Sellers beware! ... BUYERS BEWARE (*** Resolved ***)

[Nixhex524]

Wow.  LOL   This is crazy.  

 

I have done MANY deals with Stephen and every time it's A+.  He has always been straight up and fair and things are delivered exactly as described.  All I can say is sorry this even got this far @swwpp5, there is clearly a lack of knowledge in how to measure a club going on here. 

 

Not to be redundant, but you CAN NOT use a tape measure.  It is easy to be off by more than you think measuring this way.  From the early pics taken, the wedge looks to be exactly as listed.  Just about 35.5" which is 1/2" over standard for the 58.  In any case, @russian7 please be sure to post back when your builder measures this the correct way for you.  Very interested to hear this input, but I don't think you are going to like the way this turns out for you.

[rooski]

@swwpp5 has had clearly written, valid responses throughout the thread, as well as suggesting amicable solutions

 

@russian7 is on a wild tangent yap-fest throughout the thread, and refuses to provide any of the very reasonable proof or photos asked for over the course of 5 pages of posts

 

I think it is very clear to any reasonable reader that @swwpp5 is not the problem here

Edited November 25, 2024 by rooski

[I'_rather_be_golfing]

9 hours ago, russian7 said:

 

Def an option but now i have the claim to deal with an I obviously originally wanted to try the wedges and ordered the extensions to rectify as mentioned. You offered a return way later only at my cost making the whole process a headache and waste of time. I may just sell to Fourpar or offer to my mens club group locally and not deal with shipping at my expense. Or keep and lengthen etc. Again all hassles... Need to think on it and deal with it when back home. No one is going to waste their time making up a story to get a product and return an deal with claims, that isnt even a plausible story what would be the benefit?

You are a perfect example why it’s becoming more and more difficult to sell/buy here. You have been given plenty of options to resolve this. But yet you keep dancing around it all. Clearly Fourpar is the best solution. But no it’s too much of a hassle and to move on. Just admit it’s buyers remorse and you tried to find every little inch, literally to say you are right. And maybe you are who knows.  You sure aren’t doing a great job proving it. Not that you care to. 

[SBH9458]

5 hours ago, rooski said:

@swwpp5 has had clearly written, valid responses throughout the thread, as well as suggesting amicable solutions

 

@russian7 is on a wild tangent yap-fest throughout the thread, and refuses to provide any of the very reasonable proof or photos asked for over the course of 5 pages of posts

 

I think it is very clear to any reasonable reader that @swwpp5 is not the problem here

Have to agree with @rooski on his assessment.  

[5underdouble]

1 minute ago, SBH9458 said:

Have to agree with @rooski on his assessment.  

Add me to that list as well. 

[LPSISCO]

From what I can tell, @swwpp5 must personally know 99% of the WRX members, because they all think he’s right here. 😂

[cassel191919]

9 hours ago, russian7 said:

No one is trying to get any discounts especially that way period. If a member had a history of using PP documented then sure you have a valid claim. I have a clean sheet since the beginning of time with my accounts so Im not worried, nor am I worried what you think.

Nice work giving Russians an even worse reputation.

[Puttersaurus Rex]

At least there aren't "gouges" or "gashes" involved.

 

The fact that the Buyer is dragging his feet to prove himself right instead of actually taking photos with the entire club next to a ruler or tape measure is very telling.  I was never going to buy anything from Mr. JB Weld anyways, but this seals the deal.

[third-times-a-charm]

6 hours ago, rooski said:

@swwpp5 has had clearly written, valid responses throughout the thread, as well as suggesting amicable solutions

 

@russian7 is on a wild tangent yap-fest throughout the thread, and refuses to provide any of the very reasonable proof or photos asked for over the course of 5 pages of posts

 

I think it is very clear to any reasonable reader that @swwpp5 is not the problem here

 

I just like that we have rooski vs russian7 in here like how many Russians actually play golf much less are in the same BST issue thread

Edited November 25, 2024 by third-times-a-charm

[svlido]

I've been measuring clubs for a long time.  I personally use the Mitchell SteelClub because it seems to be the most repeatable, but there are literally dozens of ways the different OEMs and builders measure length.  On top of that some do cut and some do end of grip.  On top of that, most OEMs have really bad tolerances for length.  

