Will Tiger leave Hank haney???

[scores]

Tiger Woods is the best player in the world not the guy with the best swing in the world. The only thing I see that people are not taking a real close look at it how many times have the crowds saved the guy of a really high number. There are times when the guy hits into the crowds and the ball just ends up in a great place. The guy actually hit one in a club house and how it was not lost or OB is beyond me???

 

I guess he earned those breaks but as I look back he never hit the driver straight!!!!!!!!! His wing has always been somewhat dippy not a lot but enough to be slightly noticeable. I love the way he plays and scores I almost hope he does not fix his swing because it keeps it somewhat even with the field.

 

If he hits the driver SOMEWHAT straight he will kill the field.

 

He is better than everyone else and he has the trophies to prove it.

[mikpga]

This week on "As The World Turns"

 

Will Tiger leave Hank Haney?

 

Will he be reunited with his long lost guru Butch Harmon?

 

Perhaps he has found the essential advice he's been searching for on a golf blog called golfwrx?

 

Is he considering remaining coach free for a few years, or...

 

Will AJ Bonar fill in as a surprise twist to the plot?

 

Will Tiger finally ditch Nike's inferior driver technology?

 

Are Steve and Tiger having a secret affair?

 

Find out all of this and more, next week on "As The World Turns"

[owaisdurrani]

Maybe Tiger should get back to the basics and concentrate on feel type elements.

[hackemlong]

Looks like some of Sir Charles has rubbed off on Tiger - Hank being the carrier.

 

I think it's a combo of Tiger still learning how to swing the club with what is supposed to be a good knee, and trying too hard. It's not all Hank, it's not all Tiger, it's not Steve. Hank needs to remind him about the stinger, though. You can't expect a "machine" to be a machine when it's had 9 months of down time hitting full shots and one of it's two supports has been completely rebuilt. His body/swing has been compromised for years because of a bad knee (assuming the knee is 100% now). Give the man a little more time. He is the best and he will adjust. Even Jack and Arnie had droughts.

 

Now - he could go back to Butch to spite Phil.....

[rblmp32]

I think his mental game is fine. I think he was still in it until he dropped to -3. And after that, he was just thinking about finishing and getting home to the Euro-wife and kiddies. He had good drives and shots on 16, 17, and 18. He birdied 16 with a tap-in. He had a great birdie op on 17, but by then was probably not really thinking of anything except getting out of there. He wants to win ... when he knows he's not going to have a shot, he's gonna check-out. Sorry if that bugs some fans ... but that's how I see it.

 

Tiger doesn't check out. Ever. That's why he put up a 73 Sunday. It coulda easily been 78. I mean, did you not see the way he reacted after he missed the putt on 17? He wanted to make it. No way he checks out. Ever. He gives 100% on every shot, til he has stroked the final putt.

[caryk]

Will Tiger finally ditch Nike's inferior driver technology?

Would be interesting to see if Tiger has been trying out other non-Nike drivers (i.e. Titleist, Callaway, TM R9, etc) in his backyard or at "the Oven" just to see if it is the Nike drivers that are causing the problem in his game. I'll bet Tom Stites is working his tail off trying to come up with better technologies/designs to match what the other companies already have. Unfortunately, TW is in a situation where if he was to use a competing driver during a tournament it would be splashed all over the media and create negative press for Nike. Since he's the heart and soul of Nike Golf, that's just something that ain't gonna happen. Guys like Cink, Leonard, Immelman, Casey, etc could get away with doing that, but not Tiger.

[juansky]

Tiger's best swinging days were with Butchie. Tiger working with Hank has not produced GREAT results.

 

Tiger knows his swing and he knows all about the golf swing in general. He needs to take a cue from Hogan and dig the swing out of the ground on his own. No golf coach knows anybodies swing better than the one swinging.

 

I bet if Tiger to were to go on a Haney hiatus, he could figure out his flaws on his own.

[ej002]

Tiger's best swinging days were with Butchie. Tiger working with Hank has not produced GREAT results.

 

Tiger knows his swing and he knows all about the golf swing in general. He needs to take a cue from Hogan and dig the swing out of the ground on his own. No golf coach knows anybodies swing better than the one swinging.

 

I bet if Tiger to were to go on a Haney hiatus, he could figure out his flaws on his own.

