The Way

[GoGoErky]

1 hour ago, Hawkeye77 said:

 

Mirror work maybe falls into this as well and I've known folks to grind indoors at home with their launch monitors and make a lot of progress, but takes discipline and awareness. Even inside for lessons or indoors on their own they'll get feedback you aren't going to get from a net set up a few feet away.  I'd think seeing real ball flight in juxtaposition with drills and so forth would be important as well.  Otherwise, to some extent it's just chasing positions, maybe correctly maybe not, and not hitting golf shots, working on any part of your game in any real sense or even playing golf.  To each his or her own but the occasional and again maybe, maybe not, "aha" moment on a camera and no more context seems a difficult way to become a better golfer, if that's the goal.

Yes mirror work or using a camera indoors falls into that.

 

theres two types of practice. Movement practice and ball striking.

 

too many combine the two and slow their progress as a result.

 

if someone has limited time to practice they will benefit from 15-20 mins of mirror work.

 

One should work on both ball striking and movement practice. But not spending time using mirror, work, hitting into a net or having the focus to go the range and not care about the result is going to make getting better harder 

 

 

[sundaypins]

11 minutes ago, GoGoErky said:

if someone has limited time to practice they will benefit from 15-20 mins of mirror work.

 

Thanks to @getitdaily mirror work is bunk.  

[getitdaily]

9 minutes ago, sundaypins said:

 

Thanks to @getitdaily mirror work is bunk.  

I like it. 

 

However, I also like mirror work for certain things.

[Nels55]

1 hour ago, getitdaily said:

I like it. 

 

However, I also like mirror work for certain things.

Shaving?

[getitdaily]

Just now, Nels55 said:

Shaving?

Definitely. 

Posing (not like you and your silence of the lambs fetish stuff)

P2 checkpoint

Flexing

Transition hand path and wrist work

 

You know, traditional stuff

 

[Nels55]

20 minutes ago, getitdaily said:

Definitely. 

Posing (not like you and your silence of the lambs fetish stuff)

P2 checkpoint

Flexing

Transition hand path and wrist work

 

You know, traditional stuff

 

I've never seen the film.

 

Does the mirror work help your game?

[RayPlan]

Just now, Nels55 said:

I've never seen the film.

 

Does the mirror work help your game?

Improving (and maintaining) swing mechanics is an important part of playing well.

[getitdaily]

2 minutes ago, Nels55 said:

I've never seen the film.

 

Does the mirror work help your game?

Yeah. I mean, it's not game changing stuff, but a really quick way to spot check how things look without having to go outside or setup a camera/phone.

 

Juat about quick way to spot check the basics.

[GoGoErky]

3 hours ago, sundaypins said:

 

Thanks to @getitdaily mirror work is bunk.  

And experts like @iacas and many others show it’s not and works for all level of players especially to learn movement patterns. 

Anyone that understands how the motor control system works when it comes to changing the motor pathway mirror work goes into the slower movements needed to retrain that motor neurons.

 

Edited July 20 by GoGoErky

[sundaypins]

The tribal hunter's task of spearing food efficiently so the tribe wouldn't starve was not made any easier by seeing his reflection in a smooth pool of water learning how to throw a spear effectively.   I'm guessing the Chief would have agreed, if you're eating it was successful.  

[GoGoErky]

2 minutes ago, sundaypins said:

The tribal hunter's task of spearing food efficiently so the tribe wouldn't starve was not made any easier by seeing his reflection in a smooth pool of water learning how to throw a spear effectively.   I'm guessing the Chief would have agreed, if you're eating it was successful.  

Those who teach movement based things know and understand the importance of slow reps and using mirrors, video and so on to use as a tool for visually watching the movement and to ensure that one is executing the movement properly. As a corrective exercise specialist I fall into that category.

 

Feels ain’t real if your using mirrors and/or video you have no idea if your doing what your supposed to be or not. 

[iacas]

MLB pitchers do mirror work, and they seem to have no problem feeding themselves. Even if their "group" is now called the Guardians. 😛 

 

• https://www.platecrate.com/blogs/baseball-101/how-to-practice-pitching-without-a-catcher-techniques-for-skill-development
• https://www.topvelocity.net/2023/04/17/off-season-throwing-program-for-professional-pitchers/
• etc.

 

 

Edited July 20 by iacas
nah

[RayPlan]

41 minutes ago, sundaypins said:

The tribal hunter's task of spearing food efficiently so the tribe wouldn't starve was not made any easier by seeing his reflection in a smooth pool of water learning how to throw a spear effectively.   I'm guessing the Chief would have agreed, if you're eating it was successful.  

Golf is a game that requires much reflection.

