Pay it Forward Scam

[blade_man]

[quote name='tpariff' post='1836618' date='Jul 22 2009, 01:56 PM']Patrick, here's the real issue. You joined here on May 25, then on June 15 you start a thread about your clubs being stolen. Members here step up to help you, and now we have this mess. The people who stepped up didn't know you from Adam, nor did you have any real history here. They basically helped a stranger, a fellow golfer in need.

I think that's what pisses people off more than anything. It's not the $10. Geez, that's what most people spend on going out for lunch every day. It's the principle. And unfortunately it will leave a bad taste in the mouths of those who helped and those who have read this thread.

Listen, I hope you get your situation squared away. You're young and have a long road ahead. You'll make more mistakes...we ALL have. Heck, I make mistakes all the time. But it's how you step up and correct them that will show your true colors.

Kevin[/quote]
I haven't read all these post nor do I intend to, but Kevin said it right, at this point it really isn't about the money but that here we try to trust people, you are good until you prove yourself otherwise and you have. When all of a sudden several threads started popping up about stolen clubs I became suspcious that "copy cats" were trying to play on the good hearts of people here trying to help someone and thats what happened. You could have printed a shipping label from PayPal and never sent the money to the bank account (sorry if this has already been covered) time to quit posting and just make it right. k?

[TimeToFly]

[quote name='stage1350' post='1837137' date='Jul 22 2009, 05:03 PM'][b]You could sell your putter alone, clear your overdraft, and still have enough money to cover shipping. Why not post a for sale ad?[/b]

It's not like you'll be playing golf anytime soon. You obviously need money for more important things than greens fees right now.

Get your life in order and [i]then[/i] rebuild your bag.[/quote]


i wonder if anyone would be brave enough to buy something off this kid?

[stage1350]

[quote name='TimeToFly' post='1837518' date='Jul 22 2009, 07:00 PM'][quote name='stage1350' post='1837137' date='Jul 22 2009, 05:03 PM'][b]You could sell your putter alone, clear your overdraft, and still have enough money to cover shipping. Why not post a for sale ad?[/b]

It's not like you'll be playing golf anytime soon. You obviously need money for more important things than greens fees right now.

Get your life in order and [i]then[/i] rebuild your bag.[/quote]


i wonder if anyone would be brave enough to buy something off this kid?
[/quote]

Somebody will buy it. It's a Scotty Cameron. [i] A SCOTTY!!!![/i]

[EMKelly]

[quote name='stage1350' post='1837944' date='Jul 22 2009, 10:11 PM'][quote name='TimeToFly' post='1837518' date='Jul 22 2009, 07:00 PM'][quote name='stage1350' post='1837137' date='Jul 22 2009, 05:03 PM'][b]You could sell your putter alone, clear your overdraft, and still have enough money to cover shipping. Why not post a for sale ad?[/b]

It's not like you'll be playing golf anytime soon. You obviously need money for more important things than greens fees right now.

Get your life in order and [i]then[/i] rebuild your bag.[/quote]


i wonder if anyone would be brave enough to buy something off this kid?
[/quote]

Somebody will buy it. It's a Scotty Cameron. [i]A SCOTTY!!!![/i]

[/quote]


Buy it for 80$ and realize they just gave him money for another camping trip! The guy has no credit... no one should do business with him.

PS... it may be a SCOTTY but it's not the best one he's made... never liked that model personally.

Regards,
Eric

[kamtile]

[quote name='Fr3ak' post='1837467' date='Jul 22 2009, 04:32 PM'][quote name='kamtile' post='1836884' date='Jul 22 2009, 03:30 PM']The kid ran into some problems, he is a kid. It happens. $80 or $40 isnt as easy to come by for most kids as it is for us. He tried to do something good here with the clubs he received. Cut him some slack, we are supposed to be the adults here. Maybe the kid is a bit irresponsible, that doesnt make him a criminal. Lighten up, your righteous anger is very unbecoming.[/quote]


People like you are very unbecoming. This "kid" should learn the hard way, ie: someone show up at this house and beat the piss out of him. These "kids" are the same kids jumping women in a dark alley for a few dollars. People need to learn the hard way. Damn liberals
[/quote]
13 days ago this guy said he was sending a wedge to someone for the cost of shipping. He hasnt done it yet. That is the ONLY fact here, period. Everything else that has been said is speculation and witchhunting by people . Now you equate him to someone that attacks women in dark alleys. This concept of not judging is not a new deal. Some people considered to be very wise talked about this a couple thousand years ago . It's in books and everything. And if you really want to beat up a juvenile over being slow to send a free wedge, you are more like the attacker you describe than he is.

