2023 T100 are they still the right clubs for me?

[henry14]

Some general questions about the setup I was fit into which was T100 irons, X100 shafts, standard everything.  At the time I was a 12hdcp, distance was not an issue, spin was good apex was higher, IIRC ~110-115.

 

Fast forward, several months and my hands were aching like crazy, unsure if it was the weight of the shafts, the amount I was playing or just the mishits amplified. 

 

Prior to this I was in game improvement irons with Nippon Modus 3 Tour 115 stiff -- swing speed and ball striking have drastically improved, and at the time had similar results with the 115 and 120, but opted for the 115.  I went ahead and threw a set of Modus 3 Tour 120x into the T100 and launch/apex/spin are out of control, dispersion is what you'd expect from a 36 handicap, for some reason I am chunking bad behind the ball taking a divot ball, yet somehow my hand ache went away. I've probably hit 500 range balls, and played 6 rounds of golf. Do I give it more time? I have only had them in 2 weeks.

 

Finally one thing I noticed is the spin/apex/launch are all extremely high, but not so much with range balls, I play Pro V1 but didn't think the ball could have that drastic of an effect. With the Pro V1, some iron shots will take off fast reach a high apex with excessive spin then just drop straight costing me distance.

 

Perhaps the X100 with Z Cord were too much -- I also went back to Tour Velvet so it's hard for me to say for sure. 

 

From here, do I just throw the X100 back in, go see about alternative shafts any recommendations to consider? Now that my hands feel fine I am itching to have them back, this time with Tour Velvet and not Z Cord.

 

As an aside I am not very technical at all and unsure the magnitude each component will have on the spin, launch, apex data -- should I expect that I can find a ball and shaft combo with these heads to make them work for me? I really liked the set up for a while and even with my handicap trending higher these days, I hate the thought of GI irons mainly because of the turf interaction that makes me cringe, plus having to deal with flyers.  I am not chasing distance, I am chasing good distance dispersion.

 

 

[MiloMalt]

Are you practicing on mats and how often? I hit about 500 balls a week on mats and had to switch to graphite shafts as I was getting soreness in my wrist and shoulder. Before switching I had to cut back to about 100 balls a week off mats and now that I have switched I feel I could hit as many balls as I want each week.

[tippethor]

Z grips will kill my hands, i love the tour velvets. 
 

[Pnwpingi210]

19 hours ago, henry14 said:

Some general questions about the setup I was fit into which was T100 irons, X100 shafts, standard everything.  At the time I was a 12hdcp, distance was not an issue, spin was good apex was higher, IIRC ~110-115.

 

Fast forward, several months and my hands were aching like crazy, unsure if it was the weight of the shafts, the amount I was playing or just the mishits amplified. 

 

Prior to this I was in game improvement irons with Nippon Modus 3 Tour 115 stiff -- swing speed and ball striking have drastically improved, and at the time had similar results with the 115 and 120, but opted for the 115.  I went ahead and threw a set of Modus 3 Tour 120x into the T100 and launch/apex/spin are out of control, dispersion is what you'd expect from a 36 handicap, for some reason I am chunking bad behind the ball taking a divot ball, yet somehow my hand ache went away. I've probably hit 500 range balls, and played 6 rounds of golf. Do I give it more time? I have only had them in 2 weeks.

 

Finally one thing I noticed is the spin/apex/launch are all extremely high, but not so much with range balls, I play Pro V1 but didn't think the ball could have that drastic of an effect. With the Pro V1, some iron shots will take off fast reach a high apex with excessive spin then just drop straight costing me distance.

 

Perhaps the X100 with Z Cord were too much -- I also went back to Tour Velvet so it's hard for me to say for sure. 

 

From here, do I just throw the X100 back in, go see about alternative shafts any recommendations to consider? Now that my hands feel fine I am itching to have them back, this time with Tour Velvet and not Z Cord.

 

As an aside I am not very technical at all and unsure the magnitude each component will have on the spin, launch, apex data -- should I expect that I can find a ball and shaft combo with these heads to make them work for me? I really liked the set up for a while and even with my handicap trending higher these days, I hate the thought of GI irons mainly because of the turf interaction that makes me cringe, plus having to deal with flyers.  I am not chasing distance, I am chasing good distance dispersion.

 

 

These is going to be tough to pin down since so many variables changed.

 

with what we know from you post, it’s sounds like the heads are ok, atleast from a pain standpoint since you are playing those currently with no pain.  
 

x100 is a great shaft, but is 130 grams and almost as heavy as anything else out there.   You moved to the modus 120 which is 10 grams lighter, but a much softer midsection and that can help reduce vibrations.  
 

moving to your velvet, which is a softer grip than the z grip( just about the firmest) is likely helping too.  
 

sounds like you pain free with the new setup, so the shaft and grip change had a positive impact on pain.  Dispersion seems to have suffered so you might look into something lighter than x100, and a little different profile.    If you liked the modus 115, you will likely like the modus 105, 115, and 125 as they are all similar.  The modus 120 and 130 are very unique and fit a much smaller segment of golfers.

