Morikawa + Greiner = success?

[CHM 12]

https://www.yahoo.com/sports/article/collin-morikawa-splits-longtime-caddie-183208819.html
 

I'm shocked he’s switching caddies since everything appears to be coming together. Maybe he thinks the JT boost will help him finally close out some of these tournaments. Thoughts?

[BSI99]

Morikawa needs a change. It's pretty obvious he's having major mental blocks over closing and his game hasn't looked all too sharp lately. 

[Zjhl2024]

as long as he only plays with cuts, I don't think he will make any breakthrough in his game

[Mr.Cleeks]

Collin needs more pop off the tee. There’s no other way around it. He hits it about 10 yards shorter than the avg tour player. I remember last year at Augusta Scottie was bombing it past him 

[BSI99]

10 minutes ago, Zjhl2024 said:

as long as he only plays with cuts, I don't think he will make any breakthrough in his game

He won 2 majors only playing cuts, I don't think the shot shape is the issue. I agree though he needs more ball speed, since he last won the field is jumping up in speed and he's being left behind.

[Titleist99]

 

Collin Morikawa immediately becomes my favorite to win the PGA Championship.

 

Especially since Xander and Scottie can't recover from their freak accidents. 🙂

[airjammer]

2 hours ago, Mr.Cleeks said:

Collin needs more pop off the tee. There’s no other way around it. He hits it about 10 yards shorter than the avg tour player. I remember last year at Augusta Scottie was bombing it past him 

My thoughts exactly. You can only hit it so good and when you are 25 yards behind the likes of Rory, you need your A+ game to close it out and he’s not been showing up on Sundays with that game. 

[Mr.Cleeks]

1 hour ago, airjammer said:

My thoughts exactly. You can only hit it so good and when you are 25 yards behind the likes of Rory, you need your A+ game to close it out and he’s not been showing up on Sundays with that game. 

I don’t think he’s actually doing anything to gain distance. He’s always in the 295 yard range. Scottie averages about 6 yards more off the tee but he clearly has another gear if he needs it. 

[PedronNiall]

4 hours ago, Thollo said:

He won 2 majors only playing cuts, I don't think the shot shape is the issue. I agree though he needs more ball speed, since he last won the field is jumping up in speed and he's being left behind.

 

It's not just that he plays a cut, it's that he's all but unable to call up draws when they'd give the best result. Yeah, many great players mained a fade, but they could draw on demand and Morikawa can't, and there's the distance issue. 

 

Still, he doesn't play anymore like he did in those Majors. Guy was stone cold focused down the stretch, even dropping 20+ foot putts to save par at The Open without missing a beat, and he's looked nothing close to that in years. 

[Titleist99]

1 hour ago, Mr.Cleeks said:

I don’t think he’s actually doing anything to gain distance. He’s always in the 295 yard range. Scottie averages about 6 yards more off the tee but he clearly has another gear if he needs it. 

 

He's not chasing distance, nor should he; 295 yards off the tee is enough to win on any golf course on the planet. You're correct regarding Scottie's length as well. He's around the 300 range and manages to do quite well with that.

 

It's the talking heads that are obsessed with swing speed, ball speed, etc... IMO

[Mr.Cleeks]

9 minutes ago, Titleist99 said:

 

He's not chasing distance, nor should he; 295 yards off the tee is enough to win on any golf course on the planet. You're correct regarding Scottie's length as well. He's around the 300 range and manages to do quite well with that.

 

It's the talking heads that are obsessed with swing speed, ball speed, etc... IMO

Distance matters in the modern game and it’s the reason Collin doesn’t win as much as he should. If he picked up 10ish yards off the tee, he’d be tough to beat. I just think he’s a tier below Rory and Scottie right now and a lot of it has to do with lack of distance. 

Edited April 30 by Mr.Cleeks

[Titleist99]

10 hours ago, Mr.Cleeks said:

Distance matters in the modern game and it’s the reason Collin doesn’t win as much as he should. If he picked up 10ish yards off the tee, he’d be tough to beat. I just think he’s a tier below Rory and Scottie right now and a lot of it has to do with lack of distance. 

 

Agree to disagree....

 

IMO If Collin Morikawa pursued more distance, he would then become Matt Fitzpatrick or Max Homa.

 

~Lost in the wilderness.  🙂

[Jayjay_theweim_guy]

He's 14th on the entire Tour in SG:  Off the Tee.  3rd in SG:  Tee to Green.  Now that's due to lapping the field in fairway accuracy and likely iron accuracy as well, and I don't know how well that skill correlates year to year, but still... 

 

Putting and Short Game are meh this year; that's why he's not crushing like before.  No idea why that's the case.

[Titleist99]

11 minutes ago, Jayjay_theweim_guy said:

He's 14th on the entire Tour in SG:  Off the Tee.  3rd in SG:  Tee to Green.  Now that's due to lapping the field in fairway accuracy and likely iron accuracy as well, and I don't know how well that skill correlates year to year, but still... 

 

Putting and Short Game are meh this year; that's why he's not crushing like before.  No idea why that's the case.

100%.      Let's see how the new caddy pans out.

[Mr.Cleeks]

29 minutes ago, Titleist99 said:

 

Agree to disagree....

 

IMO If Collin Morikawa pursued more distance, he would then become Matt Fitzpatrick or Max Homa.

 

~Lost in the wilderness.  🙂

Yeah well Xander won multiple majors after that. 10 yards isn’t gonna ruin Morikawa’s game. Fitzpatrick’s iron game has regressed. Nothing to do w distance 

[BSI99]

11 hours ago, Titleist99 said:

 

He's not chasing distance, nor should he; 295 yards off the tee is enough to win on any golf course on the planet. You're correct regarding Scottie's length as well. He's around the 300 range and manages to do quite well with that.

