So... Paddy for Player of the year?

[IM_ALL_IN]

I think this race is very close at this point too. 2 majors isn't a guaranteed POY IMO, he won those two without you know who in the field...we have to take that into consideration right?

Wrong.

We do not have to take Tiger into consideration any more than we do any other of the great players from over the years.

What next?

It was not a real win because Ben Hogan(or any great ex champoin) could not attend.

 

The player who performed the best won and should be congratulated accordingly.

This has nothing to do with Tiger bashing...it's the way it is and always has been..

 

I didn't say anything about not being a real win, it is clearly, but we are talking about the player of the year race and what each player did, taking all considerations into account. I'm not trying to knock his accomplishment, but I think we'd all agree that it would've been MUCH sweeter if Tiger was in the field...then POY is a lock and it would be up on the list with the greatest seasons ever.

 

Tiger's U.S Open was quite possibly the greatest golf tournament ever played, that has to carry a ton of weight. He won 4 of 6 starts and made more money than Paddy, the POY isn't over IMO just b/c Paddy won 2 majors.

[hksaikung]

For the PGA player of the year (point system) Paddy seems to be a lock

 

Paddy 144 points

Tiger 80 points

Kenny Perry 62 points

Phil Mickelson 56 points

 

As for the vote from the Tour players for the PGA Tour Player of the year , that's another story

 

 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

 

Harrington soars to lead in PGA Player of Year, Vardon Trophy races

From PGA.com

 

PALM BEACH GARDENS, Fla. -- Padraig Harrington of Ireland, who wrote a remarkable chapter in major championship history over the past few weeks with victories in the British Open and PGA Championship, has taken a commanding lead in The PGA of America's 2008 Player of the Year point standings.

 

Harrington also leads the Vardon Trophy race, and with 44 completed rounds, needs to record 16 additional complete rounds to meet the required minimum of 60 rounds for one of the most prestigious season-ending awards.

 

Should Harrington continue his momentum toward both awards, he would be the first European since Nick Faldo in 1990 to win the PGA Player of the Year Award and would be the first-ever European to capture the Vardon Trophy, presented annually by The PGA of America since 1937 (not awarded from 1942-'46 due to WWII).

 

Harrington has accumulated 144 total points toward earning his first PGA Player of the Year award, based on 60 points for his two major championships, 50 bonus points for achieving that feat, 14 points for his standing on the season money list and 20 points for leading with an adjusted scoring average of 69.28.

 

Tiger Woods, who ended his season in June to undergo and recover from knee surgery, is second in the PGA Player of the Year standings with 80 points. Kenny Perry, a three-time winner this season, is next with 62 points, while Phil Mickelson is fourth with 56 points.

 

Mickelson is second in the Vardon Trophy standings with an adjusted scoring average of 69.42, based on 65 rounds. He is second on the money list with 18 points and has won two events.

 

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

The PGA of America has honored the game's best players with The PGA Player of the Year Award since 1948. The Award is currently presented to the top touring professional based on a point system for tournament wins, official money standings and scoring averages. Points are tabulated from Jan. 7, through the Children's Miracle Network Classic, which concludes Nov. 9. In addition, 50 bonus points are awarded to players with more than one major championship in the same year, and an additional 25 points for each additional major championship.

[Calamity Todd]

Tiger would trade his year for Harrington's year every day of the week! Period.

 

Paddy = POY

[SQgolfer523]

Tiger would trade his year for Harrington's year every day of the week! Period.

 

Paddy = POY

well lets see... shortened year due to injuries or playing the full year.... tough decision

[Calamity Todd]

Tiger would trade his year for Harrington's year every day of the week! Period.

 

Paddy = POY

well lets see... shortened year due to injuries or playing the full year.... tough decision

 

I was referring to each of their respective wins in '08.... :russian_roulette:

 

I don't think the debate in this thread has been which one had the better health records in '08......yeah, nope.....it's about the POY.

