Ryder Cup Broken... here's the fix

[kiwigolf72]

2 hours ago, darkhelmet said:

Not a change to the actual playing format, but I'd like to see them go to a 3-year rotation among the US, Europe, and International teams.  They'll never do it because the Ryder Cup name has too much cache, and they'll want to keep it on an every other year schedule.

 

But I think it means more to the Europeans because they only play every other year.  US players play in one of these every single fall.  Add in a Europe/International competition, and each team gets one year in 3 off.

please don't drag the international team into this, we have a hard enough time with the PC, most international fans realise that the PC is not about golf it's about the PGA making money.

[One Putter]

The American team should become the North American team and include players from Canada and Mexico. That would be fun.

[Chunkitgood]

The Cup was supposed to be a friendly competition.  It seems the US guys don’t care and the Euros think it is life and death.  The intent or at least expectation from the beginning was for the home team to win most if not all matches.

 

No doubt the tolerance of heckling makes it less likely that the winner would be the same team as would win without it.  I doubt anybody involved in the organization of the event really wants Europe to ever lose in Europe.

 

 

[Dutch1008]

7 hours ago, bladehunter said:

The fix is culturally. Personally believe that the European players grow up less privileged…and they play like they were raised. Humble.   The Americans are mostly country club brats. And they handle adversity like country club brats. Speaking in general terms. There are exceptions on both sides. 

 

Rory was a country club kid. Pretty sure Rose and Fitzpatrick and the whole lot were too. The big difference is that it's not cost prohibitive to have a club membership in the GB&I. I can't speak to the rest of Europe but the cost to join the local club in Scotland or Ireland is a pittance compared to the US. I have a buddy from Scotland who paid $500 / year for his course. A year!! $500 for unlimited golf. In my neck of the woods you're lucky to get 5 rounds w/ that. Take a look at what it costs to join the club Rory grew up playing...

 

https://holywoodgolfclub.co.uk/become-a-member

 

The US built their golf infrastructure to cater to the well heeled. Exclusivity was part of the appeal. To be a competitive junior player in the US, you need that silver spoon. There are certainly exceptions. Max Homa cuts his teeth at the local muni but its far more likely to see kids that walked the same path as Spieth, Cantlay, and Wyndham Clark. Growing up at the country club where the parents dropped them off in the morning and they battered balls all day long and played as much as they want.   

 

If this country truly figured out a way to make golf a sport for the masses, you'd see a far different make up of professionals from the US. I don't see that happening any time soon. If anything, it's getting worse. The only new courses being built are private or destination resort courses in the image of Bandon Dunes. Post pandemic the cost of public courses continue to rise. The muni's by me are all $50-75 minimum w/ a bucket of range balls all running from $10-15 at least. Good luck becoming world class w/o a parent that can handle the bill. How many athletes in the mold of Ludvig Aberg could the US pump out if the cost of golf wasn't prohibitive? You can find a very talented 6'4" kid with no hope of getting a basketball scholarship on just about every high school basketball team in America. We have a structural handicap.     

[bladehunter]

1 hour ago, Dutch1008 said:

 

Rory was a country club kid. Pretty sure Rose and Fitzpatrick and the whole lot were too. The big difference is that it's not cost prohibitive to have a club membership in the GB&I. I can't speak to the rest of Europe but the cost to join the local club in Scotland or Ireland is a pittance compared to the US. I have a buddy from Scotland who paid $500 / year for his course. A year!! $500 for unlimited golf. In my neck of the woods you're lucky to get 5 rounds w/ that. Take a look at what it costs to join the club Rory grew up playing...

 

https://holywoodgolfclub.co.uk/become-a-member

 

The US built their golf infrastructure to cater to the well heeled. Exclusivity was part of the appeal. To be a competitive junior player in the US, you need that silver spoon. There are certainly exceptions. Max Homa cuts his teeth at the local muni but its far more likely to see kids that walked the same path as Spieth, Cantlay, and Wyndham Clark. Growing up at the country club where the parents dropped them off in the morning and they battered balls all day long and played as much as they want.   