[getitdaily]

Let's not derail Ray's thread in another battle of who's more right...

[GoGoErky]

42 minutes ago, getitdaily said:

Let's not derail Ray's thread in another battle of who's more right...

There’s only one right and it’s not the group giant mirror work or those

telling Ray to not use the net

[Hawkeye77]

2 minutes ago, GoGoErky said:

There’s only one right and it’s not the group giant mirror work or those

telling Ray to not use the net

 

I don't think anyone has told him not to use the net, just suggested not to use it exclusively.  Whether it is being used productively is a different discussion altogether but not trying to open that up. 

[GoGoErky]

11 minutes ago, Hawkeye77 said:

 

I don't think anyone has told him not to use the net, just suggested not to use it exclusively.  Whether it is being used productively is a different discussion altogether but not trying to open that up. 

we interpret the comment of our swings looking differently in a net compared to our one the open differently when you look at the context of what Ray is doing.

 

ray is doing movement practice. That doesn’t require a range or open area. Which for many seeing the ball flight causes them to start changing what they are working on because seeing what the ball is doing influences them to try and do something different to get a particular ball flight or result 

[Hawkeye77]

8 minutes ago, GoGoErky said:

we interpret the comment of our swings looking differently in a net compared to our one the open differently when you look at the context of what Ray is doing.

 

ray is doing movement practice. That doesn’t require a range or open area. Which for many seeing the ball flight causes them to start changing what they are working on because seeing what the ball is doing influences them to try and do something different to get a particular ball flight or result 

 

He was demonstrating a drill he's invented to chase P 7.5, which may have changed since he showed the video, haven't followed it - are drills and movement practice the same things?  

[RayPlan]

Just now, Hawkeye77 said:

are drills and movement practice the same things?  

In my case, any drill I'm doing is in pursuit of a particular movement, or more broadly, the coordination necessary to make those moves.

[GoGoErky]

13 hours ago, Hawkeye77 said:

 

He was demonstrating a drill he's invented to chase P 7.5, which may have changed since he showed the video, haven't followed it - are drills and movement practice the same things?  

Yes you do a drill for a movement you are working on. 

[Hawkeye77]

1 hour ago, GoGoErky said:

Yes you do a drill for a movement you are working on. 

But that doesn't answer the question - Kwon has people dancing around with a rope which I assume is working on a movement pattern, but not a drill.  Can't you work on movements in a mirror/not a mirror/however without being engaged in a "drill"? Not sure it's just semantics but if the industry uses them interchangably so be it.

[TheDeanAbides]

1 hour ago, Hawkeye77 said:

But that doesn't answer the question - Kwon has people dancing around with a rope which I assume is working on a movement pattern, but not a drill.  Can't you work on movements in a mirror/not a mirror/however without being engaged in a "drill"? Not sure it's just semantics but if the industry uses them interchangably so be it.

What do you think a drill is? Why do you think the rope thang isn't a drill?

[GoGoErky]

57 minutes ago, Hawkeye77 said:

But that doesn't answer the question - Kwon has people dancing around with a rope which I assume is working on a movement pattern, but not a drill.  Can't you work on movements in a mirror/not a mirror/however without being engaged in a "drill"? Not sure it's just semantics but if the industry uses them interchangably so be it.

Swing the rope is a drill. 
 

When you work on movements the action of working on that is a drill.

If I want to train a hinge at the waist. The hinging is the movement. Whatever I do to train that movement is a drill.

 

The action of training the movement pattern is a drill. Drills may look different for different people.

 

[Hawkeye77]

5 minutes ago, TheDeanAbides said:

What do you think a drill is? Why do you think the rope thang isn't a drill?

Bad example but no I don’t, hence the question. 

[Pnwpingi210]

3 minutes ago, Hawkeye77 said:

Bad example but no I don’t, hence the question. 

A drill is really just repeating a specific task, procedure, or process.  This would make the “kwons rope drill” a drill.

[TheDeanAbides]

20 minutes ago, Hawkeye77 said:

Bad example but no I don’t, hence the question. 

Okay, fair. It's just what the other guys said then, really. 

[RayPlan]

Hogan is a good guide as I'm drilling the P6 gateway through P7.5 reference point. 

 

[NosajNeelik]

4 hours ago, RayPlan said:

Hogan is a good guide as I'm drilling the P6 gateway through P7.5 reference point. 

 

So good 

[biker74]

Delete. Not gonna add more than needed. Or less to add more 

Edited July 22 by biker74

[TheDeanAbides]

12 hours ago, RayPlan said:

Hogan is a good guide as I'm drilling the P6 gateway through P7.5 reference point. 

 

Could watch that all day.