Early wrist set: yes or no?

[onehopstopt]

4 minutes ago, NosajNeelik said:

I honestly can’t think of any that “float load” 

 

Some have already been mentioned earlier in this thread, including some video links. Float loading in elite golfers is fairly uncommon, though, which is why I mentioned in my first post that I would probably discourage that as an extreme. I would similarly discourage wrist set significantly before P3 as being on the extreme side in the other direction.

[getitdaily]

16 hours ago, onehopstopt said:

 

I really don't think Valtiel actually touched on the downside of it aside from asserting that it isn't repeatable, which IMO is kind of a non-explanation.

 

I think generally I just need to see more to believe the assertions that it "hurts sequencing" or "makes it harder to move the arms across the chest." I haven't heard anything especially compelling yet, and the huge range we see at the top level suggests to me that the reason is because it doesn't really matter.

 

Fwiw, I set pretty early, so this isn't personal defensiveness. I just see extremely varied wrist set timings at every level of play, so I'd need a very convincing argument to believe that early set is somehow fundamentally preferable. 

I agree with you...

 

"It hurts sequencing" and "most ams don't sequence well" will be the default answer. But these statements are nuanced...

 

Late wrist set hurts sequencing when the arms overrun the turn. You can fix the arm overrun without an earlier wrist set. Earlier wrist set often helps, but it's not necessary for everyone. 

 

Then sequencing....oi, there are about 417.5 things that cause bad sequencing for that would need to be fixed before wrist set.

 

Wrist set is just another matchup element. Earlier isn't necessarily better or worse. And "earlier" isn't a definition or parameter...it's ambiguous.

 

If you shift off the ball a good bit...earlier

 

If you dont shift off the Ball much, you can get away with later.

 

If your tempo is quick...earlier. if your tempo is more deliberate...later is OK.

 

If you're "wide" with your takeaway then earlier often helps. If youre not wide, earlier may hurt.

 

Where they set is a ton more important than when they set. Set them early or late in the wrong direction...compensation city. 

 

Set them in the correct up/back matchup...early or late, much easier for the rest to fall in place.

 

Valtiel gets this. Some others in this thread...they like generalizations.

Edited July 10 by getitdaily

[dpc]

51 minutes ago, onehopstopt said:

 

I really don't think Valtiel actually touched on the downside of it aside from asserting that it isn't repeatable, which IMO is kind of a non-explanation.

 

I think generally I just need to see more to believe the assertions that it "hurts sequencing" or "makes it harder to move the arms across the chest." I haven't heard anything especially compelling yet, and the huge range we see at the top level suggests to me that the reason is because it doesn't really matter.

 

Fwiw, I set pretty early, so this isn't personal defensiveness. I just see extremely varied wrist set timings at every level of play, so I'd need a very convincing argument to believe that early set is somehow fundamentally preferable. 

 

OK, I see your point now.  Early or late makes no difference as long as it's correct. 

My take now is: a player has many things that need fixing, one of which is an incorrect wrist set.  That's low hanging fruit, let's fix that first - earlier because it's easier for the player to manage then, and see what shakes out after that.

[Nels55]

2 hours ago, Valtiel said:

Until that point is reached, early vs. late vs. float load is a useless debate

Cannot have useless debate here!

[Valtiel]

1 hour ago, onehopstopt said:

...so I'd need a very convincing argument to believe that early set is somehow fundamentally preferable. 

That's what I addressed though....it isn't. It's preferable to learn *how* by doing it earlier when one doesn't know how to do it correctly, which is most average players, but from there it's personal preference when it happens. 
 

Quote

I really don't think Valtiel actually touched on the downside of it aside from asserting that it isn't repeatable, which IMO is kind of a non-explanation.

