Getting the club behind you?

[Brokensticks]

6 minutes ago, KMeloney said:

I don't think these two statements jive at all.

 

It's like saying that you want to be able to ski as fast as you can and don't care if you crash and kill yourself. How could you fault the coaching if they told you to point your skis directly down the mountain, crouch, and not turn?

 

 

I was thinking its a process and if face control gets abit worse if there is a big jump in CHS so be it, it can always be improved after it feels like cruise speed. 

[Valtiel]

1 hour ago, Brokensticks said:

I told them basicly what I said here, I want a crazy amount of speed and dont give a s*** if it raises my hcp 10 points. 
 

I know my sequence is wack. I know my pressure shift is too late...

I was thinking its a process and if face control gets abit worse if there is a big jump in CHS so be it, it can always be improved after it feels like cruise speed. 

 

26 minutes ago, KMeloney said:

I don't think these two statements jive at all.

 

It's like saying that you want to be able to ski as fast as you can and don't care if you crash and kill yourself. How could you fault the coaching if they told you to point your skis directly down the mountain, crouch, and not turn?

Agreed with @KMeloney here, and i'd add that based on what you said above @Brokensticks that you're setting yourself up for failure by not looking at this correctly. You paid someone to break you and are now disappointed in the results of what you paid for. 

Speed, especially speed beyond a current established ceiling, comes from good fundamentals and good sequencing. You can't just say "screw all this busted stuff, i'm just going to add a bunch of speed", because to use a different analogy...that's like saying you just want your car to go as fast as possible but you don't care about the type or condition of the engine/drivetrain etc. That latter is what allows you to create that speed, you can't just ignore it. To do so is to not understand that connection which will just lead to frustration. And i'm not just the president, i'm a client!

Sequencing issues place a pretty firm ceiling on your speed generating potential AND means that you're far more likely to introduce damaging moves and bad habits should you try to plow past this. To further the car analogy....going to a coach and basically telling them "I don't care about fundamentals, just make me faster" and then being disappointed with the results is like going to a mechanic and saying "I don't care about general maintenance, slap a turbocharger in there" and being upset that your car broke down a week later because your oil had 20,000 miles on it and your timing belt had never been changed. It's a setup for failure, and only the most hyper-ethical and non-financially motivated golf instructors would do the right thing in refusing to do what you're asking for.....which is to say like 10 guys in the whole world. 😆

[PedronNiall]

2 hours ago, Brokensticks said:

I was expecting alot more from being coached tbh. I feel like Im guessing things out loud instead of being crystal clear of my overall goals from the beginning. Maybe it would be great if I took 20 lessons but I cant afford thst either.  

 

Like with many other things you have to be your own advocate. You need to decide what your expectations are, communicate them as clearly as you can, and, if needed, politely but directly share that what's happening isn't meeting what you're looking for. 

 

If you've already paid for a package then salvage what's left. Tell them you want to fix the faults in your swing that are in the way of easy speed production if that's what you actually want to do. All we can tell you is that is the fastest and easiest way to consistent, sustainable speed.

 

You're not 20 lessons from swing improvement but you could easily be dozens away from making real progress trying to chase speed with the massive consistency and power leaks that are present now. Your swing isn't far from being much more solid, so don't feel like you're miles away. You just need to decide what's most important to you and if you're okay with going a different way than you initially wanted to. 

 

My recommendation is to try getting more neutral as I shared before and going from there as that's a very easy check you can mess around with even if you can't get to the range and that you can check the results of on video yourself when you do get out to hit. Regardless, you should figure out a better picture of what you want out of your remaining lessons so they progress in a way you'll feel you got your money's worth or at least can be sure where the issues lie if they aren't with what you're asking for to begin with. 

[GoGoErky]

2 hours ago, Brokensticks said:

I was very honest going into the lessons and unfortunately I got myself a package deal. I told them basicly what I said here, I want a crazy amount of speed and dont give a s*** if it raises my hcp 10 points. 
 

