LIV Tour Discussion Thread (*** NO POLITICS ***)

[Titleist99]

3 hours ago, Shilgy said:

I will certainly acknowledge Jack’s efforts and it did make the Ryder Cup something it never ever was in his day.  Namely it’s now competitive.

 And it seems to be a bigger deal to the Euros than it is to the US players.

 

Oh, yes. No argument that they've somehow made it a big deal with unbelievable hype.

 

National pride is at stake...... until the next one. 😂

[bcjim]

Definitely bigger for the Euros but lately everyone has $een the writing on the wall$ so now its hype city for a previously boring event that has gotten way out of hand.  But, if people want to play $1000 bucks and $19 for beers to yell "mashed potatoes", god bless them.

[Shilgy]

13 minutes ago, bcjim said:

Definitely bigger for the Euros but lately everyone has $een the writing on the wall$ so now its hype city for a previously boring event that has gotten way out of hand.  But, if people want to play $1000 bucks and $19 for beers to yell "mashed potatoes", god bless them.

And it’s even more of an “importance” mismatch since the President’s Cup began.  It has to get a bit annoying to be one of the guys that plays in the team matches every year instead of every other.  I don’t recall seeing any US player that got into it as much as Seve, Sergio and Poulter.  

[Holy Moses]

Can’t believe Reed lost his lawsuit…again

[WesternRacing]

5 minutes ago, Holy Moses said:

Can’t believe Reed lost his lawsuit…again

 

Damn shame.

[WesternRacing]

1 hour ago, bcjim said:

Definitely bigger for the Euros but lately everyone has $een the writing on the wall$ so now its hype city for a previously boring event that has gotten way out of hand.  But, if people want to play $1000 bucks and $19 for beers to yell "mashed potatoes", god bless them.

 

Honestly, it’s always been bigger for the Euros, even when they were getting trounced.  Most Americans really don’t care about the Ryder Cup, even though the hype train froths everybody up every couple of years.  At this point, it’s more about the pomp and circumstance than it is the golf, starting with those inane introductory events and press conferences where all the golf bigwigs take themselves way too seriously, and ending with drunk Euros wrapped in flags singing Ole, Ole, Ole as if it wasn’t the worst chant ever to be sung at a sporting event, ever.

[Buddon _Burn]

6 hours ago, WesternRacing said:

 

Honestly, it’s always been bigger for the Euros, even when they were getting trounced.  Most Americans really don’t care about the Ryder Cup, even though the hype train froths everybody up every couple of years.  At this point, it’s more about the pomp and circumstance than it is the golf, starting with those inane introductory events and press conferences where all the golf bigwigs take themselves way too seriously, and ending with drunk Euros wrapped in flags singing Ole, Ole, Ole as if it wasn’t the worst chant ever to be sung at a sporting event, ever.

I do enjoy the use of 'inane' generally but I don't find the ceremony around the event particularly overdone considering the stature of the event (I've only attended in Europe so not aware of how the U.S. hosted events are kicked off) and when compared to say the contrived fanfare around the FedEx Cup at the playoffs. The various comments regarding drunk Euros and chanting are slightly comical (respectfully) considering what is inflicted on the rest of the world with regards to drunk Americans and the chanting/shouting of mindless dribble (at least Ole does bring with it some historical significance). I'm not European so am somewhat impartial (although I definitely support Europe in the RC).  

[dcmidnight]

10 hours ago, bcjim said:

Definitely bigger for the Euros but lately everyone has $een the writing on the wall$ so now its hype city for a previously boring event that has gotten way out of hand.  But, if people want to play $1000 bucks and $19 for beers to yell "mashed potatoes", god bless them.

 

I will say this in any thread to anyone who will listen - but that is all you go to the RC for. From a pure watching golf perspective, Its honestly one of the worst times I've had at a golf event. We had week passes in Rome and other than being in the bleachers for the opening ceremony Friday morning, nope, you can have it. And I imagine the logisitics of getting into Bethpage might actually be worse.

