PLEASE READ: Negativity on GolfWRX

[PixlPutterman]

I have clicked the violation button more times today than I have the entire time I have been a member of this site. What is up with all the negativity and personal attacks? If you don't like a topic or post, THEN MOVE ON. There is no need to call anyone out. Arguing on the internet accomplishes NOTHING. Lets not forget why we are all here, because we love golf! I would hate to see this site get negative because of a few bad seeds. This is my favorite site to visit, and I would like to keep it that way. So come on guys (and gals) lets all remember why we are here and get along. :friends:

i dont like you

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

jk

[kittart]

Maybe there should be a new forum heading:

 

PGA WITB

Tour

Dom & Imp

Golf Style

General Golf

Putter Talk

etc

 

Then maybe

 

"Golf Spleen"

or

"Have A Go If You Think You're Hard Enough"

 

People could start threads like

"Tiger is talentless and lucky"

"John Daly is cleverer than George Bush"

"Ben Hogan was the nicest man my daddy ever met"

"I like a man with nice big boobs"

 

There could be a big free-for-all and people could take out the frustratioins of their day, while those who want to have propper reasonable golf-related chat could get on with it unmolested.

 

What do you think?

[profsmitty]

I am convinced that the best way to treat juvenile comments is by silence. These folks seem to need attention - why give it to them? We must, as a community, create a standard for polite, spirited discourse that makes it clear that these misfits must either act as adults or they will not be welcome here. The violation button works and we must use it.

 

PS - If you don't think that discourse can be spirited without becoming disagreeable, I humbly submit Stage as an example. We have at times engaged in serious debate over complex and testy issues. On many of them, we could not be more fundamentally in disagreement. In my opinion, Stage has always conducted himself as a gentleman (even though he is usually wrong, particularly about the membership policies at ANGC - but that is another story). I look forward to engaging in converstation with him many times in the future.

 

As always

[Marrrk]

PS - If you don't think that discourse can be spirited without becoming disagreeable, I humbly submit Stage as an example. We have at times engaged in serious debate over complex and testy issues. On many of them, we could not be more fundamentally in disagreement. In my opinion, Stage has always conducted himself as a gentleman (even though he is usually wrong, particularly about the membership policies at ANGC - but that is another story). I look forward to engaging in converstation with him many times in the future.

 

As always

 

 

right on.

 

i didn't agree with Stage at all in this thread and not for a moment did it ever get heated or testy. as soon as we both had our say and realized we fundamentally disagreed, there was a gentlemanly understanding.

[TM golf guy]

PS - If you don't think that discourse can be spirited without becoming disagreeable, I humbly submit Stage as an example. We have at times engaged in serious debate over complex and testy issues. On many of them, we could not be more fundamentally in disagreement. In my opinion, Stage has always conducted himself as a gentleman (even though he is usually wrong, particularly about the membership policies at ANGC - but that is another story). I look forward to engaging in converstation with him many times in the future.

 

As always

 

 

right on.

 

i didn't agree with Stage at all in this thread and not for a moment did it ever get heated or testy. as soon as we both had our say and realized we fundamentally disagreed, there was a gentlemanly understanding.

 

That was one of the big reasons I started this thread. It is totally fine to disagree, but unfortunately very few disagree like you and Stage do/did. If we could have more discussions like that, then we wouldn't have as many problems.

[PixlPutterman]

it comes down to to many people to comfortable hiding behind their keyboard. 99 percent of them would not have the same tone and attitude if we were all face to face.

[ram01002]

Many of the ugly threads here could be avoided if a poster would spend 5-10 minutes researching the topic -- many of the inflammatory topics have been debated ad nauseum. In the past 2 weeks I've seen several of the following topic titles;

 

The new prov1 sucks

The 2009 prov1 is different

The new prov1 is not the same

I hate the new prov1

The 2009 prov1 truly is different

I found out for myself that the new prov1 sucks

 

Just adding your findings to an existing thread would suffice. Once the horse has been beaten, there is no reason to revive him and start anew.

