Cleveland Mashie+ 20.5 or Taylormade RBZ 21.5?

[Asiangolfer1995]

Looking for something to replace my Burner Superlaunch Hybrid it goes a little bit too high and I am deciding between these two, I want RBZ but the Mashie is a pretty good club for it's price, what are your thoughts, or opinions?

[J_Tizzle]

I think the Mashies are very solid, however, I'm not a fan of the light shafts. If you put anything inthe club in the 85+g range I think they're truly underrated clubs.

[Spumoni]

I swapped out 2 Burner high launch rescue hybrids for some Mashie's. The Mashie goes lower and straighter for me. I'm very happy with the switch.

[bossanovawitcha]

I have had the Tour Mashie 18* and 20.5* for a couple months now.. The 85g shaft is a must, as well as the smaller head, if you have a quick tempo or fight a hook, as is the more open face angle than the standard Mashie. These clubs, as has been reported, are easy to misalign due to the offset - but once aligned, they are strong performers - the smaller head makes contact off fairway lies amazingly simple. Bottom line - you never drop kick, skip, or top these things.. You can get these up in the air, but you can also go after them and play a big draw / hook that just runs forever. On hard AZ conditions, I've gotten 275 quite a few times out of the 18* - and 260 out of the 20.5* which is as much as I get out of a full 3w. I've been using the 18* and 20.5* off the tee more often than any other club lately.

I love the rustic style and finish of these clubs. They also make a sweet 'thwack' at impact that is satisfying, but not too dull. Definitely feels like old school meets new technology. The tour Mashies are not as obnoxious in length like some other brands. I have owned the 4h and 5h in Kua 59g and they hook like a madman. These would be great for moderate swing speed slicers or smooth tempo, slower to moderate drawers of the ball. However, the slightly longer head profile makes it easier to mishit, I found, vs the tour mashies. They do get the ball up in the air with little effort very easily, without even requiring a decent swing. The shaft is one of the best you'll ever, ever find stock in your life if it fits you. Cleveland rocks.

One gripe - 15.5*, 18* to 20.5* as the only tour options is annoying. I find the distance gap poor between the 2h and 3h, but would love the 18* and 23* combo - however, the 23* is only in the standard mashie, shut face and stock 59g (without custom order on the latter) shaft. Puzzling. I prefer to use one hybrid as a 5w replacement, and one for a strong 4 if I had my druthers, to carry four wedges. Most of the OEMs seem to offer poor loft choices for hybrid combos. Now that hybrids are as long as yesterday's metalwoods, unless you are replacing 3-4-5 irons or want to go even higher with a hybrid/iron combo set, you are left scrambling a bit for distance gaps - and usefulness. A better player is going to be able to hit multiple yardages from 200+ out with the same clubs, and really jumping even 2-3* is not all that precise at really long range. Players that need more help from hybrids are not really looking to score from 200+, so it is silly to think they have a 'number' assigned to 2h-3h and maybe even 4h. They really need to just find (or from my painful experience I needed to find) a 'go-to' club they can get decent distance control and decent distance from, and just play that 'stock hybrid' shot to the highest 'safe' % target for them. It is like the industry went from trying to hawk extra wedges on everybody to now trying to hawk extra hybrids on everybody.

Ok, on to Taylormade RBZ - I just picked up RBZ Tour 14.5, 18.5, and 21.5. Again, I do not like the 18.5-21.5 3h/4h that much and would prefer 22*, 22.5*, or 23* as my second hybrid. 3* isn't horrible, but 21.5* is not really a legit 4i replacement, especially when it really is a 2-3i replacement. Let's see more options guys! I kind of like PING's 17/20/23/26 hybrid loft setup. Typical PING - find something logical, extremely effective, if not that schnazzy or sexy, and run with it.

RBZ is long for sure. The ball comes off the hybrids hotter than anything I have ever hit. Only thing close was Tour Edge Exotics XCG/CB. These RBZs, weight included, feel a bit like larger versions of those with the cavity pocket tech. There is a springier feel to the RBZs, but they do not outrace the XCG or even the Mashie's like one might think. They are longer, but not as much as one might think, with their stock shafts and lengths.

Cleveland had better dispersion, thanks to about 1/2" shorter shaft length. So the shaft length of the RBZ counters the higher loft of the RBZ distance wise, at a minimum.

