To the instructors, an apology

[GoGoErky]

3 minutes ago, KD1 said:

 

Are you venting or asking the forum for help?

Was wondering the samething.

[GoGoErky]

10 hours ago, TexasTurf said:

We're 9 lessons in and have tried balloons between the arms and "hanger" type devices to get from clubhead even with hands at impact to clubhead behind hands at impact and nothing has worked. I hit it center face but cannot get hands forward. Still so right side dominant, frustrating.

Can you do it with slow swings?

[RayPlan]

11 hours ago, TexasTurf said:

We're 9 lessons in and have tried balloons between the arms and "hanger" type devices to get from clubhead even with hands at impact to clubhead behind hands at impact and nothing has worked. I hit it center face but cannot get hands forward. Still so right side dominant, frustrating.

After 9 lessons, can you explain in your own words why that's important and what you would need to do to achieve it? I'm assuming your instructor didn't just have you blindly take swings with training aids. Do you feel like you're learning anything?

 

Did your instructor tell you that you were right side dominant? What does that mean?

 

What are you doing between lessons?

[parbung]

i have no idea what any of that means, but im happy for you op. 

[ThinkingPlus]

11 hours ago, TexasTurf said:

We're 9 lessons in and have tried balloons between the arms and "hanger" type devices to get from clubhead even with hands at impact to clubhead behind hands at impact and nothing has worked. I hit it center face but cannot get hands forward. Still so right side dominant, frustrating.

So I would encourage you to keep at it with the drills your instructor has assigned to help with your issue. However, if you would like an additional drill, you might try the following. I have/had a similar issue with shaft lean.

 

At the top of your backswing, pin your upper trail arm to your side and as you swing down drop the trail arm/hand down keeping it close to your side. Just rotate through keeping that trail side pinned and hand close to your trail thigh. At that point you should have rotated enough to clear hips and can extend the trail arm at the target.

 

Keeping the trail arm pinned and trail hand close to the body makes it easier to resist centrifugal force pulling the trail arm out behind the ball. Once you hit some 3/4 shots and get good contact you will feel more comfortable that you can get solid contact with hands ahead (part of my issue was trusting that I wouldn't hit it right of right). Good luck.

[TexasTurf]

11 hours ago, ThinkingPlus said:

So I would encourage you to keep at it with the drills your instructor has assigned to help with your issue. However, if you would like an additional drill, you might try the following. I have/had a similar issue with shaft lean.

 

At the top of your backswing, pin your upper trail arm to your side and as you swing down drop the trail arm/hand down keeping it close to your side. Just rotate through keeping that trail side pinned and hand close to your trail thigh. At that point you should have rotated enough to clear hips and can extend the trail arm at the target.

 

Keeping the trail arm pinned and trail hand close to the body makes it easier to resist centrifugal force pulling the trail arm out behind the ball. Once you hit some 3/4 shots and get good contact you will feel more comfortable that you can get solid contact with hands ahead (part of my issue was trusting that I wouldn't hit it right of right). Good luck.

Thank you, I appreciate it.

[TexasTurf]

13 hours ago, GoGoErky said:

Can you do it with slow swings?

Negative, can only get hands in front of ball if my head is at about my waist height going into impact.

[TexasTurf]

13 hours ago, KD1 said:

 

Are you venting or asking the forum for help?

Great question. Yeah more venting than anything, while passively asking for help. I'm being taught the Club Pro Guy down up motion while also being told to hit down on the ball with a hook motion, while already hitting it fat and overhooking to start with. Seems to be adding to the issues instead of helping. 

[GoGoErky]

5 hours ago, TexasTurf said:

Negative, can only get hands in front of ball if my head is at about my waist height going into impact.

If you can’t achieve the result with slows swings you’re going to struggle to do it at full speed. You need to work slow swings to train the brain on the movement pattern and then slowly add speed, when you reach a speed you can no longer do it back off to slower speed and work on it more and then increase the speed again.

 

 

[GoGoErky]

5 hours ago, TexasTurf said:

Great question. Yeah more venting than anything, while passively asking for help. I'm being taught the Club Pro Guy down up motion while also being told to hit down on the ball with a hook motion, while already hitting it fat and overhooking to start with. Seems to be adding to the issues instead of helping. 