[woohoo4me]

Usually what I do, when I see a "hot" thread, is roll my two dice. Whatever number that comes up I find that post number and flame the bejeepers out of it, complete with personal attacks...even if I totally agree with what's said. :cheesy:

 

All kidding aside, I will say that I have avoided posting in some threads that looked "testy" or where I thought my opinion would get me flamed. Just don't have the time or energy for internet fights.

 

Still my favorite site on the interwebs.

 

Woo

[stage1350]

I always find it funny when you disagree with someone and they react like you just stabbed their child. My opinion simply differs from yours.

 

What I think is most important here, or on any site is having the ability to at least consider the other person's point of view. If for no other reason, you can take the merits of their argument and start knocking them down one by one with thoughtful debate.

 

But you will always find some people that can't look at it any other way then their own. Whether you want to call it man-love, fan boys, zombies, etc. you'd better not say anything non-positive about their crush or they will go postal on you.

 

I also find that it helps not to take this stuff too seriously. It's much more fun to post in a jovial, smart-Word not allowed tone than trying to be emotional about it.

 

I think there are (maybe) 5-6 people total that I truly have hatred for on the Internet. I mean I seriously loathe them and wouldn't walk across the street to piss on them if they were on fire. Everyone else, while we may disagree, we can still go out an play golf. That's always a good thing.

[307golf]

Is it time for the group hug yet?

[wentorf11]

You have a site with 70,000+ members, there are bound to be a few bad apples.

 

Also I think the age range of users on this site is vast. I try to keep that in mind; last thing I want to do is get into in a flame war with some dweeby high school freshman. The median age here probably like 50 years old.

 

 

and I thnk we need to remember

 

 

I personally try to ignore attacks and insulting posts (or use the violation button, not sure what it does, but the post I used it on was way out of line) and take away the good things that our membership has to offer.

[Pepperturbo]

I have clicked the violation button more times today than I have the entire time I have been a member of this site. What is up with all the negativity and personal attacks? If you don't like a topic or post, THEN MOVE ON. There is no need to call anyone out. Arguing on the internet accomplishes NOTHING. Lets not forget why we are all here, because we love golf! I would hate to see this site get negative because of a few bad seeds. This is my favorite site to visit, and I would like to keep it that way. So come on guys (and gals) lets all remember why we are here and get along. :friends:

 

I partially agree. Where we disagree there seems to be too many folks that perceive being “called out” (adolescent challenge), :fool: questioned or having someone disagree with them as arguing or being negative and shouldn’t happen.

 

This is a discussion board where for every topic there are perspectives from a culturally diverse readership; that means assorted ages, life experiences, and success levels; some have positive tilts to their personalities others have negative (glass half full or half empty) leanings. Some folks like me might believe a post lacks experience or maturity; or maybe I see their view as clearly right or wrong, and or lacking balance in some fashion.

 

Determining someone is being negative about what you feel positive towards means nothing more then an opinion derived from diversity and maybe posed passionately. At least that’s how I positively perceive discussion boards. Nevertheless, I must remind myself discussion boards are venues where I encounter people that I wouldn’t otherwise meet in my normal life, and they include those folks that don’t have much in the way social skills, education, or understanding.

 

Imagine traveling abroad for an extended period. Do you get out on the street and engage and enjoy cultural differences thereby learning or do you stay sequestered in your hotel for fear of facing those differences. If the later, why bother to travel or as it applies here post on discussion boards.

 

Too many people today expect the world to cater to them; that's not only stifling, it reflects an immaturity which is detrimental to getting along and shows a stunted learning curve. Mature people talk, hold their tongue, learn, and disagree, even argue at times and still get along. Name calling on the other hand is not only disrupting, its wrong and childish. Have a good day.

[golfortennis]

I find the "hating" is usually posted in direct correlation to the amount of "man love" threads we have.

 

Ridiculous and over the top is the same whether it is positive or negative. Reading some of the man crush threads on here raises the bile in my throat much more than reading a thread about something that pisses somebody off.