They started talking about the process, archetypes like Terry/Mike and I was measured up. Weaker grip, trail elbow working more away from target (think rory setup basicly but right hand so weak I see two knuckles) and I was kinda shocked, lift straight up and slam down, if arms bend, across the line, wrist cupping, if everything squares at impact it was suppose to be most natural, best etc

 

Then things gets broken down to details and I dont see the whole picture, concept was more or less lift arms, slam them down as fast as you can. Only on the second lesson it was more straight up instead of around me and more closed chest so the club doesnt exit low left. They try to have me extending lead arm at impact but it doesnt really happen, their guess is its because I pull with left shoulder so they try to shut the lower body off.
 

I think they have a spectrum with the archetypes and if Im within those, they let it happen as naturally as possible with the ”lift up, slam down” if Im making sense here. 

 

I know my sequence is wack. I know my pressure shift is too late but its not something that has been adressed directly, but more like indirectly by the ”lift arms up to the ceiling” instead of ”you are pulling them around like this and its wrong”. At that time I checked and straightened the wrist and I was told not to do it.

 

This whole coaching thing has kinda turned into a let down, felt like it maybe isnt for me and at the same time Ive had DMs that swears by the process. 
 

Atleast the coach and I agree now that my body is turning too early and it creates and empty, tensionless space for the arms to travel in and overrun. So we kinda making some progress I guess?

 

I was expecting alot more from being coached tbh. I feel like Im guessing things out loud instead of being crystal clear of my overall goals from the beginning. Maybe it would be great if I took 20 lessons but I cant afford thst either.  
 

 

You get what you ask for, but this could be bad coaching too; or maybe som miscommunications.

 

 

 

 

[Brokensticks]

Concentrating on backswing

Ive done some work and the change is small. Really trying to extend the trail wrist to keep the lead flatter and I think I manage it better - but its not enough. Mind-swing connection is kinda bad, Im trying to set wrists early and do Monte-power thing and even just setting arms parallel in the mirror and giving it a go to get things moving arms are going all the way back. 
 

In my mind it can be a few things, not sure which. Need a training aid to help me so need to pinpoint next move. 
 

Elbow getting too far back or too far apart? Radial deviation on both wrists or is more of a forearm rotation on the trail hand?

   

 

 

 

Edited February 1 by Brokensticks

[GoGoErky]

31 minutes ago, Brokensticks said:

Concentrating on backswing

Ive done some work and the change is small. Really trying to extend the trail wrist to keep the lead flatter and I think I manage it better - but its not enough. Mind-swing connection is kinda bad, Im trying to set wrists early and do Monte-power thing and even just setting arms parallel in the mirror and giving it a go to get things moving arms are going all the way back. 
 

In my mind it can be a few things, not sure which. Need a training aid to help me so need to pinpoint next move. 
 

Elbow getting too far back or too far apart? Radial deviation on both wrists or is more of a forearm rotation on the trail hand?

 

   

 

 

 

The change is almost non existent. Small changes are the long and slow road to getting better. 
 

The changes need to be big and noticeable. As discussed in some other threads you have to change the picture to change the swing and you’re not changing the picture.

What Monte power thing are you doing? At what speed are you doing it? Do you film yourself doing it?

 

[iacas]

17 minutes ago, GoGoErky said:

The change is almost non existent. Small changes are the long and slow road to getting better. 
 

The changes need to be big and noticeable.

 

[RayPlan]

2 hours ago, Brokensticks said:

Concentrating on backswing

Ive done some work and the change is small. Really trying to extend the trail wrist to keep the lead flatter and I think I manage it better - but its not enough. Mind-swing connection is kinda bad, Im trying to set wrists early and do Monte-power thing and even just setting arms parallel in the mirror and giving it a go to get things moving arms are going all the way back. 
 

In my mind it can be a few things, not sure which. Need a training aid to help me so need to pinpoint next move. 
 

Elbow getting too far back or too far apart? Radial deviation on both wrists or is more of a forearm rotation on the trail hand?