[henry14]

On 8/25/2024 at 12:14 AM, MiloMalt said:

Are you practicing on mats and how often? I hit about 500 balls a week on mats and had to switch to graphite shafts as I was getting soreness in my wrist and shoulder. Before switching I had to cut back to about 100 balls a week off mats and now that I have switched I feel I could hit as many balls as I want each week.

I am avoiding mats at all costs.  For some reason they feel horrible.  I hit better off of grass anyway.  Given my avoidance I don't think mats were a contributing factor.

[henry14]

18 hours ago, Pnwpingi210 said:

These is going to be tough to pin down since so many variables changed.

 

with what we know from you post, it’s sounds like the heads are ok, atleast from a pain standpoint since you are playing those currently with no pain.  
 

x100 is a great shaft, but is 130 grams and almost as heavy as anything else out there.   You moved to the modus 120 which is 10 grams lighter, but a much softer midsection and that can help reduce vibrations.  
 

moving to your velvet, which is a softer grip than the z grip( just about the firmest) is likely helping too.  
 

sounds like you pain free with the new setup, so the shaft and grip change had a positive impact on pain.  Dispersion seems to have suffered so you might look into something lighter than x100, and a little different profile.    If you liked the modus 115, you will likely like the modus 105, 115, and 125 as they are all similar.  The modus 120 and 130 are very unique and fit a much smaller segment of golfers.

 

Yes, pain free with the setup, but couldn't get along with the Modus.  Is there a chance the forged T100 heads are the culprit? I really like them and don't want to switch out of them. If I'm understanding correctly the Modus 115 is much different than the 120? I worry it may be too light, but I would consider it.

 

Obviously flushed shots cause no pain, but I have a handful of poor strikes per round and I wonder if those may have caused the pain, or perhaps it was a day where I was "off" and had one too many poor strikes?

[Mikey_HACKilroy]

What swing weight are you playing?

While not the end all be all part of the equation, if it is up there that can certainly explain hand pain; and that goes for all clubs in your bag save the putter. If any of them are higher on the scale that can show up as hand/joint pain.

Grips obviously contribute based on how firm the are, and folks have covered that.

There are ways to "tame" a heavy shaft, but if you're not playing an elevated swing weight, and you're not experiencing any serious issues there's no reason to delve into those. Rather, switching to a grip that is a touch softer whilst still maintaining the feedback you like may be a good option as suggested previously..

Impact stress itself, though, isn't what ever made my hands hurt, and heavy shafts were more apt to cause pain in the wrist and also trailing up the forearm into the left elbow. Though, the causes may also be unique to your process. Heavy swing weights were what eventually caused me pain as well as caused my process to drastically falter.

[gvogel]

On 8/24/2024 at 6:51 PM, henry14 said:

Some general questions about the setup I was fit into which was T100 irons, X100 shafts, standard everything.  At the time I was a 12hdcp, distance was not an issue, spin was good apex was higher, IIRC ~110-115.

 

Fast forward, several months and my hands were aching like crazy, unsure if it was the weight of the shafts, the amount I was playing or just the mishits amplified. 

 

Prior to this I was in game improvement irons with Nippon Modus 3 Tour 115 stiff -- swing speed and ball striking have drastically improved, and at the time had similar results with the 115 and 120, but opted for the 115.  I went ahead and threw a set of Modus 3 Tour 120x into the T100 and launch/apex/spin are out of control, dispersion is what you'd expect from a 36 handicap, for some reason I am chunking bad behind the ball taking a divot ball, yet somehow my hand ache went away. I've probably hit 500 range balls, and played 6 rounds of golf. Do I give it more time? I have only had them in 2 weeks.

 

Finally one thing I noticed is the spin/apex/launch are all extremely high, but not so much with range balls, I play Pro V1 but didn't think the ball could have that drastic of an effect. With the Pro V1, some iron shots will take off fast reach a high apex with excessive spin then just drop straight costing me distance.

 

Perhaps the X100 with Z Cord were too much -- I also went back to Tour Velvet so it's hard for me to say for sure. 

 

From here, do I just throw the X100 back in, go see about alternative shafts any recommendations to consider? Now that my hands feel fine I am itching to have them back, this time with Tour Velvet and not Z Cord.

 

As an aside I am not very technical at all and unsure the magnitude each component will have on the spin, launch, apex data -- should I expect that I can find a ball and shaft combo with these heads to make them work for me? I really liked the set up for a while and even with my handicap trending higher these days, I hate the thought of GI irons mainly because of the turf interaction that makes me cringe, plus having to deal with flyers.  I am not chasing distance, I am chasing good distance dispersion.

 

 

Why not go back to the Modus 3 Tour 115 stiff?  Sounds like you enjoyed that shaft, and ball striking was good.  Maybe they are a bit softer than the X100 or the Modus Tour 120X, but you didn't have to work as hard. 

[Pnwpingi210]

1 hour ago, henry14 said:

 

Yes, pain free with the setup, but couldn't get along with the Modus.  Is there a chance the forged T100 heads are the culprit? I really like them and don't want to switch out of them. If I'm understanding correctly the Modus 115 is much different than the 120? I worry it may be too light, but I would consider it.