When you're swinging the club back with no intention of doing anything with your wrists and the club causes them to "set" in response to you reaching the end of your swing then that is absolutely something that is volatile and not easily repeated. Proper wrist set/general wrist fundamentals are not intuitive, they don't just happen as a product of swinging the club, and like most things what *does* happen intuitively is pretty bad. I saved this reel on Facebook shared from the Champions tour page of various SEC coaches hitting tee shots and this highlights exactly what i'm talking about. Saban and Freeze (ESPECIALLY Freeze, good lord...) have the classic terrible wrist fundamentals that i've seen a hundred times that come from never learning how to set the club properly. It's the tell tale loss of extension in the trail hand and excessive extension (cupping) in the lead hand that is the hallmark of "I just swing the club back and let what happens happens" that comes from never learning how to use the wrists properly. The club tends to want to pull your wrists in that direction when you don't get them set properly, and it's all bad. Kirby Smart actually does pretty well here and gets into a strong position at the top, just lacking some depth and getting a little to "out" in the downswing. You wouldn't need to get Kirby doing things much different with his hands....Saban and Freeze though would need to spend months grinding on getting things set earlier so they can learn to feel what the wrists are supposed to feel like at the top. 
 

Quote

...and the huge range we see at the top level suggests to me that the reason is because it doesn't really matter.

 
It doesn't really matter *when you know how to do it right*. It's absolutely critical if your wrist set is being performed poorly/incorrectly to learn how to do it right first before you worry about the "when", as I said previously. 
 

Edited July 9 by Valtiel

[sundaypins]

6 hours ago, TheDeanAbides said:

Is this something you'd recommend?

 

Probably not.   Earlier sets are easier but I've seen a few with instinctive tendencies for later setting and if it's the least of their overall concerns it would be silly carving that piece up early in the process, might be an idea later.  Earlier setters can still amp up the down load so that's in play too. 

[onehopstopt]

1 hour ago, Valtiel said:

That's what I addressed though....it isn't. It's preferable to learn *how* by doing it earlier when one doesn't know how to do it correctly, which is most average players, but from there it's personal preference when it happens. 
 

When you're swinging the club back with no intention of doing anything with your wrists and the club causes them to "set" in response to you reaching the end of your swing then that is absolutely something that is volatile and not easily repeated. Proper wrist set/general wrist fundamentals are not intuitive, they don't just happen as a product of swinging the club, and like most things what *does* happen intuitively is pretty bad. I saved this reel on Facebook shared from the Champions tour page of various SEC coaches hitting tee shots and this highlights exactly what i'm talking about. Saban and Freeze (ESPECIALLY Freeze, good lord...) have the classic terrible wrist fundamentals that i've seen a hundred times that come from never learning how to set the club properly. It's the tell tale loss of extension in the trail hand and excessive extension (cupping) in the lead hand that is the hallmark of "I just swing the club back and let what happens happens" that comes from never learning how to use the wrists properly. The club tends to want to pull your wrists in that direction when you don't get them set properly, and it's all bad. Kirby Smart actually does pretty well here and gets into a strong position at the top, just lacking some depth and getting a little to "out" in the downswing. You wouldn't need to get Kirby doing things much different with his hands....Saban and Freeze though would need to spend months grinding on getting things set earlier so they can learn to feel what the wrists are supposed to feel like at the top. 
 

 
It doesn't really matter *when you know how to do it right*. It's absolutely critical if your wrist set is being performed poorly/incorrectly to learn how to do it right first before you worry about the "when", as I said previously. 
 

 

Ah, I see. So your perspective, and excuse my being a little reductive here, is that setting earlier makes it easier for a player to learn to establish proper wrist conditions?

 

I can get behind that explanation. Likely would easier for most players to integrate those movements prior to P3 rather than close to transition when lots of other things are happening quite quickly.

Edited July 9 by onehopstopt

[GoGoErky]

2 hours ago, getitdaily said:

I agree with you...

 

"It hurts sequencing" and "most ams don't sequence well" will be the default answer. But these statements are nuanced...

 

Late wrist set hurts sequencing when the arms overrun the turn. You can fix the arm overrun without an earlier wrist set. Earlier wrist set often helps, but it's not necessary for everyone. 

 

Then sequencing....oi, there are about 417.5 things that cause bad sequencing for that would need to be fixed before wrist set.

 

Wrist set is just another matchup element. Earlier isn't necessarily better or worse. And "earlier" isn't a definition or parameter...it's ambiguous.

 

If you shift off the ball a good bit...earlier

 

If you dont shift off the Ball much, you can get away with later.

