Sports Betting & Heckling…

[me05501]

14 hours ago, e.king.gill said:

The Tiger tampon thing was juvenile at best and very bad at worst.  No excuse - utterly stupid. That said - suppose we had a transcript of EVERY word said during every NFL, NHL, MLB, NCAA (football & basketball),MSL, Champions League, World Cup, Cricket (specifically India vs. Pakistan - they don't love each other so much), Boxing, MMA, WWF, F1, and NASCAR,  competition.  Do you think there MIGHT be one or two sexist, racist, homophobic, or generically politically incorrect things said by the competitors?  - just saying

 

That's true. Golf has been promoted as a game played by gentlemen who treat one another with fairness and respect. I'm not sure whether it was ever true, but it was certainly never as true as the imagemakers would have us think. 

[Skrimpdelite]

We need the bob does sports positive heckling...only words of encouragement

[TiScape]

13 minutes ago, Skrimpdelite said:

We need the bob does sports positive heckling...only words of encouragement 

Not WRX strong suits, but like where your head’s at! 😉 

[3whacker]

its like the jackwad in the gallery on Sunday who heckled Rahm at the Par 3 and said "...we have ben here all day we told you it was a _______ iron" I mean seriously did the idiot think that Rahm or any pro is going to solicit club choice advice from the crowd...the WMO mentality makes fans think that that type of behavior is now acceptable Tour wide

[ChipStrokes]

10 minutes ago, 3whacker said:

its like the jackwad in the gallery on Sunday who heckled Rahm at the Par 3 and said "...we have ben here all day we told you it was a _______ iron" I mean seriously did the idiot think that Rahm or any pro is going to solicit club choice advice from the crowd...the WMO mentality makes fans think that that type of behavior is now acceptable Tour wide

if a professional golfer can’t laugh that off or just ignore it and get the job done, they probably shouldn’t be inside the ropes. 

 

it’s a sporting event that allows fans to be extremely close to the action. fan cheer, boo, and heckle at every single sporting event in the world. why should golf be any different? 

 

as long as it isn’t abusive, offensive, or cruel, i see nothing wrong with the above example.

 

it’s like sitting in the legends seats at the stadium telling the guy on deck for the red sox that his fly is down or his shoe is untied.

[Justsomeguy]

I've got $20 on Sunjae for the Honda.

That field doesn't scream dark horse to me, and it looks like a track for a seasoned pro.

Lowry just doesn't seem to win much in the US. He always gets really close then makes a mental error.

Don't know much about Min Woo Lee.

Outside of those three, there's Billy Ho and Aaron Wise, both of whom who have been cold lately.

 

 

[3whacker]

47 minutes ago, ChipStrokes said:

if a professional golfer can’t laugh that off or just ignore it and get the job done, they probably shouldn’t be inside the ropes. 

 

it’s a sporting event that allows fans to be extremely close to the action. fan cheer, boo, and heckle at every single sporting event in the world. why should golf be any different? 

 

as long as it isn’t abusive, offensive, or cruel, i see nothing wrong with the above example.

 

it’s like sitting in the legends seats at the stadium telling the guy on deck for the red sox that his fly is down or his shoe is untied.

is is a sporting event but because its the only sporting event where you are in such close proximity and it is still a "gentlemen's" game so IMHO a different set of rules apply

[PureStrikes54]

If this was the case it sure backfired in the gamblers face. This literally focused Rahm when the wheels were falling off and motivated him to shut these morons up and show Max who had the real big boy game. 

 

I was at the tourney and standing near the hecklers on 10 and 11 when they were going bizurk and trashtalking Rahm's pitching on 10 and errant shots on 11, and they seemed like overserved, dbag 25-35 year old "bros" or potentially friends or hangarounds of Max's. 

 

I can 100% confirm the PGA tour's fan base has changed dramatically since COVID and LIV. Riv used to be a middle aged sweater vest crowd that now has turned into a loudmouth bro fest. I don't mind the change in crowd, but heckling players regardless of intention is ridiculous. Some of the garbage I heard directed at Rahm and others was disgusting. 