 

If this country truly figured out a way to make golf a sport for the masses, you'd see a far different make up of professionals from the US. I don't see that happening any time soon. If anything, it's getting worse. The only new courses being built are private or destination resort courses in the image of Bandon Dunes. Post pandemic the cost of public courses continue to rise. The muni's by me are all $50-75 minimum w/ a bucket of range balls all running from $10-15 at least. Good luck becoming world class w/o a parent that can handle the bill. How many athletes in the mold of Ludvig Aberg could the US pump out if the cost of golf wasn't prohibitive? You can find a very talented 6'4" kid with no hope of getting a basketball scholarship on just about every high school basketball team in America. We have a structural handicap.     

Right but that backs my point. I belong to a $115 a month club myself. Semi private.  Basically a pre pay discount club.  It’s blue collar as can be.     The way our kids are treated here in the summer while playing is more “ 1000 uncles babysitting “.    than    “charge it to my fathers account “. 
 

 

agree completely. The USA is NOT getting top potential athletes to pro golf.  It’s way too exclusive still.  And I used to say otherwise.  But then I raised a son , brought him up in the game , which he was good at , and then at around age 10 watched him not want to play.  Zero kids at school played. He is a big athletic. 15 year old now playing 3 varsity sports.  Track , basketball and cross country.  I didn’t press because I know that you can’t play this game unless you love it. I hope he picks it up later in life at least.  But one thing he cited time and  time again was this …. At away tournaments, which were usually at nicer clubs , he always remarked at how “ weird “ he felt compared to where he practiced daily.  His way of saying uncomfortable or unwanted.  I understand that because I get that too. Having worked at a very exclusive place in my youth , I know that feeling.  Having said that , I’m very sure that if you’re a member , that is reverse.  Perspective strikes again. 
 

 

I have no idea what the answer is. But I often wonder how many 6-4 athletes have golf offered and pass it up. My 15 year old measured 6-2 3/4 today at his physical therapy appointment ( hip tightness ) … he was driving it 230 yards at age 10 when he dropped the game. And he was a foot shorter.  I’ve lately wondered how fun it would be to play with him now off the same tees. No time. Sports today go 24/7 365. And 3 means the year is already full. 

Edited October 3, 2023 by bladehunter

[Dutch1008]

15 minutes ago, bladehunter said:

Right but that backs my point. I belong to a $115 a month club myself. Semi private.  Basically a pre pay discount club.  It’s blue collar as can be.     The way our kids are treated here in the summer while playing is more “ 1000 uncles babysitting “.    than    “charge it to my fathers account “. 
 

 

agree completely. The USA is NOT getting top potential athletes to pro golf.  It’s way too exclusive still.  And I used to say otherwise.  But then I raised a son , brought him up in the game , which he was good at , and then at around age 10 watched him not want to play.  Zero kids at school played. He is a big athletic. 15 year old now playing 3 varsity sports.  Track , basketball and cross country.  I didn’t press because I know that you can’t play this game unless you love it. I hope he picks it up later in life at least.  But one thing he cited time and  time again was this …. At away tournaments, which were usually at nicer clubs , he always remarked at how “ weird “ he felt compared to where he practiced daily.  His way of saying uncomfortable or unwanted.  I understand that because I get that too. Having worked at a very exclusive place in my youth , I know that feeling.  Having said that , I’m very sure that if you’re a member , that is reverse.  Perspective strikes again. 

 

$115/mo is a steal. If that was available in SoCal there'd be a 10 year wait list. Enjoy it. Hopefully your son finds a path back to the game. 

 

There was a story in the last issue of the Golfer's Journal that discussed the AJGA arms race. It focuses on Luke Clanton, a middle class kid from FL who's parents basically spend every disposable dollar and probably a bit more to fund his journey. He's made it to FSU so all things are possible but his journey certainly required a lot more sacrifice than others. Its a good read.

 

Regardless, I harbor no ill will for those that hit the genetic lottery. Their parent or grand parents likely earned it. But I do admit, when someone like Patrick Cantlay, who grew up at a country club, attended private schools, plays weekly for millions upon millions, still has the audacity to complain about not being compensated for the Ryder Cup? Go sit on a cactus. Cantlay could never play another shot and the golf world would keep on spinning. Somehow he doesn't understand that and I don't think he's the only professional golfer that fails to.   

