Dispute

[gripANDrip1983]

1 hour ago, golffeen007 said:

Unless the sellers email has changed from what PayPal has on file , they should have gotten multiple emails about what was going on. PayPal will not just take your money without letting know it’s about to happen unless you right the situation. 
 

BUT , if the buyer portrayed it as garbage now with the damage they provided and the PayPal rep doesn’t have the cognizance to understand it could easily be fixed , they may not require them to send it back and the buyer would be left with air. Seems like what the buyer is banking on.

He did say “look, im a good guy”. RED FLAG if you have to try and thwart your reputation to pull off a scam. 

Unfortunately my PayPal email is an old email that I only use for PayPal and I never changed it. That’s why I wasn’t getting the emails. But my thing is, they actually texted me today to let me know I owe them money but couldn’t text me once they couldn’t get ahold of me about the dispute. 

[Valtiel]

38 minutes ago, gripANDrip1983 said:

I’m gonna dig deeper and call tomorrow. All I could get today was robots.

[golffeen007]

9 minutes ago, gripANDrip1983 said:

Unfortunately my PayPal email is an old email that I only use for PayPal and I never changed it. That’s why I wasn’t getting the emails. But my thing is, they actually texted me today to let me know I owe them money but couldn’t text me once they couldn’t get ahold of me about the dispute. 

Then, is it fair to say that the same email alerts you get from PayPal that you have funds is the same email that you would get alerts that there’s a case against you from a buyer? If so , why choose to ignore the buyers request for a refund via PayPal?  You guys had been messaging and it wasn’t just going to go away, scam or no scam on the buyers end.. 
 

When PayPal deducts funds from a past sold transaction ,  it also shows up in your balance as on hold to where you can’t use PayPal until that negative balance is settled and your account would be locked. This is like a 15 day process that was ignored.  
 

I agree that you should get the putter back now there’s been a refund.  I’m also not certain the buyer didn’t somehow damage it further than how they received it , but you aren’t totally innocent in your handlings in the situation in ignoring alerts and not refunding or coming to some kind of agreement before it got to this point. 
 

Hope the buyers conscious changes his mind if he still has it. 
 

 

[gripANDrip1983]

13 minutes ago, golffeen007 said:

Then, is it fair to say that the same email alerts you get from PayPal that you have funds is the same email that you would get alerts that there’s a case against you from a buyer? If so , why choose to ignore the buyers request for a refund via PayPal?  You guys had been messaging and it wasn’t just going to go away, scam or no scam on the buyers end.. 
 

When PayPal deducts funds from a past sold transaction ,  it also shows up in your balance as on hold to where you can’t use PayPal until that negative balance is settled and your account would be locked. This is like a 15 day process that was ignored.  
 

I agree that you should get the putter back now there’s been a refund.  I’m also not certain the buyer didn’t somehow damage it further than how they received it , but you aren’t totally innocent in your handlings in the situation in ignoring alerts and not refunding or coming to some kind of agreement before it got to this point. 
 

Hope the buyers conscious changes his mind if he still has it. 
 

 

Looking back I wish I would’ve handled it different but it’s always easy to assume what if in these situations.Ive never gotten any alerts that I have funds, I just always know to look because i would’ve just made a sell on BST. I haven’t sold anything on BST  in awhile to even go on PayPal to see the messages or alerts or a dispute. I didn’t get any emails from PayPal because I only set that email up for PayPal and don’t get any alerts on that email. That’s a mistake I’m gonna address. But the dent in the insert in the picture he posted on page one doesn’t make any sense. The dent is way smaller than a golf ball and I don’t think even swinging the putter like a driver would put that indentation in the insert. It’s only two score lines that are dented. I used that putter everyday for two years and I always take care of my equipment. After a long talk with my wife, she’s convinced me to put the situation to bed and be done with it. I’ll send PayPal $10 a month to keep it off my credit score🤣

Edited June 12, 2024 by gripANDrip1983

[T_Golf_23]

3 minutes ago, gripANDrip1983 said:

Looking back I wish I would’ve handled it different but it’s always easy to assume what if in these situations.Ive never gotten any alerts that I have funds, I just always know to look because I just made a sell on BST. I didn’t get any emails from PayPal because I only set that email up for PayPal and don’t get any alerts on that email. That’s a mistake I’m gonna address. But the dent in the insert in the picture he posted on page one doesn’t make any sense. The dent is way smaller than a golf ball and I don’t think even swinging the putter like a driver would put that indentation in the insert. It’s only two score lines that are dented. I used that putter everyday for two years and I always take care of my equipment. After a long talk with my wife, she’s convinced me to put the situation to bed and be done with it. I’ll send PayPal $10 a month to keep it off my credit score🤣

I am with you in regard to the nature of the dent…, I am convinced it’s photoshopped….  And you are not getting the putter back bc there is no actual dent. 