[Holy Moses]

 

[StoutKing]

3 hours ago, dcmidnight said:

 

I will say this in any thread to anyone who will listen - but that is all you go to the RC for. From a pure watching golf perspective, Its honestly one of the worst times I've had at a golf event. We had week passes in Rome and other than being in the bleachers for the opening ceremony Friday morning, nope, you can have it. And I imagine the logisitics of getting into Bethpage might actually be worse.

It's the worst.  There are tens of thousands of fans watching not many groups.

[Titleist99]

13 hours ago, bcjim said:

Definitely bigger for the Euros but lately everyone has $een the writing on the wall$ so now its hype city for a previously boring event that has gotten way out of hand.  But, if people want to play $1000 bucks and $19 for beers to yell "mashed potatoes", god bless them.

Agreed.   LIV Golf has tried for the last four years to match the commercialism, excitement, and team spirit of the Ryder Cup, but with little success.

 

Their team format needs a total reset.  IMO

[Holy Moses]

8 minutes ago, Titleist99 said:

Agreed.   LIV Golf has tried for the last four years to match the commercialism, excitement, and team spirit of the Ryder Cup, but with little success.

 

Their team format needs a total reset.  IMO

For whatever reason, LIV is really holding onto the team concept. It’s their differentiator (besides very low ratings). 

[TheMoneyShot]

If at first you don’t succeed, try try again…

[Titleist99]

4 minutes ago, Holy Moses said:

For whatever reason, LIV is really holding onto the team concept. It’s their differentiator (besides very low ratings). 

Well, they figured that if people like the Ryder Cup and Presidents Cup, they must be clamoring for team golf. Definitely not the case.

 

There's a reason that the PGAT only has one team event, and it's a two-man team.

[Titleist99]

12 minutes ago, Holy Moses said:

For whatever reason, LIV is really holding onto the team concept. It’s their differentiator (besides very low ratings). 

See that they recently applied for world ranking points. Team events usually don't get points, including the PGAT only team tournament, the Zurich Classic.

[Titleist99]

13 minutes ago, TheMoneyShot said:

If at first you don’t succeed, try try again…

The new guy might be accepting bribes. (I kid)😂

 

Sorry Trevor Immelman.

Edited July 11 by Titleist99

[Holy Moses]

37 minutes ago, Titleist99 said:

Well, they figured that if people like the Ryder Cup and Presidents Cup, they must be clamoring for team golf. Definitely not the case.

 

There's a reason that the PGAT only has one team event, and it's a two-man team.

I think the team concept is fine. It’s a way to keep fans interested in their big name players and the players still trying to compete if they are having a bad week. Team golf is not the issue with LIV. The PIF and LIV itself are the issue. 

Edited July 11 by Holy Moses

[FriedEgg]

1 hour ago, Holy Moses said:

I think the team concept is fine. It’s a way to keep fans interested in their big name players and the players still trying to compete if they are having a bad week. Team golf is not the issue with LIV. The PIF and LIV itself are the issue. 

 

bingo, OWGR needs to find a way

[TiScape]

1 hour ago, Titleist99 said:

Agreed.   LIV Golf has tried for the last four years to match the commercialism, excitement, and team spirit of the Ryder Cup, but with little success.

 

Their team format needs a total reset.  IMO

Said it 4 years ago, I’ll say it again. Golf isn’t a team sport. Valiant effort, and epic fail. That said, LIV wouldn’t have been any better w/o it.

[CaseyC]

OWGR has said that promotion and relegation of players is the problem.  But how do you do that with the "Team" concept?  How can a Team ever sign a player to a multi-year contract if the bottom players get dropped and new players come on?

[bekgolf]

1 hour ago, Holy Moses said:

For whatever reason, LIV is really holding onto the team concept. It’s their differentiator (besides very low ratings). 

 

Team golf doesn't work for ratings in North America, never will because it's not viewed as a team sport in North America.  Golf is a game for the individual here.

 

I've said it more than a few times, Liv could do well in Oceania and perhaps they could build their business and game there for 30 years prior to trying to capture a market that doesn't care for team golf. 

 

Attraction vs promotion, get viewers to seek it out instead of buying airtime for an audience that isn't interested. 

