Rory Quote on Bay Hill set up...

[Dutch1008]

Just now, grm24 said:

If you say so.

What are you talking about? He was in the middle of the fairway and had 179 to the pin. Are you suggesting that the safe play was to lay up?

 

Making a decision between a hard 9 or a soft 8 in the fairway is not a risk/reward tradeoff. 

[Dutch1008]

12 minutes ago, grm24 said:

Guess NLU missed the two putts Cantlay made on 15 and 18 that were 15 and 10 feet? Cantlay teed off an hour before the leaders. Didn't Kitayama make a 15 footer on 17? Again just because somebody says/repeats something that doesn't mean it's correct. It's fairly easy to find out how long off putts players made on the PGA Tour website. Perhaps NLU should.

So 3 examples. Color me convinced. I'm not going to dig through shot link to calculate if the pros over/under performed historical averages. I can say, of the shots they aired on NBC, nobody was making anything. It was a boring finish with the only really highlight being Kitayama on 17 and his approach and lag putt on 18. If that's your cup of tea, totally fine. I really don't care what turns you on. I found it to be a pretty dull finish in what has been a pretty exciting year to date.  

[dropkicked]

Golf is hard and should be harder for pro's... Rors too soft.. lol

[puttingmatt]

Rory would be better served by being more critical of his performance, instead of how the course is  set up. Suck it up,

Or are you (Rory), going to skip Bay Hill

next year.

[wfrogge1]

22 hours ago, mosesgolf said:

I think Jack once said that the it's the same setup for everyone and the complainers are the ones that were not going to win.

 

I can't ever recall Tiger complaining about a course setup.

Jack also once said that he would never play the Danny Thomas Classic in Memphis again because the course was too easy, a weekend hack could win.  He preferred tough courses for sure 

Edited March 7, 2023 by wfrogge1

[golfkidd]

Here are Rory's comments from last year about API setup. Form some reason I still remeber them (I guess he was very passionate as he was this year 🙂) Rory on API Setup -2022

[Chunkitgood]

On 3/6/2023 at 1:54 PM, 2over said:

I saw Rory Mcilroy getting heat for saying Bay Hill was set up for bogeys not birdies that the fans want to see. I'm totally with Rory on this! Bay Hill this weekend was the postcard for "tricked up". When the best players in the world can't make 10-15 footers and are 3-putting from 20 feet, that's not golf. That's ridiculous. If you think tour pros are anything like weekend warriors you're seriously deluded. I've hovered around scratch-3 hdcp and can tell you first hand that even a pro bouncing between Korn Ferry and mini-tours will make scratch ams look like double digit hc duffers. Seriously. And every single one of them will putt the lights out on greens that'd be unplayable for most of us. This particular pro I know, when he was a college player, on an Arnold Palmer signature course in a D-1 intercollegiate tourney shot 63-62 from 7450. I played the course the next day (from 6950) and 3-putted several times from inside 20 feet. So when PGA tour pros can't make putts you know the conditions are truly ridiculous.

 

What I hate about this "I want to see the pros make bogies" attitude is that it trickles down from the 12 hdcp tools who sit on the board of directors to the club pros and supers. A private club in my town that hosts a senior tour event prides itself on greens that roll 12-14 on the stimp, every freakin' day. Playing with a 20 mph wind the other day the greens were totally unplayable. The wind was moving my golf ball on the practice green after it had come to rest! It's no fun to hit 12 greens, strike it well, and struggle to shoot 82 because you are just trying not to 3 putt from 12 feet. Please face reality: the pros are on a different golf planet than even decent ams. They will shoot low 60's, high 50's on a typical country club course set up for the club championship where the champ will shoot +2.

 

Just sayin'. Rory's speaks the truth. Listen to him.

Why would they set up a course in a way the fans don’t want to see?  Are fans so jaded they get bored if not supplied with a steady diet of birdies?

 

I tend to think the idea was to make the course a tough test of golf and produce a winner who could step up and do what it takes to win.
 

“12 hdcp tools”?  You mean the vast majority of people who play golf and keep courses open and running and in whatever condition they are in?

 

Self-censoring remainder of comments.

 

Except man up and learn to putt.

[grm24]

6 hours ago, Dutch1008 said:

What are you talking about? He was in the middle of the fairway and had 179 to the pin. Are you suggesting that the safe play was to lay up?

 

Making a decision between a hard 9 or a soft 8 in the fairway is not a risk/reward tradeoff. 