 

This is 100% true. And I'll never understand the need for some people to go around pushing the violation button. There is absolutely nothing anyone could ever post on an internet forum that could offend me to the point of crying to the mods. Call me any names you want, I don't care. I think these people that feel the need to report everyone are the same people who never left the side of the teacher's aide during recess.

 

 

I am convinced that the best way to treat juvenile comments is by silence. These folks seem to need attention - why give it to them? We must, as a community, create a standard for polite, spirited discourse that makes it clear that these misfits must either act as adults or they will not be welcome here. The violation button works and we must use it.

 

PS - If you don't think that discourse can be spirited without becoming disagreeable, I humbly submit Stage as an example. We have at times engaged in serious debate over complex and testy issues. On many of them, we could not be more fundamentally in disagreement. In my opinion, Stage has always conducted himself as a gentleman (even though he is usually wrong, particularly about the membership policies at ANGC - but that is another story). I look forward to engaging in converstation with him many times in the future.

 

As always

 

 

These right here. Most of the time, those who are posting in such an inflammatory way are looking for attention. Nothing sticks in their craw more than the fact no one replied to their post.

 

I would assume some of us here are usenet veterans. There were no moderators to go to, no violate button to hit. You either replied to the person and took your lumps for encouraging them, or you resisted the urge, did not reply, and watched them go away eventually. They always did. The comment about thinking we have a bunch of 6th graders here is spot on, and the think 6th graders crave the most is attention. Don't give it to them, and they go away.

 

While there are exceptions, I've found that as discussion has moved from usenet to moderated internet forums, many people have developed a "sense of security" for lack of a better term, that topics they don't like can be removed if they complain. This has led to some posters not even bothering to post because even if they have well-supported arguments, someone is going to disagree and hit violate on them.

 

It also has led to the "you don't agree 150% with what I said, why are you a hater?" person. Whether you say something racist about Tiger Woods, or say the TV networks show him too much, you are called a hater, and are deemed to be negative. While one of those certainly is hating Woods, the other is a discussion point, and really isn't about Woods so much as the networks. Yet things like that are considered "negative" and should not be posted according to some.

 

There was a discussion and a website that has "course" reviews, but also sells tee times was named in response to a quesiton about courses in a particular area. I replied that, no, do not get your information from them, get it here. Their website is nothing more than press releases. You won't find out from them that the bunkers are full of rocks, or that the tee boxes are nothing more than little mounds, or that it takes half an hour to get a hotdog at the window at the turn. Some people say that is negative and you should keep it to yourself. I want to know this information, because if I'm asking, it's because I'm not from there, and one bad experience on a vacation can ruin the vacation, and even moreso if I would have been able to find out ahead of time which courses to avoid.

 

Information such as that is invaluable, and should never be suppressed. It's one of the things that makes golfwrx great. Sure you have to learn whose opinion is worth listening to and whose isn't, but that makes golfwrx just like life.

 

Comments that appear to be made at a 6th grade level of maturity? Well, frankly, they are best ignored. They will go find someone who will give them attention soon enough.

[Ty_Webb]

I'm still very new on here, so take this opinion for whatever it's worth. But I really do think this site is a fantastic resource and I'd like to see it stay that way. I can honestly say that in the three or four months I've been on this site I've learned more about equipment, courses, technique, and other general golf "stuff" than I did in all my previous years of playing golf combined. I've also been really impressed by how open and willing to share everyone is. I mean, honestly, almost every day someone puts a video of their swing up for total strangers to view and critique. And as a credit to this site, these posters generally get friendly and helpful advice rather than ridicule. Pretty cool.