 

At the end of the day, buying used clubs and expecting them to be really close on the length is just a bad idea.  To me based on the tape measure leaning against your leg method, they look to be within an acceptable margin.

[Pnwpingi210]

52 minutes ago, svlido said:

I've been measuring clubs for a long time.  I personally use the Mitchell SteelClub because it seems to be the most repeatable, but there are literally dozens of ways the different OEMs and builders measure length.  On top of that some do cut and some do end of grip.  On top of that, most OEMs have really bad tolerances for length.  

 

At the end of the day, buying used clubs and expecting them to be really close on the length is just a bad idea.  To me based on the tape measure leaning against your leg method, they look to be within an acceptable margin.

Yup, even using the buyers own method of measuring the clubs are .25 over ping standard (the buyer explicitly states this), which is within 1/8 of an inch of what was stated in the sale.

 

top that off with the video the buyer posted to back up the validation of his method, where the builder expert in the video says using a tape measure instead of a ruler will result in a shorter measurement.  Based on that it would likely account for the 1/8 of an inch in question putting the clubs within the sellers stated specs.
 

All of the above is pretty clear to most.

 

 

 

[uga_fan]

Might want to try measuring from the bottom side; always measures longer that way.  

[russian7]

50 minutes ago, svlido said:

I've been measuring clubs for a long time.  I personally use the Mitchell SteelClub because it seems to be the most repeatable, but there are literally dozens of ways the different OEMs and builders measure length.  On top of that some do cut and some do end of grip.  On top of that, most OEMs have really bad tolerances for length.  

 

At the end of the day, buying used clubs and expecting them to be really close on the length is just a bad idea.  To me based on the tape measure leaning against your leg method, they look to be within an acceptable margin.

11 hours ago, Long Shot said:

This is your previous negative feedback, so I wouldn’t say your golfwrx account is clean. 

 

Last post here

 

As we know there are Tons of ways to measure and every mfr. Is different according to the experts on this thread. My acct goes back to 2011 100% positive feedback and 100s more transactions with positive zero issues. The irons I sold back then were +1/2" according to seller built by his pro builder. I resold them to this guy who was a new member only 1 post and zero feedback so I would hardly call his review legit, he measured and got a different reading by a different method from a builder so everyone can chime in on that now and tell him how hes wrong, plus I offered resolution. Pic of his profile tells story and I left him negative feedback as well that was 1 time in the history of my acct. with a new member arguably not correct on measuring so no one can judge anything off of that. He has made zero contributions zero positive feedback zero transactions but tries to provide me negative feedback on his only transaction...whats that tell you?

 

What we do know:

 

1. seller never offered anything to resolve until he flamed me publically 1st then tried to give the appearance he was a good guy offering solution when in fact I was the one who took action to purchase grips and extensions to remedy and the issue and offer him the 1st solution to work it out period, zero replies from him!

 

 2. We all measure different, no one on here is actually involved or seen them or even knows the real story. I provided plenty of pictures to the seller on the side and her to see the difference and people still talking like they are experts when no one has any real evidence but what I have shown.

 

3. I don't need a few dollars, the whole story to get a discount is a joke, coincidentally I just paid additional money for grips and extensions for 2 clubs, hmm I wonder what thats for, and it came on my dime, so again if I needed a discount why would I buy components to adjust? Not even plausible.

 

4. If the seller had nothing to worry about then why not communicate and offer a solution, instead he argues blames me, then goes to wrx to blast me, report me to mods prematurely and then attempts to make himself look good in the process using everyone elses opinions of his story. I advised him if he did not help I would file a claim, he then took to wrx to report me and blast me so I had to cover myself as a buyer and file a claim on Paypal.