Edited February 21, 2023 by PureStrikes54

[Ghostwedge]

1 hour ago, Justsomeguy said:

I've got $20 on Sunjae for the Honda.

That field doesn't scream dark horse to me, and it looks like a track for a seasoned pro.

Lowry just doesn't seem to win much in the US. He always gets really close then makes a mental error.

Don't know much about Min Woo Lee.

Outside of those three, there's Billy Ho and Aaron Wise, both of whom who have been cold lately.

 

 

Sounds good... or you take the PGA Tour fantasy guy's pick and miss every single week.

[Justsomeguy]

2 minutes ago, Ghostwedge said:

Sounds good... or you take the PGA Tour fantasy guy's pick and miss every single week.

Yeah ever since online sports betting became legal in more states last year, we get an extra 5-6 awful golf predictions per week. Sometimes they're laughable.

[Ghostwedge]

9 minutes ago, Justsomeguy said:

Yeah ever since online sports betting became legal in more states last year, we get an extra 5-6 awful golf predictions per week. Sometimes they're laughable.

I have read in the past few years some guy who won a million bucks say "well I take the GIR pct. and his putting from 6-8 feet and the humidity was 60% that week" and and... bud, you absolutely got lucky that is all -period. lol

[ChipStrokes]

6 hours ago, 3whacker said:

is is a sporting event but because its the only sporting event where you are in such close proximity and it is still a "gentlemen's" game so IMHO a different set of rules apply

but why should different rules apply? 

 

golf has evolved from a game into a sport. a sport with huge money on the line.  and when it was still a game, i don’t really think it was being played by gentlemen. 

 

even at the amateur level, golf is played by hacks at country clubs who drink and gamble their way through 18 holes. there isn’t much about it that’s gentlemanly. 

 

but my point stands: if you’re a professional and can’t get the job done amidst a bit of heckling from the fans, then you probably don’t belong out there. 

 

and again, i’m not supporting anything targeted or hurtful or inappropriate. that’s always been out of bounds. 

 

but if you’re trying to tell me that someone standing behind the tee box going “ehhhh i don’t know xander…are you sure you can reach with the 7 iron?” is enough to get in the heads of these guys, then you’ve lost me completely. 

[bekgolf]

58 minutes ago, ChipStrokes said:

but why should different rules apply?

 

Golf is a different game.  Why should we expect people to mess with the players?  It's wrong in baseball and it's wrong in golf.  Do you like being within earshot of the drunk yelling before every pitch at a MLB game?  I don't understand why it's tolerated.  I also don't understand why someone would do it, they must be starving for attention in their regular life.

 

Golf is not played in a stadium and it's not a team sport.  It's just not the same thing as being in a stadium with 50k drunk fans all yelling into a void.  It's an up close experience for the fan and the pro.

 

Different rules apply because golf is different.

[Ghostwedge]

1 hour ago, bekgolf said:

 

Golf is a different game.  Why should we expect people to mess with the players?  It's wrong in baseball and it's wrong in golf.  Do you like being within earshot of the drunk yelling before every pitch at a MLB game?  I don't understand why it's tolerated.  I also don't understand why someone would do it, they must be starving for attention in their regular life.

 

Golf is not played in a stadium and it's not a team sport.  It's just not the same thing as being in a stadium with 50k drunk fans all yelling into a void.  It's an up close experience for the fan and the pro.

 

Different rules apply because golf is different.

This is why I appreciate the Masters a little more each year, they don't put up with that BS. Society in general is going off the rails (thanks social media) except of course WRX (ahem) and you wouldn't put up with that at your "office."

 

[PedronNiall]

10 hours ago, ChipStrokes said:

if a professional golfer can’t laugh that off or just ignore it and get the job done, they probably shouldn’t be inside the ropes. 

 

it’s a sporting event that allows fans to be extremely close to the action. fan cheer, boo, and heckle at every single sporting event in the world. why should golf be any different? 

 

as long as it isn’t abusive, offensive, or cruel, i see nothing wrong with the above example.

 

it’s like sitting in the legends seats at the stadium telling the guy on deck for the red sox that his fly is down or his shoe is untied.