 

Okay, the endorsement for Golfwrx is over, back to topic. I definitely have noticed posts becoming more negative (maybe "combative" is a better word) even in just the short time I've been on here. Personally, I don't think the problem is so much with original posts being too negative or too positive. There certainly are, and I'm sure always have been and will continue to be, the "I hate Scotty Cameron" or "I worship Tiger Woods" types of posts. Are those maybe a little obnoxious? Sure. But I don't think those types of posts really have any major effect on the general tone of the discussions in other areas. You can either choose to ignore those kinds of posts and let them die a quick death or you can join in. Sometimes people joining in end up with a fun and spirited debate (which is a good thing that I don't believe necessarily equates to "negativity"), sometimes it gets stupid and devolves into name calling or yelling match. Either way, people know what they're getting into when they reply to those kinds of posts and, as long as it's done in a somewhat respectful manner, I don't see a huge problem. Obnoxious but benign.

 

In my opinion the much bigger problem is with the sniping replies to honest and genuine posts asking for information or advice. I've noticed a lot more of that in the posts I've read recently. Sometimes replies can be outright hostile, think the "I don't know why you even posted this" types of posts. More often it's subtle: condescension, sarcascim, etc. I don't know if people making those kinds of replies are even aware they're doing it. Maybe they're trying to be funny. Whatever it is, it's not good. People come here for information. If someone has a question, that means they're probably already a little insecure because they don't know the answer. Just like anybody else, they don't want to look foolish even if it is in front of a bunch of internet strangers. So, when they get a snarky reply back it has a chilling effect in that it encourages that poster (or those reading the posts) to be even more cautious or possibly not even ask something they have a genuine question about. That's really bad and that's the type of situation that I think has a negative carry-over effect to this site as a whole.

 

I'm certainly not calling anyone out and I'm also certain I've been guilty of this same behavior myself. I don't know what can be done other than self-policing. Let somebody know (in a constructive and respectful manner) when their reply is disrespectful or inappropriate. By the same token, don't go overboard and recognize the difference between an opinion and an insult (i.e. - "blades are way cooler than cavity backs", while a highly played out topic starter, is not an insult). I really noticed people did a great job of this when I first started reading the posts here. For some reason, I've noticed that the self-policing (i.e. - the "what you said in post #22 was out of line and you should apologize") types of responses I saw before, have started to be replaced with responses in which someone attempts to take a barb at the rude poster in a t**-for-tat. While that's possibly more satisfying in the short run, it doesn't really resolve anything and in fact usually causes things to spiral down in a back and forth of negative posts.

 

Anyway, those are my thoughts - useful or not. Now that golf season is here for most of us, maybe the negativity will go away since people can get the hate out by going all Woody Austin with their putter.

 

Couldn't agree more. The thing that annoys me is when people post in threads saying things like "haven't you guys got anything better to do than talk about this?" If you're not going to add something constructive (which may be criticism or disagreement or even argument) then don't bother adding it at all. Suggesting that people need to get a life because they're talking about this that or the other is particularly poor.

 

And if people don't like a subject, just don't click into that particular thread. I doubt if it's even possible to read every post on the board, so why not just stick to those topics that interest you? If everyone did that, I think the amount of sniping would diminish rapidly. That and keeping things impersonal. If I want to say that Tiger is better than Jack, that's fine, and likewise, you're more than welcome to disagree with me, but at least be willing to put forward a reason why you think that that is somewhat stronger than "you Tiger-lovers fawning over him make me sick". Attack the arguments, not the person making them. It's pretty easy really (well, not if you're trying to argue Jack is better than Tiger, but I digress :D).

[profsmitty]

I'm still very new on here, so take this opinion for whatever it's worth. But I really do think this site is a fantastic resource and I'd like to see it stay that way. I can honestly say that in the three or four months I've been on this site I've learned more about equipment, courses, technique, and other general golf "stuff" than I did in all my previous years of playing golf combined. I've also been really impressed by how open and willing to share everyone is. I mean, honestly, almost every day someone puts a video of their swing up for total strangers to view and critique. And as a credit to this site, these posters generally get friendly and helpful advice rather than ridicule. Pretty cool.

