on it for a few years....to the point that my path gets crazy in to out and I start hitting pushes, snap hooks and fat shots. I can tell you firsthand that being excessively in to out is just as detrimental as cutting across the ball. Now I'm trying to get the trail shoulder drop/dumped under out of my swing. When I can hit a little pull cut on command I know my swings is in a good place. 

The first part of your statement is very true.  I was taught to swing in to out as a kid(1988) and took it to the extreme.  I'm talking 4-8*.  Back then, the old school of thought was that OTT was death so it was discouraged.  It took me a good year to to get a more neutral path and I'm usually now 2-3* in to out.  If I'm out on the course I can tell just by looking at my divots.

[naj959]

4 hours ago, phizzy30 said:

The first part of your statement is very true.  I was taught to swing in to out as a kid(1988) and took it to the extreme.  I'm talking 4-8*.  Back then, the old school of thought was that OTT was death so it was discouraged.  It took me a good year to to get a more neutral path and I'm usually now 2-3* in to out.  If I'm out on the course I can tell just by looking at my divots.

I haven't been on Trackman or any other radar in ages but I film myself regularly and it's scary how far to the right my path can get. If I had to guess it's probably +8 or more when I'm swinging poorly. I can hit a block that's probably 40 yards offline or have so much "draw" that even my wedges move a decent amount. Just a difficult way to play the game.

[moehogan]

Adjustments to trail hand grip pressures can help cure a hook. Make sure the thumb and forefinger pressures are very light while increasing the ring finger pressure.

[phizzy30]

3 hours ago, naj959 said:

I haven't been on Trackman or any other radar in ages but I film myself regularly and it's scary how far to the right my path can get. If I had to guess it's probably +8 or more when I'm swinging poorly. I can hit a block that's probably 40 yards offline or have so much "draw" that even my wedges move a decent amount. Just a difficult way to play the game.

My brother says that I'm the only golfer on the planet that he knows that can hook my wedges, haha.  🤣

[DNice26]

I would say there is a VERY good chance your left miss is due to a right hand grip issue.  It is quite hard to hit the ball left if your right hand doesnt help you do it.

[Valtiel]

14 hours ago, naj959 said:

IMO the best way to really cure a hook is to get the path more neutral. I drunk the shallowing kool aid and worked on it for a few years....to the point that my path gets crazy in to out and I start hitting pushes, snap hooks and fat shots. I can tell you firsthand that being excessively in to out is just as detrimental as cutting across the ball. Now I'm trying to get the trail shoulder drop/dumped under out of my swing. When I can hit a little pull cut on command I know my swings is in a good place. 

Definitely agree with comments about neutrality and anything excessive in either direction being a problem. If you were shallowing by dropping your trail shoulder and getting excessively in to out though then it sounds like you were falling victim to one of the many forced and incorrect ways of accomplishing that. Good to get rid of it of course, but don't throw the concept of shallowing out with the bath water. 

[Nels55]

3 hours ago, phizzy30 said:

My brother says that I'm the only golfer on the planet that he knows that can hook my wedges, haha.  🤣

LOL there is at least one more golfer on the planet who can hook the s out of a wedge shot....

[naj959]

19 hours ago, phizzy30 said:

My brother says that I'm the only golfer on the planet that he knows that can hook my wedges, haha.  🤣

And now there are two of us 🙃

[naj959]

17 hours ago, Valtiel said:

Definitely agree with comments about neutrality and anything excessive in either direction being a problem. If you were shallowing by dropping your trail shoulder and getting excessively in to out though then it sounds like you were falling victim to one of the many forced and incorrect ways of accomplishing that. Good to get rid of it of course, but don't throw the concept of shallowing out with the bath water. 

Totally agree, I very much want the club shallowing in transition. When I first started I was using a Planemate. IMO it encouraged me to use the body correctly but being the tinkerer that I am, I started trying to use my wrists instead of a more body driven move. Overtime I started bringing my right shoulder down and tilting when I consciously tried to get the COM of the clubhead down and behind me. The baby draw turned into an overdraw which turned into a nasty two way miss. If I try and shallow using conscious wrist movements than I have to really think about staying in left bend to make it work. Using the pivot to shallow seems more consistent for me personally. I'm a lot less likely to drop the trail shoulder when I transition from the ground up. 

[GolfTurkey]

On 7/3/2022 at 7:29 PM, phizzy30 said:

My brother says that I'm the only golfer on the planet that he knows that can hook my wedges, haha.  🤣

 

Make that two of us. My current instructor fixed it (ok, I'm tempting fate saying that) by doing two things.

 

Higher hands with less depth in the backswing (swing thought DJ / JT / Freddie etc). I'm a knuckle-dragger so any faint hint of starting a lawnmower move gets me far too deep and I can't recover from there.