[marker]

I think this race is very close at this point too. 2 majors isn't a guaranteed POY IMO, he won those two without you know who in the field...we have to take that into consideration right?

Wrong.

We do not have to take Tiger into consideration any more than we do any other of the great players from over the years.

What next?

It was not a real win because Ben Hogan(or any great ex champoin) could not attend.

 

The player who performed the best won and should be congratulated accordingly.

This has nothing to do with Tiger bashing...it's the way it is and always has been..

 

You mean it makes no difference that the world's #1 player and two-time defending champion was not in the field?

 

Now I am not one of these morons who will talk of asterisks and what not, but I don't care what the tournament is or even the sport - when the undisputed best player in the game is missing in action, the field is not quite as strong.

 

When I see posts like I this I just think that the media has done a great job of turning people against Woods.

 

Lets just put one thing straight first.

I love Tiger Woods.

He is the greatest player of all time and also my fave player ever.

 

But I still stand by my above statement.

 

Tiger should not be player of the year because he has not played for a large part of it.

As said above,he was at the open last year when Harrington won so we know he can win with Tiger in the field.

 

Great champions often go through a period of un-popularity but that is not the reason Harrington is getting support.

 

He deserves it.

[e-dog9]

IMO, he won those two without you know who in the field...we have to take that into consideration right?

 

 

Bull Fing S*T I'm so tired of this non-issue. Did Tiger not play Carnoustie?

[SQgolfer523]

Tiger would trade his year for Harrington's year every day of the week! Period.

 

Paddy = POY

well lets see... shortened year due to injuries or playing the full year.... tough decision

 

I was referring to each of their respective wins in '08.... :russian_roulette:

 

I don't think the debate in this thread has been which one had the better health records in '08......yeah, nope.....it's about the POY.

if that is what we are talking about, i think anyone playing on the pga tour would choose to have tigers season over harringtons. tiger had so many wins this year and a major with a fifth place finish being his worse, and not just 2 majors and no other wins like harrington had.

[SQgolfer523]

IMO, he won those two without you know who in the field...we have to take that into consideration right?

 

 

Bull Fing S*T I'm so tired of this non-issue. Did Tiger not play Carnoustie?

this isnt a non-issue because harringtons only 2 wins came when tiger wasnt in the field.

[sk373]

if that is what we are talking about, i think anyone playing on the pga tour would choose to have tigers season over harringtons. tiger had so many wins this year and a major with a fifth place finish being his worse, and not just 2 majors and no other wins like harrington had.

 

1) Paddy's season isn't finished yet. Tiger's season is.

 

2) i'm willing to bet that more than several PGA Tour players would choose winning the Open and PGA Championship back-to-back over a US Open win + 3 other tour wins, especially if it came with a Vardon Trophy, which Paddy is on pace to win. only four players in the history of the game have won the Open and PGA Championship in the same year.

[e-dog9]

this isnt a non-issue because harringtons only 2 wins came when tiger wasnt in the field.

 

Yes, it is because Tiger was in the field when Immelman won the Masters. My god the stupidity of it all, just because Tiger is in the field, does not mean he will win. Yes, it calls on last year, but Tiger has been in the field a few times, and not won - even In Majors!

 

 

FYI- Golf Mag did write up a few months ago pointing out that among players who have been paired with Tiger, Harrington performs the best. Mind you it was not a big write up, just a glib bit of stats. I'll see if I can find it.

 

Tiger Effect - Yes, thats it! In honor of the ONE we should give every other event to him this year, becuase if he were in the field he would win........ I wonder if Nike will give me a job writing copy?

[btbridges]

I think this race is very close at this point too. 2 majors isn't a guaranteed POY IMO, he won those two without you know who in the field...we have to take that into consideration right?

Wrong.

We do not have to take Tiger into consideration any more than we do any other of the great players from over the years.

What next?

It was not a real win because Ben Hogan(or any great ex champoin) could not attend.