 

Okay, the endorsement for Golfwrx is over, back to topic. I definitely have noticed posts becoming more negative (maybe "combative" is a better word) even in just the short time I've been on here. Personally, I don't think the problem is so much with original posts being too negative or too positive. There certainly are, and I'm sure always have been and will continue to be, the "I hate Scotty Cameron" or "I worship Tiger Woods" types of posts. Are those maybe a little obnoxious? Sure. But I don't think those types of posts really have any major effect on the general tone of the discussions in other areas. You can either choose to ignore those kinds of posts and let them die a quick death or you can join in. Sometimes people joining in end up with a fun and spirited debate (which is a good thing that I don't believe necessarily equates to "negativity"), sometimes it gets stupid and devolves into name calling or yelling match. Either way, people know what they're getting into when they reply to those kinds of posts and, as long as it's done in a somewhat respectful manner, I don't see a huge problem. Obnoxious but benign.

 

In my opinion the much bigger problem is with the sniping replies to honest and genuine posts asking for information or advice. I've noticed a lot more of that in the posts I've read recently. Sometimes replies can be outright hostile, think the "I don't know why you even posted this" types of posts. More often it's subtle: condescension, sarcascim, etc. I don't know if people making those kinds of replies are even aware they're doing it. Maybe they're trying to be funny. Whatever it is, it's not good. People come here for information. If someone has a question, that means they're probably already a little insecure because they don't know the answer. Just like anybody else, they don't want to look foolish even if it is in front of a bunch of internet strangers. So, when they get a snarky reply back it has a chilling effect in that it encourages that poster (or those reading the posts) to be even more cautious or possibly not even ask something they have a genuine question about. That's really bad and that's the type of situation that I think has a negative carry-over effect to this site as a whole.

 

I'm certainly not calling anyone out and I'm also certain I've been guilty of this same behavior myself. I don't know what can be done other than self-policing. Let somebody know (in a constructive and respectful manner) when their reply is disrespectful or inappropriate. By the same token, don't go overboard and recognize the difference between an opinion and an insult (i.e. - "blades are way cooler than cavity backs", while a highly played out topic starter, is not an insult). I really noticed people did a great job of this when I first started reading the posts here. For some reason, I've noticed that the self-policing (i.e. - the "what you said in post #22 was out of line and you should apologize") types of responses I saw before, have started to be replaced with responses in which someone attempts to take a barb at the rude poster in a t**-for-tat. While that's possibly more satisfying in the short run, it doesn't really resolve anything and in fact usually causes things to spiral down in a back and forth of negative posts.

 

Anyway, those are my thoughts - useful or not. Now that golf season is here for most of us, maybe the negativity will go away since people can get the hate out by going all Woody Austin with their putter.

 

Couldn't agree more. The thing that annoys me is when people post in threads saying things like "haven't you guys got anything better to do than talk about this?" If you're not going to add something constructive (which may be criticism or disagreement or even argument) then don't bother adding it at all. Suggesting that people need to get a life because they're talking about this that or the other is particularly poor.

 

And if people don't like a subject, just don't click into that particular thread. I doubt if it's even possible to read every post on the board, so why not just stick to those topics that interest you? If everyone did that, I think the amount of sniping would diminish rapidly. That and keeping things impersonal. If I want to say that Tiger is better than Jack, that's fine, and likewise, you're more than welcome to disagree with me, but at least be willing to put forward a reason why you think that that is somewhat stronger than "you Tiger-lovers fawning over him make me sick". Attack the arguments, not the person making them. It's pretty easy really (well, not if you're trying to argue Jack is better than Tiger, but I digress :D).

It does occur to me that we are "preaching to the choir" to a great extent. I don't think that people who are posting or reading this thread are much of a problem. Maybe the OP would consider changing the name of the thread to something like "I really love those Titleist XXXX's". That'll snare the little miscreants.

[bhendr5]

it comes down to to many people to comfortable hiding behind their keyboard. 99 percent of them would not have the same tone and attitude if we were all face to face.

 

I think this is the real answer.

[Marrrk]

It also has led to the "you don't agree 150% with what I said, why are you a hater?" person. Whether you say something racist about Tiger Woods, or say the TV networks show him too much, you are called a hater, and are deemed to be negative. While one of those certainly is hating Woods, the other is a discussion point, and really isn't about Woods so much as the networks. Yet things like that are considered "negative" and should not be posted according to some.