If someone messes up a batter then they foul one off, strike out, whatever. Unlikely to happen due to one heckler, but no "real" harm results. If someone makes a golfer flinch someone lining the tee box or down the line becomes more likely to take a golf ball to the head. I don't want someone injured because some collar up dbag is three sheets to the wind and thinks he's a comedian.

 

That's aside from the fact the game is supposed to be about the best player winning and not someone taking home a trophy because hecklers made their opponent put one OB. As others have said, golf is simply a different sport with a different atmosphere. Golf, tennis, and many other sports and hobbies will likely always have an expectation of quiet to allow competitors to focus and deliver their best.

 

Lastly, drunk hecklers tend to shift the mood a lot at golf events. I've never seen the possibility of a fight in the offing when everyone's respectful and enjoying the day with a little decorum, but boy does the atmosphere get charged when a few different idiots won't shut up while others are simply trying to have a good time. That mess can come to blows and has no place on a golf course.

[Ghostwedge]

7 hours ago, PedronNiall said:

If someone messes up a batter then they foul one off, strike out, whatever. Unlikely to happen due to one heckler, but no "real" harm results. If someone makes a golfer flinch someone lining the tee box or down the line becomes more likely to take a golf ball to the head. I don't want someone injured because some collar up dbag is three sheets to the wind and thinks he's a comedian.

 

That's aside from the fact the game is supposed to be about the best player winning and not someone taking home a trophy because hecklers made their opponent put one OB. As others have said, golf is simply a different sport with a different atmosphere. Golf, tennis, and many other sports and hobbies will likely always have an expectation of quiet to allow competitors to focus and deliver their best.

 

Lastly, drunk hecklers tend to shift the mood a lot at golf events. I've never seen the possibility of a fight in the offing when everyone's respectful and enjoying the day with a little decorum, but boy does the atmosphere get charged when a few different idiots won't shut up while others are simply trying to have a good time. That mess can come to blows and has no place on a golf course.

Its going to happen and happen soon at a tournament near you. Some drunk azz clown is going to be yelling s--t  at a player and some kid will be there   not enjoying it and his dad will light up said clown on the Pro's back swing 6 feet away. Because you know beer sales and sponsorship are more important than a few extra security guys on each hole. (sarcasm font) definitely intended.

[ChipStrokes]

11 hours ago, bekgolf said:

 

Golf is a different game.  Why should we expect people to mess with the players?  It's wrong in baseball and it's wrong in golf.  Do you like being within earshot of the drunk yelling before every pitch at a MLB game?  I don't understand why it's tolerated.  I also don't understand why someone would do it, they must be starving for attention in their regular life.

 

Golf is not played in a stadium and it's not a team sport.  It's just not the same thing as being in a stadium with 50k drunk fans all yelling into a void.  It's an up close experience for the fan and the pro.

 

Different rules apply because golf is different.

different how though?  golf is a sport played by athletes with tournaments open to the public for the purposes of entertainment.  that's the same as baseball, basketball, football and soccer.  in all of those instances, we cheer for the teams and players we like, and we root against the ones we don't.  what makes golf different?

 

and enough with the sweeping generalizations.  not everyone at a baseball game is drunk, and  neither is everyone at a golf tournament.  

 

cheering, booing, heckling, and jeering are all parts of watching sports live.

 

for what it's worth, i absolutely abhor the "bababooey" and "mashed potatoes" people.  but that's not what i'm talking about here.  

9 hours ago, PedronNiall said:

If someone messes up a batter then they foul one off, strike out, whatever. Unlikely to happen due to one heckler, but no "real" harm results. If someone makes a golfer flinch someone lining the tee box or down the line becomes more likely to take a golf ball to the head. I don't want someone injured because some collar up dbag is three sheets to the wind and thinks he's a comedian.

 

That's aside from the fact the game is supposed to be about the best player winning and not someone taking home a trophy because hecklers made their opponent put one OB. As others have said, golf is simply a different sport with a different atmosphere. Golf, tennis, and many other sports and hobbies will likely always have an expectation of quiet to allow competitors to focus and deliver their best.