[dhabomb]

I highly doubt that play it again would give him his ''stolen' clubs back just because he said they were his. And the fact that he got to keep the donated clubs is dumb he should of gave the clubs back to the people that gave them to him and not keep them and give away his old ones. That has scam writin all over it.

[pinhigh27]

[quote name='Fr3ak' post='1837467' date='Jul 22 2009, 07:32 PM'][quote name='kamtile' post='1836884' date='Jul 22 2009, 03:30 PM']The kid ran into some problems, he is a kid. It happens. $80 or $40 isnt as easy to come by for most kids as it is for us. He tried to do something good here with the clubs he received. Cut him some slack, we are supposed to be the adults here. Maybe the kid is a bit irresponsible, that doesnt make him a criminal. Lighten up, your righteous anger is very unbecoming.[/quote]


People like you are very unbecoming. This "kid" should learn the hard way, ie: someone show up at this house and beat the piss out of him. These "kids" are the same kids jumping women in a dark alley for a few dollars. People need to learn the hard way. Damn liberals
[/quote]

YOU ARE MY HERO!

[kevn357]

[quote name='pinhigh27' post='1841439' date='Jul 24 2009, 04:35 PM']
[quote name='Fr3ak' post='1837467' date='Jul 22 2009, 07:32 PM'][quote name='kamtile' post='1836884' date='Jul 22 2009, 03:30 PM']The kid ran into some problems, he is a kid. It happens. $80 or $40 isnt as easy to come by for most kids as it is for us. He tried to do something good here with the clubs he received. Cut him some slack, we are supposed to be the adults here. Maybe the kid is a bit irresponsible, that doesnt make him a criminal. Lighten up, your righteous anger is very unbecoming.[/quote]


People like you are very unbecoming. This "kid" should learn the hard way, ie: someone show up at this house and beat the piss out of him. These "kids" are the same kids jumping women in a dark alley for a few dollars. People need to learn the hard way. Damn liberals
[/quote]

YOU ARE MY HERO!
[/quote]




Yes! He stole 40 bucks and he's jumping women in dark alleys! Let's beat the piss out of him!!! *generic political insult*.
Your internet rage is pathetic.
I hope everyone gets their money back who hasn't yet. I'm sure his parents would like to know what he's been up to.

[nyhc23]

[quote name='jsanatx' post='1837405' date='Jul 22 2009, 06:07 PM']don't know, maybe the people that donated them can chime in?[/quote]


I think the original post had a list... this is the first time I'm seeing this post and don't really know what to say about it other than I trust in the human spirit and that's why I donated in the first place... I think Patrick will eventually do the "right" thing, whatever that entails.

FYI I gave him a set of Bridgestone GC Mid irons

[kmoff77]

I was one of the guys that paid him for shipping, and have yet to receive the wedge or a follow up message from him. I originally felt bad for him and was supportive, but the more I read this post and think about it..he took advantage of everyone and seems to be running a scam.

I knew a little about his story, but not everything. I didn't know that he was keeping all the donated clubs, and "giving" away the clubs that he supposedly was given back from Play it Again? The whole story just seems very odd.

[rbmercer]

innocent curious bystander here reading this thread.

But, somewhere it got started in this thread that this kid was keeping the DONATED clubs and passing along his old clubs. However, if you read the original post, I dont read it that way and can't find anything that says that is the case. Am I missing something?

I am definitely not defending this kid, but was confused on how it got started that he was keeping the old clubs. From what I have read, that is not the case.

correct me if I'm wrong.

[bytehoven]

[quote name='Asleep' post='1837068' date='Jul 22 2009, 04:42 PM']The guy posted a "my clubs were stolen" thread and received newer, nicer clubs for free from the GolfWRX membership --- then rediscovered his stolen clubs but decided to keep the newer/nicer clubs people sent him and wanted to "give away" his old clubs???

Doesn't it sound like a free trade-up to better clubs?

I mean, why wouldn't he return the clubs gifted to him or give those gifted clubs to someone else?

It just doesn't seem right to me....am I missing something?[/quote]


As one of the folks who sent [b]mixer[/b] a free club to help him out, I don't care what he does with the club.