 

i agree with most of what you said except for the hating thing. being a "hater" is different from actually "hating" someone.

 

personally, i think a hater is 1000 times more annoying than someone who just loves a player, even if it's unconditional. my opinion of what a hater is is someone who has let their intense dislike of someone cloud their ability to properly reason. they specifically look for threads to attack. the Tiger issue is a perfect example. some people seek out those threads, or, always click on them, for the sole purpose of saying something derogatory, snide, or snarky about Tiger. that brings them joy, and THAT is what a playa hata does.

 

and like i said, personally, i'll take a person who is blinded by love over a person who is blinded by hatred any day.

 

i know Stage kind of feels the opposite, and that's all good, especially since neither of us fall into those love/hate camps.

[kyo-nax]

I always find it funny when you disagree with someone and they react like you just stabbed their child. My opinion simply differs from yours.

Me too... :cheesy:

 

Internet creates persona, people all of sudden becomes someone they are not, or they lose their persona and real one comes out??

[alfie]

Right on to call out how negative folks are turning over here at GolfWRX.com. I know that we, as a society/world are not happy if we don't vent or complain about something, but, is it necessary to carry that negative vibe over to the forum?

[stage1350]

...and like i said, personally, i'll take a person who is blinded by love over a person who is blinded by hatred any day.

 

i know Stage kind of feels the opposite, and that's all good, especially since neither of us fall into those love/hate camps.

 

Both camps deserve to me made fun of, so it's simply twice as much opportunity.

 

Double your pleasure, double your fun...

[profsmitty]

...and like i said, personally, i'll take a person who is blinded by love over a person who is blinded by hatred any day.

 

i know Stage kind of feels the opposite, and that's all good, especially since neither of us fall into those love/hate camps.

 

Both camps deserve to me made fun of, so it's simply twice as much opportunity.

 

Double your pleasure, double your fun...

I hope I never lose the ability to love passionately - even if it means that I will be periodically disappointed. The ability to hate isn't an accomplishment, its a surrender to the most base level of human nature. This is somewhat cheesy but I like it anyway:

 

Three passions have governed my life:

The longings for love, the search for knowledge,

And unbearable pity for the suffering of [humankind].

 

Love brings ecstasy and relieves loneliness.

In the union of love I have seen

In a mystic miniature the prefiguring vision

Of the heavens that saints and poets have imagined.

 

With equal passion I have sought knowledge.

I have wished to understand the hearts of [people].

I have wished to know why the stars shine.

 

Love and knowledge led upwards to the heavens,

But always pity brought me back to earth;

Cries of pain reverberated in my heart

Of children in famine, of victims tortured

And of old people left helpless.

I long to alleviate the evil, but I cannot,

And I too suffer.

 

This has been my life; I found it worth living.

 

Bertrand Russell

[Ty_Webb]

...and like i said, personally, i'll take a person who is blinded by love over a person who is blinded by hatred any day.

 

i know Stage kind of feels the opposite, and that's all good, especially since neither of us fall into those love/hate camps.

 

Both camps deserve to me made fun of, so it's simply twice as much opportunity.

 

Double your pleasure, double your fun...

I hope I never lose the ability to love passionately - even if it means that I will be periodically disappointed. The ability to hate isn't an accomplishment, its a surrender to the most base level of human nature. This is somewhat cheesy but I like it anyway:

 

Three passions have governed my life:

The longings for love, the search for knowledge,

And unbearable pity for the suffering of [humankind].

 

Love brings ecstasy and relieves loneliness.

In the union of love I have seen

In a mystic miniature the prefiguring vision

Of the heavens that saints and poets have imagined.

 

With equal passion I have sought knowledge.

I have wished to understand the hearts of [people].

I have wished to know why the stars shine.

 

Love and knowledge led upwards to the heavens,

But always pity brought me back to earth;

Cries of pain reverberated in my heart

Of children in famine, of victims tortured

And of old people left helpless.