Do you even know what you are replying to? You said Hovland had no risk/reward for his 2nd shot on 16. He played the correct shot. However when hitting over a water hazard there is always the risk of not clearing the water which Hovland did not. He hit a poor shot, brought the risk into play and cost him 2 shots. Pretty simple. 

[grm24]

5 hours ago, Dutch1008 said:

So 3 examples. Color me convinced. I'm not going to dig through shot link to calculate if the pros over/under performed historical averages. I can say, of the shots they aired on NBC, nobody was making anything. It was a boring finish with the only really highlight being Kitayama on 17 and his approach and lag putt on 18. If that's your cup of tea, totally fine. I really don't care what turns you on. I found it to be a pretty dull finish in what has been a pretty exciting year to date.  

Of course you won't go back and look at the putts made and neither will NLU since you are both incorrect that no putts over 2-3 feet were made over a 90 minute span. Scheffler made around a 6 foot putt for birdie on 16 that was on tv. Nobody is talking historical averages except you. NLU put out bad information and you believed it. 🤔

[Dutch1008]

1 hour ago, grm24 said:

Do you even know what you are replying to? You said Hovland had no risk/reward for his 2nd shot on 16. He played the correct shot. However when hitting over a water hazard there is always the risk of not clearing the water which Hovland did not. He hit a poor shot, brought the risk into play and cost him 2 shots. Pretty simple. 

Pretty simple 🤣 while your doing your putt research perhaps you can find me an example of a freaking tour pro laying up on a par 5 from less than 180 yd in the fairway. 

[mallrat]

What made you feel like the greens were too choppy or too fast? Because putts were missed? The same can be said for when greens and to slow and shaggy. Are the conditions of the greens what made you think the course is tricked up? I guess I have a different tricked up definition. 

 

I would love to see some data from the new GS3 ball, I can guarantee they used it there. 
 

Personally I like seeing the pros challenged. 

[grm24]

2 hours ago, Dutch1008 said:

Pretty simple 🤣 while your doing your putt research perhaps you can find me an example of a freaking tour pro laying up on a par 5 from less than 180 yd in the fairway. 

You're simply making stuff up. My apologies that you can't read. I never said he should have laid up. I said he played the correct shot. He hit it poorly (fat) and brought the water and 6 into play.  Again risk/reward. Stick to believing NLU and their poor information. Life lesson cliche. Don't believe anything you hear and nothing you see. And FWIW if a lie is bad enough in the rough or too risky of a shot from a fairway trap you will see players lay up. Good talk. 

[PedronNiall]

11 hours ago, grm24 said:

You're simply making stuff up. My apologies that you can't read. I never said he should have laid up. I said he played the correct shot. He hit it poorly (fat) and brought the water and 6 into play.  Again risk/reward. Stick to believing NLU and their poor information. Life lesson cliche. Don't believe anything you hear and nothing you see. And FWIW if a lie is bad enough in the rough or too risky of a shot from a fairway trap you will see players lay up. Good talk. 

To bring in a non-biased 3rd party here, it's probably overly generous to call that a risk/reward shot. It was just poor management. Had it been a par 4, his 3rd to a par 5, or a tee shot on a par 3 he would have been expected to manage it properly and play for a miss that doesn't put him in the water or face the consequences. 

 

He failed to execute a good shot. He didn't catch it flush but land it in the wrong spot only to watch in sorrow as it hop, skipped, and jumped off the collar into the water or something of the like. There wasn't some low margin of error that he failed to avoid.

 

Would it have been risk/reward if he were putting from fully across the green and he smoked it off into the water somehow when trying to make eagle? No. There simply being a consequence for a poor, poor shot doesn't make it risk/reward.

[Dutch1008]

12 hours ago, grm24 said:

You're simply making stuff up. My apologies that you can't read. I never said he should have laid up. I said he played the correct shot. He hit it poorly (fat) and brought the water and 6 into play.  Again risk/reward. Stick to believing NLU and their poor information. Life lesson cliche. Don't believe anything you hear and nothing you see. And FWIW if a lie is bad enough in the rough or too risky of a shot from a fairway trap you will see players lay up. Good talk. 

We have a very different understanding of what constitutes a risk/reward shot. I'm of the opinion that there needs to be a choice forced on the player to be conservative or aggressive with clear upside and risk associated with the aggressive choice. Had Hovland been in the rough I would understand your point. From the rough he'd be taking the risk that the ball wouldn't come out as expected and water could be in play. That risk doesn't exist from the fairway for a tour pro. I can guaranty you that Hovland wasn't even thinking about the water. It was a back pin at 180 and to carry the water was probably around 165. He was far more concerned about going long and short-siding himself than he was about the water. 