If in the end it turns out he scammed me and the other generous WRX members, that's his karma screw up, not ours.

Will I be just as willing to help the next guy after reading what as happened since? I hope I will. However, I'm sure it will be in the back of my mind.

I sent him a Nickent 17* hybrid.

[jsanatx]

whether he keeps the donated clubs or gives them away is not the point. the fact is almost 3 weeks ago he promised to send people clubs in return for cash for shipping and i don't think he's done it yet.

i'm all square with him, since he refunded my money soon after this post was made. i don't know about the other 4 people.

also, what bytehoven stated above is the real shame in all this. "Will I be just as willing to help the next guy after reading what as happened since? I hope I will. However, I'm sure it will be in the back of my mind". this is a great community, always willing to help with advise, tips, even clubs. it only takes one person to potentially ruin it for some people.

[Pweb44]

While I was reading through this thread some things were not adding up with this guy who happen to have his clubs stolen then a short time later found them after getting the help of some great WRX'ers but then had same issues with his back account, etc etc. I kept wondering to myself that if he was so short on money that he couldn't ship the clubs that he already received the shipment money; then why does he need his stolen clubs anyways (or any other golf clubs) since he can't afford to pay for Green Fees. There are lots of ways to get money besides scamming strangers, for a kid in HS there is the McJob that would give him the money quickly and help take care of his money issues

The sad part of all this next time we read a story from a member who is really down on their luck and is sharing their story, others may not offer a helping hand for fear of being taken or burned. People will wonder is this a true situation or someone fishing for some free stuff........

[jsanatx]

excatly, and how did the money get into his bank account in the first place? from using PP, i know that you have to request that the money be transferred, it doesn't just go to your bank account automatically.

i hope that we will be able to continue to help people out, but some of us will always wonder beacuse of this.

[StraightShooter]

Guys, he put the money into his bank account because he thought was was in good standing (according to his post). He claimed he didn't know he was overdrawn until he actually went to the post office to ship the clubs out.

[Fuzzifus]

[quote name='StraightShooter' post='1851239' date='Jul 29 2009, 03:59 PM']Guys, he put the money into his bank account because he thought was was in good standing (according to his post). He claimed he didn't know he was overdrawn until he actually went to the post office to ship the clubs out.[/quote]

Overdrawn or not....I believe the whole deal was a scam from the beginning. I can only hope he leaves his bag in the middle of a parking lot to be stolen for real this time. If you search under his user name, and read you will see his story just doesn't add up. Kid or not, broke or not, he's a thief, liar and poor human being. Lets face it...if he was playing infront of me he'd be eating wormburners all day long....

[wkennerson]

[quote name='xtremeinaz' post='1837304' date='Jul 22 2009, 06:13 PM']people keep talking about these donated clubs. Is there a list of the clubs that were sent to him?[/quote]


[quote name='jsanatx' post='1837405' date='Jul 22 2009, 07:07 PM']don't know, maybe the people that donated them can chime in?[/quote]

I donated a Hibore XL Tour 9.5* to him. Speaking as a donor I do not feel cheated that he found his original clubs. The bottom line for me was the club was sitting in my basement not helping anyone and I took the opportunity to help out a stranger.

I have faith that Patrick will set this right and I feel for the people holding the short end of the stick right now waiting on whichever clubs he is going to send. Hopefully the mess gets sorted out in the short term for everyone invloved.

[freelanceterry]

I like that this was jumped on by so many. I fear that a few bad seeds could really turn the bst into something ugly. So far, full credit to the mods and the wrx community for propping the good peeps and exposing the bad. Hope it keeps up.

Not to thread jack too bad...but both Karma and Donation was cited in this thread. If anyone is in need of a little Karma and/or a knit putter/hybrid cover, check out: [url="http://www.coveryourputter.blogspot.com"]www.coveryourputter.blogspot.com[/url] - or the 19th hole where I have a thread started.

I PROMISE to ship them out asap - and as a wrx member - you get to choose your own color!

My tiny way of giving back to a community that's been dead solid for so long.

Cheers WRX-ers!

[poloshankey]

[quote name='rbmercer' post='1850356' date='Jul 29 2009, 09:59 AM']innocent curious bystander here reading this thread.

But, somewhere it got started in this thread that this kid was keeping the DONATED clubs and passing along his old clubs. However, if you read the original post, I dont read it that way and can't find anything that says that is the case. Am I missing something?