 

IMG_7919.mov 17.35 MB · 1 download   IMG_7920.mov 18.62 MB · 1 download  

 

 

 

   

Converted for inline visibility.

 

Edit:

Do .mov files show up as just a download for others? I'm on Chrome (Android), and that's what they look like for me. I think I've wrongly assumed it was a forum limitation, so if anyone else is on Android and can see them, let me know. It would be very silly if I'm just reposting people's videos if this is just a me problem.

 

 

Edited February 1 by RayPlan

[Valtiel]

2 hours ago, Brokensticks said:

Concentrating on backswing

Ive done some work and the change is small.

 

1 hour ago, GoGoErky said:

The change is almost non existent.

 

1 hour ago, iacas said:

 

With a long overrunning backswing you'll starve if you try to live off small changes, and i'd argue that not only is this change small, it might be worse. Your newer swing has a higher, more disconnected right elbow and the club is further across the line. This is just more of what's already an issue. So when you're asking:
 

Quote

Elbow getting too far back or too far apart? Radial deviation on both wrists or is more of a forearm rotation on the trail hand?

Stop, and literally *just make a shorter swing*. You'll dance around everything BUT what you need to do if you don't commit to actually being uncomfortable and "changing the picture" as they said above via being hard on yourself and whatever your current comfort zone is. Don't think about elbows or wrists or forearms....just video yourself making what feels like a 3/4 swing and look at where it ends up. Is it actually 3/4? No? Then make what feels like a 1/2 swing and video that. Where did that end up? Still too long? Keep doing it until it isn't. Don't worry about elbows/wrists/forearms until you've strengthened what you admitted was weak re: mind/body connection, because think about it this way...

If the lack of that connection means you aren't aware of the macro (how big/long your swing is), then how on earth can you be aware of the micro (forearm pronation/supination, wrist deviation, elbow position)? Until you can get the former, the latter may as well not exist in terms of your awareness, so attempting to access it won't work.

Edited February 1 by Valtiel

[PedronNiall]

8 hours ago, RayPlan said:

 

Do .mov files show up as just a download for others? I'm on Chrome (Android), and that's what they look like for me. I think I've wrongly assumed it was a forum limitation, so if anyone else is on Android and can see them, let me know. It would be very silly if I'm just reposting people's videos if this is just a me problem.

 

 

 

It's something with how the forum is setup. It does it on desktop as well. On some browsers the clips aren't even available for download. Not surprising, I don't think there's a free browser codec for iOS .mov files.

 

9 hours ago, Brokensticks said:

Concentrating on backswing

Ive done some work and the change is small. Really trying to extend the trail wrist to keep the lead flatter and I think I manage it better - but its not enough. Mind-swing connection is kinda bad, Im trying to set wrists early and do Monte-power thing and even just setting arms parallel in the mirror and giving it a go to get things moving arms are going all the way back. 
 

In my mind it can be a few things, not sure which. Need a training aid to help me so need to pinpoint next move. 
 

Elbow getting too far back or too far apart? Radial deviation on both wrists or is more of a forearm rotation on the trail hand?

 

IMG_7919.mov 17.35 MB · 3 downloads   IMG_7920.mov 18.62 MB · 4 downloads  

 

 

 

 

I know you've been read the riot act a bit, but I can see that you have tried getting a little more neutral with your hands in your setup, so nice that you're willing to give something different a go. I'm going to suggest a second change that I also think will help you and that I gave to another forum member earlier. 

 

We'll play the you vs a pro game because I want to remind that you're not 20 lessons away from having a better, more repeatable swing. 

 

The setup is close, but we'll talk about what I think you should change after we look at everything. 

 

 

 

Clipped this one where you should and could be stopping and can if you adjust your setup just a little. You more or less hit the position you need at P4 but you keep going because there's nothing to stop you. 

 

 

Everything that's just enough off to lose you power and throw your sequence loose is set in motion before the downswing begins, so all you get to do at that point is take a ride. You'd need a very high level of natural ability to save it every time, but you're still not crazy far away from where you should be, so don't stress about it, just be aware.  