 

 

I think that is what we are seeing. I think Tiger took the knee injury time to continue on the swing change that he began in late 2007-2008, but now he came back flatter than ever before, I think we are just seeing a guy try to play while reworking his swing (for the better). And what he is doing now does not have Haney's stamp on it at all. Nothing to do with him. Just give it time, and he will work through it.

 

The guy already has a win in like what, 5 tournaments? Seriously, he is fine. ANd he was in contention at the masters on sunday, with a sore knee and a new swing. Come on.

[jiffypop]

Tiger should ditch that Nike driver before ditching Haney!

[bscinstnct]

There is a fundamental flaw in Tiger's swing. I don't think anyone knows what it is, not even Tiger, or it would have been fixed. Too flat, wrist too bowed, wrong shaft, that stuff ain't it, imo. If Tiger were firing on all 8, he could go imitate Furyk with a senior flex in his driver and win.

 

He'll figure it out. It's so elemental that he is hitting spinners. The fact that he is posting decent scores when his swing is so hurting means that when he does figure it out, he will absolutely destroy the field imo.

 

I do agree with Miller that he is a bit to jacked. The biceps is not the only issue. It's the triceps and lats that force your arms

out to your side ala bodybuilders looking like they are "carrying luggage". Not sure if it makes much of a difference and

if in reality he is not as big as he looks on tv.

[lagwagon23]

No, Haney has already responded to rumors of this for over a year now. He says his goal was to teach Tiger to know his faults and self correct them. Will he work with Haney some? Yes. He addressed after the round that he knows whats wrong with his swing.

[owaisdurrani]

Tiger is going to have a vido conference at a local Golfsmith in houston. Maybe I should ask him. lol.

[fats]

Just an opinion, nothing more...My feeling is Hank is "outta there"

[Money03]

Tiger working with Hank has not produced GREAT results.

 

 

lol:

 

Year Wins(Majors) Money

2005 6 (2) 10,628,024

2006 8 (2) 9,941,563

2007 7 (1) 10,867,052

2008 4 (1) 5,775,000

2009 1 1,872,313

 

Those are just pga tour results. How average!

[owaisdurrani]

Tiger working with Hank has not produced GREAT results.

 

 

lol:

 

Year Wins(Majors) Money

2005 6 (2) 10,628,024

2006 8 (2) 9,941,563

2007 7 (1) 10,867,052

2008 4 (1) 5,775,000

2009 1 1,872,313

 

Those are just pga tour results. How average!

 

 

Now put those next to tigers early years with butch.

[Fore18]

Hanks days are numbered fo sho....

 

Tiger went to a teacher that was one of the worst drivers of the golf ball ever to fix his swing. I know he though maybe something different would help and O'mera pushed him I bet. Haney has never had a player as big as Tiger or even in the top 25 in the world. Tiger is out the door after British if something does not change..IMO.

[bscinstnct]

Hanks days are numbered fo sho....

 

Tiger went to a teacher that was one of the worst drivers of the golf ball ever to fix his swing. I know he though maybe something different would help and O'mera pushed him I bet. Haney has never had a player as big as Tiger or even in the top 25 in the world. Tiger is out the door after British if something does not change..IMO.

 

One thing I picked up from the Barkley show is that Haney is low key, business like and process oriented. Similar to Tiger.

I would think that Tiger takes part in developing the gameplan for the analysis of his current issues and the plan to improve. His

overall swing model would be one that I would think that he has played an integral role in developing. I speculate that

Tiger manages his goals and the process for perfecting this model and relies on Haney to insure that this process is

executed.

 

I think that Harmon had the luxury of "teaching" raw talent at it's pinnacle. Kind of like teaching Mickey Mantle how to hit.

The best talent can be the toughest to coach, the Harmon-Phil results demonstrate this clearly. Phill still has a killer

short game and is a little wild off the tee. Not too different then when he started with Harmon.

 

I would not be surprised if Tiger had been satisfied with his overall progression prior to Sunday, but obviously saw Sunday

as a setback and is working to isolate the flaws that produced the poor results.

[Fore18]

Hanks days are numbered fo sho....

 

Tiger went to a teacher that was one of the worst drivers of the golf ball ever to fix his swing. I know he though maybe something different would help and O'mera pushed him I bet. Haney has never had a player as big as Tiger or even in the top 25 in the world. Tiger is out the door after British if something does not change..IMO.