Edited June 12, 2024 by T_Golf_23

[gripANDrip1983]

2 minutes ago, T_Golf_23 said:

I am with you in regard to the nature of the dent…, I am convinced it’s photoshopped….  And you are not getting the putter back bc there is no actual dent. 

Yeah he got me on and never had any intentions on returning the putter. I think he was hoping I would just easily refund the money and he’d either keep the putter or sell it. He prolly sold it to his buddy that chimed in earlier that was throwing insults at me. I’m at the very least glad I was able to get his name out there for everyone to see even if it may be at my own expense because there are a few guys on here that seem to think I was somehow the shady one in this transaction. 🤷🏻

[gripANDrip1983]

Here’s some better pics from the actual post on the “dented in face” rocklinsam is claiming

[jarederco]

@rocklinsam you are making yourself seem like a scammer by refusing to respond to this thread with numerous requests to return the putter, despite receiving your full refund. It is perfectly fine to dispute the condition of the putter you received and I have no opinion on who’s right or wrong, but what’s your excuse?

[jdcho]

2 hours ago, gripANDrip1983 said:

This isn’t Amazon. Sellers have no obligation to return the product on BST. In a lot of cases I’ve seen  on BST, if a buyer doesn’t like what he bought, most guys will just repost the putter and move it on to the next wrxer. That’s what I thought I was dealing with. I figured he was just trying to take the easy road out and trying to return it. If I sell a putter, it’s because I’ve already had my eyes on something else in typical wrx style.The putter wasn’t damaged when I sent it out.  Hindsight is 20/20. Of course there could’ve been some things done different. The bottom line is, he got his money, now send me my “defective putter” back and let me decide what to do with it. I’m not trying to be snappy with you because I do appreciate your feedback.

This isn’t Amazon and you are not obligated to take anything back but when a buyer claims that a product is damaged, you should be open to taking it back.  What if the putter was damaged in transit?  Is it the responsibility of the buyer?  I think BST works because we trust other members will do the right thing.  In no other forum will I send some stranger 3000 miles away $1000 for a set of irons.  I expect the item to be as described and if there’s damage that occurred during transit, I would expect the seller to help remedy the situation rather than question the timing of receipt, intent of purchase or any other inappropriate things you mentioned.  It’s not the responsibility of the buyer to resell and make money back if he received an item that was not as described.  Based on the screenshots of the correspondences, you ignored or minimized the buyer’s concerns.  
 

Personally, I would be pretty upset reading your responses and your lack of willingness to entertain that you either didn’t describe the item correctly or the damage occurred during transit. 
 

I bought an axis 1 putter here several months ago from a member here and noticed that it did not go toe up naturally as it should.  I contacted the seller and he responded immediately.  We discussed all options and thought about sending it to Axis for a repair but ultimately the putter was sent back to the seller.  He refunded me my initial purchase price and shipping cost.  No issues whatsoever and he never questioned my intent.  He even went down to the local PGASS and found an axis putter that matched my specs and offered to buy it and ship it to me.  It could have been a bad experience but we worked it out without any drama.  If anything, he made be feel good about the BST forum and I’ve continued to buy from other sellers without any issues.  
 

While I don’t condone the buyer not sending your putter back (he can’t get a refund and keep your putter), IMO, you aren’t without some fault here.  You make it sound like someone conned you and maybe he had that intent, but if I were the buyer, I would have been ticked off by your responses (questioning his story when he received it, who received it, when he took the putter out, then telling him to sell it for a profit since it’s worth more, then telling him that you don’t have the funds).  Your  responses are not what I would expect from a seller that frequents BST.  
 

Again, we all lose as a community when we can’t resolve these issues in good faith.  
 

[jdcho]

2 hours ago, gripANDrip1983 said:

This isn’t Amazon. Sellers have no obligation to return the product on BST. In a lot of cases I’ve seen  on BST, if a buyer doesn’t like what he bought, most guys will just repost the putter and move it on to the next wrxer. That’s what I thought I was dealing with. I figured he was just trying to take the easy road out and trying to return it. If I sell a putter, it’s because I’ve already had my eyes on something else in typical wrx style.The putter wasn’t damaged when I sent it out.  Hindsight is 20/20. Of course there could’ve been some things done different. The bottom line is, he got his money, now send me my “defective putter” back and let me decide what to do with it. I’m not trying to be snappy with you because I do appreciate your feedback.