[mark174ace]

20 hours ago, Jimi Thing said:

And why in the world would one want to eliminate foursomes? It is the hardest, leave your ego at the door type of golf. One has to be a pretty complete, balanced human being to perform there at this level. It is the ultimate display of team golf and the best telling sign of team quality. 

Foursomes is the best part of the Ryder and President's Cup

[isaacbm]

2 hours ago, Dutch1008 said:

 

$115/mo is a steal. If that was available in SoCal there'd be a 10 year wait list. Enjoy it. Hopefully your son finds a path back to the game. 

 

There was a story in the last issue of the Golfer's Journal that discussed the AJGA arms race. It focuses on Luke Clanton, a middle class kid from FL who's parents basically spend every disposable dollar and probably a bit more to fund his journey. He's made it to FSU so all things are possible but his journey certainly required a lot more sacrifice than others. Its a good read.

 

Regardless, I harbor no ill will for those that hit the genetic lottery. Their parent or grand parents likely earned it. But I do admit, when someone like Patrick Cantlay, who grew up at a country club, attended private schools, plays weekly for millions upon millions, still has the audacity to complain about not being compensated for the Ryder Cup? Go sit on a cactus. Cantlay could never play another shot and the golf world would keep on spinning. Somehow he doesn't understand that and I don't think he's the only professional golfer that fails to.   

I respect your opinion but…

the Ryder made $650,000,000 this year. That’s not going to charity.  That’s profit. 
There’s no Ryder Cup without the best players in the world.  
Can’t  they all be given $2,000,000 towards their foundations or favourite charity? They currently get $200,000. 
So the entire payout to players of the 650,000,000 is just under $5,000,000.

Less than 1%!!
Who’s greedy ?? We’re honestly going to label the players greedy? For real?? 

Sorry for the rant 

 

[Jimi Thing]

2 hours ago, isaacbm said:

I respect your opinion but…

the Ryder made $650,000,000 this year. That’s not going to charity.  That’s profit. 
There’s no Ryder Cup without the best players in the world.  
Can’t  they all be given $2,000,000 towards their foundations or favourite charity? They currently get $200,000. 
So the entire payout to players of the 650,000,000 is just under $5,000,000.

Less than 1%!!
Who’s greedy ?? We’re honestly going to label the players greedy? For real?? 

Sorry for the rant 

 

Regardless of which side of that argument you are on, there is a time and a place. This could have been dealt with just  after whistling straights or this week going forward. .
 

Instead it’s part of the Ryder cup week. to me that is an indication of how much you care for the Ryder cup. 
 

And it could have been kept at just that: I don’t agree with the financial policies and don’t wear a hat in protest. But it became a lot more pathetic unfortunately mainly for Cantlay and Thomas. 
 

To pull the “it doesn’t fit, just like it didn’t in whistling straights” that’s it. And you and the entire entourage have little enough care to fix that easily solved issue. Shows how much care you have for the event. 
 

And JT on Sunday, cringe worthy. Terrible. I imagine him on Saturday lining up the boys to convince them to unite in not wearing a hat. Only to see half of them joining in this act. And 2nd, let’s make a ‘hats off gesture’ each times we win or halve a hole to be literally the only one doing this.

 

I like you JT, but you looked like an an absolute fool out there. Imagine explaining that to your kids. Why are you not wearing a hat and making these signals daddy? It was to show the world that we are a strong united team, standing behind each other. “But you are the only one doing that!!” Uhh

 

Finally, team Cantlay could be a bit more business savvy. If your desire is to monetise the Ryder cup, you are going about it in the worst possible way. Sponsorship deals go to likeable performing athletes. He’s doing the Cantlay brand and associated charities a bad service. The $2m every 2 years is peanuts. 
 

However, I think Cantlay was the best performing US golfer alongside Homa. And he showed leadership, he stood up, had a backbone off and on the course. He had a stellar performance given the circumstances. As a personality and the cause he represents, it’s going to be tough for people to gather behind that. 