 

If your tempo is quick...earlier. if your tempo is more deliberate...later is OK.

 

Where they set is a ton more important than when they set. Set them early or late in the wrong direction...compensation city. 

 

Set them in the correct up/back matchup...early or late, much easier for the rest to fall in place.

 

Valtiel gets this. Some others in this thread...they like generalizations.

Monte talking about sequencing issues in your own thread about early kr late wrist set. Is that a generalization too?

 

 

https://forums.golfwrx.com/topic/1965797-why-is-late-wrist-set-a-power-leak/?do=findComment&comment=25061150

[getitdaily]

16 minutes ago, GoGoErky said:

Monte talking about sequencing issues in your own thread about early kr late wrist set. Is that a generalization too?

 

 

https://forums.golfwrx.com/topic/1965797-why-is-late-wrist-set-a-power-leak/?do=findComment&comment=25061150

Nope, monte was specific and his reply in that thread (along with valtiel's) backs up what I said here. 

 

I do like the effort you took to find that tho. Makes me think of a song from my youth...

 

 

 

 

 

[golferdude54]

Surprised no one brought up Dan Pohl. He basically never set at all and would probably be on the very end of the wrist setting spectrum. 

Also P8 is a terrible checkpoint for wrist rehinging in the follow-through, if you really want to see how much they rehinge, look at right arm perpendicular to ground. Hogan, Adam Scott, Tiger in 2006, Spieth in 2017 (his best ballstriking year), all rehinged very late.

[Valtiel]

4 hours ago, onehopstopt said:

 

Ah, I see. So your perspective, and excuse my being a little reductive here, is that setting earlier makes it easier for a player to learn to establish proper wrist conditions?

 

I can get behind that explanation. Likely would easier for most players to integrate those movements prior to P3 rather than close to transition when lots of other things are happening quite quickly.

Exactly.

The golf swing, especially a busted one, is usually riddled with a combination of things that people do at the wrong times, not at all, or WAY too much. The more those inaccuracies are ingrained the harder it is to change them. I've worked with folks who actively don't hinge their wrists at all in an effort to get "big and wide" and to "take the hands out of the swing", which is a horrible can of worms in and of itself, and when prompted to hinge "as early as you possibly can" will introduce a tiny amount of wrist hinge at the very top of the swing. The same goes for swing length...guys that swing every club like John Daly with a driver in 92' that when prompted to make a tiny punch swing will basically dial it back to John Daly with a 5-iron instead. Which is to say....hardly at all lol. You really need to go all the way back to the earliest moments in the swing to get these folks feeling the right things and when. 

It's fascinating working with the general public because you're exposed to SO many different ways of doing things wrong. Once you think you've seen it all someone will come along and blow your mind with the most ludicrous looking Gordian Knot of a golf swing that they think is perfectly normal, and you quickly realize how useless nearly every little golf platitude and -ism is as you try to figure out how and what to say to help this person. One of the biggest things i've found is that if you run down the basic checklist of questions....

- Where are you lined up (and are all your body parts aligned)?
- How strong is your grip pressure?
- Where is your weighted distributed at address (heel/toe and front/back)?
- Where does it go and when throughout the swing?
- What are your hands doing in takeaway, up the backswing, in transition, and through impact?
- How long is your backswing?
- What are you *trying* to do?

...you'll be lucky to get answers to even half of these, and of those answers (and anyone that answers more) you'll be lucky if even half of *those* are anywhere close accurate. And that is being *generous*. The guy or gal that can answer more than half of these accurately likely doesn't need much from an instruction standpoint. Most pros couldn't even answer all of them accurately, they're just so used to what they're doing that they don't need to worry about what anyone else does. But instructors do, and it's an wild world out there. 😅

Edited July 10 by Valtiel

[wasko]

Early wrist set is a death move for me, it makes me pick the club up and not finish my turn. My pre-shot routine is always to slip my right-hand under left and get the club head moving low and away with my left shoulder till I get to what feels like past my thigh then the swing is pretty much automatic from there.

