Top end of the bag suggestions (4 iron spot specifically)

[Drivingrangehero]

46 minutes ago, Garlando said:

In that case, go look at some used/demo club sites. Places like Golf Avenue, Callaway pre-owned, PXG express, the certified pre-owned section on the Tour Edge spot. There’s lots of options out there if you look!

Pxg and Tour Edge have some great deals. 
 

My Driver 3W and 5w are Tour Edge. 

 

if I didn’t love my current 7w, the first place I’d look is Tour Edge. .

 

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Edited November 10, 2022 by Drivingrangehero
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[North Butte]

35 minutes ago, North Butte said:

P.S. If by "attack a green" you mean being able to carry the ball over a hazard/bunker/deep rough and land it on the front of the green without rolling off the back that's never going to work with fairway woods or hybrids for me. I have a very low ball flight and play on extremely firm greens. So I have an iron clad course management rule that 7i is my longest "attack the green" club. Any longer club I only use when I can run it on. Fortunately, all but a very few holes at my home course allow runup shots. 

A guy who used to play at my club had a saying about this. He for weekend golfers like us, there was a certain distance where the goal switched from "try to give yourself a makable birdie putt" to "try not to bring double bogey into play".

 

He was a 4hcp and for him that was the point at which he switched from needing a hybrid to needing a fairway wood.

 

For me it's between a 7-iron from 150-something yards versus anything longer. 

[MrCook]

@North Butte

 

I see your points. I'm pretty ocd about not carrying clubs that don't produce a 'functional' ballflight, which in my book means anything that goes too low and relies on roll leaves the bag. My home course is very different from what you're describing though. I have two forced 180'ish carries into greens and our greens are not that fast, so completely different conditions. Just shows how much course conditions as well as personal preference matter for the top of the bag.

[nitram]

I went through a testing process (last year) because of the same issue as the OP. Ultimately I kept the 4-iron in the bag to cover the 200-yd carry slot and switched from 5WD to 7WD (lofted down to 20.25) to cover the 220-yd carry slot. It has worked extremely well. The only caveat to this is in temps below 50*F I will switch from the 7WD to a Bridgestone AIrMuscle 3-iron/hybrid.

 

 

[North Butte]

5 minutes ago, MrCook said:

@North Butte

 

I see your points. I'm pretty ocd about not carrying clubs that don't produce a 'functional' ballflight, which in my book means anything that goes too low and relies on roll leaves the bag. My home course is very different from what you're describing though. I have two forced 180'ish carries into greens and our greens are not that fast, so completely different conditions. Just shows how much course conditions as well as personal preference matter for the top of the bag.

Our greens are one of newish ultradwarf Bermudas and they are usually topdressed pretty frequently and mowed low enough for medium-fast speeds. So no problem for guys with a lot of clubhead speed who can generate height and spin but some of the older members can even have trouble keeping pitching wedges and gap wedges from rolling 20-30 feet after they land. 

 

I'm trying to think about the various greens and out of 18 greens there are three fronted by water (but one of those is a short Par 3 with less than 100 yard carry so it doesn't really count) and one has bunkers blocking the front of the green. The other 14 are about half completely open in front and half have some sort of bunker but there's a wide gap to play run-up shots.

 

So that makes it pretty manageable even with flat ballflights and firm greens. Which is great since so many of our members are 65 years and older, including some regular players who are in their 80's. 

[vandyfan]

1 hour ago, North Butte said:

"try to give yourself a makable birdie putt" to "try not to bring double bogey into play".

 

This is an important point. Also speaks to different player's risk tolerances as I am more afraid of bogey than I am excited by a birdie. So I am pretty aware of when results start to get sideways for me and I think that is when I move from a 5 iron (180 yds) to a hybrid (200 yds). 

[gbang15]

3 hours ago, ChipNRun said:

 

Maybe sweeping woods? But, hitting up on fairway woods off deck normally doesn't work.

Technically tour pros attack angles on fairway woods whether off the tee or off the deck is around 1-3 degrees downward. however, their head at set up is behind the clubhead to promote the "upward" feeling and to not over spin the shot which is opposed to creating a divot like a hybrid. two totally different clubs, but many amateurs think "hybrid down strike, ok then i fairway down strike too." Rory has mentioned multiple times that hybrids dont blend well through his woods for visual reasons and angle attack issues. 