[Hankshank]

8 hours ago, bladehunter said:

agree completely. The USA is NOT getting top potential athletes to pro golf.  It’s way too exclusive still.  And I used to say otherwise.  But then I raised a son , brought him up in the game , which he was good at , and then at around age 10 watched him not want to play.  Zero kids at school played. He is a big athletic. 15 year old now playing 3 varsity sports.  Track , basketball and cross country.  I didn’t press because I know that you can’t play this game unless you love it. I hope he picks it up later in life at least.  But one thing he cited time and  time again was this …. At away tournaments, which were usually at nicer clubs , he always remarked at how “ weird “ he felt compared to where he practiced daily.  His way of saying uncomfortable or unwanted.  I understand that because I get that too. Having worked at a very exclusive place in my youth , I know that feeling.  Having said that , I’m very sure that if you’re a member , that is reverse.  Perspective strikes again. 

This could be me, albeit living in Scandinavia. My son do however like to play, but he is also not the kind of guy who does sports without buddies to hang out with. OK he´s 27 now and his American Football days are over(6ft2 100kg no fat, good enough over here) but even back in his teenages too few young lads wanted to play. Its not like its a big folk sport over here too. Actually, when I started playing (first in the family blue collar roots) back in '81 in my late teens golf was more of a folk sport than now. It was massively expanding, not least since the hockey hero Sven Tumba, a working class celebrity took up golf and became an advocate for golf outside of the posh habitats.
(My son called me up this summer, since some of his colleagues have started to play, we went to the range, him not playing in 10+ys. A couple of stray shots first, then a I5 to 200 meters, then a driver into the woods beyond the range, have faith, they might just start later!)

Don´t know if this holds for the British Isles as well. 

 

 

Edited October 3, 2023 by Hankshank

[dave_3]

10 hours ago, Dutch1008 said:

 

Rory was a country club kid. Pretty sure Rose and Fitzpatrick and the whole lot were too. The big difference is that it's not cost prohibitive to have a club membership in the GB&I. I can't speak to the rest of Europe but the cost to join the local club in Scotland or Ireland is a pittance compared to the US. I have a buddy from Scotland who paid $500 / year for his course. A year!! $500 for unlimited golf. In my neck of the woods you're lucky to get 5 rounds w/ that. Take a look at what it costs to join the club Rory grew up playing...

 

https://holywoodgolfclub.co.uk/become-a-member

 

The US built their golf infrastructure to cater to the well heeled. Exclusivity was part of the appeal. To be a competitive junior player in the US, you need that silver spoon. There are certainly exceptions. Max Homa cuts his teeth at the local muni but its far more likely to see kids that walked the same path as Spieth, Cantlay, and Wyndham Clark. Growing up at the country club where the parents dropped them off in the morning and they battered balls all day long and played as much as they want.   

 

If this country truly figured out a way to make golf a sport for the masses, you'd see a far different make up of professionals from the US. I don't see that happening any time soon. If anything, it's getting worse. The only new courses being built are private or destination resort courses in the image of Bandon Dunes. Post pandemic the cost of public courses continue to rise. The muni's by me are all $50-75 minimum w/ a bucket of range balls all running from $10-15 at least. Good luck becoming world class w/o a parent that can handle the bill. How many athletes in the mold of Ludvig Aberg could the US pump out if the cost of golf wasn't prohibitive? You can find a very talented 6'4" kid with no hope of getting a basketball scholarship on just about every high school basketball team in America. We have a structural handicap.     

I don't know what courses your Scottish friends play but they must be dog tracks. Some Scottish courses are cheap because you can only play on them for 7 months a year.  There's not many sunlight hours up there in winter.   All of the courses local to me are $1500 to $2000 joining fee and $1500 per year.  That's about average in the the UK. 

Some courses will wave the joining fee if they are short of members. A basket of 70 range balls on average is €10.