 

One thing I picked up from the Barkley show is that Haney is low key, business like and process oriented. Similar to Tiger.

I would think that Tiger takes part in developing the gameplan for the analysis of his current issues and the plan to improve. His

overall swing model would be one that I would think that he has played an integral role in developing. I speculate that

Tiger manages his goals and the process for perfecting this model and relies on Haney to insure that this process is

executed.

 

I think that Harmon had the luxury of "teaching" raw talent at it's pinnacle. Kind of like teaching Mickey Mantle how to hit.

The best talent can be the toughest to coach, the Harmon-Phil results demonstrate this clearly. Phill still has a killer

short game and is a little wild off the tee. Not too different then when he started with Harmon.

 

I would not be surprised if Tiger had been satisfied with his overall progression prior to Sunday, but obviously saw Sunday

as a setback and is working to isolate the flaws that produced the poor results.

 

 

All well said but the fact Haney is A John Jacobs guy and all the teachers out of that school time frame have made some kind of name for them self but can't seem close the deal. Hank is a great guy that knows alot about the game of golf, this in turn does not make him a great teacher but he can hold his own. The result of him either A) not being the right teacher for Tiger, or B) he is not able to take players past the top 25 in the world is the main factor. I would say that Haney, Hardy, Leadbetter, Flick, Mogg, Smith and the guy from the Golf FX are all about making a name by riding talent to the top and have all been dismissed by their race horse.

The fact is find some one like a Harmon, Lynn Blake, Bennett n Plummer, Sean Fowley, or that kid that is teaching Kenny Perry. Guys bringing results to the table by stats and results, Tiger is the exception pre US Open for Haney, but where is he now??? The Knee is healthy why is'nt the swing preforming???

[martinez]

Tiger is a pragmatist, if he thinks he needs a change he makes it. We can speculate as to what he will do, but he just always wants to get better...and will do anything it takes to keep improving. If that means moving on from Hank Haney then he wont hesitate to do it.

[DukeNasty]

Hanks days are numbered fo sho....

 

Tiger went to a teacher that was one of the worst drivers of the golf ball ever to fix his swing. I know he though maybe something different would help and O'mera pushed him I bet. Haney has never had a player as big as Tiger or even in the top 25 in the world. Tiger is out the door after British if something does not change..IMO.

 

One thing I picked up from the Barkley show is that Haney is low key, business like and process oriented. Similar to Tiger.

I would think that Tiger takes part in developing the gameplan for the analysis of his current issues and the plan to improve. His

overall swing model would be one that I would think that he has played an integral role in developing. I speculate that

Tiger manages his goals and the process for perfecting this model and relies on Haney to insure that this process is

executed.

 

I think that Harmon had the luxury of "teaching" raw talent at it's pinnacle. Kind of like teaching Mickey Mantle how to hit.

The best talent can be the toughest to coach, the Harmon-Phil results demonstrate this clearly. Phill still has a killer

short game and is a little wild off the tee. Not too different then when he started with Harmon.

 

I would not be surprised if Tiger had been satisfied with his overall progression prior to Sunday, but obviously saw Sunday

as a setback and is working to isolate the flaws that produced the poor results.

 

 

All well said but the fact Haney is A John Jacobs guy and all the teachers out of that school time frame have made some kind of name for them self but can't seem close the deal. Hank is a great guy that knows alot about the game of golf, this in turn does not make him a great teacher but he can hold his own. The result of him either A) not being the right teacher for Tiger, or B) he is not able to take players past the top 25 in the world is the main factor. I would say that Haney, Hardy, Leadbetter, Flick, Mogg, Smith and the guy from the Golf FX are all about making a name by riding talent to the top and have all been dismissed by their race horse.

The fact is find some one like a Harmon, Lynn Blake, Bennett n Plummer, Sean Fowley, or that kid that is teaching Kenny Perry. Guys bringing results to the table by stats and results, Tiger is the exception pre US Open for Haney, but where is he now??? The Knee is healthy why is'nt the swing preforming???

 

 

Don't all teachers make a name for themselves by riding their race horse to the top? Did you ever hear about Sean Foley before Ohair was in the last pairing at Arnie's tournament? We sure weren't talking about him taking Steven Ames to the top at all. Also, Harmon has a stable of big name race horses as a RESULT of his history with the big kahuna Greg Norman and then none other than Tiger Woods. As far as the rest of the guys on your list...where are the major results? And the young kid who is teaching Kenny Perry hasn't developed any raw talent from the ground up. He has the two wunderkids from Kentucky (Perry and Holmes). For the most part, Perry is an ageless wonder and Holmes has been a performer since he was in elementary school. So how does that qualify as developing talent?