 

The key move: get the lead shoulder moving down and around to start the downswing and keep the chest pivoting SLOWLY (don't want to do it too fast and leave the arms behind or run out of ROM and then have to stall and throw arms/hands) all the way through to the finish. The slow and (what feels like) constant pivoting stops me hooking. As soon as I stop turning I throw the arms and flip the wrists.

 

If you don't have a lot of depth and rotate it's impossible to hook it without a crazy strong grip (hooking becomes the least of your worries; it takes late trail side bend to avoid pulls / wipes).

[golfarb1]

Setup up with a slightly open stance via pulling back your lead foot 1-2”, while keeping your hips and shoulders square to the target Then swing back along your hip and shoulder lines

On the downswing try to hit the ball into the left woods - but try to do with your pelvic rotation ONLY. The open stance will facilitate this rotation 

Edited July 5, 2022 by golfarb1

[phizzy30]

5 hours ago, GolfTurkey said:

 

Make that two of us. My current instructor fixed it (ok, I'm tempting fate saying that) by doing two things.

 

Higher hands with less depth in the backswing (swing thought DJ / JT / Freddie etc). I'm a knuckle-dragger so any faint hint of starting a lawnmower move gets me far too deep and I can't recover from there.

 

The key move: get the lead shoulder moving down and around to start the downswing and keep the chest pivoting SLOWLY (don't want to do it too fast and leave the arms behind or run out of ROM and then have to stall and throw arms/hands) all the way through to the finish. The slow and (what feels like) constant pivoting stops me hooking. As soon as I stop turning I throw the arms and flip the wrists.

 

If you don't have a lot of depth and rotate it's impossible to hook it without a crazy strong grip (hooking becomes the least of your worries; it takes late trail side bend to avoid pulls / wipes).

Good insight.  I will try that on the range.  I think I have the higher hands part down though.  Thing is, I have a super weak grip ala Bryson and I can still hook it.  I've seen Monte mention that to counter the hook, a stronger grip is needed.  I used to have a strong grip and would hook everything even more.  Over the years, I have essentially added bandages to my swing in order to help mitigate the hook.  I think it's time to get to the root of the problem and tackle it head on. 

[SollyinGA]

On 7/4/2022 at 12:54 AM, naj959 said:

And now there are two of us 🙃

Nope. Add me too the list!
 

I can hook a garden hoe when I’m going bad.

Edited July 5, 2022 by SollyinGA

[naj959]

10 hours ago, phizzy30 said:

Good insight.  I will try that on the range.  I think I have the higher hands part down though.  Thing is, I have a super weak grip ala Bryson and I can still hook it.  I've seen Monte mention that to counter the hook, a stronger grip is needed.  I used to have a strong grip and would hook everything even more.  Over the years, I have essentially added bandages to my swing in order to help mitigate the hook.  I think it's time to get to the root of the problem and tackle it head on. 

I read in one of the instruction threads years back that most of the guys on tour that fade it have a pretty strong grip. DJ comes to mind. I believe it allows you to just hold on instead of a more active release. Was kind of a light bulb moment for me in that I don't need to change my grip (3.5 knuckler). Like you said, have to address the root cause for a long term solution. 

[Mono]

i have suffered the hook as well - for 'awhile' i finally straightened out my path - at least with my irons - my driver is still under

 

my hook was due to a very inside path, weight back, hips never got far enough forwards or weight left enough

 

for me - the drills have all been lower body focused, step drills, drills with a water bottle outside of right foot (don't knock it over) drills where i start with all my weight left - i've used video feedback during the drills and after

 

what you describe should help straighten out the path with out changing your swing, ei ball forward and a more open clubface, that path will be less inside and you theoretically should have your weight more forward to hit it (you would have to or you'd likely hit the ground first)

 

[SollyinGA]

35 minutes ago, Mono said:

i have suffered the hook as well - for 'awhile' i finally straightened out my path - at least with my irons - my driver is still under

 

my hook was due to a very inside path, weight back, hips never got far enough forwards or weight left enough

 

for me - the drills have all been lower body focused, step drills, drills with a water bottle outside of right foot (don't knock it over) drills where i start with all my weight left - i've used video feedback during the drills and after

 

what you describe should help straighten out the path with out changing your swing, ei ball forward and a more open clubface, that path will be less inside and you theoretically should have your weight more forward to hit it (you would have to or you'd likely hit the ground first)

 

 

 

My big issues are not getting on the front side soon enough and coming through too early with my shoulders.

 

The water bottle drilled helped me with the first situation. 

Edited July 5, 2022 by SollyinGA

[MichMan123]

5 hours ago, SollyinGA said:

 

 

My big issues are not getting on the front side soon enough and coming through too early with my shoulders.

 

The water bottle drilled helped me with the first situation. 

 

u guys have a link to that drill

[Mono]

this is the one i like