Ryan Moore with Ping irons (merged)

[dan360]

[quote name='OneBowTie' timestamp='1288292714' post='2763672']


Really.... I did not know that tour players couldn't play clubs if tour vans and truck loads of back ups were not readily available......

I don't know about all the what if's..... but what are the failure rates out there on tour nowadays.....

I always thought that the players started a tourney with certain clubs..... and finished them pretty much with the same ones..... I can understand any player bringing along extra's for whatever reason..... but certainly between the player and his caddy they can pack enough for one golf tourney ..... can't they

and to answer your number 5...... I would think that Ping hopes that they don't fall to the level that scratch would be their competitor ....
[/quote]

They can play what they want, but having product support sure makes it easier. Otherwise why would tour vans be there to begin with?

Failure rates, probably not many outright failures, but to see the amount to tweaking that goes on at tournaments state-side, where guys have played the courses over & over again, it makes sense to think there would be a line @ the tour van for tweaks on a new golf course.

You would be surprised how few clubs pros and caddies drag along to a tournament. Sometimes they don't even show up with complete sets and have things made on site. That's kind of like assuming you unload your racecar and just go race without adjusting or tuning. Pros don't bring there own 53 foot garage with them like a race team does, they rely on the tour van.

Your hatred for Scratch stems from a deeper issue. I'm not a fanboy either but no sense in taking potshots without all the details.

[moonshine]

I bet RM is happy, shot 64!

[MrParr1Noid]

[quote name='OpusX20' timestamp='1288290832' post='2763617']
[quote name='gandor' timestamp='1288288833' post='2763559']
did u guys noticed some posts getting deleted on this thread? i wonder why? is it because scratch is a sponsor on this site?
[/quote]

There was a post where it showed all boxes instead of letters and a post asking about the boxes. I think those were the ones deleted. Nothing to do with the topic at hand, that I could see.
[/quote]

[color="#1C2837"]I deleted several posts that were not within the rules.[/color]

[color="#1C2837"][b]([/b]Please refrain from posting meaningless threads, one word (or short) nonsense posts, or the like.[b])[/b]
[/color]

[Deggs]

What is stated in Ryan's contract with Scratch?

As to why he is playing Pings it would be interesting to get an answer like "I liked these irons better." In the day and age of everybody getting paid to talk up a specific brand or company no matter what some truth would be refreshing. There is no honest talk about equipment on TV. Everybody it seems is a paid rep and working an angle.

[Jimmy Mac]

[quote name='dan360' timestamp='1288291759' post='2763648']
The tournament is in Asia.

It's a high probability that Ryan Moore decided to use Ping because:

1. Scratch can't afford to have their tour van flown all the way to Asia.
2. Moore and the folks @ Scratch talked about this way before the tournament, and having product support for your setup is paramount...all the "what ifs" that can happen.
3. Ping is all over Asia and no doubt has a sweet a** tour van @ the tournament.
4. Ryan Moore played Ping before Scratch and has a great relationship with the company.
5. Ping is a cast cavity back game improvement company and doesn't market an iron that competes with Scratch.


It's kind of a no-brainer. Clearly only my opinion but it makes sense to me.
[/quote]


Not sure about #1 - #4, but #5 seems to have been proven. He shot 7 under and is one stroke back on Ricky Barnes. He hasn't played poorly with Scratch, but he has seemed to have gained a "game improvement" with whatever he's using.

[Pepperturbo]

[quote name='OneBowTie' timestamp='1288292128' post='2763659']


Like somebody already stated...... its one thing for a player who is loosely tied to club sponsorship to test the waters...... but come on.... when you are being hailed as you came on board because you believe so much in the company and are taking a OWNERSHIP interest in the company..... why in the world would you play some other CLUB products..... sends the wrong message for sure. I see where the SCRATCH rep posted its not in RM's contract preventing him from playing other irons....that is quite the contrary to what the company was preaching about one of its NEW OWNERS.