This isn’t Amazon and you are not obligated to take anything back but when a buyer claims that a product is damaged, you should be open to taking it back.  What if the putter was damaged in transit?  Is it the responsibility of the buyer?  I think BST works because we trust other members will do the right thing.  In no other forum will I send some stranger 3000 miles away $1000 for a set of irons.  I expect the item to be as described and if there’s damage that occurred during transit, I would expect the seller to help remedy the situation rather than question the timing of receipt, intent of purchase or any other inappropriate things you mentioned.  It’s not the responsibility of the buyer to resell and make money back if he received an item that was not as described.  Based on the screenshots of the correspondences, you ignored or minimized the buyer’s concerns.  
 

Personally, I would be pretty upset reading your responses and your lack of willingness to entertain that you either didn’t describe the item correctly or the damage occurred during transit. 
 

I bought an axis 1 putter here several months ago from a member here and noticed that it did not go toe up naturally as it should.  I contacted the seller and he responded immediately.  We discussed all options and thought about sending it to Axis for a repair but ultimately the putter was sent back to the seller.  He refunded me my initial purchase price and shipping cost.  No issues whatsoever and he never questioned my intent.  He even went down to the local PGASS and found an axis putter that matched my specs and offered to buy it and ship it to me.  It could have been a bad experience but we worked it out without any drama.  If anything, he made be feel good about the BST forum and I’ve continued to buy from other sellers without any issues.  
 

While I don’t condone the buyer not sending your putter back (he can’t get a refund and keep your putter), IMO, you aren’t without some fault here.  You make it sound like someone conned you and maybe he had that intent, but if I were the buyer, I would have been ticked off by your responses (questioning his story when he received it, who received it, when he took the putter out, then telling him to sell it for a profit since it’s worth more, then telling him that you don’t have the funds).  Your  responses are not what I would expect from a seller that frequents BST.  
 

Again, we all lose as a community when we can’t resolve these issues in good faith.  
 

Edited June 12, 2024 by jdcho

[jlevitt9]

Buyer needs to be banned from this site. Dude straight up stole a putter and $. Unsure what's not clear here. 

[Greenie]

4 hours ago, gripANDrip1983 said:

Yeah he got me on and never had any intentions on returning the putter. I think he was hoping I would just easily refund the money and he’d either keep the putter or sell it. He prolly sold it to his buddy that chimed in earlier that was throwing insults at me. I’m at the very least glad I was able to get his name out there for everyone to see even if it may be at my own expense because there are a few guys on here that seem to think I was somehow the shady one in this transaction. 🤷🏻

 

If you would have responded to PP about the dispute there is no way he would have been refunded without returning the putter. Because you failed to respond the case was ruled in his favor and at that point he was refunded. The return of the putter would have been worked out if you would have responded to the case. I have never know PP to refund someone without the item being returned to the seller unless the seller doesn't respond to the case. PP doesn't say here is your money and you can keep the item too.

 

This case is about an item not as described. The buyer has every right to ask for a refund. I don't know if the dent was there when sold. I don't know if the dent happened in shipping. I don't know if the buyer dented it. I don't know if the dent is photo shopped.  I do know in these type of situations the buyer is going to win 99% of the time disputing it through PP. It's best that you refund and move on. 

 

 I feel you handled the situation poorly and because of it right now you are out your money and the putter. 

 

Keep on PP. It's not right that the buyer keeps the putter too.

 

 

 

[rukahs]

I've not read every single post here, but my initial thought since you aren't getting it back is you have the buyers address that you sent the putter to. Using Google you can find lots of information about an individual, work place, family etc. You see where I am going, I have had luck in the past with this sort of ideology. If the address is even within 100 miles of you, get in your car. 

[gripANDrip1983]

5 hours ago, jdcho said:

This isn’t Amazon and you are not obligated to take anything back but when a buyer claims that a product is damaged, you should be open to taking it back.  What if the putter was damaged in transit?  Is it the responsibility of the buyer?  I think BST works because we trust other members will do the right thing.  In no other forum will I send some stranger 3000 miles away $1000 for a set of irons.  I expect the item to be as described and if there’s damage that occurred during transit, I would expect the seller to help remedy the situation rather than question the timing of receipt, intent of purchase or any other inappropriate things you mentioned.  It’s not the responsibility of the buyer to resell and make money back if he received an item that was not as described.  Based on the screenshots of the correspondences, you ignored or minimized the buyer’s concerns.  
 

Personally, I would be pretty upset reading your responses and your lack of willingness to entertain that you either didn’t describe the item correctly or the damage occurred during transit. 
 