 

The player who performed the best won and should be congratulated accordingly.

This has nothing to do with Tiger bashing...it's the way it is and always has been..

 

You mean it makes no difference that the world's #1 player and two-time defending champion was not in the field?

 

Now I am not one of these morons who will talk of asterisks and what not, but I don't care what the tournament is or even the sport - when the undisputed best player in the game is missing in action, the field is not quite as strong.

 

When I see posts like I this I just think that the media has done a great job of turning people against Woods.

 

By this reasoning... Byron Nelson's streak shouldn't count either since some of the events weren't medal play and other members of the tour were in the Army.

 

Total BS in my opinion. There's no asterisk beside those who won major's after Hogan's wreck.

 

The game of golf always has been bigger than one player, and always will be. Granted Tiger has done things that are jaw dropping and brought otherworldly amounts of revenue to the tour, but to say Paddy's wins shouldn't count as much because Tiger wasn't there is flawed.

 

As far as the original topic, the PGA Tour Player of the Year (as determined by votes of PGA members) is going to be interesting. If Paddy wins a playoff cup event, he's a lock. Otherwise, flip a coin on who wins.

[IM_ALL_IN]

We can't forget Tiger's run at Augusta. Along with his 4 wins, he had a second at the masters and beat Harrington there. Hawkins just said on golf central "Tiger's heroic U.S Open=two majors" and I think this is a fair point. That U.S open was by far the best display of guts I've ever seen and Tiger deserves mad props for that.

 

I don't think it's that outrageous to say Padraig's BRITISH+PGA= Tiger's U.S OPEN

[e-dog9]

I don't think it's that outrageous to say Padraig's BRITISH+PGA= Tiger's U.S OPEN

 

 

Perhaps as far as heroics and winning the Golfer of the Year Award, but not in terms of wins and losses. 2 wins is greater than 1.

 

To me, Tiger's Major win, while great, does not stand alone as greatness for his consideration of GOY. His major this year caps off what was a brilliant season, brilliant because he accomplished so much in such little time, and heroic becuase he was injured when he did it. His worst finish this year was to tie for second! So I think its more complicated than comparing majors.

 

Its funny Padraig came closer to winning three majors than Tiger did! If he had not finsihed 5th at the Masters and won would we all be talking about PADDY SLAM - LOL Granted while P.H. did well at Augusta, he was not in it like Immelman and Snedeker were.

[chrisfx811]

I think Paddy gets GOY with the 2 majors. Tiger's season was great, but cut short.

 

It's kind of like when other NBA players won the MVP during Jordan's heyday. Everyone knew Jordan was the best, and the most valuable, but if someone else had a career year it was given to them... then Jordan spanked their respective backsides in the playoffs.

[mr ice]

OK, let's try the statistical way to solve this issue then, although I still think that the game is always bigger than the players.

 

Up until now Mr Woods has played in 51 Majors (I think) and won 14. This means that he nails about 28% of them as an average which transforms to 1 major per year. So to me it looks as if he had a fairly normal year. That is on average.

[Swingtheclub]

Like I said on the other thread right now its Padrick but the season is not over.

 

If Perry wins the Fed Ex Cup I would give him a hard look.

[dlygrisse]

What a load of complete and utter crap. And offensive too. How dare you accuse anyone who does not worship Tiger of being racist.

 

I am Irish and support Paddy and if you don't like that you can f[censored] right off. I need not and will not explain myself to you, you moron.

 

 

well said :jester:

Well said x 2

[dlygrisse]

Like I said on the other thread right now its Padrick but the season is not over.

 

If Perry wins the Fed Ex Cup I would give him a hard look.