You said you had 9 lessons. How far alert have those lessons been between each one?

[TexasTurf]

On 6/20/2025 at 4:57 AM, GoGoErky said:

You said you had 9 lessons. How far alert have those lessons been between each one?

About a week or two apart, I thought they were teaching stack and tilt and first which turned me off, but it seems like they're just teaching more of a Malaska move, which I'm good with. 

 

For some reason I've always followed the way open to way closed clubface guys and tried to copy that. (Erikson, Hogan, Bradley Hughes..) This is the opposite. 

[TheDeanAbides]

6 hours ago, TexasTurf said:

About a week or two apart, I thought they were teaching stack and tilt and first which turned me off, but it seems like they're just teaching more of a Malaska move, which I'm good with. 

 

For some reason I've always followed the way open to way closed clubface guys and tried to copy that. (Erikson, Hogan, Bradley Hughes..) This is the opposite. 

Why would you book a lesson without a chat to determine the pros philosophy? This should be the first port of call. 

[GoGoErky]

7 hours ago, TexasTurf said:

About a week or two apart, I thought they were teaching stack and tilt and first which turned me off, but it seems like they're just teaching more of a Malaska move, which I'm good with. 

 

For some reason I've always followed the way open to way closed clubface guys and tried to copy that. (Erikson, Hogan, Bradley Hughes..) This is the opposite. 

How much practice are you getting in between lessons?

[TexasTurf]

16 hours ago, TheDeanAbides said:

Why would you book a lesson without a chat to determine the pros philosophy? This should be the first port of call. 

This is Dallas, there is no chat without pay. I've contacted all "recommended" instructors on this site in DFW and they all say they have no openings for new students for years. You can't join a horribly run and maintained club in this city for less than 80 to 100k initiation. 

 

But the real reason, they have 6+ instructors, I can take lessons from all of them. They have all the cameras, force plates, and technology (before I was with an old man with a net in his back yard telling me to go harder with the right shoulder, to the point of hurting the right shoulder). I don't know what philosophy is right for me. What I have been doing on my own isn't working, so I'm willing to try several new perspectives to see if anything helps. 

[TexasTurf]

15 hours ago, GoGoErky said:

How much practice are you getting in between lessons?

Plenty. I spend 12+ hours per day on course. The biggest issue seems to be trying something new to work on every lesson, it keeps changing.

Edited June 23 by TexasTurf

[GoGoErky]

5 hours ago, TexasTurf said:

Plenty. I spend 12+ hours per day on course. The biggest issue seems to be trying something new to work on every lesson, it keeps changing.

What does your on course time look like? Does that include range time, practicing what you learned after the lesson?

 

a week or two between lessons can be to quick of a turn around for a lot of people when trying to make a

change and even more so if it’s something new every time.

[RayPlan]

7 hours ago, TexasTurf said:

But the real reason, they have 6+ instructors, I can take lessons from all of them. They have all the cameras, force plates, and technology (before I was with an old man with a net in his back yard telling me to go harder with the right shoulder, to the point of hurting the right shoulder). I don't know what philosophy is right for me. What I have been doing on my own isn't working, so I'm willing to try several new perspectives to see if anything helps. 

I think I've spotted the problem. You may be getting multiple perspectives that may not be consistent or even compatible with each other. If you're just getting more lessons because you think more is inherently better, you may just be spinning your wheels unproductively. 

 

Do you ever see the same person twice in a row?

Edited June 23 by RayPlan

[TexasTurf]

17 hours ago, RayPlan said:

I think I've spotted the problem. You may be getting multiple perspectives that may not be consistent or even compatible with each other. If you're just getting more lessons because you think more is inherently better, you may just be spinning your wheels unproductively. 

 

Do you ever see the same person twice in a row?

I've been seeing the same guy, but they all work together and pitch in.

[TexasTurf]

18 hours ago, GoGoErky said:

What does your on course time look like? Does that include range time, practicing what you learned after the lesson?

 

a week or two between lessons can be to quick of a turn around for a lot of people when trying to make a

change and even more so if it’s something new every time.