 

 

 

Suggestion: yes, do work on controlling the length of your backswing but try to do so by first getting a better set at address.

 

 

Scott starts with a more athletic position over the ball with more knee flex and his weight acting more in the balls of his feet. I'm willing to bet he'd be a lot more stable on a gusty day or if someone tried to rock him off balance than you would, and that stability is power. The other benefit, besides stability, is that the spine angle starts and stays in a more powerful alignment and the knee flex naturally restricts your total range of motion. That restriction is control. 

 

 

Notice you decrease your spine angle/get more upright in your takeaway and gain a bit of height, putting you in a weaker position and allowing your arms and body to keep turning well beyond where they need to until they collapse, while Scott maintains his spine angle throughout. Scott's stance applies the brakes and starts his downswing while yours lets your upper body run away from you. 

 

Yes, there are the Åbergs of the world who can start with and maintain a bit less flex and still hit a good swing path and arrest their swing without issue, but most aren't Åberg and shouldn't be trying to make his more upright stance work. I recommend you learn to get into a more stable set at address that has your weight in the balls of your feet feeling stable and powerful and allows you to turn within reason. 

[TheDeanAbides]

8 hours ago, Valtiel said:

 

 

With a long overrunning backswing you'll starve if you try to live off small changes, and i'd argue that not only is this change small, it might be worse. Your newer swing has a higher, more disconnected right elbow and the club is further across the line. This is just more of what's already an issue. So when you're asking:
 

Stop, and literally *just make a shorter swing*. You'll dance around everything BUT what you need to do if you don't commit to actually being uncomfortable and "changing the picture" as they said above via being hard on yourself and whatever your current comfort zone is. Don't think about elbows or wrists or forearms....just video yourself making what feels like a 3/4 swing and look at where it ends up. Is it actually 3/4? No? Then make what feels like a 1/2 swing and video that. Where did that end up? Still too long? Keep doing it until it isn't. Don't worry about elbows/wrists/forearms until you've strengthened what you admitted was weak re: mind/body connection, because think about it this way...

If the lack of that connection means you aren't aware of the macro (how big/long your swing is), then how on earth can you be aware of the micro (forearm pronation/supination, wrist deviation, elbow position)? Until you can get the former, the latter may as well not exist in terms of your awareness, so attempting to access it won't work.

To add to this, OP, I looked like you for two decades and maintained a decent standard through hitting a thousand balls a week. As soon as I couldn't do that it all went south. I literally had to feel like I was hitting a 40 yard pitch to retrain my brain, but with mostly mirror work and wedge work during Covid I fixed it in a season. It still took looking at my backswing and overcoming what my feel was telling me many times to trust it. It'll be worth it. 

[Golfbeat]

For the longest time, I had a long back swing like you. I needed to feel my back swing as if I was chipping for many months and with that feel my back swing on video was just short of parallel. 

[golferdude54]

3 hours ago, PedronNiall said:

 

It's something with how the forum is setup. It does it on desktop as well. On some browsers the clips aren't even available for download. Not surprising, I don't think there's a free browser codec for iOS .mov files.

 

 

I know you've been read the riot act a bit, but I can see that you have tried getting a little more neutral with your hands in your setup, so nice that you're willing to give something different a go. I'm going to suggest a second change that I also think will help you and that I gave to another forum member earlier. 

 

We'll play the you vs a pro game because I want to remind that you're not 20 lessons away from having a better, more repeatable swing. 

 

The setup is close, but we'll talk about what I think you should change after we look at everything. 

 

 

 

Clipped this one where you should and could be stopping and can if you adjust your setup just a little. You more or less hit the position you need at P4 but you keep going because there's nothing to stop you. 

 

 

Everything that's just enough off to lose you power and throw your sequence loose is set in motion before the downswing begins, so all you get to do at that point is take a ride. You'd need a very high level of natural ability to save it every time, but you're still not crazy far away from where you should be, so don't stress about it, just be aware.  