I am definitely not defending this kid, but was confused on how it got started that he was keeping the old clubs. From what I have read, that is not the case.

correct me if I'm wrong.[/quote]
He "chose" to keep the wedges and hybrids for sure.
[quote name='mxer581' post='1808176' date='Jul 9 2009, 03:03 PM']wow, this really is awesome. I thought i'd stop by Play it Again sports just one more time just to see. And sitting right there inn the store is my old wedges, my driver, my bag, and my hybrid. Now i really like the new wedges and hybrids, so if you all dont mind i'd like to keep those. But i would like to offer up the Hibore XL, my old wedges, a Spin Milled 56.10 and a rac satin 60*, and my Adams Pro Gold 20* with the JavlnFX stiff shaft to anyone who is in need or knows someone who could use them. All i need is money for shipping. i'll will also post this in the pay it forward.[/quote]

[TimeToFly]

[quote name='freelanceterry' post='1851409' date='Jul 29 2009, 05:08 PM']I like that this was jumped on by so many. I fear that a few bad seeds could really turn the bst into something ugly. So far, full credit to the mods and the wrx community for propping the good peeps and exposing the bad. Hope it keeps up.

Not to thread jack too bad...but both Karma and Donation was cited in this thread. If anyone is in need of a little Karma and/or a knit putter/hybrid cover, check out: [url="http://www.coveryourputter.blogspot.com"]www.coveryourputter.blogspot.com[/url] - or the 19th hole where I have a thread started.

I PROMISE to ship them out asap - and as a wrx member - you get to choose your own color!

My tiny way of giving back to a community that's been dead solid for so long.

Cheers WRX-ers![/quote]

done. as someone who has struggled with an addiction problem in the past, i am happy to help out a good cause like yours. thanks!

[kamtile]

If he was trying to scam everyone why would he tell us about finding his old clubs?

[grizzlyblades]

[quote name='kamtile' post='1851568' date='Jul 29 2009, 04:22 PM']If he was trying to scam everyone why would he tell us about finding his old clubs?[/quote]

to get money, that he did by saying he would send the members who wanted his old clubs for the cost of shipping and handling. I think he totaled 40 bucks. and one poster who sent this "kid" ten bucks posted yesterday mentioned he still hasn't heard from this "kid."

[skizix]

I would just like to point out that the Pay It Forward thread was clearly labled as a "social experiment", i.e. definitely not guaranteed to work as planned. This thread right here is part of the "social experiment" as well, I'd say. If golfwrx.com were a petri dish, the white-coats behind the microscope would be astounded, disturbed, and also laughing, i think, with the social behavior displayed here.

I decided to experiment with P-I-F. I got burned, I suppose, but not necessarily scammed -- just lameness from a fellow golfwrx member. Did I get angry as hell and want to physically beat someone? No. Do I think GolfTitan is a lame-a** douchebag? Yes, I guess I do, but it's not eating me up inside. I gambled (low stakes) and lost, and moved on with my life.

GolfTitan offered up a putter -- older NeverCompromise: not a precious prize, but I was curious to try it, and so bit. He said he'd be sending it, so I put up a Mizuno wedge (MX series 'S' wedge -- brand new, but also non-precious). I did not ask for shipping, seeing as I'd be getting it back with the shipped putter, and promptly shipped the wedge.

I never got the putter, sent a few followups in the following weeks/months, and did get one or two "oh, I guess I forgot. I'll send it right away..." responses. Whatever...finally I gave up. No putter. Lame, but not heartbreaking.

Here's the funny part: almost exactly a year after our last exchange, d-bag GolfTitan PM's me, saying the putter is still available and do I still want it. I said you bet, sounds good, please send it. Never arrived, again I sent a couple followup PM's, and........no response, no putter, no class on Golftitan's part.

So at least, after hearing back a year later, I don't feel I was "scammed" per se, but rather just happened to choose a comically lame loser to do a transaction with.

So I guess I'm out $10 or so shipping, plus a wedge I was not going to ever use, and probably would've given away anyhow.

But in any case, my point was: THE PAY-IT-FORWARD THREAD WAS CLEARLY LABLED AN [i]EXPERIMENT[/i]. What this means is: [i]should you choose to participate, the outcome will be uncertain, you know that up-front, and your therefore can't really get too angry if it breaks down[/i]. Sounds like it worked out ok for many, and I still think it's a cool/fun idea.