Definitely need more time. But fine checking in a lot. I love Monte but I need the exact opposite of Rose drill. Currently under plane going back and even more under plane and going through, and need much more "handle dragging" and "over the top." They've never seen this pattern before so we're trying to figure it out.

[RayPlan]

2 hours ago, TexasTurf said:

Definitely need more time. But fine checking in a lot. I love Monte but I need the exact opposite of Rose drill. Currently under plane going back and even more under plane and going through, and need much more "handle dragging" and "over the top." They've never seen this pattern before so we're trying to figure it out.

Sounds like those instructors owe you an apology, if that's the sort of guidance you're getting. If you've had 9 lessons and they can't even figure out how to get you to change your swing patterns, that means either they're bad teachers, or you're a bad student. 

 

What does your swing look like? Even if it's a weird combination of things, there's no way it's so uniquely broken that you can't just focus on one thing and change the picture. 

 

I'm no instructor, but it really is not that hard to change a single piece of the swing sufficiently to look different on video. Getting it ingrained is the hard part.

[TheDeanAbides]

2 minutes ago, RayPlan said:

Sounds like those instructors owe you an apology, if that's the sort of guidance you're getting. If you've had 9 lessons and they can't even figure out how to get you to change your swing patterns, that means either they're bad teachers, or you're a bad student. 

 

What does your swing look like? Even if it's a weird combination of things, there's no way it's so uniquely broken that you can't just focus on one thing and change the picture. 

 

I'm no instructor, but it really is not that hard to change a single piece of the swing sufficiently to look different on video. Getting it ingrained is the hard part.

This. OP, post a swing. I also can't believe that any pro worth anything won't be able to identify your primary issue after a few swings. This all sounds very red flaggy. 

[GoGoErky]

5 hours ago, TexasTurf said:

Definitely need more time. But fine checking in a lot. I love Monte but I need the exact opposite of Rose drill. Currently under plane going back and even more under plane and going through, and need much more "handle dragging" and "over the top." They've never seen this pattern before so we're trying to figure it out.

Never said to go see Monte or do the rose drill.

 

I’ll ask again. The 12+ hours on course what does that consist of? Is it all course play and no practice between lessons? Is there some course play and some range work? Has your instructor given you drills to work on after the lesson?

 

I ask what that time looks like because if you’re trying to make a change it takes time and reps. Taking a lesson at the intervals you are and doin something new every lesson doesn’t really allow time for a change to be made. If 12 hours was spent working on the change then it’s possible, maybe even 6 hours could have some change take place

 

 

Edited June 24 by GoGoErky

[GoGoErky]

23 minutes ago, TheDeanAbides said:

This. OP, post a swing. I also can't believe that any pro worth anything won't be able to identify your primary issue after a few swings. This all sounds very red flaggy. 

I agree. 

[TexasTurf]

18 hours ago, GoGoErky said:

Never said to go see Monte or do the rose drill.

 

I’ll ask again. The 12+ hours on course what does that consist of? Is it all course play and no practice between lessons? Is there some course play and some range work? Has your instructor given you drills to work on after the lesson?

 

I ask what that time looks like because if you’re trying to make a change it takes time and reps. Taking a lesson at the intervals you are and doin something new every lesson doesn’t really allow time for a change to be made. If 12 hours was spent working on the change then it’s possible, maybe even 6 hours could have some change take place

 

 

Thanks guys. The 12 hours I was referring to was managing the course maintenance employees and contractors (35 to 150+ people depending on the day) and full course renovation we've been doing for the past year and a half, not my swing. But I get a few shots in a day when I get the chance. 

[KD1]

On 6/22/2025 at 12:12 AM, TexasTurf said:

Malaska move

 

On 6/24/2025 at 12:06 AM, TexasTurf said:

but I need the exact opposite of Rose drill.

 

Not gunna lie, i use both of these. See my avatar... ymmv

 

What does malaska's "over the top from the inside" mean to you ?

 

Step 1 is cast a, or wall drill, or J.R. drill, or counter top drill.