Scratch reminds me of another wedge company that once was...... I wonder if in the not too distant future we will all be able to order scratch wedges from Golfsmith
[/quote]

Some touring pros that contribute design ideas - might play another product for that very reason. The only time it sends the wrong message to people with my mindset would be if he was regularly playing other clubs.

[OneBowTie]

[quote name='Pepperturbo' timestamp='1288294019' post='2763717']
]

Some touring pros that contribute design ideas - might play another product for that very reason. The only time it sends the wrong message to people with my mindset would be if he was regularly playing other clubs.
[/quote]

Not sure what your saying .....if your saying RM should test other products... absolutely, but not in a PGA event.... on a private practing area-yes

You don't see other heads or those being promoted as impact employee's using other competitors products in such a promotional way......

[OneBowTie]

[quote name='dan360' timestamp='1288293362' post='2763693']


They can play what they want, but having product support sure makes it easier. Otherwise why would tour vans be there to begin with?

Failure rates, probably not many outright failures, but to see the amount to tweaking that goes on at tournaments state-side, where guys have played the courses over & over again, it makes sense to think there would be a line @ the tour van for tweaks on a new golf course.

You would be surprised how few clubs pros and caddies drag along to a tournament. Sometimes they don't even show up with complete sets and have things made on site. That's kind of like assuming you unload your racecar and just go race without adjusting or tuning. Pros don't bring there own 53 foot garage with them like a race team does, they rely on the tour van.

Your hatred for Scratch stems from a deeper issue. I'm not a fanboy either but no sense in taking potshots without all the details.
[/quote]

I hate to disappoint you.... but I have no hatred toward scratch at all..... I actually have hoped all along that they would make it further then another once great wedge company did-Snake Eyes.

Sorry that I just am not buying into that at every single tour event, especially this deep into the season that the pro's are still experimenting with and tweaking IRONS.
I appreicate your opinions as you present them.... but I think that its a stretch to say a tour pro needs a 53 ft tour van for iron adjustments ..... I doubt that any of the companys are represented in the way you think at this event.

[Pepperturbo]

[quote name='gators77' timestamp='1288293317' post='2763691']


First, I wholeheartedly believe that to be at PGA Tour level you should know your grinds in and out, or at least have them fit for you, they are simply too big of a variable to just wing it. It seems, although I could be wrong, that Scratch has recognized an opportunity in the market by bringing custom grinds to the masses in a way that few companies have done before, so I'd consider it fairly important.

Second, I do agree with you the majority of people out there have no clue what clubs he plays, but my point is that's why it's a big gamble to start playing some other companies clubs. He gets a lot of press by being the spokesperson of Scratch, plus he's a likable guy and has a fairly large following compared to some other players. I'm not trying to make a mountain out of a mole hill, but I will say I think it's risky to switch from Scratch so quickly when the company is still in its infancy.

Third, I do not agree the same is true for all other tour players. Yes, those that are loosely affiliated with companies will switch up here and there, but Tiger still plays Nikes, Phil still plays Callaway, Westwood still plays Pings and so on.

Lastly, I don't know how my concluding statement was very bold when I'm staring at a picture of Ryan, part owner of Scratch golf, playing a Ping club. What else am I left to assume other than they couldn't meet his needs with a warehouse of clubs at his disposal? Trust me I think Scratch is a great company and I love how they produce some great products for each customer and develop some serious relationships compared to the OEMs, but my main point is if I'm a shareholder, I'm not too happy.
[/quote]

He's gets press, but let's keep this somewhat real... What he or other tour pros put in play on a given day isn't covered nearly as much as people like to theorize. Besides what ever people think, it's still guessing at what his motive is; plus doing so is based upon no understanding of his Scratch relationship or contract. In other words your assuming based upon some ideal or what you think you would do if.... neither of which fits as an argument.