Ken, I have to disagree with you on this one, and I do respect your opinion and agree with what you say 98% of the time. 2 majors vs. the Fed Ex Cup, a points system that was manufactured by the tour 1 year ago. Quite frankley the Fed Ex cup to me is a lot like the work ranking, interesting to look at but what I care about is wins, especially major wins, that determines greatness. Perry has no wins of great significance this year(except maybe the Memorial), he played in one major and withdrew after one round. He is a good player and his only goal was to make the Ryder Cup team. Mission accomplished, but I am crossing my fingers to see if now that he has accomplished his goal if he plays worth a darn in the Ryder Cup. JMO

[Calamity Todd]

Harrington has likely put himself in the HOF with his accomplishments this year. Whether or not he is a HOF'er is debateble.....but in my opinion with the three majors total now, along with his other accomplishments, he is a virtual lock. His record can be compared to several already in the HOF.

 

I know that we aren't discussing the HOF....just trying to point out what a great year he had. Tiger's wins at the Buick Invitational, Match Play, and Bay Hill were nice....but as I've contended before....he and most every other player on tour would trade Tiger's one major and 3 other wins for Harrington's 2 majors. Two majors, plus a halfway decent career, gets you into the World Golf HOF these days. IMHO.

[sk373]

^^ well, 3 majors ought to get a golfer into the HOF, considering only 18 golfers in history have accomplished that feat.

[hksaikung]

From PGATour.com

 

with the reminder of the choice between Duval and Marc O'Meara for POY in 1998

 

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

By Vartan Kupelian, PGATOUR.COM Correspondent

 

The PGA TOUR's Player of the Year honor, until Sunday at Oakland Hills, was being conceded to Tiger Woods. And with good reason.

 

In six starts, Woods won four times, finished in the top 10 in the other two, and capped it off with that awe-inspiring playoff triumph on wounded knee at the U.S. Open.

vartan_kupelian.jpg

 

To deprive Woods -- who has won three consecutive Player of the Year awards and nine in his career -- somebody had to do something special.

 

Enter Padraig Harrington.

 

Never has a golfer won two majors and not been rewarded as Player of the Year by a vote of the membership. Simply put, two majors trumps anything else that has happened this year, including Tiger's accomplishments before his season was shortened due to injury.

 

Not only will Harrington's back-to-back major victories at the Open Championship and PGA Championship be remembered at voting time, so will the way he finished the rain-soaked tournament at Oakland Hills -- a pair of 66s that he posted on Sunday, a spectacular display of golf on a course that left so many of his colleagues gasping for air.

 

There is precedent for Harrington outdistancing Woods when the TOUR members cast their ballots.

 

In 1998, David Duval led the TOUR with four victories (no majors). He topped the money list with $2,591,031. In addition, he led the Presidents Cup team eligibility list and won the Vardon Trophy for lowest scoring average (69.13).

 

By any measure, it was a season worthy of Player of the Year.

 

Meanwhile, Mark O'Meara won just twice that year -- but both came in majors, the Masters and the Open Championship. Those two major victories put O'Meara over the top in the Player of the Year voting. Duval finished a close second.

 

The same thing should happen this year. Harrington deserves to win Player of the Year. He's currently fourth on the FedExCup points list and has four other top five finishes besides his two majors, all impressive stuff. If he wins the PGA TOUR Playoffs for the FedExCup, or even just one of the four Playoff events, he'll should seal the deal.

 

But even if he doesn't, those two major victories will be enough for him to join O'Meara and Vijay Singh (2004) as the only players to win Player of the Year in the Tiger Era.

[yedi015]

Not to take anything away from the victory for Tiger at the US open and what he went through Didn't Paddy almost withdraw from the Open Championship due to a injured wrist. While Tigers Injury is more serious to the being Paddy's Hampers the swing much more seeing tiger even said it doesn't hurt until after impact and didn't hurt when cheering his put on the 18 to force a playoff. Paddy gets my knod all the way.

[Swingtheclub]

Should we just cancel the PGA tour all majors the Fed Ex until Tiger gets back?

 

 

 

 

I think this race is very close at this point too. 2 majors isn't a guaranteed POY IMO, he won those two without you know who in the field...we have to take that into consideration right?