 

It's the talking heads that are obsessed with swing speed, ball speed, etc... IMO

I disagree with your take that it's enough to win any at any golf course. Sure if he has his A++ game he can win anywhere, but that's not going to happen and it's gonna be really tough to win at a course like Oakmont with his distance. Look at the Masters, Bryson had maybe his C game yet the fact that he hits the ball a mile was still enough to keep him in contention until Sunday. 

[tippethor]

Martin Kaymer became world nr 1 with only cuts. Rocco almost took down Tiger with only draws. Harman won The Open with a ballspeed of Morikawa’s 3 wood. 
 

Colin needs to get his short game and putting back on track. And for gods sake stop having a long discussion with his caddie on every shot. Trust your instincts its what got him to the top.

[BSI99]

There are a lot of ways to skin a cat. My opinion is that gaining strokes chipping and putting at the highest level is very difficult and highly variable. Gaining 10 yards off the tee is significantly easier and decreases the overall variability in your game. Collin can get back to winning either way, but 1 is much easier than the other. 

[Titleist99]

23 minutes ago, Thollo said:

I disagree with your take that it's enough to win any at any golf course. Sure if he has his A++ game he can win anywhere, but that's not going to happen and it's gonna be really tough to win at a course like Oakmont with his distance. Look at the Masters, Bryson had maybe his C game yet the fact that he hits the ball a mile was still enough to keep him in contention until Sunday. 

 

Agree to disagree. My counter would be Scottie Scheffler and Xander Schaufele. Both average a modest 295-305 off the tee (which is my unverified hypothesis).

 

Those numbers are the sweet spot in my opinion, and I'd put either of those guys against anyone in the top twenty in driving distance on the PGAT.

[Jayjay_theweim_guy]

30 minutes ago, Titleist99 said:

 

Agree to disagree. My counter would be Scottie Scheffler and Xander Schaufele. Both average a modest 295-305 off the tee (which is my unverified hypothesis).

 

Those numbers are the sweet spot in my opinion, and I'd put either of those guys against anyone in the top twenty in driving distance on the PGAT.

Xander, 71st at 303.2; Scottie 82nd at 301.7.

 

Morikawa could totally use another 10 yds.  It'd only help, provided he didn't feel like he had to change anything else about his swing.  Which is the catch, isn't it?  But 10 fewer yards off the tee isn't why he hasn't been racking up wins.

 

BDC does hit the ball a mile still, true.  But he also has some fairly impressive short game/putting chops. ~1.5 in Around the Green, nearly that in Putting, per DataGolf.  Morikawa right now isn't awful there---DataGolf still has him above PGAT avg for both---but he's not that good.  Like a hair above avg for Putting and like +3/4 SG for ATG.

Edited April 30 by Jayjay_theweim_guy

[bcjim]

He's always been as good as his putting.  

[Golfnutgalen]

 

Morikawa isn't even that short per datagolf, always hovering a little above or below tour average. He's not the equivalent of Jim Furyk, Scott Verplank, or David Toms who were legit short hitters. 

 

His worst statistic is almost always putting. His around the green game is hit or miss as well. 

 

[cardoustie]

Embrace your strengths and work on weaknesses … don’t re-invent the wheel 

 

kid has a good US Open game and then he could be another Grand Slam chaser 

[Bakeyham]

Back to the original idea of the thread, Collin needs someone to tell him what to do and not question it. You can tell Collin either wasn’t trusting what JJ was telling him to do, or JJ wasn’t instilling confidence in Collin’s own decisions.
 

Hopefully Joe can right the ship for him. I think Collin has a ton of work to do in the mental department, but Joe seems like the right guy to fix that based on his previous experiences. 

Edited April 30 by Bakeyham

[Mr.Cleeks]

1 hour ago, Titleist99 said:

 

Agree to disagree. My counter would be Scottie Scheffler and Xander Schaufele. Both average a modest 295-305 off the tee (which is my unverified hypothesis).

 

Those numbers are the sweet spot in my opinion, and I'd put either of those guys against anyone in the top twenty in driving distance on the PGAT.

Scottie and Xander have always been in the 300-310 range and they have that extra gear when needed. The longer the easier the game IMO

[9thGreenAt9]

trying to make Collin something he's not (long hitter) is a gamble that has been proven to not be worth the risk...because he's so good he won 2 majors at a young age, trying to disrupt his swing by adding speed can throw off his whole game....with his height and frame I'd be working on the putting and not worrying about 10 more yards. 

[BSI99]

I think adding speed does "future proof" your game though.  He's not that short now but if he decides to not add any speed he will quickly get left behind as the rest of the tour gets longer and longer. That is until the ball rollback (lol) and then he may be the best player on tour.

[BBO]

2 hours ago, Bakeyham said:

Back to the original idea of the thread, Collin needs someone to tell him what to do and not question it. You can tell Collin either wasn’t trusting what JJ was telling him to do, or JJ wasn’t instilling confidence in Collin’s own decisions.
 

Hopefully Joe can right the ship for him. I think Collin has a ton of work to do in the mental department, but Joe seems like the right guy to fix that based on his previous experiences. 

Agreed. The caddy isn't the one telling him to speed train so I don't know how that discussion took off. Hopefully they work well together as they both have the potential.

[mosesgolf]

On 4/29/2025 at 2:57 PM, Zjhl2024 said:

as long as he only plays with cuts, I don't think he will make any breakthrough in his game

Doesn't seem to be working very well.  He'd likely have a grand slam by now if he played a draw too like Rory 😂  Only 2 majors at 28 years old.  

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Collin_Morikawa

[GDB67]

Crying Collin