We don't have to agree, but every tour player including Tiger and Phil have allowances written into their contracts. Based upon your stated expectations, I suspect you'd be surprised at how detailed sports contracts get. I hate to disillusion you but even though Tiger plays Nike, at times he's been known to pull out an old piece of equipment from another vendor. He's done it during the Travis Cup... No matter what you and others want to assume, there's no absolute.

When it comes to being a significant shareholder, what's in Ryans' hands on any given day is NOT what makes or breaks a company like Scratch... it might influence your personal buying habits or momentary feelings, but it's not going to change Scratches future or how Ari and his advisers management the company. Remember, for a significant period of time Ryan along with other touring pros used scratch equipment without being paid.

[vanla01]

[quote name='gandor' timestamp='1288288833' post='2763559']
did u guys noticed some posts getting deleted on this thread? i wonder why? is it because scratch is a sponsor on this site?
[/quote]

Being a sponsor has its benefits, especially in a golf forum... you may need asisstant to hide facts that can harm your company!!!

[dan360]

[quote name='OneBowTie' timestamp='1288294964' post='2763745']


I hate to disappoint you.... but I have no hatred toward scratch at all..... I actually have hoped all along that they would make it further then another once great wedge company did-Snake Eyes.

Sorry that I just am not buying into that at every single tour event, especially this deep into the season that the pro's are still experimenting with and tweaking IRONS.
I appreicate your opinions as you present them.... but I think that its a stretch to say a tour pro needs a 53 ft tour van for iron adjustments ..... I doubt that any of the companys are represented in the way you think at this event.
[/quote]

I still have my Ernie Vadersen wedges and putters.

I wonder how many players did this back in the day before the crazy media attention and instant worldwide exposure to pictures via the internet. Imagine the horror if Nicklaus got caught playing a Palmer Peerless. lol

[chickenpotpie]

[quote name='gandor' timestamp='1288288833' post='2763559']
did u guys noticed some posts getting deleted on this thread? i wonder why? is it because scratch is a sponsor on this site?
[/quote]

Only a matter of time until this thread gets moved to the WRX shop or other forum that gets lower traffic.

[Pepperturbo]

[quote name='OneBowTie' timestamp='1288294560' post='2763731']


Not sure what your saying .....if your saying RM should test other products... absolutely, but not in a PGA event.... on a private practing area-yes

You don't see other heads or those being promoted as impact employee's using other competitors products in such a promotional way......
[/quote]

Why not... attempting a argument for what pros should or should not do, based upon uninformed personal opinion at best brings up a good

[MSU Dogs]

[quote name='OneBowTie' timestamp='1288292714' post='2763672']
[quote name='dan360' timestamp='1288291840' post='2763650']
The tournament is in Asia.

It's a high probability that Ryan Moore decided to use Ping because:

1. Scratch can't afford to have their tour van flown all the way to Asia.
2. Moore and the folks @ Scratch talked about this way before the tournament, and having product support for your setup is paramount...all the "what ifs" that can happen.
3. Ping is all over Asia and no doubt has a sweet a** tour van @ the tournament.
4. Ryan Moore played Ping before Scratch and has a great relationship with the company.
5. Ping is a cast cavity back game improvement company and doesn't market an iron that competes with Scratch.


It's kind of a no-brainer. Clearly only my opinion but it makes sense to me.
[/quote]

Really.... I did not know that tour players couldn't play clubs if tour vans and truck loads of back ups were not readily available......

I don't know about all the what if's..... but what are the failure rates out there on tour nowadays.....

I always thought that the players started a tourney with certain clubs..... and finished them pretty much with the same ones..... I can understand any player bringing along extra's for whatever reason..... but certainly between the player and his caddy they can pack enough for one golf tourney ..... can't they

and to answer your number 5...... I would think that Ping hopes that they don't fall to the level that scratch would be their competitor ....
[/quote]


I've got to agree with the reply here. Assuming RM is still "part" owner, how in the world does he not have Scratch irons in the bag???? It seems to me that pure exposure would be worth it for him! I don't understand this move at all nor do I understand the horrific outfit ! HA

[rymail00]

Besides people on this site (us the 5% of golfers), about 95% of golfers/people who watch golf have no idea what pros are playing unless they read the WITB in Golf Magazine. That 95% of viewers think every pro plays what the commericals say they play,or what ever there staff bag sponsors is. No one knows whats in pro's bag but us on this site.