 

Lastly, drunk hecklers tend to shift the mood a lot at golf events. I've never seen the possibility of a fight in the offing when everyone's respectful and enjoying the day with a little decorum, but boy does the atmosphere get charged when a few different idiots won't shut up while others are simply trying to have a good time. That mess can come to blows and has no place on a golf course.

your argument against heckling is spectator safety?  that's a really thin branch to be out there on.

 

the best players win because they're above what's happening around them.  i'm not supporting yelling during a back swing.  that's not cool.  but chirping a guy while he's standing behind the tee box waiting to hit is fair game.  so is a little back and forth while they search for their ball in the rough.  if they can't laugh it off or block it out and do their job, then i'm sure allstate needs a salesman somewhere.

 

you're also conflating two issues here.  on one hand i'm talking about completely normal fan/athlete interactions that happen across sports every single day.  golf shouldn't be held apart from that.  you're bringing belligerence into the equation, which i've never said i was in support of.  the two can be mutually exclusive. 

[khalespace]

Does anyone know the return of golf betting? 50 cents, 60 cents? Sometimes on data golf I see a player's chance of winning is 5% but betting is like 12:1. I still bet but keep it under $20 because the return is so terrible. 

[TiScape]

22 hours ago, 3whacker said:

its like the jackwad in the gallery on Sunday who heckled Rahm at the Par 3 and said "...we have ben here all day we told you it was a _______ iron" I mean seriously did the idiot think that Rahm or any pro is going to solicit club choice advice from the crowd...the WMO mentality makes fans think that that type of behavior is now acceptable Tour wide

That is where ya missed it. There is no thinking involved there. 

[ChipStrokes]

2 hours ago, khalespace said:

Does anyone know the return of golf betting? 50 cents, 60 cents? Sometimes on data golf I see a player's chance of winning is 5% but betting is like 12:1. I still bet but keep it under $20 because the return is so terrible. 

depends who you're betting and for what.

 

i've got $50 on harris english this week as a 37:1 longshot that would pay out $1850

 

the payouts on golf bets are actually pretty great, it's just not easy at all to pick the right horse in a field of 156.

[PedronNiall]

4 hours ago, ChipStrokes said:

your argument against heckling is spectator safety?  that's a really thin branch to be out there on.

 

the best players win because they're above what's happening around them.  i'm not supporting yelling during a back swing.  that's not cool.  but chirping a guy while he's standing behind the tee box waiting to hit is fair game.  so is a little back and forth while they search for their ball in the rough.  if they can't laugh it off or block it out and do their job, then i'm sure allstate needs a salesman somewhere.

 

you're also conflating two issues here.  on one hand i'm talking about completely normal fan/athlete interactions that happen across sports every single day.  golf shouldn't be held apart from that.  you're bringing belligerence into the equation, which i've never said i was in support of.  the two can be mutually exclusive. 

The normal fan/athlete interactions you're talking about are not a normal part of golf, tennis, and many other sports and hobbies historically. They still aren't the norm on the DP World Tour stops, LPGA or LET Tour stops, and so on. I'm not sure why the majority should have to deal with clowns getting rowdy or ribbing players who haven't brought the interaction on themselves.

 

There's literally nothing positive coming out of that kind of jeering. It doesn't make the sport better, it doesn't make the broadcast better, and it's never been a part of the expected atmosphere for golf.

[m d g]

Rahm would be the one guy on tour I wouldn't heckle, were I the heckling sort (I am not).

 

He is strong like bull...

[Malvern]

2 hours ago, ChipStrokes said:

depends who you're betting and for what.

 

i've got $50 on harris english this week as a 37:1 longshot that would pay out $1850

 

the payouts on golf bets are actually pretty great, it's just not easy at all to pick the right horse in a field of 156.

I only bet on one site for golf, I can get 48/1 on Harris English today. A lot of sports books have really high percentages takes (120%) on golf, that is, less odds for the punter.

 

I know you guys have all weird rules depending on what state you are in, if you can go "global" use the site where you can back/lay against other punters and the book percentage is closer to 100%.

[SurfDuffer]

With the explosion of sports betting I view all professional sports with the name Tim Donaghy in mind.  If you don't know who Tim Donaghy is I suggest you look up and watch the documentary the Netflix did on him called "Operation Flagrant Foul".

