Ridding myself of Early Extension

[BigManSlim]

Played at a decent-ish level into my late 30's including several USGA events. At my best I was a +3 though I think that was probably a bit inflated by an artificially high course rating.

 

Anyway, always had a bit of EE in my swing but managed it ok. Highs were good but lows could be quite low.

 

Took like 10 years to coach my daughters teams, etc. and I basically played more or less casually until COVID. Then tried to get serious when I turned 50 with the coming of Senior golf. In that time my EE got worse. I tried to mask it but I need to eliminate it or I can't play very well at all. Super frustrating. Tried multiple lessons with multiple teachers and just realize that without eliminating or significantly minimizing the EE I can't play at any sort of level.

 

I am now 55 and currently a 3.5 index.

 

Bought the "Getting Rid of Early Extension" video from Luke Benoit after hearing him on several pods. Will be seriously following the protocols and taking my time with it. I expect the rest of this season is toast but that's fine. 

 

Will post some before videos soon and progress as well. If anyone has done that protocol I'd love to hear feedback.

[sundaypins]

39 minutes ago, BigManSlim said:

Will post some before videos soon and progress as well. If anyone has done that protocol I'd love to hear feedback.

 

Nice! 

[Valtiel]

42 minutes ago, BigManSlim said:

Played at a decent-ish level into my late 30's including several USGA events. At my best I was a +3 though I think that was probably a bit inflated by an artificially high course rating.

 

Anyway, always had a bit of EE in my swing but managed it ok. Highs were good but lows could be quite low.

 

Took like 10 years to coach my daughters teams, etc. and I basically played more or less casually until COVID. Then tried to get serious when I turned 50 with the coming of Senior golf. In that time my EE got worse. I tried to mask it but I need to eliminate it or I can't play very well at all. Super frustrating. Tried multiple lessons with multiple teachers and just realize that without eliminating or significantly minimizing the EE I can't play at any sort of level.

 

I am now 55 and currently a 3.5 index.

 

Bought the "Getting Rid of Early Extension" video from Luke Benoit after hearing him on several pods. Will be seriously following the protocols and taking my time with it. I expect the rest of this season is toast but that's fine. 

 

Will post some before videos soon and progress as well. If anyone has done that protocol I'd love to hear feedback.

No direct experience with this video, but he talks about EE in a way that seems pretty sound i.e. it being a symptom of other things and also just an intuitive movement pattern. One of the reasons (the main reason IMO) that EE can be so difficult to rid yourself of is the fact that so many roads lead to it. It kinda "infects multiple organs" of the golf swing if that makes sense. Club coming down really steep? Early extend to manage low point. Weight unbalanced at setup? Get up on your toes and early extend to balance yourself. Weight shift sequence off? Early extend because your hips moving forward forces you to. And underpinning ALL of this is the fact that our brain really tries to resist performing all these rotational and vertical golf swing moves while staying bent over. It's uncomfortable and unintuitive, so early extension is something that our brain kinda *wants* just to not be bent over anymore.

Therefore it's really tough to kick with most common swing flaws leading to some form of EE *and* it being something that feels intuitive to do. Seeing swing videos would definitely be interesting, particularly if you have any older ones that mark the difference between your "manageable EE" and whatever you feel into afterwards that was worse. 

[johnrobison]

2 hours ago, Valtiel said:

he talks about EE in a way that seems pretty sound i.e. it being a symptom of other things and also just an intuitive movement pattern.

Agreed! For me EE was a huge catch-22. I had to work on it to make other things possible (primarily shallower downswing) but I also couldn't resolve EE until the other things were better since it was the compensation I was making. I remember talking with Monte about it over lunch one day - it was a "It's not whether people need to do this or that, but that people need to do both" kind of discussion.

[BigManSlim]

This is from 2 or 3 months ago with a 7 Iron. I can sorta get it around with the irons but Driver is just a full on train wreck. Flippy flip through impact

 

 

[biker74]

Sure you heard this one.But the best advice I ever got was at the tour striker academy a few years ago.Martin’s assistant had me hit golf balls with a chair 🪑 behind me.I tried to keep my butt on the chair.And in the follow thru I tried and push the chair slightly back.Might help 

[iacas]

You over-load the arms a little and then right tilt (and turn in the frontal plane too much) to get the club to the ground rather than rotating horizontally more. You've likely learned to throw the clubhead at the ball so you have a chance because you're almost completely square to the ball with your whole body at impact.

[MonteScheinblum]

40 minutes ago, BigManSlim said:

This is from 2 or 3 months ago with a 7 Iron. I can sorta get it around with the irons but Driver is just a full on train wreck. Flippy flip through impact

 

 

Standing that close to the ball leads to a domino affect that FORCES early extension.