[Holy Moses]

20 minutes ago, FriedEgg said:

 

bingo, OWGR needs to find a way

It’s not the OWGR’s responsibility to find a way to give LIV points. Do they deserve points based on who LIV players are? Yes. Does LIV need to change things up to line up with the OWGR’s rules? Yes. 

[Holy Moses]

17 minutes ago, CaseyC said:

OWGR has said that promotion and relegation of players is the problem.  But how do you do that with the "Team" concept?  How can a Team ever sign a player to a multi-year contract if the bottom players get dropped and new players come on?

LIV has to trust that the players they sign for big bucks will play well enough to stay on. And if they don’t, well it’s not like LIV isn’t used to losing money. Just have a clause if you get relegated, you get a pro-rated portion of your signing bonus. I think they already are giving out the bonuses year-by-year anyway. The problem is relegating captains that have equity, but then again teams aren’t worth anything because the only way they are EBIDTA + (to use Bryson’s word) is because the league is giving each team tons of cash to make it look like the teams are turning a profit.

[dcmidnight]

Besides, their "relegation" is a joke right now. Every player you think is going to be relegated or ends up in last place, oh wait, there's a magic reason they cant be cut - and they end up on the next year's roster.

 

The real problem for LIV is that they have 3 day, no cut events, same roster every week - against weak fields. Their strength of field multiplier would be so low that they would get almost no points anyway. The top ten LIV guys wont be happy unless they are getting KFT type points - when they end up with 1/10th of that, are they going to be happy because they are "getting points"?

Edited July 11 by dcmidnight

[Holy Moses]

23 minutes ago, dcmidnight said:

Besides, their "relegation" is a joke right now. Every player you think is going to be relegated or ends up in last place, oh wait, there's a magic reason they cant be cut - and they end up on the next year's roster.

 

The real problem for LIV is that they have 3 day, no cut events, same roster every week - against weak fields. Their strength of field multiplier would be so low that they would get almost no points anyway. The top ten LIV guys wont be happy unless they are getting KFT type points - when they end up with 1/10th of that, are they going to be happy because they are "getting points"?

Once LIV does get points, they are going to be surprised at how few of points they get and then they’ll complain about that too

[SnowbirdTom]

58 minutes ago, FriedEgg said:

 

bingo, OWGR needs to find a way

LIV can have OWGR points easily. Conform to all the rules and they’re in.

[Mr.Cleeks]

Honestly LIV players should be happy that they have a pathway into all 4 majors.  Both the Masters and The PGA have given special invitations to LIV players the past 2 seasons and Ridley said they'll continue to use that model. Both the US Open/Open have exemption categories for the LIV guys. I don't really think getting OWGR points will do anything for them since the points they'll receive will be minimal.

Edited July 11 by Mr.Cleeks

[philly2kuk]

I thought the OWGR stuff had gone? The rules for ranking points existed before LIV. They need cuts, meaningful relegation and other stuff. It’s been the same from day one, LIV needs to change not OWGR.

 

They have a pathway to majors, that’s all they should get if they won’t abide by the rules that existed before they did.

[Titleist99]

4 minutes ago, Mr.Cleeks said:

Honestly LIV players should be happy that they have a pathway into all 4 majors.  Both the Masters and The PGA have given special invitations to LIV players the past 2 seasons and Ridley said they'll continue to use that model. Both the US Open/Open have an exemption categories for the LIV guys. I don't really think getting OWGR points will do anything for them since the points they'll receive will be minimal.

100%.

 

I'm on record as stating that the Majors have gone out of their way to include the Saudi tour. It's pathetic to see the bending over backwards going on. It's their tournament, so they can do as they please, but I'm of the belief that it is to appease the DOJ.

 

 

[Titleist99]

6 minutes ago, philly2kuk said:

I thought the OWGR stuff had gone? The rules for ranking points existed before LIV. They need cuts, meaningful relegation and other stuff. It’s been the same from day one, LIV needs to change not OWGR.

 

They have a pathway to majors, that’s all they should get if they won’t abide by the rules that existed before they did.

 

That's not how it works when you have a sense of entitlement. 😂