I long to alleviate the evil, but I cannot,

And I too suffer.

 

This has been my life; I found it worth living.

 

Bertrand Russell

 

Bertrand Russell is the man (or was anyway). I wish everyone thought like he does (or did). The world would be a much better place.

[Jaylasvegas]

...and like i said, personally, i'll take a person who is blinded by love over a person who is blinded by hatred any day.

 

i know Stage kind of feels the opposite, and that's all good, especially since neither of us fall into those love/hate camps.

 

Both camps deserve to me made fun of, so it's simply twice as much opportunity.

 

Double your pleasure, double your fun...

I hope I never lose the ability to love passionately - even if it means that I will be periodically disappointed. The ability to hate isn't an accomplishment, its a surrender to the most base level of human nature. This is somewhat cheesy but I like it anyway:

 

Three passions have governed my life:

The longings for love, the search for knowledge,

And unbearable pity for the suffering of [humankind].

 

Love brings ecstasy and relieves loneliness.

In the union of love I have seen

In a mystic miniature the prefiguring vision

Of the heavens that saints and poets have imagined.

 

With equal passion I have sought knowledge.

I have wished to understand the hearts of [people].

I have wished to know why the stars shine.

 

Love and knowledge led upwards to the heavens,

But always pity brought me back to earth;

Cries of pain reverberated in my heart

Of children in famine, of victims tortured

And of old people left helpless.

I long to alleviate the evil, but I cannot,

And I too suffer.

 

This has been my life; I found it worth living.

 

Bertrand Russell

 

Bertrand Russell is the man (or was anyway). I wish everyone thought like he does (or did). The world would be a much better place.

If we all thought the same way it would be a pretty boring place

[Ty_Webb]

If we all thought the same way it would be a pretty boring place

 

I stand corrected. That's a very good point.

[stage1350]

...and like i said, personally, i'll take a person who is blinded by love over a person who is blinded by hatred any day.

 

i know Stage kind of feels the opposite, and that's all good, especially since neither of us fall into those love/hate camps.

 

Both camps deserve to me made fun of, so it's simply twice as much opportunity.

 

Double your pleasure, double your fun...

I hope I never lose the ability to love passionately - even if it means that I will be periodically disappointed. The ability to hate isn't an accomplishment, its a surrender to the most base level of human nature. This is somewhat cheesy but I like it anyway:

 

Three passions have governed my life:

The longings for love, the search for knowledge,

And unbearable pity for the suffering of [humankind].

 

Love brings ecstasy and relieves loneliness.

In the union of love I have seen

In a mystic miniature the prefiguring vision

Of the heavens that saints and poets have imagined.

 

With equal passion I have sought knowledge.

I have wished to understand the hearts of [people].

I have wished to know why the stars shine.

 

Love and knowledge led upwards to the heavens,

But always pity brought me back to earth;

Cries of pain reverberated in my heart

Of children in famine, of victims tortured

And of old people left helpless.

I long to alleviate the evil, but I cannot,

And I too suffer.

 

This has been my life; I found it worth living.

 

Bertrand Russell

 

Bertrand Russell is the man (or was anyway). I wish everyone thought like he does (or did). The world would be a much better place.

If we all thought the same way it would be a pretty boring place

If we all thought the same way, nobody would have anyone left to label as a "hater."

 

It's sad that douchebag is censored here but hater is not.

[Jaylasvegas]

...and like i said, personally, i'll take a person who is blinded by love over a person who is blinded by hatred any day.

 

i know Stage kind of feels the opposite, and that's all good, especially since neither of us fall into those love/hate camps.

 

Both camps deserve to me made fun of, so it's simply twice as much opportunity.

 

Double your pleasure, double your fun...

I hope I never lose the ability to love passionately - even if it means that I will be periodically disappointed. The ability to hate isn't an accomplishment, its a surrender to the most base level of human nature. This is somewhat cheesy but I like it anyway:

 

Three passions have governed my life:

The longings for love, the search for knowledge,

And unbearable pity for the suffering of [humankind].