 

 

 

Suggestion: yes, do work on controlling the length of your backswing but try to do so by first getting a better set at address.

 

 

Scott starts with a more athletic position over the ball with more knee flex and his weight acting more in the balls of his feet. I'm willing to bet he'd be a lot more stable on a gusty day or if someone tried to rock him off balance than you would, and that stability is power. The other benefit, besides stability, is that the spine angle starts and stays in a more powerful alignment and the knee flex naturally restricts your total range of motion. That restriction is control. 

 

 

Notice you decrease your spine angle/get more upright in your takeaway and gain a bit of height, putting you in a weaker position and allowing your arms and body to keep turning well beyond where they need to until they collapse, while Scott maintains his spine angle throughout. Scott's stance applies the brakes and starts his downswing while yours lets your upper body run away from you. 

 

Yes, there are the Åbergs of the world who can start with and maintain a bit less flex and still hit a good swing path and arrest their swing without issue, but most aren't Åberg and shouldn't be trying to make his more upright stance work. I recommend you learn to get into a more stable set at address that has your weight in the balls of your feet feeling stable and powerful and allows you to turn within reason. 

 

You're really splitting hairs here. His setup passes the eye test with an A grade already. He's not too far from the ball or too close to it nor is his ball position too far forward or back, I could go on and on. It just looks normal aesthetically, and that's alright.

[iacas]

4 hours ago, PedronNiall said:

It's something with how the forum is setup. It does it on desktop as well. On some browsers the clips aren't even available for download. Not surprising, I don't think there's a free browser codec for iOS .mov files.

It’s the file extension and the forum setup, not the codec. They’re just H.264 videos.

[Brokensticks]

4 hours ago, PedronNiall said:

 

It's something with how the forum is setup. It does it on desktop as well. On some browsers the clips aren't even available for download. Not surprising, I don't think there's a free browser codec for iOS .mov files.

 

 

I know you've been read the riot act a bit, but I can see that you have tried getting a little more neutral with your hands in your setup, so nice that you're willing to give something different a go. I'm going to suggest a second change that I also think will help you and that I gave to another forum member earlier. 

 

We'll play the you vs a pro game because I want to remind that you're not 20 lessons away from having a better, more repeatable swing. 

 

The setup is close, but we'll talk about what I think you should change after we look at everything. 

 

 

 

 

Clipped this one where you should and could be stopping and can if you adjust your setup just a little. You more or less hit the position you need at P4 but you keep going because there's nothing to stop you. 

 

 

Everything that's just enough off to lose you power and throw your sequence loose is set in motion before the downswing begins, so all you get to do at that point is take a ride. You'd need a very high level of natural ability to save it every time, but you're still not crazy far away from where you should be, so don't stress about it, just be aware.  

 

Suggestion: yes, do work on controlling the length of your backswing but try to do so by first getting a better set at address.

 

Scott starts with a more athletic position over the ball with more knee flex and his weight acting more in the balls of his feet. I'm willing to bet he'd be a lot more stable on a gusty day or if someone tried to rock him off balance than you would, and that stability is power. The other benefit, besides stability, is that the spine angle starts and stays in a more powerful alignment and the knee flex naturally restricts your total range of motion. That restriction is control. 

 

 

Notice you decrease your spine angle/get more upright in your takeaway and gain a bit of height, putting you in a weaker position and allowing your arms and body to keep turning well beyond where they need to until they collapse, while Scott maintains his spine angle throughout. Scott's stance applies the brakes and starts his downswing while yours lets your upper body run away from you. 

 

Yes, there are the Åbergs of the world who can start with and maintain a bit less flex and still hit a good swing path and arrest their swing without issue, but most aren't Åberg and shouldn't be trying to make his more upright stance work. I recommend you learn to get into a more stable set at address that has your weight in the balls of your feet feeling stable and powerful and allows you to turn within reason. 

 

Thanks.