 

Basically, the water was not a part of his decision making process. He just hit a garbage shot.  

[TiScape]

Gotta love reading these back and forth arguments over these aspects of the tournament. Was it risk/reward wasn’t it… Almost makes ya think we need to get a life! 😂 

I mean I get it’s a discussion forum, but daaang. Or perhaps I just don’t take golf seriously enough to be on this forum! 😜

Cheers boys 🍻 

[Dutch1008]

13 hours ago, mallrat said:

What made you feel like the greens were too choppy or too fast? Because putts were missed? The same can be said for when greens and to slow and shaggy. Are the conditions of the greens what made you think the course is tricked up? I guess I have a different tricked up definition. 

 

I would love to see some data from the new GS3 ball, I can guarantee they used it there. 
 

Personally I like seeing the pros challenged. 

I have no problem with the pros being challenged. Beside the Masters (tough greens) and the Open (tough breaks), the US Open is my favorite tournament. I just found the finish to this event boring. It felt like Kitayama survived it as opposed to won it, if that makes sense. 

[IndyArcher]

21 minutes ago, TiScape said:

Gotta love reading these back and forth arguments over these aspects of the tournament. Was it risk/reward wasn’t it… Almost makes ya think we need to get a life! 😂 

I mean I get it’s a discussion forum, but daaang. Or perhaps I just don’t take golf seriously enough to be on this forum! 😜

Cheers boys 🍻 

 

Clearly you don't know how to argue online! Heck, look at the beer you're toasting with: it's a pale ale instead of the obviously better dark stout! 

Edited March 8, 2023 by IndyArcher

[TiScape]

Just now, IndyArcher said:

 

Clearly you don't know how to argue online! Heck, look at the beer you're toasting with: it's a pale ale instead of the obviously better dark stout! 

No way! Pale ale and IPAs are faaaaarrrr superior to dark stouts! What are you not understanding!!!! 

[IndyArcher]

1 minute ago, TiScape said:

No way! Pale ale and IPAs are faaaaarrrr superior to dark stouts! What are you not understanding!!!! 

 

Hovland drinks IPA's and look what happened to him at the API! 

[TiScape]

18 minutes ago, IndyArcher said:

 

Hovland drinks IPA's and look what happened to him at the API! 

I simply can’t argue w/that! 😜

 

*I think I’m doing it wrong 😑 

How’s this. My opinion is right and your opinion is wrong to infinity ♾️ 😝
 

People see something and have an opinion. Thankfully we don’t all have the same one. You can argue til the cows 🐄 come home and you aren’t going to change someone’s opinion. It reminds me of the old ‘distance debate’ thread. Two sides w/very strong and opposing opinions going back and forth w/each other at nauseam. It’s gets to the point where one is trying to push their opinion on someone else over and over again and saying the opposing opinion is wrong. Seems immature to me to think if someone doesn’t think like you do, they are wrong. But as ppl get older it seems to be the way it goes. 
Okay rant over… Phew 

 

*I’m not specifically calling out anyone in this thread. Just riffin. So save the hate mail! 😂 

Edited March 8, 2023 by TiScape

[IndyArcher]

4 minutes ago, TiScape said:

I simply can’t argue w/that! 😜

 

*I think I’m doing it wrong 😑 

How’s this. My opinion is right and your opinion is wrong to infinity ♾️ 😝

 

By jove, I think he's got it! (except when you don't)

 

[TiScape]

9 minutes ago, IndyArcher said:

 

By jove, I think he's got it! (except when you don't)

 

I updated my post w/a little rant. 😂 

🤗 

[GolfTurkey]

On 3/7/2023 at 5:54 AM, 2over said:

I've hovered around scratch-3 hdcp and can tell you first hand that even a pro bouncing between Korn Ferry and mini-tours will make scratch ams look like double digit hc duffers. Seriously.

 

 

Yes, but we all know it's the 4-handicappers that the pro's have to watch out for.

[Jim53]

1 minute ago, GolfTurkey said:

 

Yes, but we all know it's the 4-handicappers that the pro's have to watch out for.

If only they had a short game....

[iNeedMoreGolf]

Golf is adjustment even more so then any sport.

[King_Slender]

I enjoy hearing from pros complaining about a hard course setup because they never mention all the advantages they get EVERY SINGLE WEEK - baked out fairways that springboard drives, never losing a ball, perfect bunkers, etc.

 

Short of some of the completely baked out greens we've seen at Shinnecock, anything goes.