 

5. I am the buyer, I absolutely wanted to try these wedges, the deal was good Im not complaining, my issue was the length on arrival period. Yes I can return them at my cost, no thanks, or I can sell them sure, but I did for sure want to try them why else would I buy them? Lastly, I already paid for 2 extensions and 2 grips to adjust, again at my expense so if I keep them I paid more than what I really paid plus have to do the work.

 

6. Take what you want from this, Ive been an outstanding member here and every other outlet since those selling avenues began, 100s of people that will vouge for me so I am not concerned with everyones opinion that has no validity.

 

7. I will likely cancel the claim once I get them measured just to end the drama if the length is close to what he says. Im not here to cause problems just wanted some service and an amicable solution. I pressed it because the seller kept trying to talk and talk and blast me without ever trying to be reasonable to me, except visibally in the group to make himself look good.

 

Previous member issue below you can see the profile and take what you want from it but dont judge if you werent in olved and had zero clue of the situation.

 

Thanks.

 

[Pnwpingi210]

6 minutes ago, russian7 said:

 

Last post here

 

As we know there are Tons of ways to measure and every mfr. Is different according to the experts on this thread. My acct goes back to 2011 100% positive feedback and 100s more transactions with positive zero issues. The irons I sold back then were +1/2" according to seller built by his pro builder. I resold them to this guy who was a new member only 1 post and zero feedback so I would hardly call his review legit, he measured and got a different reading by a different method from a builder so everyone can chime in on that now and tell him how hes wrong, plus I offered resolution. Pic of his profile tells story and I left him negative feedback as well that was 1 time in the history of my acct. with a new member arguably not correct on measuring so no one can judge anything off of that. He has made zero contributions zero positive feedback zero transactions but tries to provide me negative feedback on his only transaction...whats that tell you?

 

What we do know:

 

1. seller never offered anything to resolve until he flamed me publically 1st then tried to give the appearance he was a good guy offering solution when in fact I was the one who took action to purchase grips and extensions to remedy and the issue and offer him the 1st solution to work it out period, zero replies from him!

 

 2. We all measure different, no one on here is actually involved or seen them or even knows the real story. I provided plenty of pictures to the seller on the side and her to see the difference and people still talking like they are experts when no one has any real evidence but what I have shown.

 

3. I don't need a few dollars, the whole story to get a discount is a joke, coincidentally I just paid additional money for grips and extensions for 2 clubs, hmm I wonder what thats for, and it came on my dime, so again if I needed a discount why would I buy components to adjust? Not even plausible.

 

4. If the seller had nothing to worry about then why not communicate and offer a solution, instead he argues blames me, then goes to wrx to blast me, report me to mods prematurely and then attempts to make himself look good in the process using everyone elses opinions of his story. I advised him if he did not help I would file a claim, he then took to wrx to report me and blast me so I had to cover myself as a buyer and file a claim on Paypal.

 

5. I am the buyer, I absolutely wanted to try these wedges, the deal was good Im not complaining, my issue was the length on arrival period. Yes I can return them at my cost, no thanks, or I can sell them sure, but I did for sure want to try them why else would I buy them? Lastly, I already paid for 2 extensions and 2 grips to adjust, again at my expense so if I keep them I paid more than what I really paid plus have to do the work.

 

6. Take what you want from this, Ive been an outstanding member here and every other outlet since those selling avenues began, 100s of people that will vouge for me so I am not concerned with everyones opinion that has no validity.

 

7. I will likely cancel the claim once I get them measured just to end the drama if the length is close to what he says. Im not here to cause problems just wanted some service and an amicable solution. I pressed it because the seller kept trying to talk and talk and blast me without ever trying to be reasonable to me, except visibally in the group to make himself look good.

 

Previous member issue below you can see the profile and take what you want from it but dont judge if you werent in olved and had zero clue of the situation.

 

Thanks.