[sundaypins]

8 hours ago, BigManSlim said:

This is from 2 or 3 months ago with a 7 Iron. I can sorta get it around with the irons but Driver is just a full on train wreck. Flippy flip through impact

 

Hitting at the ball instead of hitting into the finish.  In other words, stalling out and not finishing.   So, pretty standard fix if you can find someone who knows how to get you moving properly through the ball and not at it. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[virtuoso]

19 hours ago, BigManSlim said:

Played at a decent-ish level into my late 30's including several USGA events. At my best I was a +3 though I think that was probably a bit inflated by an artificially high course rating.

 

Anyway, always had a bit of EE in my swing but managed it ok. Highs were good but lows could be quite low.

 

Took like 10 years to coach my daughters teams, etc. and I basically played more or less casually until COVID. Then tried to get serious when I turned 50 with the coming of Senior golf. In that time my EE got worse. I tried to mask it but I need to eliminate it or I can't play very well at all. Super frustrating. Tried multiple lessons with multiple teachers and just realize that without eliminating or significantly minimizing the EE I can't play at any sort of level.

 

I am now 55 and currently a 3.5 index.

 

Bought the "Getting Rid of Early Extension" video from Luke Benoit after hearing him on several pods. Will be seriously following the protocols and taking my time with it. I expect the rest of this season is toast but that's fine. 

 

Will post some before videos soon and progress as well. If anyone has done that protocol I'd love to hear feedback.

What did your past coaches say was the cause of your EE?

[MK7Golf21]

10 hours ago, MonteScheinblum said:

Standing that close to the ball leads to a domino affect that FORCES early extension.

 

yeah, that is true. Standing too close can cause EE, just like standing too far away. We just hear more about standing too far away being the issue.

[BigManSlim]

1 hour ago, virtuoso said:

What did your past coaches say was the cause of your EE?

Pivot needs some work...very steep from the top. Tend to be quick in transition which leads to disconnect between upper and lower body

[virtuoso]

17 minutes ago, BigManSlim said:

Pivot needs some work...very steep from the top. Tend to be quick in transition which leads to disconnect between upper and lower body

Hmmm, ok.

 

Here are some assumptions, tell me which ones are right or wrong:

 

Scoopy, shallow divot

Lack of compression

Ball launches pretty high, and starts right

When things are going well, it is a high slight draw

When things are bad, can be a high bloopy block, or can turn into hook, especially with driver

A low penetrating punch pull cut would be very difficult to hit

Face on view will probably show a strong lateral shift with the pelvis.

A clunky toe hit is common, and toe hits with driver turn into hooks quickly.

[johnrobison]

1 hour ago, BigManSlim said:

Pivot needs some work...very steep from the top. Tend to be quick in transition which leads to disconnect between upper and lower body

Steep? Really?! I'm tuning into this one to learn what the pros here have to say about it.

[MonteScheinblum]

1 hour ago, BigManSlim said:

Pivot needs some work...very steep from the top. Tend to be quick in transition which leads to disconnect between upper and lower body

None of those things are true…..aside from pivot which can’t be good or you’d miss the ball.

 

9 minutes ago, johnrobison said:

Steep? Really?! I'm tuning into this one to learn what the pros here have to say about it.

Agree, too shallow if anything.

[Valtiel]

2 hours ago, BigManSlim said:

Pivot needs some work...very steep from the top. Tend to be quick in transition which leads to disconnect between upper and lower body

 

1 hour ago, johnrobison said:

Steep? Really?! I'm tuning into this one to learn what the pros here have to say about it.

 

49 minutes ago, MonteScheinblum said:

None of those things are true…..aside from pivot which can’t be good or you’d miss the ball.

 

Agree, too shallow if anything.

Would it be worth saying (or accurate) that the *hand path* is too steep from the top? I'm seeing that "back the hands up, dump them behind, right tilt, scoop from the inside toe slap" kind of pattern here which feels like it can get confusing when calling things steep vs. shallow. 

Edited July 18 by Valtiel

[MonteScheinblum]

23 minutes ago, Valtiel said:

 

 

Would it be worth saying (or accurate) that the *hand path* is too steep from the top? I'm seeing that "back the hands up, dump them behind, right tilt, scoop from the inside toe slap" kind of pattern here which feels like it can get confusing when calling things steep vs. shallow. 

Hand path is not too steep to where the ball is, but because he’s so close to the ball, you can make a case it’s steep to the body.

Edited July 18 by MonteScheinblum

[BigManSlim]

1 hour ago, MonteScheinblum said:

Hand path is not too steep to where the ball is, but because he’s so close to the ball, you can make a case it’s steep to the body.