 

Being half English and half american I can tell you the biggest difference in golf are the courses.  For the most part the UK courses are much shorter and tighter off the tee because we don't have the room and real estate 

Edited October 3, 2023 by dave_3

[bladehunter]

7 hours ago, isaacbm said:

I respect your opinion but…

the Ryder made $650,000,000 this year. That’s not going to charity.  That’s profit. 
There’s no Ryder Cup without the best players in the world.  
Can’t  they all be given $2,000,000 towards their foundations or favourite charity? They currently get $200,000. 
So the entire payout to players of the 650,000,000 is just under $5,000,000.

Less than 1%!!
Who’s greedy ?? We’re honestly going to label the players greedy? For real?? 

Sorry for the rant 

 

I agree completely.  Calling any player greedy in context is wrong.     You can no more make that money minus top players than you can bake a cake minus eggs.  Ive seen several recipes that try it. And the result is always the same. Dry , Hard and flat 😂.  

[FriedEgg]

8 hours ago, mark174ace said:

Foursomes is the best part of the Ryder and President's Cup

 

and the parking lot drama 😁

[jmplautz]

8 hours ago, isaacbm said:

I respect your opinion but…

the Ryder made $650,000,000 this year. That’s not going to charity.  That’s profit. 
There’s no Ryder Cup without the best players in the world.  
Can’t  they all be given $2,000,000 towards their foundations or favourite charity? They currently get $200,000. 
So the entire payout to players of the 650,000,000 is just under $5,000,000.

Less than 1%!!
Who’s greedy ?? We’re honestly going to label the players greedy? For real?? 

Sorry for the rant 

 

I'd feel sorry for them if they didn't just get a multi week vacation to Rome for free. Getting flown private. Being put up in a great hotel with private chefs. And enough swag for them and their wives to make Amy Michelson blush. These people are pampered and catered to their entire time there. 

[spacecowboy]

If you qualify and accept, or are a captains pick and accept, then there is a $___?___ buy in to compete.  Winner take all.  Settle up in cash, on camera, on sunday.

If that's not enough, then the loser is also sentenced to be winner's butler for a year.

[Guest RobS]

8 hours ago, isaacbm said:

I respect your opinion but…

the Ryder made $650,000,000 this year. That’s not going to charity.  That’s profit. 
There’s no Ryder Cup without the best players in the world.  
Can’t  they all be given $2,000,000 towards their foundations or favourite charity? They currently get $200,000. 
So the entire payout to players of the 650,000,000 is just under $5,000,000.

Less than 1%!!
Who’s greedy ?? We’re honestly going to label the players greedy? For real?? 

Sorry for the rant 

 

I don't disagree with your general premise but where did you get the $650m profit number from?  The revenue projection for the event was $540m.  Perhaps total revenue ended up at $650m.  The projected profit for the DPWT (60% cut as host) was around $15m. Actual dollars aside, in prior years I would have been critical of a player complaining about money but with the entire professional golf world turning mercenary over the last couple years, I can understand the players being a little more cynical.  Granted, this is the PGA of America and not the Tour but when it comes down to it, this is a fundraiser for private organizations.  It's not the Olympics.  I'm most definitely patriotic and while I think it's an honor to represent your country, this is a fundraiser.  Representing your country, for a couple golf organizations to generate revenue, is not quite the same thing as say, representing the USA in the Olympics or any other official capacity.  I don't care if the players get paid or not but I not totally on board with the profiting off of patriotism that's in play.

[gvogel]

4 hours ago, dave_3 said:

I don't know what courses your Scottish friends play but they must be dog tracks. Some Scottish courses are cheap because you can only play on them for 7 months a year.  There's not many sunlight hours up there in winter.   All of the courses local to me are $1500 to $2000 joining fee and $1500 per year.  That's about average in the the UK. 

Some courses will wave the joining fee if they are short of members. A basket of 70 range balls on average is €10.

 

Being half English and half american I can tell you the biggest difference in golf are the courses.  For the most part the UK courses are much shorter and tighter off the tee because we don't have the room and real estate 

Excellent comment dave 3.  You should post your comments about golf course room and real estate on the roll-back thread!

[gvogel]

22 hours ago, Golfnuck said:

 

Isn't the current rotation really a "home and away" series but just over a span of a couple of years.   I don't really see the problem. 

