On UST Recoil Irons Shaft, What type of Weights should you use for swing weight?

[JS Golf]

For UST Recoil Shafts, what type of weights should you use to adjust swing weight? 

 

I am sure the ones you use on steel won't work so what type? 

 

Any idea? 

[Stuart_G]

5 hours ago, JS Golf said:

For UST Recoil Shafts, what type of weights should you use to adjust swing weight? 

 

I am sure the ones you use on steel won't work so what type? 

 

Any idea? 

 

Yes, graphite shafts can not use tip weights intended for steel shafts.

 

Be careful about the ones that take up a lot of space in the hosel (like the tungsten rubber ones) - especially for heads with shorter bore depths.  You need to make sure you get enough insertion depth for a good glue joint and those types of tip weight can reduce the insertion depth by at least 1/4."

 

 

For 2g or 4 gm weights, I'll use these lead graphite tip weights:

https://www.golfworks.com/lead-shaft-tip-weights/p/gw0105/

 

 

For more than 4 gm, I'll use either of these:

https://billybobsgolf.com/product/brass-swingweights-for-graphite-shafts/

https://billybobsgolf.com/product/brass-swingweight-for-heavy-graphite-shafts-with-small-mandrel-hole/

Edited September 18, 2023 by Stuart_G

[driveandputtmachine]

Since I went to graphite in my irons I have just decided to use lead tape.   I know some people HATE the look of lead tape on irons, but it doesn't bother me.  There was just a pile of issues when dealing with insertion depth and the fact you cannot get as much weight in the graphite as you can steel. Add in the fact I play at a higher starting SW off my 7 iron than most and then MOI match to it with 1/4" down and 3/8" up in length, I need to add quite a bit of weight as well in some irons and graphite tips just don't add enough.

[Stuart_G]

14 minutes ago, driveandputtmachine said:

Since I went to graphite in my irons I have just decided to use lead tape

 

and the fact you cannot get as much weight in the graphite as you can steel.

 

I need to add quite a bit of weight as well in some irons and graphite tips just don't add enough.

 

The largest tip weight for graphite - that doesn't take up hardly any hosel space - is 10 gm.   That's more than most people will ever need.

 

I don't have a problem with the looks of lead tape - but even I can't imagine having to fit more than 10 gm of lead tape onto any head - even a blade.   That's a LOT of lead tape.   That's got to be something to see 🙂

 

 

Edited September 18, 2023 by Stuart_G

[driveandputtmachine]

11 minutes ago, Stuart_G said:

 

I don't have a problem with the looks of lead tape - but even I can't imagine having to fit more than 10 gm of lead tape onto any head - even a blade.   That's a LOT of lead tape.   That's got to be something to see 🙂

 

 

Well with some of my weird lengths and when irons show up with steel shafts and already have weights in the shafts, and then I pull and play at a shorter length, and need a D6 or so SW I cannot get away with 2 or 4 grams.   Those are the only tip weights I trust in graphite shafts, so if I am gonna use some lead tape, might as well use it all in lead tape.

[NRJyzr]

7 minutes ago, driveandputtmachine said:

Well with some of my weird lengths and when irons show up with steel shafts and already have weights in the shafts, and then I pull and play at a shorter length, and need a D6 or so SW I cannot get away with 2 or 4 grams.   Those are the only tip weights I trust in graphite shafts, so if I am gonna use some lead tape, might as well use it all in lead tape.

 

The golf gods will be pleased with all the lead tape

 

[Stuart_G]

24 minutes ago, driveandputtmachine said:

Those are the only tip weights I trust in graphite shafts

 

OK - so it's a matter of trust, not availability.   That's different - but perfectly fine.

[driveandputtmachine]

1 minute ago, Stuart_G said:

 

OK - so it's a matter of trust, not availability.   That's different - but perfectly fine.

When I used to do all of my fitting with Dana Upshaw we tried some graphite in my irons.  He didn't like the longer heavier graphite tip weights at my swing speed.

 

Now that was over ten years ago, and since then graphite iron shafts have gotten even better, and my swing speed has gotten even slower.  Dana is no longer with us to see if his thoughts have changed, but those words are still stuck in my head.  

 

No chance I'd trust a brass one that was longer than insertion, but maybe those rubber tungsten ones could be OK, but those didn't fit the recoils I had before going to Axiom, and there are just so many variables that as a hobbyist that does my work, plus just a few guys that are friends I find no need to have piles of different options and lead tape works on everything.

[Stuart_G]

34 minutes ago, driveandputtmachine said:

maybe those rubber tungsten ones could be OK

 

I'm not a fan because of how much they reduce the insertion depth.  Some people trim down the part that sits below the shaft tip to help reduce that effect - but you loose a lot of the weight that way.