 

[Drivingrangehero]

My bag 4i spot rotation

 

Mizuno HMB 22* 4 iron SF i110r 1/2 over (39”)

 

Adams Super 9031 proto 23* hybrid with an OG Hzrdus black 6.0 85g shaft  at  3 iron length (39”)

 

Adams Tight Lies 22* 7W with a 90g shaft (ACCRA Z X485 M5) at 41 inches

 

I hit the ball high around 110-115ft apex and all three of my clubs carry similar distance so I had to decide what was my best miss.  With that in mind, the 7w put me in closest proximity to the hole on average. 
 

if I were hitting into a par 3 that’s 210-215y, then the 4i might be best, but dodgy lies in the fairway, and hitting out of 1st cut, or rough, the 7W is best. 

 

For some odd reason, I find it easier to flight my 7W down and fade it better too (not my natural shot shape)  than I do my hybrid. 
 

My misses are always low on the face, so the 7w doesn’t punish my poor strikes as much as much as the 4i or Hybrid. 
 

 

 

 

[North Butte]

9 minutes ago, gbang15 said:

Rory has mentioned multiple times that hybrids dont blend well through his woods for visual reasons and angle attack issues. 

 

Yeah, me and Rors deal with a lot of the same swing issues 🤥

Edited November 10, 2022 by North Butte

[ChipNRun]

12 minutes ago, gbang15 said:

Technically tour pros attack angles on fairway woods whether off the tee or off the deck is around 1-3 degrees downward.

 

Interesting point. At a golf demo day, I had a former pro suggest I hit down "very slightly" on my fairway woods if I was having contact problems. I did it for a couple of seasons, but went back to sweeping when I took excess steepness out of my downswing.

 

@gbang15 and others, what are the instructors telling amateurs these days on fairway woods? Hit down slightly, or sweep?

[Pepperturbo]

Sorry, I can't come up with a 4i replacement option.  This ole man still enjoys working long irons, and can't imagine replacing them with hybrids.  My bag goes Driver, 15.5' 4wd, to 17' 2 iron, then 21' 3i to PW.  Titleist 620 5i nutted is 168 carry, 170+ finish.  Maybe I should say, can't teach this ole dog new tricks, or hybrids just don't have the creative shot versatility, pick your potion. 

 

Recently, I measured my 24' 4i on a 181yd Par 3, carry was 178yds, 180yds+ finish, using MMT 125s shafts in a 620 MB heads, 620 CB 4i head is same yardage.  I replaced MMT 125s with 105s but not feeling the love.  More recent possibilities opened my eyes when experimenting with my wife's 714 AP1 5i with Kuro Kage 65 gram (low-bend) senior flex shaft, a whopping 178-185yds straight and consistent.  I just may have to admit I am a senior flex bound, as opposed to hybrid LOL

[scooterhd2]

Ahh... the old 4 iron replacement. Most expensive spot in the bag. 4 iron, 7 wood, hybrid, driving iron, i've tried them all. and then circled back through a few more times in case I missed anything. and then bought new shafts for them in case that was the problem. and then kept them all in a bin just in case they would remerge later or maybe my swing would change to clearly benefit one of them. But alas, they are still full of faults. 

[J.Bex]

Had a set 4 iron for a long time that really needed no replacement, Hogan Apex Edge Pro.  I wanted a bit more forgiveness so experimented with hybrids and a Mizuno MP-H4.  All ok, but I've ended up oddly in the SGI iron world.  Went TM 6 iron that works well but huge offset, and just switched to a big headed, low CG, relatively low offset (for SGI), easy to hit Callaway Steelhead XR 5 iron head in a length between 5 and 4 iron.  My 4.5 Frankeniron.

[driveandputtmachine]

I started as a 3 wood Ho.  I finally got that figured out(thank you 300 mini @13.5).  Then I stumbled across the callaway UW for the next club, 5 wood has never been a problem for me there.  I struggled with hybrids in this spot for the most part.

 

Then came the 4 iron merry-go-round.  I tried everything.  7 wood, hybrids, driving irons, SGI irons, just about everything in this spot.  I prefer the look of the iron just wanted more height, in comes the Taylor Made DHY.

 

To be completely honest it has done wonders for me.  I can hit a lower bullet shot if needed, I can hit a high shot with it and an in between.  I tends to want to go a lot higher than every iron I have tried and just about the same height as most hybrids, but it is so much better for me to look at.  I have the older SIM version I snagged cheap at global golf, but I have a couple of friends that have the stealth version too.  I have mine in 22* and it has been amazing.

[musicman1951]

I'm 71 and find my 5 hybrid covers about the same distance as my 4 iron (180) with a lot more confidence and accuracy.