 

As to elimination of foursomes .....  why eliminate them just be analytics show that format statistically is producing lopsided results or stated another way the Europeans win more than the Americans so we need to get rid of it so the Americans will will more????  What a joke.  Shayne Ryan is clearly only interested in having the US win more.

The United States won every year from 1937 to 1983, except for one year, 1957 when Great Britain won.  Heck, that's almost 50 years of domination.

 

I'd say that if Europe won for the next 20 years or more, they still would not be getting even.  So maybe that's why they play with a chip on their shoulder.

[st1800e]

21 hours ago, Pleasedwith3putts said:

At least bababooeeyy man was absent from Rome...

Very refreshing he didn’t attend, or maybe he did and they ejected him? 
 

As to the original question, it’s a sporting event, for our entertainment. 
Just like all other major sports.  Generating revenue and profit is at the core of all major sports. If there’s none of that, we wouldn’t see it.   I’ll leave it to the organizers to determine the best format and who plays.  They are not very likely to consider any input I might have.  
The best team won, as is always the case.  Why they won is for the Monday morning analysts, at home, or in the media.   
Its over , I’m playing golf today.  

[Ferguson]

23 hours ago, Hawkeye77 said:

This is really a dumb idea.

 

@2over  shows up after a brutal American loss (with less than 250 posts on WRX) and claims the Ryder Cup is broken.

That takes some real festoons. 

 

 

Dumb idea for sure but look at the people that actually think the club player could beat Ms. Hull.

 

 

[gvogel]

16 hours ago, Dutch1008 said:

 

Rory was a country club kid. Pretty sure Rose and Fitzpatrick and the whole lot were too. The big difference is that it's not cost prohibitive to have a club membership in the GB&I. I can't speak to the rest of Europe but the cost to join the local club in Scotland or Ireland is a pittance compared to the US. I have a buddy from Scotland who paid $500 / year for his course. A year!! $500 for unlimited golf. In my neck of the woods you're lucky to get 5 rounds w/ that. Take a look at what it costs to join the club Rory grew up playing...

 

https://holywoodgolfclub.co.uk/become-a-member

 

The US built their golf infrastructure to cater to the well heeled. Exclusivity was part of the appeal. To be a competitive junior player in the US, you need that silver spoon. There are certainly exceptions. Max Homa cuts his teeth at the local muni but its far more likely to see kids that walked the same path as Spieth, Cantlay, and Wyndham Clark. Growing up at the country club where the parents dropped them off in the morning and they battered balls all day long and played as much as they want.   

 

If this country truly figured out a way to make golf a sport for the masses, you'd see a far different make up of professionals from the US. I don't see that happening any time soon. If anything, it's getting worse. The only new courses being built are private or destination resort courses in the image of Bandon Dunes. Post pandemic the cost of public courses continue to rise. The muni's by me are all $50-75 minimum w/ a bucket of range balls all running from $10-15 at least. Good luck becoming world class w/o a parent that can handle the bill. How many athletes in the mold of Ludvig Aberg could the US pump out if the cost of golf wasn't prohibitive? You can find a very talented 6'4" kid with no hope of getting a basketball scholarship on just about every high school basketball team in America. We have a structural handicap.     

As I recall, Rory's father worked as a bartender at Holywood in order to fund his family's membership.

[Ferguson]

42 minutes ago, gvogel said:

As I recall, Rory's father worked as a bartender at Holywood in order to fund his family's membership.

 

Those stories are strewn throughout the golf world.  Dads working the hard jobs such as machinists, masons, cell phone tower techs, foundry workers and abalone divers.    

[Dutch1008]

6 hours ago, dave_3 said:

All of the courses local to me are $1500 to $2000 joining fee and $1500 per year.  That's about average in the the UK. 

Some courses will wave the joining fee if they are short of members. A basket of 70 range balls on average is €10.

I literally posted the cost to join Rory's old club. It's 800 pounds a year. And yes, my friends home track isn't Royal County Down and he has a limited playing window but it's 6,000 yds and the pictures looked comparable or better to the public courses I pay $100 to play. 