Perhaps so. I “feel” like I get far too narrow from the top and never really have much width

 

if i can find a driver swing it is exacerbated significantly

Edited July 18 by BigManSlim

[johnrobison]

1 hour ago, Valtiel said:

Would it be worth saying (or accurate) that the *hand path* is too steep from the top? I'm seeing that "back the hands up, dump them behind, right tilt, scoop from the inside toe slap" kind of pattern here which feels like it can get confusing when calling things steep vs. shallow. 

So, hand path appears steep from excessive right tilt? My (uneducated) first thought was to keep the right shoulder high and straighten the right arm sooner. Hands come out more, while shaft is still on plane.

[Valtiel]

1 hour ago, MonteScheinblum said:

Hand path is not too steep to where the ball is, but because he’s so close to the ball, you can make a case it’s steep to the body.

 

59 minutes ago, BigManSlim said:

Perhaps so. I “feel” like I get east too narrow from the top and never really have much width

 

if i can find a driver swing it is exacerbated significantly

 

14 minutes ago, johnrobison said:

So, hand path appears steep from excessive right tilt? My (uneducated) first thought was to keep the right shoulder high and straighten the right arm sooner. Hands come out more, while shaft is still on plane.

The point Monte is making above I believe @johnrobison is that in doing that he'd basically miss the ball, hah. I was seeing the steep path relative to the body, but if it being relative to the ball based on address position means it's kind of a requirement to get to impact then keeping the right shoulder from dropping (reducing right tilt) and straightening the right arm sooner would have him swinging outside and over the top of the ball. 

[MonteScheinblum]

2 hours ago, BigManSlim said:

Perhaps so. I “feel” like I get far too narrow from the top and never really have much width

 

if i can find a driver swing it is exacerbated significantly

Standing that close you are forced to be narrow.  There is no choice.

[sundaypins]

@BigManSlim  Make sure trying the Bobby Jones drill is on your to do list.   Being that cramped and close to your work will FORCE a body doing a few things it may not have experienced before.  What Beck accomplishes starting the return swing with the lower body, which we all do, while working himself out from underneath the club is he doesn't stall very much to do so- just a little but given his stance width and hand proximity he does a great job with it.    If you get good at this drill you'll probably start setting your hands out just a little farther from you thereby making what was becoming easier easy but better yet, sensed and now owned.     

[BigManSlim]

6 hours ago, virtuoso said:

Hmmm, ok.

 

Here are some assumptions, tell me which ones are right or wrong:

 

Scoopy, shallow divot Not really

Lack of compression Can be a bit wipey yes at times

Ball launches pretty high, and starts right Definitely adding some launch...misses are generally right and going righter

When things are going well, it is a high slight draw More high cutters

When things are bad, can be a high bloopy block, or can turn into hook, especially with driver Correct

A low penetrating punch pull cut would be very difficult to hit I've always been pretty good at hitting low bullets with the irons

Face on view will probably show a strong lateral shift with the pelvis. Hips stall between P5 and P6 then it's just whether I time up the flip

A clunky toe hit is common, and toe hits with driver turn into hooks quickly. Not as common as open club face blocks

See above

[virtuoso]

2 minutes ago, BigManSlim said:

See above

Gotcha, now i have better understanding of the impact numbers. That would change my diagnosis and a little bit. Are you wanting to play a draw as your stock shot and lower ball flight generally?

[vsabre]

I never comment in the instructional thread but as a multi-decade HOF EE, I watched your video and went WTF, I don't see EE at all. Hell , your right foot is still flat on the ground inches before impact. If you EE'd your club would hit your knee before impact because you'd be up on your right toe half way through transition like the rest of us😆. 

 

Here we are side by side at roughly P6ish. Mine from yesterday with a 7 iron as well. 

 

In my best Crocodile Dundee voice " that's not early extension, this is early extension!"

[iacas]

32 minutes ago, vsabre said:

I never comment in the instructional thread but as a multi-decade HOF EE, I watched your video and went WTF, I don't see EE at all. Hell , your right foot is still flat on the ground inches before impact. If you EE'd your club would hit your knee before impact because you'd be up on your right toe half way through transition like the rest of us😆. 

 

It's EE:

 

[vsabre]

41 minutes ago, iacas said:

 

It's EE:

 

Relax, just being humorous..

[iacas]

11 minutes ago, vsabre said:

Relax, just being humorous..

Your main issue isn’t the right knee my man.

[BigManSlim]

A week of doing  the protocol. Looks better. Still working on width and shadowing but looks and feels much better. This was not yet hitting a ball

 

Also Need to work on clearing my lead hip better on the way down. I don’t use the front foot very well yet

 

[MK7Golf21]

1 minute ago, BigManSlim said:

A week of doing  the protocol. Looks better. Still working on width and shadowing but looks and feels much better. This was not yet hitting a ball

 

Also Need to work on clearing my lead hip better on the way down. I don’t use the front foot very well yet

 

swinging wayyy too much in to out. That’s your issue.