Short game book: Sieckmann or Grieve

[upanddown]

Want to add a short game book to my Christmas list.. anyone read both and have an opinion?  thanks

[iacas]

 

Also, I'd recommend the Utley book.

[Ltowngolfer]

I found both books to be beneficial.  If you struggling around the greens I would go with Dan.  Both teach a similar system when it comes to the finesse wedges.  Dan I would stay takes it a step farther when it comes to the different types of releases.  Maybe give his YouTube videos a shot to see if they speak to you.  There are hour long lessons with Ian Poulter, Rick Shields, and other golfers of various skill.

 

If you struggling with distance wedges I'd give the edge to Sieckmann.  He'll break down the different movements we make when hitting these shots, whether its a steepening or as shallowing movement, and then provide the corresponding fix. You can't go wrong with either book.

 

[SheriffBooth]

I've not read Dan Grieve but I have read Utley and Sieckmann.  I could never get any of Utley's stuff to work for me, but Sieckmann is my go to for all things short game related now.  He's a Pelz descendant so a lot his stuff resonated with me since I followed Pelz way back in the day.

Edited November 21, 2024 by SheriffBooth

[naj959]

Sieckmanns book is very good. Really has all you good want for improving short game; from technique to games to mental approach. Also, his brother was pretty close with Seve and that relationship influenced his teaching. Oddly enough I feel like my feels are closer to what Utley teaches despite not having read his book. I should probably do that 😅

[upanddown]

23 hours ago, Ltowngolfer said:

 

If you struggling with distance wedges I'd give the edge to Sieckmann.  He'll break down the different movements we make when hitting these shots, whether its a steepening or as shallowing movement, and then provide the corresponding fix. You can't go wrong with either book.

 

Definitely more chipping, short pitch shots than distance wedges.  I like things really simple but also detail as to how to do it.. not just "use the bounce" which is something I struggle with.  I've looked at Utley but havne't had much luck with him.  I feel like he's more a short game is a mini swing guy.

Edited November 21, 2024 by upanddown

[rchang72]

One thing about Grieve is he’s by now put out videos of almost all the info in his book. His channel is a great resource 

[mstuewe]

Go with Grieve.  Yes, he’s put a ton on YouTube for free, and that’s why you should buy his book.

 

1. get his book

2. watch his YouTube lessons to reinforce the book

3. he’s on Skillest if you decide you want a personal video lesson

 

 

[nosil]

I have read both, my short game improved with Grieve’s approach.   But I also watch videos from Short Game Chef, James Ridyard, and Joseph Mayo.   I personally like understanding and learning the various approaches so I can understand what my body is supposed to do and what the club is supposed to do.   I feel like I have applied nuggets from the 4 I listed.

[iacas]

30 minutes ago, nosil said:

I have read both, my short game improved with Grieve’s approach.   But I also watch videos from Short Game Chef, James Ridyard, and Joseph Mayo.   I personally like understanding and learning the various approaches so I can understand what my body is supposed to do and what the club is supposed to do.   I feel like I have applied nuggets from the 4 I listed.

 

To beginners I teach what I call the ends of the spectrum - "leading edge, shaft lean, hinge and hold type" chipping and super "use the bounce, let the clubhead go, soft wrists" pitching, and then tell them virtually every shot they'll ever play will be somewhere in between those two. Even in the Grieve system, for example, there are going to be plenty of shots that aren't quite Release 1 or 2, but are somewhere in between.

 

Learning a variety of techniques to accomplish short game shots is a good way to go. I'm a bit like you — which is part of the reason I encouraged him to get three books, not just one. Sure, start with one, but expose yourself to the others as well, and take the bits that work to create different shots.

[jumboross]

I have both books.  Both have merit, but I found Grieve's easier to put into practice.  Plus see above for the YouTube advice with Grieve.  Also, I cannot play a low shot with Sieckmann's chipping style.  

[Hstead]

I have read all of the above mentioned books and I would add Todd Sones to the list.  His focus is on simplifying everything.  He has plenty of youtube videos as well.  

[SheriffBooth]

1 hour ago, jumboross said:

I have both books.  Both have merit, but I found Grieve's easier to put into practice.  Plus see above for the YouTube advice with Grieve.  Also, I cannot play a low shot with Sieckmann's chipping style.  