 

I think what seems to be lost in this post is what exactly is the seller supposed to remedy?  The clubs appear to be in spec (3/8 over ping standard)

 

 

 

[Red4282]

18 minutes ago, russian7 said:

 

Last post here

 

As we know there are Tons of ways to measure and every mfr. Is different according to the experts on this thread. My acct goes back to 2011 100% positive feedback and 100s more transactions with positive zero issues. The irons I sold back then were +1/2" according to seller built by his pro builder. I resold them to this guy who was a new member only 1 post and zero feedback so I would hardly call his review legit, he measured and got a different reading by a different method from a builder so everyone can chime in on that now and tell him how hes wrong, plus I offered resolution. Pic of his profile tells story and I left him negative feedback as well that was 1 time in the history of my acct. with a new member arguably not correct on measuring so no one can judge anything off of that. He has made zero contributions zero positive feedback zero transactions but tries to provide me negative feedback on his only transaction...whats that tell you?

 

What we do know:

 

1. seller never offered anything to resolve until he flamed me publically 1st then tried to give the appearance he was a good guy offering solution when in fact I was the one who took action to purchase grips and extensions to remedy and the issue and offer him the 1st solution to work it out period, zero replies from him!

 

 2. We all measure different, no one on here is actually involved or seen them or even knows the real story. I provided plenty of pictures to the seller on the side and her to see the difference and people still talking like they are experts when no one has any real evidence but what I have shown.

 

3. I don't need a few dollars, the whole story to get a discount is a joke, coincidentally I just paid additional money for grips and extensions for 2 clubs, hmm I wonder what thats for, and it came on my dime, so again if I needed a discount why would I buy components to adjust? Not even plausible.

 

4. If the seller had nothing to worry about then why not communicate and offer a solution, instead he argues blames me, then goes to wrx to blast me, report me to mods prematurely and then attempts to make himself look good in the process using everyone elses opinions of his story. I advised him if he did not help I would file a claim, he then took to wrx to report me and blast me so I had to cover myself as a buyer and file a claim on Paypal.

 

5. I am the buyer, I absolutely wanted to try these wedges, the deal was good Im not complaining, my issue was the length on arrival period. Yes I can return them at my cost, no thanks, or I can sell them sure, but I did for sure want to try them why else would I buy them? Lastly, I already paid for 2 extensions and 2 grips to adjust, again at my expense so if I keep them I paid more than what I really paid plus have to do the work.

 

6. Take what you want from this, Ive been an outstanding member here and every other outlet since those selling avenues began, 100s of people that will vouge for me so I am not concerned with everyones opinion that has no validity.

 

7. I will likely cancel the claim once I get them measured just to end the drama if the length is close to what he says. Im not here to cause problems just wanted some service and an amicable solution. I pressed it because the seller kept trying to talk and talk and blast me without ever trying to be reasonable to me, except visibally in the group to make himself look good.

 

Previous member issue below you can see the profile and take what you want from it but dont judge if you werent in olved and had zero clue of the situation.

 

Thanks.

 

Sorry, but to act like there are hundreds of ways to measure is just not true. There really only is two ways. One throughout the center of shaft axis, and the other down the back. Some account for butt cap, some dont. Bottom line, his description of +3/8 could mean alot of things. I feel its on you to clarify before you buy, its also always best to get a hard measurement (ex. 35.75”) rather than a “+\-“ number.

 

For you to have a valid case, you would need to have shown the product didnt arrive as  seller described. Based on methods and tolerences, you would had to ask for more details to justify. Just take it as a learning lesson and move on.  

[tungstenplug]

In my opinion, Buyer refusing to send a photo of the wedges laying down on the ground next to a tape measure shows that he is unwilling to act reasonably in resolving the issue

Edited November 25, 2024 by tungstenplug

[Nixhex524]

32 minutes ago, russian7 said:

 

Last post here

 

As we know there are Tons of ways to measure and every mfr. Is different according to the experts on this thread. My acct goes back to 2011 100% positive feedback and 100s more transactions with positive zero issues. The irons I sold back then were +1/2" according to seller built by his pro builder. I resold them to this guy who was a new member only 1 post and zero feedback so I would hardly call his review legit, he measured and got a different reading by a different method from a builder so everyone can chime in on that now and tell him how hes wrong, plus I offered resolution. Pic of his profile tells story and I left him negative feedback as well that was 1 time in the history of my acct. with a new member arguably not correct on measuring so no one can judge anything off of that. He has made zero contributions zero positive feedback zero transactions but tries to provide me negative feedback on his only transaction...whats that tell you?