 

This is something I wanted to ask, is my backswing generally in the OK-zone up to this spot? Hand-arm-path wise so if I "just" have to short it, or its more of a total rebuild. 

 

Right leg movement if something Ive gotten from my others threads, the intention is probably to push me to my lead leg, but with a raising and dropping into the left leg. I was linked videos showing long drive guys even putting their feet on a step up so its really dramatic. Now Im starting to question that idea. 

I will try to wrench something together with a pool noodle or something to physically stop me from moving my arms up. Ive done a DIY-step board that will hopefully help me understand the weightshift better. 

Why Im asking for different training aids is that I obviously have trouble learning. Im prone to falling in trap of chasing immediate speed gains, especially after feeling I wasted almost 3 months working on the wrong things. Whats also messing with my head is watching really fast guys are all across the line but they have like 35mph on me and its coming from something, and there is plenty of guys alot faster than me not really going much across the line.

[RayPlan]

14 minutes ago, Brokensticks said:

 

Thanks.

 

This is something I wanted to ask, is my backswing generally in the OK-zone up to this spot? Hand-arm-path wise so if I "just" have to short it, or its more of a total rebuild. 

 

Right leg movement if something Ive gotten from my others threads, the intention is probably to push me to my lead leg, but with a raising and dropping into the left leg. I was linked videos showing long drive guys even putting their feet on a step up so its really dramatic. Now Im starting to question that idea. 

I will try to wrench something together with a pool noodle or something to physically stop me from moving my arms up. Ive done a DIY-step board that will hopefully help me understand the weightshift better. 

Why Im asking for different training aids is that I obviously have trouble learning. Im prone to falling in trap of chasing immediate speed gains, especially after feeling I wasted almost 3 months working on the wrong things. Whats also messing with my head is watching really fast guys are all across the line but they have like 35mph on me and its coming from something, and there is plenty of guys alot faster than me not really going much across the line.

I can't comment on the technical aspects of how your swing looks in that comparison picture, but I can offer something about the mental side of things.

 

I don't think you have trouble learning, I think you have trouble letting go of your preconceived notions about how to generate speed. You have the power within you to say "I'm going to set those things aside for now and look at the swing in a different way." I had a lot of ideas about the golf swing that I gathered from a variety of sources, but I couldn't piece them together into a cohesive whole that actually improved my swing. Once I started listening to good advice, I realized that I needed to keep it simple.

 

It seems like you're thinking about way too many things at once, because you really shouldn't need some kind of device just to stop you from taking the club back so far. Just try it, like others have said above. Take a short swing or two, review the video, then repeat. Thinking you need to buy or create a training aid seems like a way to delay or externalize the issue, when it's a really simple thing you're trying to do here.

 

What could it hurt just to try?

[Brokensticks]

3 hours ago, RayPlan said:

I can't comment on the technical aspects of how your swing looks in that comparison picture, but I can offer something about the mental side of things.

 

I don't think you have trouble learning, I think you have trouble letting go of your preconceived notions about how to generate speed. You have the power within you to say "I'm going to set those things aside for now and look at the swing in a different way." I had a lot of ideas about the golf swing that I gathered from a variety of sources, but I couldn't piece them together into a cohesive whole that actually improved my swing. Once I started listening to good advice, I realized that I needed to keep it simple.

 

It seems like you're thinking about way too many things at once, because you really shouldn't need some kind of device just to stop you from taking the club back so far. Just try it, like others have said above. Take a short swing or two, review the video, then repeat. Thinking you need to buy or create a training aid seems like a way to delay or externalize the issue, when it's a really simple thing you're trying to do here.

 

What could it hurt just to try?

My problem is that I have no awareness and I think ”building a box to swing inside” could help me with instant feedback rather than trying to feel something, stopping and going to review a video. I have no real rememberance of what I did because just like you say Im juggling these things

 

Straight lead arm, straighter trail arm, flat wrist, armpath more outside, keeping swing short, straighting trail leg, getting to lead leg sooner etc and its a mess for me. I come back thinking my arm path feels way different and I ended up making some things worse. 
 