I bought an axis 1 putter here several months ago from a member here and noticed that it did not go toe up naturally as it should.  I contacted the seller and he responded immediately.  We discussed all options and thought about sending it to Axis for a repair but ultimately the putter was sent back to the seller.  He refunded me my initial purchase price and shipping cost.  No issues whatsoever and he never questioned my intent.  He even went down to the local PGASS and found an axis putter that matched my specs and offered to buy it and ship it to me.  It could have been a bad experience but we worked it out without any drama.  If anything, he made be feel good about the BST forum and I’ve continued to buy from other sellers without any issues.  
 

While I don’t condone the buyer not sending your putter back (he can’t get a refund and keep your putter), IMO, you aren’t without some fault here.  You make it sound like someone conned you and maybe he had that intent, but if I were the buyer, I would have been ticked off by your responses (questioning his story when he received it, who received it, when he took the putter out, then telling him to sell it for a profit since it’s worth more, then telling him that you don’t have the funds).  Your  responses are not what I would expect from a seller that frequents BST.  
 

Again, we all lose as a community when we can’t resolve these issues in good faith.  
 

I agree we all lose here in a sense and if I legitimately thought the putter was damaged, I would’ve found a way to get this resolved with him. The problem is if you’d read through all the messages me and him sent were that the picture he sent me wouldn’t load and he had my number and didn’t send the picture through text. Everything about this kid was somewhat sketchy and sometimes, you just gotta go with your gut on things. Turns out I was right all along sadly. 

[gripANDrip1983]

1 hour ago, rukahs said:

I've not read every single post here, but my initial thought since you aren't getting it back is you have the buyers address that you sent the putter to. Using Google you can find lots of information about an individual, work place, family etc. You see where I am going, I have had luck in the past with this sort of ideology. If the address is even within 100 miles of you, get in your car. 

I’ve thought about this scenario but the problem is I live in Louisville Kentucky and he lives in California. So I’m not sure the drive would justify the loss.

[gripANDrip1983]

1 hour ago, Greenie said:

 

If you would have responded to PP about the dispute there is no way he would have been refunded without returning the putter. Because you failed to respond the case was ruled in his favor and at that point he was refunded. The return of the putter would have been worked out if you would have responded to the case. I have never know PP to refund someone without the item being returned to the seller unless the seller doesn't respond to the case. PP doesn't say here is your money and you can keep the item too.

 

This case is about an item not as described. The buyer has every right to ask for a refund. I don't know if the dent was there when sold. I don't know if the dent happened in shipping. I don't know if the buyer dented it. I don't know if the dent is photo shopped.  I do know in these type of situations the buyer is going to win 99% of the time disputing it through PP. It's best that you refund and move on. 

 

 I feel you handled the situation poorly and because of it right now you are out your money and the putter. 

 

Keep on PP. It's not right that the buyer keeps the putter too.

 

 

 

In hindsight I should’ve handled it differently but as they say, hindsight is 20/20. I’ll learn from this. Thanks for the input!!

[circa3182]

3 minutes ago, gripANDrip1983 said:

I’ve thought about this scenario but the problem is I live in Louisville Kentucky and he lives in California. So I’m not sure the drive would justify the loss.

I think he’s suggesting letting his mom/boss/wife/grandma/club pro know what he’s been up to. 

[gripANDrip1983]

6 minutes ago, circa3182 said:

I think he’s suggesting letting his mom/boss/wife/grandma/club pro know what he’s been up to. 

I’m about to turn that assignment over to my wife. She has more time during the day to dig in and come up with a plan. The truth is, I need to just learn from it and move on. I got scammed and I’ll make sure it doesn’t happen again.

Edited June 12, 2024 by gripANDrip1983

[GwrxMod]

Locked at the request of the OP.

[gripANDrip1983]

I asked the mod to reopen the feed so I can fill everyone in on this matter. The buyer has gone completely silent and PayPal informed me that they’re protecting the buyer at all costs. Looking back there is definitely some things I could’ve did different and because of the feedback I’ve gotten from the community ill be more transparent about any ads and make sure to include things like, “feel free to ask any questions” or “I’d be glad to take more pictures”. This isn’t the end of this story though. Because of a member that has asked to remain anonymous, he rallied up some other members to help make me whole. I can’t find the words to express how much I appreciate every member involved, including the members that put in feedback on the matter. At the end of the day, this hurts the community as a whole and this gesture demonstrates how strong the WRX community is. I’ll most definitely be paying this forward and want to let the members that donated know that if you ever need anything, don’t hesitate to message me. 🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻

[TyNiles]

On 6/12/2024 at 6:06 AM, rukahs said:

I've not read every single post here, but my initial thought since you aren't getting it back is you have the buyers address that you sent the putter to. Using Google you can find lots of information about an individual, work place, family etc. You see where I am going, I have had luck in the past with this sort of ideology. If the address is even within 100 miles of you, get in your car. 