 

Step 2 is cast b, or malaska move, or broom force, or Manzella tumble, or over the top from the inside, or turn the steering wheel, or turn the door knob... etc etc

 

Full disclosure I'm still a crappy golfer so maybe just ignore my ranting and raving.

[RayPlan]

5 hours ago, TexasTurf said:

Thanks guys. The 12 hours I was referring to was managing the course maintenance employees and contractors (35 to 150+ people depending on the day) and full course renovation we've been doing for the past year and a half, not my swing. But I get a few shots in a day when I get the chance. 

Ah, so you're a superintendent? So are my dad and my brother. Spending 12+ hours on a course that way can sap your energy and desire to dedicate time to your game, especially in Texas.

 

My brother was down there for several years, and it sounds absolutely brutal compared to the same work here in the Midwest. I did golf course maintenance in the summers for years up here (40+ hours per week), and I can't imagine dealing with that kind of heat for as long as it lasts down there. 

 

Thank you for doing the hard, often thankless work. 

 

For what it's worth, with the right focus, you might be able to make some serious improvements with just 15 minutes per day, as discussed by @iacas in this podcast episode shared by @GoGoErky here: 

 

You should post a swing video, even if it's a just a video of you hitting your superintendent's test club that you roll around with in your Gator/Workman/Cushman/EZ-GO. Prop your phone up on the seat or something. Maybe you could make a good makeshift stand with a cup setter if you just slide your phone in between the handle and the inner ring, assuming you use this style. 

 

 

Or whatever you come up with. The superintendents in my family are regular MacGyvers, so I'd bet you are too.

 

Edited June 25 by RayPlan

[GoGoErky]

5 hours ago, TexasTurf said:

Thanks guys. The 12 hours I was referring to was managing the course maintenance employees and contractors (35 to 150+ people depending on the day) and full course renovation we've been doing for the past year and a half, not my swing. But I get a few shots in a day when I get the chance. 

Thanks for the clarification. You may benefit from doing short 5 min practice sessions a few times a day to work on something from your lesson.

 

I would suggest scaling back lessons to once every 4-6 weeks maybe slightly longer since you are limited in practice time. This way you avoid having some new concept given to you each lesson and trying to make all the changes that you’ve been given 

[TexasTurf]

18 hours ago, GoGoErky said:

Thanks for the clarification. You may benefit from doing short 5 min practice sessions a few times a day to work on something from your lesson.

 

I would suggest scaling back lessons to once evedry 4-6 weeks maybe slightly longer since you are limited in practice time. This way you avoid having some new concept given to you each lesson and trying to make all the changes that you’ve been given 

Thanks. Yeah it was the "stock" drills after the first lesson: wall drill (left shoulder forward and down, then more forward, and up, which I think is wrong (need lead shoulder to to go back a bit and down to rotate to start?).  And "bowler drill", where I drop my trail foot way back, and try to attack the ball even more from the inside, even though I'm hooking the s*** out of it. 

 

"The bigger hook, the better." I feel like that's crazy. 

Edited June 26 by TexasTurf

[TheDeanAbides]

1 hour ago, TexasTurf said:

Thanks. Yeah it was the "stock" drills after the first lesson: wall drill (left shoulder forward and down, then more forward, and up, which I think is wrong (need lead shoulder to to go back a bit and down to rotate to start?).  And "bowler drill", where I drop my trail foot way back, and try to attack the ball even more from the inside, even though I'm hooking the s*** out of it. 

 

"The bigger hook, the better." I feel like that's crazy. 

What was the teacher trying to over correct with the hooks? That's often a device teachers use - get you to do something to extreme to change a pattern and then pull it back to a manageable level. 

[GoGoErky]

7 hours ago, TexasTurf said:

Thanks. Yeah it was the "stock" drills after the first lesson: wall drill (left shoulder forward and down, then more forward, and up, which I think is wrong (need lead shoulder to to go back a bit and down to rotate to start?).  And "bowler drill", where I drop my trail foot way back, and try to attack the ball even more from the inside, even though I'm hooking the s*** out of it. 

 

"The bigger hook, the better." I feel like that's crazy. 

By left shoulder more forward does that mean towards the target line.

 

Why would he want you to come even more from the inside? That seems to be a recipe for making things worse if already coming from the inside