I went to a simulator and apparently, trackman has a camera app for instant live video feedback that I was unaware off on the main screen. Will check that put before next time. 
 

Anyway, this is me trying to concentrate on keeping it shorter. Everything else I tried to think off went out the window and as can be seen, its a very minor one and the worse thing is the longer swing felt better and faster, not effort so Im not honest on myself.  Im just trying to take it slow with a wedge but Im so far off this will probably take some time. Unfortunately my arms got sucked in when its not my main swing thought. 

[Brokensticks]

This is rehearsing between the shots and hitting a few from static top position. Not sure if this is the arm structure I would be looking for? Thanks. Sorry ios device. 

 

 

[RayPlan]

45 minutes ago, Brokensticks said:

This is rehearsing between the shots and hitting a few from static top position. Not sure if this is the arm structure I would be looking for? Thanks. Sorry ios device. 

IMG_7959.mov 43.28 MB · 1 download  

 

This is just a short excerpt of the full video, from the top:

 

 

 

 

[PedronNiall]

9 hours ago, golferdude54 said:

 

You're really splitting hairs here. His setup passes the eye test with an A grade already. He's not too far from the ball or too close to it nor is his ball position too far forward or back, I could go on and on. It just looks normal aesthetically, and that's alright.

 

So it's nitpicking to point out that on average pro golfers setup with more depth and spine tilt than OP and are able to maintain both their spine tilt and depth better as well rather than standing up out of it? Is it nitpicking to point out that their address positions allow them to control the length of their swing more easily than OP? Is it nitpicking to point out that it will take far more effort to spend weeks training himself to arrest the swing from his current starting position?

 

His setup adds something he has to compensate for that the majority of pro golfers do not. Their arms hang straight down and allow for a better spine angle, his reach for the ball and have him starting more upright and standing up from there to collapse his arms in a runaway backswing. 

 

A slight tweak at address is much easier than trying to learn to control his backswing length as a conscious exercise during each swing the way he'd have to with his current positions. 

 

 

Vs

 

 

 

8 hours ago, Brokensticks said:

 

Thanks.

 

This is something I wanted to ask, is my backswing generally in the OK-zone up to this spot? Hand-arm-path wise so if I "just" have to short it, or its more of a total rebuild. 

 

Right leg movement if something Ive gotten from my others threads, the intention is probably to push me to my lead leg, but with a raising and dropping into the left leg. I was linked videos showing long drive guys even putting their feet on a step up so its really dramatic. Now Im starting to question that idea. 

I will try to wrench something together with a pool noodle or something to physically stop me from moving my arms up. Ive done a DIY-step board that will hopefully help me understand the weightshift better. 

Why Im asking for different training aids is that I obviously have trouble learning. Im prone to falling in trap of chasing immediate speed gains, especially after feeling I wasted almost 3 months working on the wrong things. Whats also messing with my head is watching really fast guys are all across the line but they have like 35mph on me and its coming from something, and there is plenty of guys alot faster than me not really going much across the line.

 

My guy, what long drivers do should be the last thing on your mind right now. You need a repeatable, controllable, efficient swing before you ever worry about chasing more distance. Get the fundamentals right, then you can worry about more speed, and that's if you even need to chase speed at that point. 

[golferdude54]

27 minutes ago, PedronNiall said:

 

So it's nitpicking to point out that on average pro golfers setup with more depth and spine tilt than OP and are able to maintain both their spine tilt and depth better as well rather than standing up out of it? Is it nitpicking to point out that their address positions allow them to control the length of their swing more easily than OP? Is it nitpicking to point out that it will take far more effort to spend weeks training himself to arrest the swing from his current starting position?

 

His setup adds something he has to compensate for that the majority of pro golfers do not. Their arms hang straight down and allow for a better spine angle, his reach for the ball and have him starting more upright and standing up from there to collapse his arms in a runaway backswing. 