This is horrible advice and I shouldn’t have to explain why. 

[noodle3872]

Reading through this thread reminds me why I have been using OEM’s trade in bonus offers more and more for my used gear. 
 

 

[Bad9]

I’d be embarrassed to take anything from other people in a cast like this.

[golffeen007]

6 hours ago, Bad9 said:

I’d be embarrassed to take anything from other people in a cast like this.

I’d probably be embarrassed to make a statement like that after I reread it. 
 

OP got swindled by a scum freeloader that PayPal protected. Everyone here including OP agreed he should have handled differently, but the fact of the matter is he’s out the putter and the funds. In what world do you think that’s alright? 

[Valtiel]

7 hours ago, Bad9 said:

I’d be embarrassed to take anything from other people in a cast like this.

I think we can all likely agree that two things are true here:

 

1) The seller mishandled a couple key things that made the situation more complicated/worse.

2) The buyer absconding with both money *and* product is not a deserved outcome for said mishandlings. 
 

Maybe you disagree, and that’s your prerogative, however I think we can all agree that the buyer and his “friend” are the ones that should be embarrassed here.

 

[JungleJimbo]

On 6/12/2024 at 6:06 PM, rukahs said:

I've not read every single post here, but my initial thought since you aren't getting it back is you have the buyers address that you sent the putter to. Using Google you can find lots of information about an individual, work place, family etc. You see where I am going, I have had luck in the past with this sort of ideology. If the address is even within 100 miles of you, get in your car. 

 

@rukahs i would say "Don't google "@rocklinsam" " ... but you probably have already done so, with a set of special skills a'la Liam Neeson's character in 'Taken')

(using those skills for good... what can you tell me about 'Arne Slot' the new LiverpoolFC manager, in your part of the world ... given that Arne Slot's 1st June start-date at LFC has come & gone, without a proper unveiling? ... or have i mis-remembered, and you're part of the Blue-Nose side of Merseyside?) 

 

[rukahs]

2 minutes ago, JungleJimbo said:

 

@rukahs i would say "Don't google "@rocklinsam" " ... but you probably have already done so, with a set of special skills a'la Liam Neeson's character in 'Taken')

(using those skills for good... what can you tell me about 'Arne Slot' the new LiverpoolFC manager, in your part of the world ... given that Arne Slot's 1st June start-date at LFC has come & gone, without a proper unveiling? ... or have i mis-remembered, and you're part of the Blue-Nose side of Merseyside?) 

 

 

 

Haha, how dare you say my name in the same sentence as Everton 😄

 

Yes, surprising not much has been said of Slot so far.... fingers crossed.... would have been good to see/hear from him in the lead up.

[Bad9]

5 hours ago, Valtiel said:

I think we can all likely agree that two things are true here:

 

1) The seller mishandled a couple key things that made the situation more complicated/worse.

2) The buyer absconding with both money *and* product is not a deserved outcome for said mishandlings. 
 

Maybe you disagree, and that’s your prerogative, however I think we can all agree that the buyer and his “friend” are the ones that should be embarrassed here.

 

I agree with everything you and the others say and made that clear earlier in the thread it's just that I wouldn't take money from other people, as nice as a gesture it is. I especially agree with the part I bolded and they should both be banned if they haven't already.

[gripANDrip1983]

2 hours ago, Bad9 said:

I agree with everything you and the others say and made that clear earlier in the thread it's just that I wouldn't take money from other people, as nice as a gesture it is. I especially agree with the part I bolded and they should both be banned if they haven't already.

We must have a different understanding of what the word “take” means. Considering I didn’t take a red cent from anyone. I didn’t ask for any of this. There happens to be good people on this forum that decided to help me out. I don’t particularly like the idea of accepting things like this but I’ve learned that when people want to help, accept their help. It’s not that complicated. 

Edited June 17, 2024 by gripANDrip1983

[Valtiel]

2 hours ago, Bad9 said:

I agree with everything you and the others say and made that clear earlier in the thread it's just that I wouldn't take money from other people, as nice as a gesture it is. I especially agree with the part I bolded and they should both be banned if they haven't already.

Ah gotcha, it read like you were saying "he should feel embarrassed for accepting it" which I assume is what the reactions thought as well, which makes sense because that would be kind of a lousy thing to add. If it's just how you would feel personally then understood.