Can grips help with vibration damping?

[Stuart_G]

2 hours ago, karstens_ghost said:

I… just… I give up.

 

Apparently not 🙂

 

2 hours ago, karstens_ghost said:

Because if you're correct, all the shaft R&D can pack up, go home, and faff about because it's impossible to get better.

 

You're incorrectly assuming I (and the the shaft designers) think that only the objective influences are important.   That's completely wrong.   It's the subjective influences that are the MOST important.   But those are the influences that are not consistent or predictable across different individuals.  Therefor the effect on the ball flight results because of those influences can not be an objective property of the shaft alone.

 

And it's not about the details of the statistics that is the issue - it's the importance or significance of the results as it applies to real life.  And it's also about the relevance of your hypothetical that doesn't even exist.

 

In effect the Mizuno optimizer is using statistical data to make recommendations.   It means there is a decent chance the shafts it recommends will work for any individual - but it doesn't mean the recommendation will be better or work well for any one particular individual.   If you really want to define a shaft as being a "better" quality shaft just because the Mizuno optimizer recommends it more than another different shaft - or even define a shaft as obsolete because the Optimizer doesn't recommend it very often?     I certainly don't think that's a useful way to define those terms.

 

 

 

2 hours ago, karstens_ghost said:

If you don't agree, just block me, please.

 

I don't block anyone for any reason.    If you don't want to continue the discussion, that's fine.  All you have to do is stop.  That's up to you.

Edited October 26, 2023 by Stuart_G

[03trdblack]

On 10/9/2023 at 10:30 AM, vtpachyderm said:

Background - permanent injury in my left arm/elbow after a mountain bike crash. Played with graphite shafts up until this season (Recoil 110 F4s), and now playing with Project X LZ 6.0. The 120g weight really helped my swing such that this is the best I've played my irons since after the crash. Down to a 8 hcp again after 2 years of swing changes, but noticed a tendency to have golfers/tennis elbow now. Thus can't practice as much as I want to, and definitely no iron play off of mats. 

 

Winter is upon us now and my course is closing in a couple of days and if I want to practice indoors, and not give up my clubs to go back to graphite again, can I compensate with a softer grip that is maybe a bit bigger to lessen the pressure in my grip and consequently arm? Choices and availability off the shelf is limited for those speciality grips i.e anything other than standarard MCC or Tour Velvet, so before I take the plunge wanted to ask on here if this is worth pursuing or should I just focus on trying to find a new set with graphite shafts. The latter I really don't want to since I really do like my iron setup at at the moment (Cobra MIM Tours with afore mentioned LZ shafts).

 

TIA.

 

Since True Temper quit selling the Sensicore inserts, I've been using these with great success. 

 

https://amzn.to/3QfvoJY

 

[nitram]

On 10/10/2023 at 8:53 AM, Doaner84 said:

I've been taking some tylenol and Advil before a round or practice session and it helps a lot.  

ANSAIDS work, for a while. If you have a chronic situation you'll eventually be compelled to find another source of relief, either because of the side effects or you increase the dosage above the recommended levels. Either way, liver and kidney damage can occur with prolonged consumption.

[CDLgolf]

I'd try prosoft inserts and cp2 or Winn dry tac grips. Not as good as graphite but might just help enough.

[Guest RobS]

Grips can make a significant difference in damping vibration.  Rubber is one of the best materials for dealing with vibration.  The lower the durometer, the better it will absorb vibration.  In other words, you want to look for a soft grip (hardness of the material not texture).  Golf Pride CP2 and CPX and Lamkin Sonar and Sonar Wrap are some examples. Going up in size with those grips will further increase the effect.  The downside is that the softer, low durometer grips have a squishy feel that some players may not like.  Graphite shafts are also very effective as the epoxy matrix in the composite is great for reducing vibration.  If you want to play a firmer grip like a MCC or pretty much any cord grip or even a moderately firm grip like a TV or Crossline, graphite is your answer. For maximum comfort, vibration reduction, a mid to heavy graphite shaft with the appropriate size grip like a CP2 will be hard to beat.

[Mike_C]

On 10/9/2023 at 12:38 PM, HeadCovered said:

What I find works to help prevent some of it, is LIFTING WEIGHTS, doing curls, and lifting barbells or free weights, doing push ups

Yup, me too.

 

Went through elbow problems for a few years, started working to fix it and first focused on wrists/forearms, it helped but it wasn't until I started working the upper arm muscles did it really clear up.

[pured_42]

I had a similar issue of developing tennis elbow/elbow pain when I switched into Project X shafts.  I had Dynamic Gold prior to that for years with no issues.  Switched to Nippons and have had zero issues since.  

 

Maybe try a different brand of steel shafts.  Can always find a cheap set to experiment.  

[BudPat]

On 10/27/2023 at 6:42 AM, Mike_C said:

Yup, me too.

