“Extreme Counterbalanced”

[Red4282]

I know this guy used to be on these forums (I believe his name is AJ), maybe he still is, but this video was a bit shocking. He made an “extreme counterbalanced” set, by having 1.5” over standard, putting a heavy counterbalanced weight in the butt, but then gripping down by the 1.5” or so. Whats the big deal, you ask… well his 7 iron shot data went from 90-91mph, ball speeds low 120s, carrying about 170, to 95mph, 130bs, carrying 195ish.

 

Is this legit? And how?

 

 

[Stuart_G]

16 hours ago, Red4282 said:

I know this guy used to be on these forums (I believe his name is AJ), maybe he still is, but this video was a bit shocking. He made an “extreme counterbalanced” set, by having 1.5” over standard, putting a heavy counterbalanced weight in the butt, but then gripping down by the 1.5” or so. Whats the big deal, you ask… well his 7 iron shot data went from 90-91mph, ball speeds low 120s, carrying about 170, to 95mph, 130bs, carrying 195ish.

 

Is this legit? And how?

 

Sorry, IMO those types of youtube vids are a waste of time.

 

The question is not whether it's legit or not.  The better question is:  even if it might be legit for one person, does that also mean it's going to work that way for anyone else?   Is it really the butt weight that helped or is it just that some other aspect of the non-cB build was a bad fit to begin with and the CB compensated for in some way.

 

If you want to experiment and give it a try, go ahead.   There are plenty of ways to temporarily add weight to the butt.   Just don't get your hopes up to high.    According to someone who did a lot of research into the benefits of effects of added butt weight over a much larger sample size it shows that yes, some will benefit from it, some will be indifferent to it and for others it will make things work.  And there is currently no known way to predict which category any particular individual might fall into.

 

And FWIW, the extra 1.5" of length is either a gimmick or an indication that he's using the wrong grip size to begin with.

 

Edited March 11 by Stuart_G

[Red4282]

1 hour ago, Stuart_G said:

 

Sorry, those youtube vids are a waste of time.

 

The question is not whether it's legit or not.  The better question is:  even if it might be legit for one person, does that also mean it's going to work that way for anyone else?   Is it really the butt weight that helped or is it just that some other aspect of the non-cB build was a bad fit to begin with and the CB compensated for in some way.

 

If you want to experiment and give it a try, go ahead.   There are plenty of ways to temporarily add weight to the butt.   Just don't get your hopes up to high.    According to someone who did a lot of research into the benefits of effects of added butt weight over a much larger sample size it shows that yes, some will benefit from it, some will be indifferent to it and for others it will make things work.  And there is currently no known way to predict which category any particular individual might fall into.

 

And FWIW, the extra 1.5" of length is either a gimmick or an indication that he's using the wrong grip size to begin with.

 

As someone who uses a counterbalanced putter, I could get on board with the benefits to keeping hands steady. But a lot of this just doesn't make sense to my logical brain. First, in a putting stroke, little to no wrist action is what is desired, but when it comes to full swings, the wrists and hands are a major power source.

 

The speed gains just seem fishy. I have an old 6 iron head and an extra shaft laying around, I just may build it up to see. 

[Stuart_G]

1 hour ago, Red4282 said:

As someone who uses a counterbalanced putter, I could get on board with the benefits to keeping hands steady. But a lot of this just doesn't make sense to my logical brain. First, in a putting stroke, little to no wrist action is what is desired, but when it comes to full swings, the wrists and hands are a major power source.

 

The speed gains just seem fishy. I have an old 6 iron head and an extra shaft laying around, I just may build it up to see. 

 

I'm not sure I'd call it fishy - at least conceptually.    The weight feel(s) of the club can play a big part in both how much and when we apply forces to the club as we swing it.  So can potentially effect rhythm, tempo, sequencing and even in some cases club path or plane.  It's not that much different in how important it is to fit for shaft weight.   Adding weight to the butt end is basically an extreme case of increasing the static weight (linear resistance) without any effective increase in the MOI (rotational resistance).  So it's not really that surprising that it can effect the ball flight results.

 

It's just that one can never assume that everyone will get the same improvements or changes to the results.  Every one is different in how they respond to changes in feel.  And it's also going to be very dependent on how good the fit of the equipment is - and how good the mechanics are before adding the butt weight.  So seeing such a significant increase could possibly be an indication that the fit of the club before adding the weight might have been less than ideal - or there could be some issue with the mechanics that the added weight helps "fix" - such as a change in the sequencing to increase efficiency of the swing.   But those are just some of many possibilities as to why he got the results he did.