 

A slight tweak at address is much easier than trying to learn to control his backswing length as a conscious exercise during each swing the way he'd have to with his current positions. 

 

 

Vs

 

 

 

 

My guy, what long drivers do should be the last thing on your mind right now. You need a repeatable, controllable, efficient swing before you ever worry about chasing more distance. Get the fundamentals right, then you can worry about more speed, and that's if you even need to chase speed at that point. 

 

Shoulders in front of toes, butt behind heels, knees flexed but not flexed past toes, arms not too far out or in, and back posture is shaped fine.

 

 

So you're saying Ben Hogan and Mickey Wright were compensating for their setups. According to your model, their arms seem to be pretty far out to me.

[Golfbeat]

What may also help to shorten your back swing is to put a glove in your right arm pit.

[Valtiel]

On 2/2/2025 at 1:37 PM, Brokensticks said:

This is rehearsing between the shots and hitting a few from static top position. Not sure if this is the arm structure I would be looking for? Thanks. Sorry ios device. 

IMG_7959.mov 43.28 MB · 2 downloads  

 

Yup, thats pretty good. Length wise it's as long as you'd want to be and plane wise it's quite neutral. The one caveat would be when you pause and look back the club is quite laid off (not bad in a vacuum) and the swing you then complete from that paused position goes from laid off to neutral quite quickly. Both positions are viable, but flipping from the former to the latter can be dangerous because the shaft plane changing that much, that late, and in that direction is something that works directly against what you need in transition, which is the club going back the other way. Some guys like Cameron Smith use this as a bit of a trigger, but when you're working yourself out of a bad ingrained pattern it's good to be very diligent in resisting things that resemble that pattern. 

One thing I would suggest is that laid off position you stopped and looked at:



See if you can maintain that same shaft plane all the way to the top of your swing. Exaggerate whatever you need to feel to make that happen. You might not want to ultimately swing from there, but learning to feel what "laid off" actually feels like and what it takes to produce is basically the opposite of the pattern you had before, and as such has a lot of value. So take that structure you have there and turn it all the way to the "top" while challenging yourself to hit some shots from there. 

Edited February 3 by Valtiel

[Brokensticks]

So, Ive been debating if I should post another video because I work on one thing and the other thing gets back to same ingrained pattern. 
 

I think the wrists are in a better place but probably doesnt matter in the bigger picture. Most likely not as flat as in still picture but atleast not cupping like crazy. 

 

 

Ive tried to reduce my turn (sportbox says shoulders are 102° and hips 55ish) but that turns into the most horrible start left and wipe it you could ever imagine and only thing that fixes it with this pattern is turning the right cheek ”up against the wall”.

 

Still want to try what Pedron suggested and see if it reduces things but it hurt the speed alot going a short backswing.

 

Speed is the same, 85ish with Pw, 115 w driver. Wrist set has atleast helped with reduce the right miss. However, Im a pretty weak guy. I probably couldnt even bench 100lbs for ten reps, serious. 
 

Debating on trying some online coaching like Montes. Ive looked around more locally but Ive heard stuff like ”why are you not happy with tour average and hitting fairways?” and that keeps me from investing money into it. 

[GoGoErky]

If you want to improve then going online with Monte or several others like Iacas, Dan Carraher, Jayson Nickol to mention some is your best bet. 
 

That swing is longer than people’s driver swings 

 

fairways aren’t that important. Distance is a bigger advantage even if it’s just into the rough. 

[iacas]

I don't think you see the golf ball at the top. Certainly not well.

 

If you're right eye dominant… hooo boy.

 

[Brokensticks]

2 minutes ago, iacas said:

I don't think you see the golf ball at the top. Certainly not well.

 

If you're right eye dominant… hooo boy.

 

Yeah I noticed that as well, I have no idea how I play a 3 while 32 putting on average. 
 

My best guess is the long swing gives me time to catch up/time it and same reason Im spraying all over the place when I try to make it shorter. 
 

All of that turns to s*** when I dont practice 3 days a week and play another 2.