I then picked up a used Tour 18.5* RBZ on the 'bay with a 39.25" 757 Speeder shaft - much shorter than stock. I just took it to the range today and it was filthy, filthy. Explodes and just goes straight or a little tail either way. Piercing trajectory. Just point and shoot. The white head / black face, and the tour model face angle, do make alignment simple. It may do for woods what the Odyssey 3-ball putter did for alignment. No gimmick, just works.

Control of the Mashie, with piercing ballflights, and the feel of a rail gun at impact. Close to obnoxious but so hot off the face you just don't care, you feel like you just fragged it. RBZ does not need the ridiculous shaft length - a few extra yards when their product is clearly the envy of the market? I do not like Taylormade's marketing and some of their gear is overhyped - they're like Microsoft, they seem to borrow or steal an idea, then after a few iterations and throwing gobs of R&D at it, they eventually hit paydirt.

They hit goldrush paydirt with RBZ fairway / hybrid woods, that much is obvious.

Probably the only club that could relegate Mashie to backup, for me. I am ordering a 15.5* Mashie FW to test in a quest to find and test more loft / club combinations. I like the extra .5* or 1* in woods. Maybe give the RBZ Tour 4w a shot when they get released.

For what it is worth, I really didn't like the 14.5*, for my game. I am happy with my Rapture V2 driver (another hot face), and while the RBZ is sweet off the tee, the head size is too long face to back for me to hit consistently off the deck - especially when today's hybrids fly like 3w a few years ago and take most risk out of going for par 5's in two off the table. I just don't find myself hitting 3w off the deck a good play for me anymore.

I'm really intrigued by the possibility of dumping 3w altogether and trying the RBZ Tour 16.5* hybrid. If it is as long as I will bet it is, my perfect combo may be 16.5 / 21.5 and keep a 4i for the scrambling shots and 4i distance gap. The 21.5* is really as long as a 2i, after all. Ridiculous.

You can't really go wrong with Cleveland vs RBZ. One may fit you best based on shaft. Cleveland offers a shaft that will help more players' game - screw the #'s, take the playable distance. For higher swing speeds - the RBZ compounds the benefit/spring, and if you get a premium shaft or cut it down, you get fairway wood distance with a hybrid 'simple' button.

One last plug for TEE XCG / CB - for what the 4/5 series is going for at auction NEW, you get a Motore 70 and a club similar to the RBZ 757 Speeder I just hit.. for like 1/3 of a new RBZ hybrid. I'm just sayin'.. Frugality for the win.. wish I was not a club slut.

[bossanovawitcha]

I have had the Tour Mashie 18* and 20.5* for a couple months now.. The 85g shaft is a must, as well as the smaller head, if you have a quick tempo or fight a hook, as is the more open face angle than the standard Mashie. These clubs, as has been reported, are easy to misalign due to the offset - but once aligned, they are strong performers - the smaller head makes contact off fairway lies amazingly simple. Bottom line - you never drop kick, skip, or top these things.. You can get these up in the air, but you can also go after them and play a big draw / hook that just runs forever. On hard AZ conditions, I've gotten 275 quite a few times out of the 18* - and 260 out of the 20.5* which is as much as I get out of a full 3w. I've been using the 18* and 20.5* off the tee more often than any other club lately.

I love the rustic style and finish of these clubs. They also make a sweet 'thwack' at impact that is satisfying, but not too dull. Definitely feels like old school meets new technology. The tour Mashies are not as obnoxious in length like some other brands. I have owned the 4h and 5h in Kua 59g and they hook like a madman. These would be great for moderate swing speed slicers or smooth tempo, slower to moderate drawers of the ball. However, the slightly longer head profile makes it easier to mishit, I found, vs the tour mashies. They do get the ball up in the air with little effort very easily, without even requiring a decent swing. The shaft is one of the best you'll ever, ever find stock in your life if it fits you. Cleveland rocks.

One gripe - 15.5*, 18* to 20.5* as the only tour options is annoying. I find the distance gap poor between the 2h and 3h, but would love the 18* and 23* combo - however, the 23* is only in the standard mashie, shut face and stock 59g (without custom order on the latter) shaft. Puzzling. I prefer to use one hybrid as a 5w replacement, and one for a strong 4 if I had my druthers, to carry four wedges. Most of the OEMs seem to offer poor loft choices for hybrid combos. Now that hybrids are as long as yesterday's metalwoods, unless you are replacing 3-4-5 irons or want to go even higher with a hybrid/iron combo set, you are left scrambling a bit for distance gaps - and usefulness. A better player is going to be able to hit multiple yardages from 200+ out with the same clubs, and really jumping even 2-3* is not all that precise at really long range. Players that need more help from hybrids are not really looking to score from 200+, so it is silly to think they have a 'number' assigned to 2h-3h and maybe even 4h. They really need to just find (or from my painful experience I needed to find) a 'go-to' club they can get decent distance control and decent distance from, and just play that 'stock hybrid' shot to the highest 'safe' % target for them. It is like the industry went from trying to hawk extra wedges on everybody to now trying to hawk extra hybrids on everybody.