 

If anyone has developed talent, it is Leadbetter. Huge success on the LPGA and coached Faldo, Els, Price, etc. All who became major winners under his tutelage. Does he self promote? Of course he does. That is just smart business. If any of these coaches didn't do the same, they would be foolish.

 

E.

[Money03]

Tiger working with Hank has not produced GREAT results.

 

 

lol:

 

Year Wins(Majors) Money

2005 6 (2) 10,628,024

2006 8 (2) 9,941,563

2007 7 (1) 10,867,052

2008 4 (1) 5,775,000

2009 1 1,872,313

 

Those are just pga tour results. How average!

 

 

Now put those next to tigers early years with butch.

 

ok:

1996 2 790,594

1997 4 (1) 2,066,833

1998 1 1,841,117

1999 8 (1) 6,616,585

2000 9 (3) 9,188,321

2001 5 (1) 6,687,777

2002 5 (2) 6,912,625

 

Same format as above obviously. Left out 03-04 as those were years of transition obviously.

[Swingtheclub]

First off I think Tiger drove the ball better with Butch but he burned that bridge.

 

All the same has he been out of the top ten during his comeback?

 

Next thread we read will have him firing his caddy.

[rjklein4470]

Problem with Tigers swing is it is so violent, and fast if he is not on I dont think he can dial it back. I personally do not even like to watch him swing, because the tempo is so fast however if you look at his positions with the slow speed camera his back swing is beautiful, but his motion down to the ball is well only tiger can put that motion into play.

[Babydaddy]

Butch Harmon is successful partly because he is one of the few guys that teaches golf shots. Shots like the cut 4 wood (now hybrid) out of the rough, and the dairy queen bunker shot.

He brings with him experiences from years of learning from guys like Tommy Armour, and Ben Hogan and his own father.

He is from an era of shot-makers and opposed to swingers.

He equipped Tiger to do more than swing. Tiger thought in terms of strategy and course management under Harmon's tutelage.

Now, it appears to me that he has allowed the pursuit of perfect plane to override that strategic genius at times. He is now testing his swing on the course as opposed to dissecting the course as he used to talk about.

People can criticize teachers all day long, but the fact is when you have guys that win under your guidance, you at least didn't screw them up too bad.

Harmon is not a method teacher. In my opinion, he took Tiger's natural swing and reduced the only real downside of his natural swing, which was distance control. Tiger became a great iron player. In that stretch from 1999-2001 Tiger could do anything he wanted with a golf ball. He had pretty much all the shots, and he thought like a general.

 

All of us are pretty much speculating, but at the end of the day, you look at results. Tiger could win swinging any way. He's that good.

[owaisdurrani]

It would be really intresting to see both Phil and Tiger under Butch Harmon.

[scores]

Tigar had a shot he could get in play off the tee when he needed it. I have been reading this thread and Babbydaddy made a great point.

 

I think Tigar will win at least two more this year and maybe one of the majors lets remember the guy has all day long to resolve and fix his issues.

 

The best player in the world can fix those things in a couple weeks and ingrain them quicker than any other tour player.

 

It just shows you how hard this game is and how hard it is to stay at the top : Duval got hurt, Love got hurt both I believe snow boarding/skiing countless others and look how fast Tigar won after coming back.

[owaisdurrani]

Tigar had a shot he could get in play off the tee when he needed it. I have been reading this thread and Babbydaddy made a great point.

 

I think Tigar will win at least two more this year and maybe one of the majors lets remember the guy has all day long to resolve and fix his issues.

 

The best player in the world can fix those things in a couple weeks and ingrain them quicker than any other tour player.

 

It just shows you how hard this game is and how hard it is to stay at the top : Duval got hurt, Love got hurt both I believe snow boarding/skiing countless others and look how fast Tigar won after coming back.

 

 

 

 

Yeah the comment about tiger having 3 weeks of practicing every day, really made me think he will come back great.

[Slapjax7s]

I would say this is false since TNT just showed Tiger at the Cavs/Magic game sitting with Hank Haney courtside.