Wrong.

We do not have to take Tiger into consideration any more than we do any other of the great players from over the years.

What next?

It was not a real win because Ben Hogan(or any great ex champoin) could not attend.

 

The player who performed the best won and should be congratulated accordingly.

This has nothing to do with Tiger bashing...it's the way it is and always has been..

 

You mean it makes no difference that the world's #1 player and two-time defending champion was not in the field?

 

Now I am not one of these morons who will talk of asterisks and what not, but I don't care what the tournament is or even the sport - when the undisputed best player in the game is missing in action, the field is not quite as strong.

 

When I see posts like I this I just think that the media has done a great job of turning people against Woods.

[SQgolfer523]

Should we just cancel the PGA tour all majors the Fed Ex until Tiger gets back?

 

 

 

 

I think this race is very close at this point too. 2 majors isn't a guaranteed POY IMO, he won those two without you know who in the field...we have to take that into consideration right?

Wrong.

We do not have to take Tiger into consideration any more than we do any other of the great players from over the years.

What next?

It was not a real win because Ben Hogan(or any great ex champoin) could not attend.

 

The player who performed the best won and should be congratulated accordingly.

This has nothing to do with Tiger bashing...it's the way it is and always has been..

 

You mean it makes no difference that the world's #1 player and two-time defending champion was not in the field?

 

Now I am not one of these morons who will talk of asterisks and what not, but I don't care what the tournament is or even the sport - when the undisputed best player in the game is missing in action, the field is not quite as strong.

 

When I see posts like I this I just think that the media has done a great job of turning people against Woods.

haha coming from the guy that thinks kenny perry still has a chance. If your saying that there wouldnt have been a difference at the british and pga if Tiger was in the field, your dilusional. Tiger not being able to be in the field at these tournaments should be taken into consideration.

[lewisgl]

I gotta go with Padraig on this one.

[lewisgl]

Padraig Harrington is just the kind of guy that could play well against Tiger on a Sunday in a major and I think it would be fun to watch, and he has beaten Tiger head to head in a pretty big tournament awhile back.

[Rambler]

Paddy will have to tank a lot of people if he wins LOL

[Swingtheclub]

Should we just cancel the PGA tour all majors the Fed Ex until Tiger gets back?

 

 

 

 

I think this race is very close at this point too. 2 majors isn't a guaranteed POY IMO, he won those two without you know who in the field...we have to take that into consideration right?

Wrong.

We do not have to take Tiger into consideration any more than we do any other of the great players from over the years.

What next?

It was not a real win because Ben Hogan(or any great ex champoin) could not attend.

 

The player who performed the best won and should be congratulated accordingly.

This has nothing to do with Tiger bashing...it's the way it is and always has been..

 

You mean it makes no difference that the world's #1 player and two-time defending champion was not in the field?

 

Now I am not one of these morons who will talk of asterisks and what not, but I don't care what the tournament is or even the sport - when the undisputed best player in the game is missing in action, the field is not quite as strong.

 

When I see posts like I this I just think that the media has done a great job of turning people against Woods.

haha coming from the guy that thinks kenny perry still has a chance. If your saying that there wouldnt have been a difference at the british and pga if Tiger was in the field, your dilusional. Tiger not being able to be in the field at these tournaments should be taken into consideration.

 

 

Now that is just ridiculous. Why would you even suggest that?

 

 

Lets not stretch my words first I said if Kenny Perry was to win the Fed Ex Cup then I think he would be in contention for player of the year

 

Would Tiger have made a difference if he played in the British or the PGA who knows he wins a lot of majors not all of them

 

Remember if Tiger does not come back sucessfully from his surgery he may never make a difference again .

 

 

Tenementrock buddy that was the way I interpreted your statement as if without Tiger the tournaments were lessoned or did not matter.

[IM_ALL_IN]

Should we just cancel the PGA tour all majors the Fed Ex until Tiger gets back?

 

Yes, this would probably be best.