[jaffabell]

12 hours ago, NosajNeelik said:

I honestly can’t think of any that “float load” 

Lucas Glover

[NosajNeelik]

23 minutes ago, jaffabell said:

Lucas Glover

Good one. Yea he’s not really on my radar lol.  Another great ball striker who just can’t putt

 

would young Sergio count?

 

Either way my point is that it’s an outlier situation 

[naval2006]

6 hours ago, Valtiel said:

- Where are you lined up (and are all your body parts aligned)?
- How strong is your grip pressure?
- Where is your weighted distributed at address (heel/toe and front/back)?
- Where does it go and when throughout the swing?
- What are your hands doing in takeaway, up the backswing, in transition, and through impact?
- How long is your backswing?
- What are you *trying* to do?

Most of these are points that cannot be answered by the player.  Not even through video. Because only a seasoned instructor can scan through, diagnose and treat a golfer after a certain number of swings. 
 

More and more these days the average YouTube student will find a vid on social media and they’ll decide “this is what I need” and that’s how they’ll fix their swing. It all works for a round or two and then it’s time to blame so and so on Instagram and move on to the next. This is the weirdest way of learning to play but most golfers have all this info at hand so easily that it’s almost an obvious way to obtain knowledge. The vicious circle never ends. 

[TheDeanAbides]

27 minutes ago, naval2006 said:

Most of these are points that cannot be answered by the player.  Not even through video. Because only a seasoned instructor can scan through, diagnose and treat a golfer after a certain number of swings. 
 

More and more these days the average YouTube student will find a vid on social media and they’ll decide “this is what I need” and that’s how they’ll fix their swing. It all works for a round or two and then it’s time to blame so and so on Instagram and move on to the next. This is the weirdest way of learning to play but most golfers have all this info at hand so easily that it’s almost an obvious way to obtain knowledge. The vicious circle never ends. 

Those videos have a lot to answer for. I don't actually blame the average weekend golfer for falling for 'just do this one thing - all your ballstriking problems will be over!' type guff. If you have no idea about the mechanics of the swing, it's super easy to just believe that stuff. It's called Argument by Authority, and it's a huge part of the FUBAR dynamic. 

[virtuoso]

It’s not the fault of the content creators. This is what the people asked for.

 

So, we are going to scold the YouTube merchants because they didn’t rise above their own best interest and do a more nanny-state analysis of the unwashed masses such that they should decide in a benevolent way to give the people what they need, not what they clearly yearned for. Shame on them.

Edited July 10 by virtuoso

[virtuoso]

Alright, my rant went off topic. I’m starting a fresh rant thread.

 

btw, in regards to this topic: I correctly set my wrists as early as I can after I finish my one piece take away.

Edited July 10 by virtuoso

[getitdaily]

8 minutes ago, virtuoso said:

Alright, my rant went off topic. I’m starting a fresh rant thread.

 

btw, in regards to this topic: I correctly set my wrists as early as I can after I finish my one piece take away.

I love it...ambiguously specific. It's like a 2 worded oxymoron.

[jaffabell]

22 minutes ago, virtuoso said:

Alright, my rant went off topic. I’m starting a fresh rant thread.

 

btw, in regards to this topic: I correctly set my wrists as early as I can after I finish my one piece take away.

Is that after you load up your power package?

[TheDeanAbides]

38 minutes ago, virtuoso said:

It’s not the fault of the content creators. This is what the people asked for.

 

So, we are going to scold the YouTube merchants because they didn’t rise above their own best interest and do a more nanny-state analysis of the unwashed masses such that they should decide in a benevolent way to give the people what they need, not what they clearly yearned for. Shame on them.

Burn them all! MWAHAHAHA!

[slytown]

On 7/8/2025 at 9:30 AM, naval2006 said:

I usually see threads on this forum about early wrist set during the takeaway.  It's like an in thing at WRX.  

 

Yesterday a friend sent me a vid of Max Homa's swing.  I don't see those vids that analyze tour players swings and explain technique, but when I saw Homa's swing in slow motion it was kind of mesmerizing.  

 

Apart from the beauty of his swing, what drew my attention most was how straight his hands and wrists are during the takeaway, a la Nicklaus. 