 

Went through elbow problems for a few years, started working to fix it and first focused on wrists/forearms, it helped but it wasn't until I started working the upper arm muscles did it really clear up.

Agree with both.  Not only have my wrists and elbows improved since focusing more on lifting weights, so has my lower back & hip pain.  It was almost like I was worried to lift weights due to my nagging injuries, but the lack of doing so may have been causing much of the issue.

 

Problem I have now, lacking good options in my area that have an abundance of graphite iron shafts to try, is that I hit the Modus 120S for the first time last week and that shaft has the feeling I've been looking for the last decade - and it does not appear to have a graphite equivalent. I may try the FC115s or I may just take the chance on the Modus 120S' and hope the nagging has been taken care of by the weights - and not the graphite shafts.

 

 

[Bigarch]

 

I've had good luck with Sensicores combined with the Lamkin Sonar midsize grip.  Good luck OP and I hope you find relief with a grip/combo that works for you.

[ewaldbeukes]

On 10/26/2023 at 2:03 PM, 03trdblack said:

 

Since True Temper quit selling the Sensicore inserts, I've been using these with great success. 

 

https://amzn.to/3QfvoJY

 

Do these add much weight if any to your overall setup? Assume you add them around the fulcrum point so little to no impact on swingweight? Hows the feel with or without? 

[03trdblack]

6 hours ago, ewaldbeukes said:

Do these add much weight if any to your overall setup? Assume you add them around the fulcrum point so little to no impact on swingweight? Hows the feel with or without? 

 

I cut them in half so they make more sets of irons so the weight is only a gram or two.  I install them about 15" down the shaft which ends up being right in the middle.  You won't be able to feel or tell any difference, even if you use them full length.

[Bigarch]

I'm assuming these are like the Sensicores... 14 inches long and you insert them 7 inches deep.  So you end up with equal amounts on either side of the 14 inch fulcrum that Swingweight is measured off of.  Therefore, no effect at all.

[vtpachyderm]

OP here 🙂

 

The new clubs with graphite shafts and oversize grips have pretty much solved the issue of pain in my arm/elbow so it just confirms what most have said here about taking the plunge and playing graphite, and not try to worry about adapting steel shafts for my situation. Also, where I live, customizing golf clubs is pretty much impossible due to lack of suppliers and good club builders that I would trust, so safest for me is shaft and grip changes.

 

Also, hitting the gym and just improving my strength overall (not just in my shoulders and arms), has helped tremendously as I feel a bit more stable when swinging and don't have to rely too much on my arms to fix wayward club motions. I know it sounds strange and early days yet, but I seem to feel I'm swinging the club a bit more easily and not losing distance. Guess it helps being in shape 😉

 

Appreciate all the feedback and suggestions. I'm still sorting out my swing with the new clubs but the preliminary trends are positive i.e. almost back to where I was with the old clubs.

[ShortGolfer]

It may help to do more frequent practice sessions and fewer repetitions per session.  Perhaps do more exercise to warm up for a session?

 

Good to hear that you solved your pain problem!

[vtpachyderm]

1 hour ago, ShortGolfer said:

It may help to do more frequent practice sessions and fewer repetitions per session.  Perhaps do more exercise to warm up for a session?

 

Good to hear that you solved your pain problem!

As I have a permanent injury in the elbow and arm, this is my regular session. I can't do many reps on a mat anyway due to the impact forces (regardless of the club I use). It was just that when I had the steel shafts, the pain was pretty bad after any session on a mat.

 

And thanks - I'm also glad I can practice indoors in the winter now 🙂

[vtpachyderm]

Further update : Played quite a few indoor rounds now and the grips + shaft switch does as advertised - no pain in my elbow anymore after I play.

 

I'm now a big fan of larger and softer grips that I have installed CP2 Pro Midsize on the top end of the bag - driver, 3 wood, hybrid and 4 iron. 5-PW are the Sensor+ oversize and am hitting them really well now.

 

Exception - wedges are still standard tourvelvet which I seem to prefer when I'm hitting partial shots, or chips or opening the face etc i.e. trying to manipulate the club more than just a straight up full shot.

[vandyfan]

I am looking to move from a Lamkin Z5 and Tour Velvet mix to all Lamkin Sonar Plus (both are standard size), do you think there will be a noticeable "softer" feel to the Sonar vs. those previously mentioned grips?

[vtpachyderm]

13 hours ago, vandyfan said:

I am looking to move from a Lamkin Z5 and Tour Velvet mix to all Lamkin Sonar Plus (both are standard size), do you think there will be a noticeable "softer" feel to the Sonar vs. those previously mentioned grips?

The oversize version of the Sonar+ was very soft compared to a Tourvelvet. It was also noticeably softer than both the CP2 Pro and CP2 Wrap in midsize.