Also whoever decides to play Scratch is not going to purchase there clubs just because RM is playing them, and would not, not order them because he is not playing them.

The pic of him hitting Ping's give us 5% of golfers something to talk about and the other 95% will never even notice. LOL, 85% of golfers dont even know who Scratch is and I am sure this pic will not change how many clubs Scratch sells.

IMHO. Its not a big deal.

[Pure745]

[quote name='rymail00' timestamp='1288297236' post='2763799']
Besides people on this site (us the 5% of golfers), about 95% of golfers/people who watch golf have no idea what pros are playing unless they read the WITB in Golf Magazine. That 95% of viewers think every pro plays what the commericals say they play,or what ever there staff bag sponsors is. No one knows whats in pro's bag but us on this site.

Also whoever decides to play Scratch is not going to purchase there clubs just because RM is playing them, and would not, not order them because he is not playing them.

The pic of him hitting Ping's give us 5% of golfers something to talk about and the other 95% will never even notice. LOL, 85% of golfers dont even know who Scratch is and I am sure this pic will not change how many clubs Scratch sells.

IMHO. Its not a big deal.
[/quote]

+1, well said Ryan.

Plus, does anyone know what his WITB is over there? Is he still using the wedges or any clubs? Or is it all Ping? I'd be more worried if he had a Ping hat on!

[Dizz]

I wasn't trying to defend Scratch with my previous post at all, just that Ryan tinkers. Hes always been like that, same guy that played well the week before with Adams woods and a Callaway ball. Next week he was using all TM woods and the Penta and played well again. HE HAS ALWAYS DONE THIS. This is not on the same level as Tiger switching to the Method. I don't think anyone that is seriously considering the purchase of Scratch golf clubs could give a flip what Ryan Moore is playing. I've hit their golf clubs, they're nice but I'm not paying $3K for an iron set since I don't pay for mine now. If you wanna pay $3K for custom irons, then I would agree Scratch is the way to go and you're gonna get a great product. But just because you do that and everything is fit to you, you better still be able to play because its not gonna turn your 89 into a 69. Again, great looking and performing clubs but I honestly don't think what Ryan puts into play would affect my decision to purchase their clubs whatsoever.

[CardsChamps11]

he looks like tool in that tie

[gators78]

[quote name='Pepperturbo' timestamp='1288295751' post='2763766']


He's gets press, but let's keep this somewhat real... What he or other tour pros put in play on a given day isn't covered nearly as much as people like to theorize. Besides what ever people think, it's still guessing at what his motive is; plus doing so is based upon no understanding of his Scratch relationship or contract. In other words your assuming based upon some ideal or what you think you would do if.... neither of which fits as an argument.

We don't have to agree, but every tour player including Tiger and Phil have allowances written into their contracts. Based upon your stated expectations, I suspect you'd be surprised at how detailed sports contracts get. I hate to disillusion you but even though Tiger plays Nike, at times he's been known to pull out an old piece of equipment from another vendor. He's done it during the Travis Cup... No matter what you and others want to assume, there's no absolute.

When it comes to being a significant shareholder,[b] what's in Ryans' hands on any given day is NOT what makes or breaks a company like Scratch... it might influence your personal buying habits[/b] or momentary feelings, but it's not going to change Scratches future or how Ari and his advisers management the company. Remember, for a significant period of time Ryan along with other touring pros used scratch equipment without being paid.
[/quote]

That's my point.

[bencash]

[quote name='dan360' timestamp='1288291840' post='2763650']
The tournament is in Asia.