If nothing else, for my troubles, I was lucky enough to learn: [i][b]don't ever freakin' purchase anything from GolfTitan!
[/b]
[/i]LOL!

P.S. I really never felt that this caused me any stress or bitterness, etc. but I have to admit...feels kinda good to get this out there at last!

[skizix]

Oh yeah, now that I'm done ranting...how does that relate to the topic at hand?

Well, for one thing, you never should've sent the "kid" money. That is 100% undermining the whole pay-it-forward concept -- even said so in the "rules" in that post, I think. So you have yourself to blame to some extent -- well, only vaguely perhaps, but really: is it worth getting so enraged over $10?

I'm reserving judgement as to whether the "kid" was deliberately trying to scam anyone -- tough to say, and I could not bear to read every single post here. But does that get him off the hook? CERTAINLY NOT! By far and away, he is 1000x lamer and d-baggier than, say GolfTitan, since "kid" actually accepted $$$, then spent it for his own needs -- even if that was not his original plan and it was only to bail out his sorry-a**, broke self, that's [i]highly [/i]unethical behavior.

But jeez...hardly seems worth making a federal case over, and/or threatening physical violence. Should "kid" be banned? Maybe (personally I could care less), but if he gets banned, I hope it is in some way satisfying for you, because in that case I would say don't even think about seeing any $$$ or clubs returned.

[kmoff77]

[quote name='skizix' post='1851795' date='Jul 29 2009, 08:30 PM']Oh yeah, now that I'm done ranting...how does that relate to the topic at hand?

Well, for one thing, you never should've sent the "kid" money. That is 100% undermining the whole pay-it-forward concept -- even said so in the "rules" in that post, I think. So you have yourself to blame to some extent -- well, only vaguely perhaps, but really: is it worth getting so enraged over $10?

I'm reserving judgement as to whether the "kid" was deliberately trying to scam anyone -- tough to say, and I could not bear to read every single post here. But does that get him off the hook? CERTAINLY NOT! By far and away, he is 1000x lamer and d-baggier than, say GolfTitan, since "kid" actually accepted $$$, spent it for his own needs -- even if that was not his original plan and it was to bail out his sorry broke a**, that's highly unethical behavior.

But jeez...hardly seems worth making a federal case over, and/or threatening physical violence. Should "kid" be banned? Maybe (personally I could care less), but if he gets banned, I hope it is in some way satisfying for you, because in that case I would say don't even think about seeing any $$$ or clubs returned.[/quote]

I already chalked it up as a $10 lesson learned. If I do receive the wedge, than SWEET.

But I did purchase a set of Snake Eyes wedge heads in the meantime just in case I don't.

I think I got a good deal on the 3 Snake Eyes, and I will just take them to Dick's to get shafts.

[ezra76]

[quote name='grizzlyblades' post='1851599' date='Jul 29 2009, 06:42 PM'][quote name='kamtile' post='1851568' date='Jul 29 2009, 04:22 PM']If he was trying to scam everyone why would he tell us about finding his old clubs?[/quote]

to get money, that he did by saying he would send the members who wanted his old clubs for the cost of shipping and handling. I think he totaled 40 bucks. and one poster who sent this "kid" ten bucks posted yesterday mentioned he still hasn't heard from this "kid."
[/quote]

Not that this is any of my business but don't you think he could have sold a HiboreXL and a Nickent hybrid on Ebay for a lot more than $40? He probably should just Ebay one his own original clubs and make it right. IMO he screwed up and give him a chance to make it right. Sounds like the guys who sent $10 are getting some clubs worth a heck of a lot more than $10 so if they have to wait a couple weeks, so what. The way I see it he made an effort to send the clubs along to someone else as someone did to him and that's a very good natured act. I'd be willing to bet he had some auto-payment for a cell phone or car insurance that got taken unexpectedly early and just happened to be within the same few days he transferred out the Paypal to send the clubs. One thing is for sure, I'll continue to donate my old stuff to the 1st tee or give it away on another forum after I see how ungracious and unforgiving these guys have been towards this kid.

[Rambler]

It doesn't take 20 questions to figure this one out...

Question 1: Where can a person go to make money?
Answer: A JOB!

[CORBO]

Update-no Hibore XL, but finally refunded my $10. Lesson learned...