 

What we do know:

 

1. seller never offered anything to resolve until he flamed me publically 1st then tried to give the appearance he was a good guy offering solution when in fact I was the one who took action to purchase grips and extensions to remedy and the issue and offer him the 1st solution to work it out period, zero replies from him!

 

 2. We all measure different, no one on here is actually involved or seen them or even knows the real story. I provided plenty of pictures to the seller on the side and her to see the difference and people still talking like they are experts when no one has any real evidence but what I have shown.

 

3. I don't need a few dollars, the whole story to get a discount is a joke, coincidentally I just paid additional money for grips and extensions for 2 clubs, hmm I wonder what thats for, and it came on my dime, so again if I needed a discount why would I buy components to adjust? Not even plausible.

 

4. If the seller had nothing to worry about then why not communicate and offer a solution, instead he argues blames me, then goes to wrx to blast me, report me to mods prematurely and then attempts to make himself look good in the process using everyone elses opinions of his story. I advised him if he did not help I would file a claim, he then took to wrx to report me and blast me so I had to cover myself as a buyer and file a claim on Paypal.

 

5. I am the buyer, I absolutely wanted to try these wedges, the deal was good Im not complaining, my issue was the length on arrival period. Yes I can return them at my cost, no thanks, or I can sell them sure, but I did for sure want to try them why else would I buy them? Lastly, I already paid for 2 extensions and 2 grips to adjust, again at my expense so if I keep them I paid more than what I really paid plus have to do the work.

 

6. Take what you want from this, Ive been an outstanding member here and every other outlet since those selling avenues began, 100s of people that will vouge for me so I am not concerned with everyones opinion that has no validity.

 

7. I will likely cancel the claim once I get them measured just to end the drama if the length is close to what he says. Im not here to cause problems just wanted some service and an amicable solution. I pressed it because the seller kept trying to talk and talk and blast me without ever trying to be reasonable to me, except visibally in the group to make himself look good.

 

Previous member issue below you can see the profile and take what you want from it but dont judge if you werent in olved and had zero clue of the situation.

 

Thanks.

 

 

 

Maybe I missed this here, but you've talked about the seller not offering anything to rectify the situation, what exactly is it that you were looking for?  Rather than have him throw ideas at you that you don't like to fix it, why not just state exactly what it is that you are looking for?  I am sure it didn't have to get to the point of you taking it here first.  

 

Also, it is standard for the buyer to pay shipping back if they do not want the item for whatever reason.  Once it's in your possession, it's yours.  Instead of buying other components you literally could have just shipped them back.  It's just hard to know what it is that you were looking for out of this and in the process not doing yourself any favors to save your reputation here.

[swwpp5]

@russian7 you claim you want to try the wedges so why did you file a case for the entire value then? 

[Pnwpingi210]

3 minutes ago, swwpp5 said:

@russian7 you claim you want to try the wedges so why did you file a case for the entire value then? 

Hopefully you can use the communication in you messages and this thread as part of documentation for the dispute.  
 

Also hopefully PayPal requires him to use one of the two gold standard ways club builds measure clubs (Mitchell pin or USGA method) to validate his claim.  The tape measure while holding a club in the ground is not an acceptable method to validate.

[zip7111]

All of this over $150?  Yikes!

[golffeen007]

37 minutes ago, swwpp5 said:

@russian7 you claim you want to try the wedges so why did you file a case for the entire value then? 

Wait, @russian7 builds clubs? Are talking more than using a tool to change out driver shafts? 

[circa3182]

Seems pretty wild to be so specific about club length and claim you’re a club builder without having a ruler to even measure club length!

[bcjim]

Please, whoever gets final possession of these clubs,  go to the nearest big box and stand them next to off the rack s159s. 

 

No special rulers, methods, algorithms, etc. 