 

I'll agree with this.  Flighting the ball down with a wedge is difficult using Sieckmann's technique, at least for me.  That said, since I'm really only playing weekends now, one thing I like about it is the sameness of each shot.  I'm not spending a lot of time thinking about setup and ball position - just which wedge for what distance/shot and then I'm doing pretty much the same thing every time.

[LaterOn61]

I’ve read Siekmann’s book and had an online video lesson with him. It helped but as others have said I can’t flight it down. Grieve I’ve only watched on YT. Grieve’s approach seems like a very long swing and a lot of shaft movement. The holster part feels overdone but I haven’t had a chance to practice it.

 

For people who use Grieve is contact cleaner? Do you need tons of practice to get the distance control down? I’m less of a feel player and am more comfortable with a system I can trust.

[MonteScheinblum]

These two and Utley all have gems.

[joemcsorleypreswickGC]

Only thing i`d say about Grieves method is that he is very much against any sort of drive or streepness in lower wedge shots and prefers less loft and a wider arc which personally i struggle to implement unless the lie is perfect.

[Golfah]

I am all-in on team Grieve after flirting with the other methods.  

It takes awhile to get comfortable with his method as it seems at first so much looser, longer, and out of control than other methods.

 

I have flirted with it and dropped it 2-3 times with false starts, then decided to finally commit and make it happen.

 

Now that I've got the basic motion, for me it's way less practice and maintenance than other methods and has bottom-line impacted my scoring in a positive way. 

I feel like I have much more control over shorter-range and tricky slope shots.  I feel like I can move the club what I feel is VERY slowly and make the ball float high and stop dead with good distance control.   I can also flight it down with a different release stye.  Also, my nemesis of chunking uphill chips are gone with this method.  

I will say you do have to be careful about letting the technique subconsciously bleed into your long game.

The best video to introduce yourself to the motion is the lesson with Rick Shiels.

Edited January 6 by Golfah

[NittanyCPA]

On 11/21/2024 at 8:01 AM, iacas said:

 

To beginners I teach what I call the ends of the spectrum - "leading edge, shaft lean, hinge and hold type" chipping and super "use the bounce, let the clubhead go, soft wrists" pitching, and then tell them virtually every shot they'll ever play will be somewhere in between those two. Even in the Grieve system, for example, there are going to be plenty of shots that aren't quite Release 1 or 2, but are somewhere in between.

 

Learning a variety of techniques to accomplish short game shots is a good way to go. I'm a bit like you — which is part of the reason I encouraged him to get three books, not just one. Sure, start with one, but expose yourself to the others as well, and take the bits that work to create different shots.

Yeah I agree. Most of my short game shots are what I call a Release 1.5.

 

I've overhauled my short game using Dan Grieve's framework - it has simplified everything and I've made significant improvements. But I've studied many instructors and have learned certain shots that are so effective it would be foolish to not find a place for them.

[thezinfan]

On 1/6/2025 at 7:31 AM, Golfah said:

I am all-in on team Grieve after flirting with the other methods.  

It takes awhile to get comfortable with his method as it seems at first so much looser, longer, and out of control than other methods.

 

I have flirted with it and dropped it 2-3 times with false starts, then decided to finally commit and make it happen.

 

Now that I've got the basic motion, for me it's way less practice and maintenance than other methods and has bottom-line impacted my scoring in a positive way. 

I feel like I have much more control over shorter-range and tricky slope shots.  I feel like I can move the club what I feel is VERY slowly and make the ball float high and stop dead with good distance control.   I can also flight it down with a different release stye.  Also, my nemesis of chunking uphill chips are gone with this method.  

I will say you do have to be careful about letting the technique subconsciously bleed into your long game.

The best video to introduce yourself to the motion is the lesson with Rick Shiels.

In one of Dan’s video he mentions that the release can leak a bit into the long game so you do have to be careful of that. 

[Canada8888]

Sieckmann's book worked wonders for me.

 

The chapter on  "fitness wedge fundamentals " and the one handed drills were the keys for me.

 

Worked at the fundamentals every day for 2 winters indoors and they became automatic.

 

Still go back and read that chapter at least once a year