 

As an update : Switched out the oversize grips to midsize ones once the outdoor season started. Found it really hard to rotate my wrists to turn the face - was missing straight left all the time. Much better with midsize. The shafts are really good at softening the blow, that I'm now experimenting with 'normal' grips - currently have Star grips in midsize on my irons. Have CP2 Pro's and Wraps on all my other clubs, and they are noticeably softer, but in terms of arm and elbow pain, doesn't make too much of a difference between them and the Star grips.

 

In conclusion - as many have already alluded to - changing the shaft was the best way for me to reduce the vibrations. Am a very happy golfer now and can play 18 with no problems.

[Trouble_shooter]

Winn dri tac grips

[ewood39]

On 10/9/2023 at 9:30 AM, vtpachyderm said:

Background - permanent injury in my left arm/elbow after a mountain bike crash. Played with graphite shafts up until this season (Recoil 110 F4s), and now playing with Project X LZ 6.0. The 120g weight really helped my swing such that this is the best I've played my irons since after the crash. Down to a 8 hcp again after 2 years of swing changes, but noticed a tendency to have golfers/tennis elbow now. Thus can't practice as much as I want to, and definitely no iron play off of mats. 

 

Winter is upon us now and my course is closing in a couple of days and if I want to practice indoors, and not give up my clubs to go back to graphite again, can I compensate with a softer grip that is maybe a bit bigger to lessen the pressure in my grip and consequently arm? Choices and availability off the shelf is limited for those speciality grips i.e anything other than standarard MCC or Tour Velvet, so before I take the plunge wanted to ask on here if this is worth pursuing or should I just focus on trying to find a new set with graphite shafts. The latter I really don't want to since I really do like my iron setup at at the moment (Cobra MIM Tours with afore mentioned LZ shafts).

 

TIA.

im playing the LZ 120’s in some T150’s. The heavier weight has helped my swing too. I switched to midsize mcc in them and it has helped with the tennis elbow. Also not hitting on mats will be huge. I noticed the soreness every single time in my elbow and shoulders anytime I hit off a mat. Now I completely dodge a mat and issues have subsided 

[ArnoldD.Bali]

Hi my name is Arnold D. Bali, the creator of Golf Dampening System (GDS).  It's a two piece device that wraps around your club shaft that will help alleviate body aches (such as tennis elbow) and muscle fatigue.

 

You may not see it, but you'll eventually feel it...these unwanted vibrations from hitting the golf ball.  Even with graphite shaft, the vibrations are still there.

 

How I came up with GDS, years  ago, I bought a set of brand new drivers and irons from one of our leading club manufacturer.  I headed to the driving range and started wacking away.  Suddenly, I started experiencing this sharp pain in my forearm.  It reminded me of playing tennis with a Ceramic Racquet.  I was experiencing tennis elbow.  
 

From years of playing tennis, I've used theses dampening devices to help prevent body aches and muscle fatigue.  The contact from golf, by using a steel shaft (and even graphite shaft in my case) hitting a hard plastic coated golf ball is more severe than hitting tennis ball with a tennis racquet. The vibration is exponential!  I actually place some rubber bands around my golf shaft, and the pain went away. It helped me, I figured it could also help others...GDS was born!

 

I'm still in the infancy stage right now.  In the next week or two I should be receiving my prototype.  Stay tuned, I'm hoping to have it shelf ready sometime this year.  Aloha!

[karstens_ghost]

On 1/8/2025 at 2:24 AM, ArnoldD.Bali said:

Hi my name is Arnold D. Bali, the creator of Golf Dampening System (GDS).  It's a two piece device that wraps around your club shaft that will help alleviate body aches (such as tennis elbow) and muscle fatigue.

 

You may not see it, but you'll eventually feel it...these unwanted vibrations from hitting the golf ball.  Even with graphite shaft, the vibrations are still there.

 

How I came up with GDS, years  ago, I bought a set of brand new drivers and irons from one of our leading club manufacturer.  I headed to the driving range and started wacking away.  Suddenly, I started experiencing this sharp pain in my forearm.  It reminded me of playing tennis with a Ceramic Racquet.  I was experiencing tennis elbow.  
 

From years of playing tennis, I've used theses dampening devices to help prevent body aches and muscle fatigue.  The contact from golf, by using a steel shaft (and even graphite shaft in my case) hitting a hard plastic coated golf ball is more severe than hitting tennis ball with a tennis racquet. The vibration is exponential!  I actually place some rubber bands around my golf shaft, and the pain went away. It helped me, I figured it could also help others...GDS was born!

 

I'm still in the infancy stage right now.  In the next week or two I should be receiving my prototype.  Stay tuned, I'm hoping to have it shelf ready sometime this year.  Aloha!

 

Tell us more about the rubber bands.