[NoTalentLefty]

Good read . I am of the opinion that hecklers should immediately get their arse kicked by the crowds closest to them or if rather large intimidating individuals, the rent a cops get to brutally beat the man or woman with Billy clubs. But I’m a genteel person ……

[SkiSchoolPro]

On 2/20/2023 at 9:04 PM, AzRoger said:

If more golf was match play you would probably see crime organizations attempting to get directly involved with the players and offering them payouts to fix a match. It's been a known issue in tennis for many years, not sure anyone really knows how bad it is.

While tournaments themselves are not matchplay, many sports books do allow you to bet on who wins a pairing for the round and/or various other prop bets that depend heavily on a single player's performance.

 

 

[OBbogey5]

On 2/20/2023 at 7:07 PM, e.king.gill said:

Mental toughness.  ONLY you are in control of your swing and what your ball does. Do I appreciate relative silence when hitting a shot - 100% unequivocally YES.  That said I'm the only one responsible for my outcomes.  I've come to realize the chances of everyone being quiet are low.   I'm working on getting to the place where ALL distractions become a leaf floating by in a stream or a cloud moving overhead - yeah thats there - BUT I'M DOING THIS.... RIGHT HERE RIGHT NOW. 

 

My transformation from a person with expectations of etiquette and respect on the part of others into "i'm doing THIS." has really helped bulletproof my psyche.  For many years I was so impressed when someone would accidentally make a sound at exactly the wrong time during someone else's shot - immediately apologize - followed by the person hitting the shot saying "What?".  I realized I needed to get to that place.   You can't count on quiet.  You can count on yourself.   I go out of my way to be quiet when others are hitting - but now a lot of the time when someone does something (accidentally) during my swing and says sorry - I have no idea what they are talking about - I LOVE that. 

 

Tour guys are bulletproof.  They deal with all sorts of distractions all the time.  I think when they don't achieve it's a convenient excuse to lash out at a camera or a leather lung fan or someone moving.  If that kind of thing really bothered them they would never have made it on tour. 

 

Does Bobba Booie and Mashed Potatoes have a place in the game - IMO not really.  Is golf better if more people follow it - probably.  This brings me to my next point. 

 

 The Tiger tampon thing was juvenile at best and very bad at worst.  No excuse - utterly stupid. That said - suppose we had a transcript of EVERY word said during every NFL, NHL, MLB, NCAA (football & basketball),MSL, Champions League, World Cup, Cricket (specifically India vs. Pakistan - they don't love each other so much), Boxing, MMA, WWF, F1, and NASCAR,  competition.  Do you think there MIGHT be one or two sexist, racist, homophobic, or generically politically incorrect things said by the competitors?  - just saying

Read your comment and appreciate that you’re willing to address this. As a child golfer, my dad and my friend’s dad would get annoyed and outwardly pissed at sounds.. cart brakes, laughing, talking, whatever.. as they were teeing off, usually on hole 1 near the busiest part of the course. Seeing how they acted I always thought that it looked ridiculous. So my way was to not care about anything being done while I hit. As long as someone doesn’t physically move my ball during my swing, I couldn’t care less. Most of the time, other players are polite, but if I’m playing with someone that apologizes for making noise, I let them know that they need not worry about it, I’m fine with whatever. 

[Barfolomew]

That's just Rahm's family...... it's a Spanish thing

[m d g]

On 2/20/2023 at 5:02 PM, bekgolf said:

Last week someone yelled in his backswing.  I'm of the opinion it was intentional to throw him off.

 

IMO you have a plausible theory.

 

With Matsuyama it might make a difference.

 

Rahm's backswing (along with that of Nick Price) has been measured at just under the speed of light.

[NevinW]

I was born and raised in Las Vegas and was around gambling and gamblers the whole time.  Old-time professional gamblers are a special breed and I greatly enjoyed the stories about their exploits. 

 

Unfortunately, I can pretty much guarantee that if the there is betting in sports and there is anyway to alter the outcome and influence the bets, someone will be trying to do it.  I am of the opinion that major sports will rue the day they got into betting.  A point will come where no one will believe the results are legitimate.  There is a reason baseball has traditionally been so adverse to gambling.