When Good Members Do Stupid Things

[Pudgelewis]

[quote name='sandiegonative' timestamp='1349400130' post='5752583']
[quote name='Pudgelewis' timestamp='1349398611' post='5752445']
Goes both ways, doesn't it ? If you knew him personally and considered him a friend, don't you think you'd be "singing a different tune" to SOME EXTENT?

As i've said before, I don't know him personally and I initially wished him the best moving forward after his apology thinking he had come to his senses. When it became clear that he still wasn't "on the right track" after that, a lot of us changed our tunes.
[/quote]

Negative, when it comes to BST everything is strictly business. There are no friends, there is only a buyer and a seller. I personally think positive Feedback is overrated. Sure a higher Feedback rating should in theory result in a good transaction but there is no guarantee. Because of that, I treat everyone equally and trust only as much as I need to. For example, as a buyer I send funds immediately (within a couple hours) after a deal has been made. I then give the seller 2 days MAX after payment has cleared to ship my items (I let the seller know that up front). After that, its on to PayPal for a dispute. This kind of crap happens far to frequently. I have to look out for #1 and in my book that's me.
[/quote]

Sounds simple enough if you don't like having friends.

[tinman]

[quote name='sandiegonative' timestamp='1349400130' post='5752583']
[quote name='Pudgelewis' timestamp='1349398611' post='5752445']
Goes both ways, doesn't it ? If you knew him personally and considered him a friend, don't you think you'd be "singing a different tune" to SOME EXTENT?

As i've said before, I don't know him personally and I initially wished him the best moving forward after his apology thinking he had come to his senses. When it became clear that he still wasn't "on the right track" after that, a lot of us changed our tunes.
[/quote]

Negative, when it comes to BST everything is strictly business. There are no friends, there is only a buyer and a seller. I personally think positive Feedback is overrated. Sure a higher Feedback rating should in theory result in a good transaction but there is no guarantee. Because of that, I treat everyone equally and trust only as much as I need to. For example, as a buyer I send funds [b]immediately (within a couple hours[/b]) after a deal has been made. I then give the seller 2 days MAX after payment has cleared to ship my items (I let the seller know that up front). After that, its on to PayPal for a dispute. This kind of crap happens far to frequently. I have to look out for #1 and in my book that's me.
[/quote] I wouldn't call that immediately at all.No seller is going to wait that long for a payment,if there are others wanting to pay for it now.

[Stinger82]

Unless paypal changed their rules again you can't file a dispute after 2 days, good luck with that. And I agree with Pudge, sounds simple if you dont like having friends. Albatrosser is a good guy, we have done a few transactions together on here. In fact the last transaction I didnt even see pics of the irons I just sent him the money and he shipped them to me. I KNOW that if there was an issue Grant would take care of me. Same goes for Pudge, he messaged me after our last transaction to make sure that everything was good because there was a small scratch on the crown of one club...Told him I'm not that picky and I really hadnt even noticed it. I am still playing that club to. I wouldnt hesitate to buy from Pudge without seeing pics either.

[sandiegonative]

As I stated before, this kind of crap happens way too often. I think GolfWRX should enact better rules to protect buyers and sellers.

My Ideas:
1) 2 day maximum ship by date after payment has cleared
- As a buyer you should be ready to ship ASAP. Shipping supplies (box, bubble wrap, etc) should be in hand. You have the buyer's funds, there is no excuse not to ship. If you can't for whatever reason, refund their money.
- This sets up real expectations for both buyer and seller. NO EXCUSES.
2) If the item has not been shipped after two days, the buyer should publicly post "Proof of Payment" (i.e. PayPal screenshot with personal information blacked out) in the BST Thread.
- The MODs can then move the thread to Dispute Area.
- I believe another 2 days to ship after Proof of Payment is feasible. But that is it.
3) At the "4 days after payment has cleared" mark, the buyer should protect themselves and start a PayPal dispute to get their funds back.
- The deal has gone "south" why prolong it. I personally do not believe its worth the risk.
- Waiting does nothing except allow the ability for PayPal dispute time to run out, then you are really S.O.L.