Ok, on to Taylormade RBZ - I just picked up RBZ Tour 14.5, 18.5, and 21.5. Again, I do not like the 18.5-21.5 3h/4h that much and would prefer 22*, 22.5*, or 23* as my second hybrid. 3* isn't horrible, but 21.5* is not really a legit 4i replacement, especially when it really is a 2-3i replacement. Let's see more options guys! I kind of like PING's 17/20/23/26 hybrid loft setup. Typical PING - find something logical, extremely effective, if not that schnazzy or sexy, and run with it.

RBZ is long for sure. The ball comes off the hybrids hotter than anything I have ever hit. Only thing close was Tour Edge Exotics XCG/CB. These RBZs, weight included, feel a bit like larger versions of those with the cavity pocket tech. There is a springier feel to the RBZs, but they do not outrace the XCG or even the Mashie's like one might think. They are longer, but not as much as one might think, with their stock shafts and lengths.

Cleveland had better dispersion, thanks to about 1/2" shorter shaft length. So the shaft length of the RBZ counters the higher loft of the RBZ distance wise, at a minimum.

I then picked up a used Tour 18.5* RBZ on the 'bay with a 39.25" 757 Speeder shaft - much shorter than stock. I just took it to the range today and it was filthy, filthy. Explodes and just goes straight or a little tail either way. Piercing trajectory. Just point and shoot. The white head / black face, and the tour model face angle, do make alignment simple. It may do for woods what the Odyssey 3-ball putter did for alignment. No gimmick, just works.

Control of the Mashie, with piercing ballflights, and the feel of a rail gun at impact. Close to obnoxious but so hot off the face you just don't care, you feel like you just fragged it. RBZ does not need the ridiculous shaft length - a few extra yards when their product is clearly the envy of the market? I do not like Taylormade's marketing and some of their gear is overhyped - they're like Microsoft, they seem to borrow or steal an idea, then after a few iterations and throwing gobs of R&D at it, they eventually hit paydirt.

They hit goldrush paydirt with RBZ fairway / hybrid woods, that much is obvious.

Probably the only club that could relegate Mashie to backup, for me. I am ordering a 15.5* Mashie FW to test in a quest to find and test more loft / club combinations. I like the extra .5* or 1* in woods. Maybe give the RBZ Tour 4w a shot when they get released.

For what it is worth, I really didn't like the 14.5*, for my game. I am happy with my Rapture V2 driver (another hot face), and while the RBZ is sweet off the tee, the head size is too long face to back for me to hit consistently off the deck - especially when today's hybrids fly like 3w a few years ago and take most risk out of going for par 5's in two off the table. I just don't find myself hitting 3w off the deck a good play for me anymore.

I'm really intrigued by the possibility of dumping 3w altogether and trying the RBZ Tour 16.5* hybrid. If it is as long as I will bet it is, my perfect combo may be 16.5 / 21.5 and keep a 4i for the scrambling shots and 4i distance gap. The 21.5* is really as long as a 2i, after all. Ridiculous.

You can't really go wrong with Cleveland vs RBZ. One may fit you best based on shaft. Cleveland offers a shaft that will help more players' game - screw the #'s, take the playable distance. For higher swing speeds - the RBZ compounds the benefit/spring, and if you get a premium shaft or cut it down, you get fairway wood distance with a hybrid 'simple' button.

One last plug for TEE XCG / CB - for what the 4/5 series is going for at auction NEW, you get a Motore 70 and a club similar to the RBZ 757 Speeder I just hit.. for like 1/3 of a new RBZ hybrid. I'm just sayin'.. Frugality for the win.. wish I was not a club slut.

[mikefjohnson]

I have the original Mashie, 18.5 with the stock shaft. Took a little gettinging use to (like 2 rds) and I was fighting some hooks. Now that it's dialed in, I can say I hit it probably 20 yds longer than my TM11 rescue. I hit the most beautiful low bullet out of a horrible lie in the rough last time I played. 200 straight down the pipe, a couple of hops and onto the green. Hard to beat it for the $59 I got it for at Golfsmith.