 

There is really not any actual basis for concern for damaging the shaft with the longer brass weights - but to each his own.   They are certainly far from ideal even with that fact.   They do have a slightly higher chance of causing some rattles but the bigger problem is they can easily become epoxied in into the shaft.  That makes them a PITA to remove if you ever want to pull the shafts and reuse them in different heads (that need different amount of tip weights).

 

One of these days I want to try and fabricate some from lead wire if I can find the right diameter.

[Nessism]

Adjusting swingweight when using graphite shafts is definitely a drawback to their usage.  I'm someone that has chopped down lead tip weights, to reduce the head on the end, which, as Stuart mentions, reduces insertion depth.  I've also resorted to increasing shaft length 1/4" as well, to gain a smig extra swingweight that way.  I can adjust to slightly longer shafts easier than the reduction of swingweight, although in truth, 1/4" of length doesn't have a great swingweight effect.  Every little bit helps, though.

[JS Golf]

Thanks for all the inputs. 

 

I am looking at 105g graphite shaft and currently use PX LZ which is around 115 so not going down by much in terms of overall weight. 

 

By the way, has anyone tried this weight? Pic below.  It's lead. Doesn't seem to take up too much space in hosel. 

[st1800e]

You’ll have to make sure the ID of the shaft tip is bigger than the OD of the weight.  

[Stuart_G]

14 hours ago, JS Golf said:

I am looking at 105g graphite shaft and currently use PX LZ which is around 115 so not going down by much in terms of overall weight. 

 

Shaft weight alone w/o balance point differences will not give any kind of indication of how much tip weight you may or may not need.  

 

It's an extreme example but I've had to add 8 gm of weight going to a 15 gm heavier shaft.

 

14 hours ago, JS Golf said:

By the way, has anyone tried this weight? Pic below.  It's lead. Doesn't seem to take up too much space in hosel. 

 

 

You have a link? 

 

But I've used similar shaped ones made out of brass - see the links I posted in the second post of the thread.   \

 

So they could be fine depending on the diameter of the stem.   11/64" is the most I'd want to drill out the tip ID's - so if the stems are 5/32" or 1/8" - they would probably work out fairly well.  (equal or less than ~0.170-0.175").

Edited September 19, 2023 by Stuart_G

[Socrates]

16 hours ago, JS Golf said:

Thanks for all the inputs. 

 

I am looking at 105g graphite shaft and currently use PX LZ which is around 115 so not going down by much in terms of overall weight. 

 

By the way, has anyone tried this weight? Pic below.  It's lead. Doesn't seem to take up too much space in hosel. 

 

13 hours ago, st1800e said:

You’ll have to make sure the ID of the shaft tip is bigger than the OD of the weight.  

Unless its a very light weight shaft, you likely have lots of ID that can be drilled out of the shaft to fit the weights.  It's not a problem to take out a few 1000's of ID from a shaft tip from a structural point of view.

[JS Golf]

https://www.ebay.com/itm/385282232802?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0&ssspo=b_mww0cdtsm&sssrc=4429486&ssuid=xmiM-6njQMW&var=653169126093&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPYThanks 

 

Its on Ebay 

[Mark_Tha_Tinkerer]

Some may consider it heresy, but I routinely use high density tungsten powder for swing-weighting purposes in graphite shafts for both woods and irons.  I jam foam ear plugs down the shaft with a ramrod to act as a plug instead of using a cork.  You can roll them up real tight and once jammed in to near the hosel they expand to fill the shaft.  The powder is much easier to use in terms of getting the right weighting than tip weights and you don't have the cosmetic concerns of lead tape.  

 

I only build for myself and might not do this if I was building for others because I suppose it could interfere with integrity of the club/shaft over the long term.  However, to date, there have been zero adverse consequences to using the powder and ear plugs.  

[Stuart_G]

11 hours ago, Mark_Tha_Tinkerer said:

Some may consider it heresy,

 

Some might, but I wouldn't go that far.   The ID of the shafts are just so small that it's relatively inefficient compared to alternatives.   Meaning the weight isn't concentrated as far down and therefore you need to add more weight for any given swing weight change.

 

 

11 hours ago, Mark_Tha_Tinkerer said:

I jam foam ear plugs down the shaft with a ramrod to act as a plug instead of using a cork.

 

That's an interesting idea.  Sounds like it would address one of the other common concerns - using a cork that's not the right size and potentially damaging the shaft trying to get it in place.