Just another "[color=#282828][size=3][background=rgb(247, 247, 247)]absolute ridiculous idea" from me.[/background][/size][/color]

[sandiegonative]

[quote name='Stinger82' timestamp='1349401317' post='5752719']
Unless paypal changed their rules again you can't file a dispute after 2 days, good luck with that. And I agree with Pudge, sounds simple if you dont like having friends. Albatrosser is a good guy, we have done a few transactions together on here. In fact the last transaction I didnt even see pics of the irons I just sent him the money and he shipped them to me. I KNOW that if there was an issue Grant would take care of me. Same goes for Pudge, he messaged me after our last transaction to make sure that everything was good because there was a small scratch on the crown of one club...Told him I'm not that picky and I really hadnt even noticed it. I am still playing that club to. I wouldnt hesitate to buy from Pudge without seeing pics either.
[/quote]

Sorry, I don't know the PayPal Minimum number of days before one can file a dispute. Whatever it is, it should be apart of the BST rules?

I have plenty of friends and hold them to higher standards. Sellers should treat non-friend buyers as good if not better then a friend buyer. This whole "friends" crap is great until you get screwed. Your last statement about "buying without seeing pics" is also very foolish. No one should ever do that, friend or not. I'm sure Pudge himself would rather you see what you are buying vice buying blind. Its all apart of good salesmanship.

[sandiegonative]

[quote name='tinman' timestamp='1349400449' post='5752629']
I wouldn't call that immediately at all.No seller is going to wait that long for a payment,if there are others wanting to pay for it now.
[/quote]

Tinman My bad, 100% agree. 2 hours is a bit long, I would expect payment within 10-30 minutes. If the seller decided to sell to someone else in that time, so be it. An item is "For Sale" till payment is received.

[Pure745]

Thread.. derailed.

[Stinger82]

[quote name='sandiegonative' timestamp='1349402561' post='5752811']
[quote name='Stinger82' timestamp='1349401317' post='5752719']
Unless paypal changed their rules again you can't file a dispute after 2 days, good luck with that. And I agree with Pudge, sounds simple if you dont like having friends. Albatrosser is a good guy, we have done a few transactions together on here. In fact the last transaction I didnt even see pics of the irons I just sent him the money and he shipped them to me. I KNOW that if there was an issue Grant would take care of me. Same goes for Pudge, he messaged me after our last transaction to make sure that everything was good because there was a small scratch on the crown of one club...Told him I'm not that picky and I really hadnt even noticed it. I am still playing that club to. I wouldnt hesitate to buy from Pudge without seeing pics either.
[/quote]

Sorry, I don't know the PayPal Minimum number of days before one can file a dispute. Whatever it is, it should be apart of the BST rules?

I have plenty of friends and hold them to higher standards. Sellers should treat non-friend buyers as good if not better then a friend buyer. This whole "friends" crap is great until you get screwed. Your last statement about "buying without seeing pics" is also very foolish. No one should ever do that, friend or not. I'm sure Pudge himself would rather you see what you are buying vice buying blind. Its all apart of good salesmanship.
[/quote]

I choose to trust people, you don't. Your choice I don't care either way. But to say noone should ever do that is your opinion not mine, I know these guys will take care of me if there was an issue. I give people a chance and look at the glass half full while you obviously see the glass half empty. Not everyone can ship within 2 days like you suggest, I would wager that will never be a bst rule regardless of your opinion.

[sandiegonative]

Ask CanGolfNut and TiltPutting about trust. I'm sure after this fiasco they will air on the side of caution. I'm assuming you've been fortunate never to been screwed over on the BST (I'm glad for you).

"2 Days" was just an example for an idea. Its the personal deadline I've set for myself whether on here, on eBay, for whatever I sell. I'm not sure how developed the town of Wellsboro, PA is. Maybe 2 days is not feasible for you. I'm in San Diego and there is a USPS, UPS, FedEx, etc around every block. Regardless, there should be an agreed upon reasonable time to ship after receipt of payment between buyer and seller. That's all I'm saying.

[jj9000]

[quote name='sandiegonative' timestamp='1349405315' post='5753035']
Ask CanGolfNut and TiltPutting about trust. I'm sure after this fiasco they will air on the side of caution. I'm assuming you've been fortunate never to been screwed over on the BST (I'm glad for you).