It's a high probability that Ryan Moore decided to use Ping because:

1. Scratch can't afford to have their tour van flown all the way to Asia.
2. Moore and the folks @ Scratch talked about this way before the tournament, and having product support for your setup is paramount...all the "what ifs" that can happen.
3. Ping is all over Asia and no doubt has a sweet a** tour van @ the tournament.
4. Ryan Moore played Ping before Scratch and has a great relationship with the company.
5. Ping is a cast cavity back game improvement company and doesn't market an iron that competes with Scratch.


It's kind of a no-brainer. Clearly only my opinion but it makes sense to me.
[/quote]


Come on man, your hypothesis is absurd. You really think that because scratch does not have a tour van at that tournament, he will just play a completely different set of irons in case he tweaks a club????

He likes the Pings more than the Scratch irons, at least for this week.

[gxDD]

Bunch of [b][u]guesses [/u][/b]thus far.....so let me add a couple.


(1) He want's to win more....and it wasn't happening often enough with his previous set up?

(2) He needs the money from a club contract........money that I'm pretty sure Scratch wasn't giving him?

[FairwayFred]

Hey guys, I am on the road and just saw this during a spare second. Our agreement with Ryan has centered around our wedges, which is the product that we have made our name on. Ryan has tinkered around with many many different clubs all year including about 10 different sets of irons that we have made for him. With this event in Malaysia, our Tour rep wasn't there to talk to Ryan or see what irons he has in play this week but I do know that he has played Scratch irons for the bulk of 2010 and has had the best year of his career. Ryan played great yesterday and I hope he continues his great play throughout the weekend!

No need to worry about Scratch as a company. We have had by far our best year ever in 2010, more than doubling our sales from 2009 despite the supply problems that we have faced this year. We are not going anywhere and you can expect some really exciting things from us in 2011, both club wise and on Tour.

[NWS Alpine]

I have a set of AR-1s for sale now or trade for a set of Ping S56s




I'm J/K I love my Scratch stuff

[WestyNH]

[quote name='FairwayFred' timestamp='1288298398' post='2763825']
Hey guys, I am on the road and just saw this during a spare second. Our agreement with Ryan has centered around our wedges, which is the product that we have made our name on. Ryan has tinkered around with many many different clubs all year including about 10 different sets of irons that we have made for him. With this event in Malaysia, our Tour rep wasn't there to talk to Ryan or see what irons he has in play this week but I do know that he has played Scratch irons for the bulk of 2010 and has had the best year of his career. Ryan played great yesterday and I hope he continues his great play throughout the weekend!
[/quote]

Let me guess, you had to catch the red eye to Malaysia!

[TheMoneyShot]

These S56 irons must be something, everyone is switching..

[EastPhillyReppin]

If anyone should have any questions regarding the recent observation of Ryan Moore not playing Scratch irons please call me directly at 248-885-6511.

[PingEye2]

Scratch makes some sweet wedges is all I know!

[theironhorse]

whatever the reason, bottom line to me is it looks bad, period.

[Tmiller72]

99% of the people that see him on tv are not going to notice the change. He still has a Scratch bag and is wearing the hat, that's the main thing.

[BTO]

[i][b]"Again, great looking and performing clubs but I honestly don't think what Ryan puts into play would affect my decision to purchase their clubs whatsoever"


[/b][/i]Wow. I hear ya. I am about to pull the trigger on SB-1's but I have to tell the truth; when I was in GolfTown Southern Ontario a couple month ago perusing all the irons the Ping s56 had me salivating above and beyond all others they were pitching even the Mizzy m-68 which I originally went in to look at. But for whatever reason I ended up buying ar-1's. Like 'em alot; in fact so much I decided to go back to my beloved blades and the only thing in my mind was sb-1's..........till now. Now I'm in a little bit of a conundrum. Sweet memories of the s56 are filling my noodle and I can only blame Ryan Moore for that. Heck of an owner/sponser????
So chalk me up as at least one that is being effected by all this. And I know the s56's have a pretty good track record already in their short existence.