 

 

12 hours ago, Mark_Tha_Tinkerer said:

The powder is much easier to use in terms of getting the right weighting than tip weights

 

That's arguable.  In fact,  I think it's much easier with tip weights.   But to each his own.

[Mark_Tha_Tinkerer]

11 hours ago, Stuart_G said:

That's arguable.  In fact,  I think it's much easier with tip weights.   But to each his own.

 

You are right about it being arguable and each person has to decide what is easier to use.  My tip weights are seldom exactly the weight that I want (I don't have an inventory of tip weights gradually increasing in weight 1 gram at a time).  When I have used tip weights, I inevitably have to cut them to get to the weight I want.  I have to pull the saw out, attach my vice to the workbench, put on my protective glasses,  and then cut using guesswork as to what the tip will weigh after the cutting.  Using powder, I just pour out the powder on a scale to get the exact amount of weight I want to add and, using a funnel,  pour it down the shaft.  For me, that is "easier." 

[ARL67]

I use the lead tip weights from Golfworks for 2-4g and grind them down as required. For heavier, I like the Wishon tungsten 9g weights as the butt/cap is only 1/8" thick and they do not protrude past the hosel -> contact a Wishon dealer to order them.

 

I quickly and easily grind my tip weights  ( lead, brass, tungsten ) to perfection with my cheapo 1" belt sander and disc combo.  This is an MVP in my home golf shop and something like below is readily available for under $100.  PSA for anyone in Canada, you can get this for $74 $C from Princess Auto.

 

 

Edited September 20, 2023 by ARL67

[ShortGolfer]

My XXIO 12 SGI irons have a convenient shelf to attach lead tape.  I cover the lead tape with hot melt glue for a fine adjustment of swing weight.  A hot air gun re-melts the hot melt glue to make it look nice.

My Stealth 7W has a 10g tungsten/rubber tip weight as I cut it down to 38.75 inches.  I like my clubs very short.    - 2inches, 2 degrees upright.

Edited September 21, 2023 by ShortGolfer

[Stuart_G]

17 hours ago, Mark_Tha_Tinkerer said:

each person has to decide what is easier to use.

 

Agree 100% - although I might say which they are more comfortable using.   None of this is really difficult for anyone with the right tools.

 

From my perspective:

1) get protective eye-wear  -> 5 seconds

2) cut tip weight => 30 seconds with a pair of pliers and a Dremel tool w/ cutoff wheel for brass tip weights for graphite.  Add 15 more seconds more if I want to use the bench clamp instead of pliers.

3) Another 15-20 sec to grind any sharp edges of the new end of the tip weight. 

4) And another 30 seconds to cool off the tip weight. 

 

Total time 2-3 minutes.

And that's just for brass.  Lead tip weights are even faster since you can just use a good pair of wire cutters.

 

And no need to guess on how much needs to be cut off.  If you know the playing length and how many swing weight pts you want to add,  you know how much weight you need add.  And it's easy to determine how how much to cut off the tip weight to get a particular final weight.

 

With the powder in a graphite shaft, you never know how far down the powder will go or how much will stick to the sides, and therefore (if you want any level of accuracy) it's going to be a tedious iterative process back and forth between adding powder and putting the club on the scale and check the weight (being careful to keep the powder in the right place).  And if you end up adding too much, you have to dump it out and start over again.

 

But as I said, that's my perspective.   Nothing wrong if yours doesn't match mine.  Whatever ends up working is fine.

 

 

Edited September 21, 2023 by Stuart_G

[Even Further]

On 9/17/2023 at 10:58 PM, JS Golf said:

For UST Recoil Shafts, what type of weights should you use to adjust swing weight? 

 

I am sure the ones you use on steel won't work so what type? 

 

Any idea? 

 

 I used copper 10 gauge romex wire. I had scraps left over from a project and worked great. I also used a long metal rod to tap the weight down, to make sure it was fully down toward the head before the epoxy set, after putting the head on the shaft.

 

[Mark_Tha_Tinkerer]

5 hours ago, Even Further said:

 

 I used copper 10 gauge romex wire. I had scraps left over from a project and worked great. I also used a long metal rod to tap the weight down, to make sure it was fully down toward the head before the epoxy set, after putting the head on the shaft.

 

Sometimes it amazes me as to the creative/novel hacks or fixes WRXers come up with to accomplish a club making objective.  I learned of the foam ear plugs used as a substitute for cork plugs from another WRXer post.  Building for myself only, I am not afraid of potential catastrophic failure from experimenting on myself and diverting from conventional wisdom or mainstream accepted practices.  Then again, as a kid, I liked to put my fingers in electrical sockets.  So there is that to consider.  

 

Thanks for sharing that idea.