 

Obviously flushed shots cause no pain, but I have a handful of poor strikes per round and I wonder if those may have caused the pain, or perhaps it was a day where I was "off" and had one too many poor strikes?

Any of the components can cause pain.  In your case since  the pain subsided after a shaft and grip change while still playing the t100 heads I would say it’s doubtful it’s the root cause.

 

Moving from modus 115 s to x100 is a substantial difference in weight and feels.  I would guess this is the largest contributor.  The z cord grips are also the firmest grip out there and they probably magnified it.

 

The goal should always be to play choose the lightest option that gives you the best dispersion/impact dynamics.  

below are some options to try that will be a little softer and easier on your hands/wrists.  You will need to try them to see what works the best.  If you go to a fitter, let them know the x100s were causing hand pain 
 

modus 105/115/125 is stiff and x

dynamic gold 105/120 in s or x

kbs tour 120 s

kbs s taper 120 s

Px 5.5 or 6.0
Graphite 

axiom 105 or 125

mmt 105 or 125

 

Edited August 26, 2024 by Pnwpingi210

[henry14]

4 hours ago, gvogel said:

Why not go back to the Modus 3 Tour 115 stiff?  Sounds like you enjoyed that shaft, and ball striking was good.  Maybe they are a bit softer than the X100 or the Modus Tour 120X, but you didn't have to work as hard. 

 

I went ahead and threw a set of Modus 3 Tour 120x into the T100 and launch/apex/spin are out of control, dispersion is what you'd expect from a 36 handicap, for some reason I am chunking bad behind the ball taking a divot ball, yet somehow my hand ache went away.

[Pnwpingi210]

2 minutes ago, henry14 said:

 

I went ahead and threw a set of Modus 3 Tour 120x into the T100 and launch/apex/spin are out of control, dispersion is what you'd expect from a 36 handicap, for some reason I am chunking bad behind the ball taking a divot ball, yet somehow my hand ache went away.

The modus 120x are a very unique profile.  So while they are a little lighter and still and x flex, the bend profile for them is nothing like an x100 or modus 115s (the x100 and modus 115 are more similar than different).

 

I guess in summary, while a modus 115 might be a few grams lighter than 120x, they are going feel and play much different.  Most players find that modus 115 plays more linear and with less bend than 120x.  The 115 will also be closer to x100 than 120x.

[henry14]

3 hours ago, Pnwpingi210 said:

Any of the components can cause pain.  In your case since  the pain subsided after a shaft and grip change while still playing the t100 heads I would say it’s doubtful it’s the root cause.

 

Moving from modus 115 s to x100 is a substantial difference in weight and feels.  I would guess this is the largest contributor.  The z cord grips are also the firmest grip out there and they probably magnified it.

 

The goal should always be to play choose the lightest option that gives you the best dispersion/impact dynamics.  

below are some options to try that will be a little softer and easier on your hands/wrists.  You will need to try them to see what works the best.  If you go to a fitter, let them know the x100s were causing hand pain 
 

modus 105/115/125 is stiff and x

dynamic gold 105/120 in s or x

kbs tour 120 s

kbs s taper 120 s

Px 5.5 or 6.0
Graphite 

axiom 105 or 125

mmt 105 or 125

 

 

 

Thanks, I will look into those.  For reference my driver swing speed is 115mph+, 7iron is 95mph

 

I tried Project X Rifle 6.5 today and couldn't find consistency, front to back or side to side -- overall more distance from a good strike, but lots of poor strikes as well with misses front back left right.  A good strike produced the following:

 

*179yard carry, 183yard total, 126feet apex, 130mph ball speed, 96mph club speed, 6600rpm, 18.8 launch angle* of 10 shots I only had 4-5 like this

 

What I loved about the X100 was the distance dispersion especially was very very tight, the T100s felt very forgiving in terms of getting good distance even with an off center strike. The PX 6.5 seemed to magnify the issue.

[henry14]

1 minute ago, Pnwpingi210 said:

The modus 120x are a very unique profile.  So while they are a little lighter and still and x flex, the bend profile for them is nothing like an x100 or modus 115s (the x100 and modus 115 are more similar than different).

 

I guess in summary, while a modus 115 might be a few grams lighter than 120x, they are going feel and play much different.  Most players find that modus 115 plays more linear and with less bend than 120x.  The 115 will also be closer to x100 than 120x.

 

 

Interesting, I am curious how that weight will feel?  I am 115mph swing speed with the driver and 95 with 7 iron

[Pnwpingi210]

51 minutes ago, henry14 said:

 

 

Interesting, I am curious how that weight will feel?  I am 115mph swing speed with the driver and 95 with 7 iron

Cam champ is 130mph with driver and 100+ with 7 iron and plays modus 105 s

 

im north of both those metrics and am playing 120 to 125 grams and looking to go lighter.  I can play heavier but it takes a toll on your joints. (Edit north of 115 mph and 95)

Edited August 26, 2024 by Pnwpingi210