 

Further, I would literally kill for your deal. The most affordable club by me is a $25,000 buy in w/ $750 in monthly dues. There were a couple club corp tracks that were $10k/$500 but I believe those prices have jumped post pandemic. Depending on traffic, it'd take me 45 min to an hour to get to those clubs. The clubs closest to me range from $125k to $250k buy in. There are a couple about  30 minutes away that cost around $50-75k buy in. The latter all require monthly dues between $1,000 to $1,500. To be fair, LA/OC might be the worst spots for public golf in America and there are certainly better deals to be had across the country but the point stands. The barriers to entry in the US are far higher than GB&I.  

[Dutch1008]

13 hours ago, isaacbm said:

I respect your opinion but…

the Ryder made $650,000,000 this year. That’s not going to charity.  That’s profit. 
There’s no Ryder Cup without the best players in the world.  
Can’t  they all be given $2,000,000 towards their foundations or favourite charity? They currently get $200,000. 
So the entire payout to players of the 650,000,000 is just under $5,000,000.

Less than 1%!!
Who’s greedy ?? We’re honestly going to label the players greedy? For real?? 

Sorry for the rant 

 

 

I'm going to need a source on the $650M. That's equivalent to the annual broadcasting rights for the entire PGAT. The report I heard was that the PGA of America makes $30M off the event. 

 

Regardless, the players are getting compensated in multiple ways. 20% of the pot goes to the PGAT which contributes to tournament purses and the players pension. The Ryder Cup is the primary revenue driver of the DPWT, w/o which purses would plummet and that tour may not exist. They get $200k for charity, travel expenses and meals are all covered, wives get some insane $10-20k dress allowance. Each player probably has bonuses w/ their sponsors that kick in when they make the Ryder cup. It's likely a huge boost to each players profile which contributes to there PIP score and payout. They are 100% getting something of value for participating. 

 

I have no issue with the players asking for and receiving a full accounting of where the money goes and based on that, re-negotiating the percentages that get allocated to the PGAT and how much players receive in charitable donations. But please don't turn this into another designated event. NBA players, the most spoiled and overpaid athletes on the planet, don't get compensated for the Olympics. The Ryder Cup should be no different. If you're a player that doesn't like that deal, you have every right to decline. There is an endless list of dudes that will happily take your spot. 

 

Lastly, some of these dudes need to understand that they are not Michael Jordan or Tiger Woods. They do not move the needle. Swap Patrick Cantlay or Xander w/ Keegan and Lucas Glover and the attendance and viewership would not change one bit. The vast majority of these players w/ very few exceptions are interchangable parts. The value is not in the players, it's in the legacy of the event. If they were to truly distribute money every year based on contributed value, the Ryder Cup would still be cutting checks to the estates of Arnold Palmer and Seve. Ian freaking Poulter  has done more to elevate the status of the Ryder Cup than Cantlay or Xander. Should he get backpay? Should Sergio? Or Ben Crenshaw? This is not Capital One's The Match trying to sell consumers on Bryson vs Brooks. This event of far bigger than the 24 people that participate every 2 years.   

Edited October 3, 2023 by Dutch1008

[DZClark]

Here's the fix....and hear me out here......2 man scramble.....but instead of best ball, it's worst ball. Nonplayer participate is responsible for picking the worst ball. Sure in 4 ball they can have a go at it. In foresomes you have to worry about playing the other guys ball brand, but imagine the frustration of hitting good shot after good shot and being forced to play from Jordan's drives! Or Scott's putts!

 

Lets make this entertaining for the hacks out there. See a score of 78 or 80 instead of 62! 

[isaacbm]

3 hours ago, Dutch1008 said:

 

I'm going to need a source on the $650M. That's equivalent to the annual broadcasting rights for the entire PGAT. The report I heard was that the PGA of America makes $30M off the event. 

 

Regardless, the players are getting compensated in multiple ways. 20% of the pot goes to the PGAT which contributes to tournament purses and the players pension. The Ryder Cup is the primary revenue driver of the DPWT, w/o which purses would plummet and that tour may not exist. They get $200k for charity, travel expenses and meals are all covered, wives get some insane $10-20k dress allowance. Each player probably has bonuses w/ their sponsors that kick in when they make the Ryder cup. It's likely a huge boost to each players profile which contributes to there PIP score and payout. They are 100% getting something of value for participating. 

