Embedded or moved? I think I got this wrong.

[Augster]

Hey, a little help. 
 

Playing today and the ground is firm. No mud or anything anywhere. 
 

I hit a shot toward a green and pull it into the left rough. I see it bounce a couple times then roll to a stop left of the green. Did I mention it’s firm? 🙂

 

Anyway, I get to my ball and it looks to be sitting down. Embedded. There’s no way it was embedded in it’s own pitch mark as I saw it bounce twice then roll. I look over and a guy in my group must have driven over it as his cart was parked about 10 yards beyond where my ball was lying. 
 

Now, if it was an embedded ball, I’d get to drop within 1CL. Since there was no way my ball was “in it’s own pitch mark”, as I saw it bounce twice, it can’t be an embedded ball. 
 

This means it must be a moved ball. A ball at rest moved is PLACED as close as possible to where it was. Since none of us know exactly where it was, it has to be estimated. 
 

If I “estimate” that the cart just pushed it straight down, so I get to fix the pushed in ground, then place the ball on top of that? Or should I “estimate” that the ball must have rolled toward where the cart was parked when it was hit them squished, in this case to the left, and place the ball just to the right of the concave soil?

 

Let me know what I was supposed to do here. 
 

Thanks. 

[Hawkeye77]

Haven't dived into the rules yet but am questioning why a depression off the green could be fixed? I think you just find a lie similar to the pre-compressed lie?

[nsxguy]

19 minutes ago, Augster said:

Hey, a little help. 
 

Playing today and the ground is firm. No mud or anything anywhere. 
 

I hit a shot toward a green and pull it into the left rough. I see it bounce a couple times then roll to a stop left of the green. Did I mention it’s firm? 🙂

 

Anyway, I get to my ball and it looks to be sitting down. Embedded. There’s no way it was embedded in it’s own pitch mark as I saw it bounce twice then roll. I look over and a guy in my group must have driven over it as his cart was parked about 10 yards beyond where my ball was lying. 
 

Now, if it was an embedded ball, I’d get to drop within 1CL. Since there was no way my ball was “in it’s own pitch mark”, as I saw it bounce twice, it can’t be an embedded ball. 
 

This means it must be a moved ball. A ball at rest moved is PLACED as close as possible to where it was. Since none of us know exactly where it was, it has to be estimated. 
 

If I “estimate” that the cart just pushed it straight down, so I get to fix the pushed in ground, then place the ball on top of that? Or should I “estimate” that the ball must have rolled toward where the cart was parked when it was hit them squished, in this case to the left, and place the ball just to the right of the concave soil?

 

Let me know what I was supposed to do here. 
 

Thanks. 

 

Since someone rode(?) over it, altering the original lie, I think it's in 14.2d(2)

 

d. Where to Replace Ball When Original Lie Altered

 

{snip}

 

(2) Ball Anywhere Except in Sand. When the ball was anywhere except in sand, the player must replace the ball by placing it on the nearest spot with a lie most similar to the original lie that is:

   

Within one club-length from its original spot (which if not known must be estimated) (see Rule 14.2c),

   

Not nearer the hole, and

   

In the same area of the course as that spot.

 

If the player knows that the original lie was altered but does not know what the lie was, the player must estimate the original lie and replace the ball under (1) or (2).

Edited April 12, 2023 by nsxguy

[rogolf]

1 hour ago, nsxguy said:

 

Since someone rode(?) over it, altering the original lie, I think it's in 14.2d(2)

 

d. Where to Replace Ball When Original Lie Altered

 

{snip}

 

(2) Ball Anywhere Except in Sand. When the ball was anywhere except in sand, the player must replace the ball by placing it on the nearest spot with a lie most similar to the original lie that is:

   

Within one club-length from its original spot (which if not known must be estimated) (see Rule 14.2c),

   

Not nearer the hole, and

   

In the same area of the course as that spot.

 

If the player knows that the original lie was altered but does not know what the lie was, the player must estimate the original lie and replace the ball under (1) or (2).

14.2d is the correct Rule to follow.

(or you could ask Patrick Reed 🤨)

[Augster]

Awesome. Thanks!

 

I couldn’t figure to use 14.2B on the course and it was a casual round. So I placed the ball like 1” away from the depressed ground that my ball was in. 
 

Turns out I played it correctly, by accident. 🙂

 

Thanks!

[Colin L]

Mostly when  I play my ball correctly, it's by accident - but that's not quite what you meant. 🙂