 

Love brings ecstasy and relieves loneliness.

In the union of love I have seen

In a mystic miniature the prefiguring vision

Of the heavens that saints and poets have imagined.

 

With equal passion I have sought knowledge.

I have wished to understand the hearts of [people].

I have wished to know why the stars shine.

 

Love and knowledge led upwards to the heavens,

But always pity brought me back to earth;

Cries of pain reverberated in my heart

Of children in famine, of victims tortured

And of old people left helpless.

I long to alleviate the evil, but I cannot,

And I too suffer.

 

This has been my life; I found it worth living.

 

Bertrand Russell

 

Bertrand Russell is the man (or was anyway). I wish everyone thought like he does (or did). The world would be a much better place.

If we all thought the same way it would be a pretty boring place

If we all thought the same way, nobody would have anyone left to label as a "hater."

 

It's sad that douchebag is censored here but hater is not.

they cant censor the word douchebag because there are too many here

it wouldnt be fair

[Watch]

I have a master's degree in rhetoric. I like to argue. So what? It's all academic to me, even though some of you guys are nuts. And of course, you're all studs who crush the ball 350 yards on drives and post handicap indexes that amount to scratch golfers.

 

Go on tour, why don't you?

[profsmitty]

I have a master's degree in rhetoric. I like to argue. So what? It's all academic to me, even though some of you guys are nuts. And of course, you're all studs who crush the ball 350 yards on drives and post handicap indexes that amount to scratch golfers.

 

Go on tour, why don't you?

Rhetoric is the use of the written or spoken word to persuade. Rhetoric is always and everywhere, appropriate. It is the language of philosophy and learning. It should be the vehicle upon which this forum and all civilized discourse moves. Rhetoric, I would suggest, is argument with without being argumentative.

 

Many, including myself, believe (and have eloquently expressed in this thread) that too much of what passes for accepted and unchallenged discourse is, in fact, anything but rhetoric. In too many cases it has taken the form of harangue and/or attempts to humiliate others. It is the expression of bombast and demagoguery, of anger and ignorance, of immaturity and commonness. Its purpose is not to inform, to persuade, or connect. Its purpose is to divide and to destroy. It may be the standard of the street but I hope it is not the standard of the golf course. Too many people have struggled over the years to make golf different. They created a sport that is known for its gentility, honor, and camaraderie. It is up to us, here and everywhere golf is played or discussed, to keep it that way.

 

Watch, please use the skills you learned in earning your masters degree to serve as an example of the difference between rhetoric and bombast.

[ghodges]

I had stayed away from here recently because there really has been a lot more heat than light. I think civil debate/discussion/disagreement is great. Having differing perspectives makes things interesting. However, the way things devolve here on Wrx lately has been pretty bad. Having a difference of opinion is fine, but the name calling, baseless accusations and general nastiness just isn't my cup of tea. I'm not optimistic, but hoping we see less of it moving forward and we get more insightful/thoughtful debate and discussion moving forward.

 

I'm in the camp life would be boring if we all agreed, but that doesn't mean we have to be downright ugly either.

[forgedforever]

I'll keep this short. I've only been on here since November. I was extremely excited at first, with all the wonderful features this site has to offer. I still love to log-on, but I have to admit that that the negativity I've seen over the past few months in some topics has lessened my enthusiasm. I just don't understand the personal attacks I've seen at times. In my humble opinion, we should be able to disagree with each other without being disagreeable on a personal level.

 

For myself, I simply try to stay out of the topics where I see firefights developing. It just isn't worth it. I don't understand how someone can "hate" another person for posting their opinion.

 

If I am going to hate someone, I think back to the morning of 911. Let's think about what is really important.

 

Having said that, there are far, far more positives than negatives about this website. There is a wealth of information on this site, and a lot of very, very good people.

 

I would also like to take this opportunity to thank the moderators. From my little corner of the world, beruo does a wonderful job. Many thanks to him and the others :hi:

 

A good weekend to all!