"2 Days" was just an example for an idea. Its the personal deadline I've set for myself whether on here, on eBay, for whatever I sell. I'm not sure how developed the town of Wellsboro, PA is. Maybe 2 days is not feasible for you. I'm in San Diego and there is a USPS, UPS, FedEx, etc around every block. Regardless, there should be an agreed upon reasonable time to ship after receipt of payment between buyer and seller. That's all I'm saying.
[/quote]

I've got no quarrel with you here, but, we're drifting way off-course.

You've made some excellent suggestions, of which, should be in a standalone thread as opposed to this thread.

[cgbm]

[quote name='sandiegonative' timestamp='1349400130' post='5752583']
[quote name='Pudgelewis' timestamp='1349398611' post='5752445']
Goes both ways, doesn't it ? If you knew him personally and considered him a friend, don't you think you'd be "singing a different tune" to SOME EXTENT?

As i've said before, I don't know him personally and I initially wished him the best moving forward after his apology thinking he had come to his senses. When it became clear that he still wasn't "on the right track" after that, a lot of us changed our tunes.
[/quote]

Negative, when it comes to BST everything is strictly business. There are no friends, there is only a buyer and a seller. I personally think positive Feedback is overrated. Sure a higher Feedback rating should in theory result in a good transaction but there is no guarantee. Because of that, I treat everyone equally and trust only as much as I need to. For example, as a buyer I send funds immediately (within a couple hours) after a deal has been made. I then give the seller 2 days MAX after payment has cleared to ship my items (I let the seller know that up front). After that, its on to PayPal for a dispute. This kind of crap happens far to frequently. I have to look out for #1 and in my book that's me.
[/quote]

what about guys like me who are at work for 3 days at a time. i post things on day one of my off days but if it sells on day two i have to wait till 3 days later to ship.
you wouldnt buy from me because of that?

[cgbm]

hey dont bash wellsboro PA. im from that area.

not all of us can grow up in the sun. in a state where everyone thinks their right all the time...

just a bit of humor please dont take offense.

i loved cali when i was stationed there.

[sandiegonative]

cgbm,

I would NEVER buy from you... I'm a LEFTY But in all honesty, that would be fine. Communication is key. As long as there was an understanding that a purchased item would ship within a reasonable time frame then everything would be all good.

No bash on Wellsboro, PA. I'm sure its a great area. Like any area, San Diego has its ups and downs too.

Humor understood and no offense taken.... BTW, do you they still use AOL Dial-up for Internet over there

[chickenpotpie]

[quote name='sandiegonative' timestamp='1349400130' post='5752583']
[quote name='Pudgelewis' timestamp='1349398611' post='5752445']
Goes both ways, doesn't it ? If you knew him personally and considered him a friend, don't you think you'd be "singing a different tune" to SOME EXTENT?

As i've said before, I don't know him personally and I initially wished him the best moving forward after his apology thinking he had come to his senses. When it became clear that he still wasn't "on the right track" after that, a lot of us changed our tunes.
[/quote]

Negative, when it comes to BST everything is strictly business. There are no friends, there is only a buyer and a seller. I personally think positive Feedback is overrated. Sure a higher Feedback rating should in theory result in a good transaction but there is no guarantee. Because of that, I treat everyone equally and trust only as much as I need to. For example, as a buyer I send funds immediately (within a couple hours) after a deal has been made. I then give the seller 2 days MAX after payment has cleared to ship my items (I let the seller know that up front). After that, its on to PayPal for a dispute. This kind of crap happens far to frequently. I have to look out for #1 and in my book that's me.
[/quote]

Sandiegonative, while I appreciate your point, and would have absolutely zero problems complying with your terms, I would not deal with you.

You specifying the 2 day shipment thing up front is enough of a red flag for me to suggest you would be a high maintenance buyer...whether or not you actually are.

Oh, and get off albatrosser, he's not the problem here. He's one of the best Wrx'ers on these forums.

[Tmiller72]

[quote name='Pure745' timestamp='1349403765' post='5752909']
Thread.. derailed.
[/quote]

+1

These guys are causing this thread to jump the shark.

[drpino]

Buyers both refunded in full. OP has had BST privs revoked. Topic way off-topic.

Locked.