 

I have no issue with the players asking for and receiving a full accounting of where the money goes and based on that, re-negotiating the percentages that get allocated to the PGAT and how much players receive in charitable donations. But please don't turn this into another designated event. NBA players, the most spoiled and overpaid athletes on the planet, don't get compensated for the Olympics. The Ryder Cup should be no different. If you're a player that doesn't like that deal, you have every right to decline. There is an endless list of dudes that will happily take your spot. 

 

Lastly, some of these dudes need to understand that they are not Michael Jordan or Tiger Woods. They do not move the needle. Swap Patrick Cantlay or Xander w/ Keegan and Lucas Glover and the attendance and viewership would not change one bit. The vast majority of these players w/ very few exceptions are interchangable parts. The value is not in the players, it's in the legacy of the event. If they were to truly distribute money every year based on contributed value, the Ryder Cup would still be cutting checks to the estates of Arnold Palmer and Seve. Ian freaking Poulter  has done more to elevate the status of the Ryder Cup than Cantlay or Xander. Should he get backpay? Should Sergio? Or Ben Crenshaw? This is not Capital One's The Match trying to sell consumers on Bryson vs Brooks. This event of far bigger than the 24 people that participate every 2 years.   

I stand corrected! 👍

[golfheaven69]

Ryder Cup isn’t broken. Euro’s are just better. 

[MountainKing]

The entire thing IMO needs to be revamped.  Get rid of the Presidents Cup, it's worthless, and figure out how to turn this into a worldwide event that takes place in the middle of the season.  It's really weird to have both events be a USA vs somebody situation, reeks of American arrogance.

[Dave230]

5 hours ago, Dutch1008 said:

I literally posted the cost to join Rory's old club. It's 800 pounds a year. And yes, my friends home track isn't Royal County Down and he has a limited playing window but it's 6,000 yds and the pictures looked comparable or better to the public courses I pay $100 to play. 

 

Further, I would literally kill for your deal. The most affordable club by me is a $25,000 buy in w/ $750 in monthly dues. There were a couple club corp tracks that were $10k/$500 but I believe those prices have jumped post pandemic. Depending on traffic, it'd take me 45 min to an hour to get to those clubs. The clubs closest to me range from $125k to $250k buy in. There are a couple about  30 minutes away that cost around $50-75k buy in. The latter all require monthly dues between $1,000 to $1,500. To be fair, LA/OC might be the worst spots for public golf in America and there are certainly better deals to be had across the country but the point stands. The barriers to entry in the US are far higher than GB&I.  

I've played Holywood. It's really a poor enough course. I've heard dog track mentioned in this thread, wouldn't be far off. On the side of a hill. The club also isn't particularly exclusive.

 

I heard at some point in his teens also that Rory just stopped playing there because it didn't test him and got his game out of shape. The club deserves some credit but it's really benefitted way more than the other way around, considering how long he actually played there. He was a prodigy then and would play a lot of tournaments around Ireland and abroad, then in Northern Ireland he would play Royal Belfast, Royal County Down, Portrush and a few others. I think the reason he joined there was that probably it was a reasonable price for membership and nearby, also I believe that they allowed younger members than nearby courses so he could join when he was 8 years old.

 

Holywood is a richer suburb of Belfast but Rory wasn't a country club boy, far from it, he wasn't poor but he wasn't rich.  The membership price for Holywood is fairly standard for Ireland for full membership I'd say, around average. There are some exclusive places where it's significantly more, some decent courses you may get for less than that.

 

I think his father worked all those jobs moreso to bring him to junior events, rather than membership which I imagine he would have comfortably afforded. It was stuff like going to junior national and international events, going to America, travelling around Ireland and Britain when he was younger.

 

Edited October 3, 2023 by Dave230

[bscinstnct]

If this merger goes through, there will definitely be a 

 

PGA Tour vs LIV “cup”

 

This would impact the RC possibly. Maybe it will be every 3 or 4 years instead of every 2.