 

Then there is also the consideration that any equipment feel based changes may not be permanent.  The more we get used to the "new" feel and it becomes the normal feel, the chances of any old habits creeping back into the swing increases.  Only time will tell if any improvements will last or not.

 

 

Edited March 11 by Stuart_G

[ChaosTheory]

He is on here, but I’ve never seen him post in a thread that is discussing one of his videos.  Can’t blame him, I guess.

[Red4282]

1 hour ago, ChaosTheory said:

He is on here, but I’ve never seen him post in a thread that is discussing one of his videos.  Can’t blame him, I guess.

Ah, thats a shame, have a lot of questions about it, find it very interesting.

[Red4282]

Built it up and can verify, for me, no extra speed. It did have a slightly different feel, but I didnt see any dispersion improvements really either. 

[Howard_Jones]

On 3/10/2025 at 9:00 PM, Red4282 said:

I know this guy used to be on these forums (I believe his name is AJ), maybe he still is, but this video was a bit shocking. He made an “extreme counterbalanced” set, by having 1.5” over standard, putting a heavy counterbalanced weight in the butt, but then gripping down by the 1.5” or so. Whats the big deal, you ask… well his 7 iron shot data went from 90-91mph, ball speeds low 120s, carrying about 170, to 95mph, 130bs, carrying 195ish.

 

Is this legit? And how?

 

 

The idea is not new, and i dont know who came up with it, maybe it was Balance certified who makes counterweights, (they clame to be the first with that), and there has also been a Golf club company (cant recall their name), who used lighter shafts, and a insert weight (same total wgt) and claimed it would deliver higher speed and distance.

I never tried that out like The Mobile club maker does here (@Adam C is his profile name here),but im open to that it might be so, since i never tested that, and cant tell if is right or wrong.

PS dont compare CW inserts for putters vs full swing clubs, they dont work the same way.

[Pnwpingi210]

12 minutes ago, Howard_Jones said:

The idea is not new, and i dont know who came up with it, maybe it was Balance certified who makes counterweights, (they clame to be the first with that), and there has also been a Golf club company (cant recall their name), who used lighter shafts, and a insert weight (same total wgt) and claimed it would deliver higher speed and distance.

I never tried that out like The Mobile club maker does here (@Adam C is his profile name here),but im open to that it might be so, since i never tested that, and cant tell if is right or wrong.

PS dont compare CW inserts for putters vs full swing clubs, they dont work the same way.

I have some counterweight testing anecdotes.
 

I built up a demo “Bryson” 9 iron a few months ago with a jumbo max xl grip that was 130 ish grams and really like it in the irons and even the wedges.  Consistency was really good and I picked up almost 8 mph on club head speed when comparing the Bryson build (37.5) to my normal 6 iron.

 

what present led the problem was I hated it with the driver.  Couldn’t square the face and pushed the very ball I hit, and I hit a lot of them.  
 

in the end the I abandoned the experiment since I didn’t want to play two vastly different grip and swing-weights in my woods vs irons.

 

 

[Maine Golfer]

Im sure he's fine, he does extreme ideas to generate clicks.  Its up to you if you want to try it! 

[alittleoverpar]

I remember reading somewhere that Jack Nicklaus used counterbalanced weights in his irons, if that is true, then the idea has been around for a while.

[hollabachgt]

50 minutes ago, alittleoverpar said:

I remember reading somewhere that Jack Nicklaus used counterbalanced weights in his irons, if that is true, then the idea has been around for a while.

Hogan used counterbalanced irons.

[azgreg]

https://golfweek.usatoday.com/story/sports/golf/2004/04/03/clubmaker-counterbalanced-jack-nicklauss-golf-club/76790069007/

 

[taki27]

16 hours ago, alittleoverpar said:

I remember reading somewhere that Jack Nicklaus used counterbalanced weights in his irons, if that is true, then the idea has been around for a while.

Counterbalancing has been around forever.  What AJ is trying on the video is different than your standard counterbalancing, which is usually a weight inside the shaft by the grip.  I’ve used counterbalancing like that in my graphite shafts for 30 years (Tour Lock has to be 20 years old and they sold back weights for years before that).  He is actually making the club 1.5 inches longer and basically adding the full

counterweight ABOVE the hands.  I could try it once, but I already know I wouldn’t like it because I hate choking down (it’s an unreasonable OCD thing, even if it worked)