 

One party will immediately be vindicated by this simple exercise. 

 

I'm tempted to make an offer just to settle this myself😂

Edited November 25, 2024 by bcjim

[basbolstar]

Some of you guys LOVE to pile on huh?

[snapier]

21 hours ago, squishyy said:

 

For many reasons:

 

1. Having to repost the items to sell again, wasting more time.

2. Losing PP fees/shipping cost.

 

Seller stated lengths are correct. Why should he accept a return without hard evidence that they are not? To him, they are as advertised. But he is being pushed by russian7 to pay for extensions without being shown they were not as described.

Agreeing to accept a return is often a part of on line sales when PayPal is involved.  Unless the buyer/seller have reached some sort of agreement by now, a return will be forced by PayPal if the buyer opens a case and  cites not as described as reason for the return.  All the nonsense in this thread would be avoided.  
 

 

[russian7]

47 minutes ago, basbolstar said:

Some of you guys LOVE to pile on huh?

Exactly

[russian7]

1 hour ago, bcjim said:

Please, whoever gets final possession of these clubs,  go to the nearest big box and stand them next to off the rack s159s. 

 

No special rulers, methods, algorithms, etc. 

 

One party will immediately be vindicated by this simple exercise. 

 

I'm tempted to make an offer just to settle this myself😂

SO NOW WHAT?? To the 100 people piling in on me here saying I must be incompetent and I must be wrong and a bad guy and blah blah...

 

I finally had time in my day to go to our local fitter that is the largest fitting centers in my area to speak to one of the pros and get a couple of stock wedges to match these two so we can compare side by side...

 

hmm low and behold set down side by side they measure exactly STOCK length.

 

PROOF of my claim as I said!

 

Unfortunately with kids in sports and traveling all weekend I didn't have the time in my day to immediately get to a retail store so despite everyone's opinions on the measuring this and that like everyone else stated the easiest way was to drop by grab some stock ones off the shelf and prove exactly what I said they arent +3/8" 

 

 

[gentles]

wrong thread

Edited November 25, 2024 by gentles
decided not to waste my time

[Pnwpingi210]

5 minutes ago, russian7 said:

SO NOW WHAT?? To the 100 people piling in on me here saying I must be incompetent and I must be wrong and a bad guy and blah blah...

 

I finally had time in my day to go to our local fitter that is the largest fitting centers in my area to speak to one of the pros and get a couple of stock wedges to match these two so we can compare side by side...

 

hmm low and behold set down side by side they measure exactly STOCK length.

 

PROOF of my claim as I said!

 

Unfortunately with kids in sports and traveling all weekend I didn't have the time in my day to immediately get to a retail store so despite everyone's opinions on the measuring this and that like everyone else stated the easiest way was to drop by grab some stock ones off the shelf and prove exactly what I said they arent +3/8" 

 

 

The clubs with the black shafts are longer.  You can see the butt caps extend further, once of them extended further than the red additional cap added to stock wedge.
 

did you put them on the club builders ruler and take a picture at the shop?  That would have been the best way.  
 

you should be looking for a clubs that measure 

 

35 and 3/8 (stock ping 58+3/8)

and

35 and 7/8 (stock ping 52+3/8)

 

the comparisons photos like that just aren’t very accurate when you are quibbling over 1/4 to 1/8 of an inch. 

 

 

 

[dmecca2]

@russian7 My guy.... it's time to do some self reflecting. Not only on whether your claim has validity (it doesn't), but also on how you've handled this situation (poorly to put it nicely), and lastly your general attitude and rush to aggressiveness/hysteria. Any wrx'er who reads this thread will not buy from or sell to you.

 

Even in the picture that you just provided... The clubs are longer. 3/8" is less than half an inch. Which is so small. Additionally, as other people have mentioned, "standard" length from a manufacturer has tolerance. It's not always perfect.

 

In Summary: You are wrong. Stop arguing. End your paypal dispute and sell the clubs to the kind wrx'er who offered to buy them.

Edited November 25, 2024 by dmecca2