 

My question to the coaches here is if early wrist set is better than one piece takeaway or it all depends on the player's ability and natural tendencies. 

 

Depends. In general, a wide, one piece takeaway with later wrist set is better on driver but it can be done on shorter clubs.

 

The problem a lot of players have with late wrist set is casting the club out in the downswing as a reaction. In general u want wrist set to be relatively the same throughout the backswing and downswing except near impact.

 

A better question is how to achieve early wrist set. Some actively set the wrists. Others push the hands down, which effectively sets the wrists. Its mostly a preference thing. I  general though, more players would benefit from earlier wrist set because it gets the club working vertical early.

[bladehunter]

1 hour ago, TheDeanAbides said:

Those videos have a lot to answer for. I don't actually blame the average weekend golfer for falling for 'just do this one thing - all your ballstriking problems will be over!' type guff. If you have no idea about the mechanics of the swing, it's super easy to just believe that stuff. It's called Argument by Authority, and it's a huge part of the FUBAR dynamic. 

Bingo. Was just going to say it’s  an appeal to authority fallacy ( which is the same thing as what you said ). Just because so and so said it. Doesn’t mean it’s not a brain  fart he overheard at lunch in the clubhouse. Show your work.  I want to hear the “ why “.  

[GoGoErky]

5 minutes ago, slytown said:

The problem a lot of players have with late wrist set is casting the club out in the downswing as a reaction. In general u want wrist set to be relatively the same throughout the backswing and downswing except near impact.

Do you though? If so why is it that pros are releasing wrist angles by time they get to p6?

 

around the 9 min mark they get into the angles changing. These 3 pros have lost 13-44° of wrist hinge by p6.

 

 

 

 

 

[virtuoso]

29 minutes ago, jaffabell said:

Is that after you load up your power package?

I dabbled with the yellow book from 1984 to late 1986. Then I transferred over to Morad Model One, then much later had to go to Morad Rehab.

[naval2006]

55 minutes ago, virtuoso said:

It’s not the fault of the content creators. This is what the people asked for.

 

So, we are going to scold the YouTube merchants because they didn’t rise above their own best interest and do a more nanny-state analysis of the unwashed masses such that they should decide in a benevolent way to give the people what they need, not what they clearly yearned for. Shame on them.

I don't blame creators.  Several of them are reputable teachers who know what they are saying.  But imagine you have a bad stomachache and you decide to diagnose and treat it through Google Academics.  After an hour of reading you'll be appalled at aaaaall the things that can cause that pain.  You'll get scared to death, relieved later on, and so on and so forth until you decide to go to the doctor´s.  Doc will see to it on the spot, screen you if necessary and they´ll write a prescription.  

[virtuoso]

3 minutes ago, naval2006 said:

I don't blame creators.  Several of them are reputable teachers who know what they are saying.  But imagine you have a bad stomachache and you decide to diagnose and treat it through Google Academics.  After an hour of reading you'll be appalled at aaaaall the things that can cause that pain.  You'll get scared to death, relieved later on, and so on and so forth until you decide to go to the doctor´s.  Doc will see to it on the spot, screen you if necessary and they´ll write a prescription.  

Yes, but if you told everyone you were removing Dr Google from the internet, people would revolt.

[naval2006]

2 minutes ago, virtuoso said:

Yes, but if you told everyone you were removing Dr Google from the internet, people would revolt.

I fully agree, that's the way things are.  It's a shame a lot of people are not aware that it's a pretty misleading system.  

[virtuoso]

Just now, naval2006 said:

I fully agree, that's the way things are.  It's a shame a lot of people are not aware that it's a pretty misleading system.  

Do you think most people don’t know? I think they know, but they want to take a quick peek, just in case.

…..just as most people, deep down, have a feeling that golf content creators are “probably” making unrealistic promises, but they want to want to take a quick peek….just in case.

[TheDeanAbides]

18 minutes ago, virtuoso said:

Do you think most people don’t know? I think they know, but they want to take a quick peek, just in case.

…..just as most people, deep down, have a feeling that golf content creators are “probably” making unrealistic promises, but they want to want to take a quick peek….just in case.

And there's the issue. People are idiots. Present company included, of course.