So i'm watching Larry Nelson

[wolfpack]

I've watched they one yesterday a couple times off my DVR and the one today on driving is on now. These have to be the best set of academy vids I have seen yet. Larry breaks it down so simple, and unlike many guys who just DO something he knows why he does what he does. I am super impressed. Larry was a bit before my time, but I am really glad he is being featured on these shows. DVR them if you can.

[lightgrip]

[quote name='wolfpack' timestamp='1358295509' post='6235665']
I've watched they one yesterday a couple times off my DVR and the one today on driving is on now. These have to be the best set of academy vids I have seen yet. Larry breaks it down so simple, and unlike many guys who just DO something he knows why he does what he does. I am super impressed. Larry was a bit before my time, but I am really glad he is being featured on these shows. DVR them if you can.
[/quote]

Yeah, I saw the show also. I thought it was very good. His tip about starting the downswing slowly, I think the phrase he used was "take your time," to improve tempo I believe will be really helpful for me, since I am an "attack the ball" kind of guy once I get to the top.

[wolfpack]

His ball placement with the driver breakdown, it just made so much sense. I always thought of it differently.

[hogans71]

I'm sorry I missed that episode.

Story is, he learned the game from Hogan's Five Lessons.

Always liked him and his game...

[WRXClarky]

[quote name='wolfpack' timestamp='1358308708' post='6237327']
His ball placement with the driver breakdown, it just made so much sense. I always thought of it differently.
[/quote]
Care to give us a short synopsis of the ball placement?

[wolfpack]

He had the ball well forward, almost to the outside of his left foot. He said If you put the ball inside your left heel like most people are told, you will start the ball to the right, which causes most people to slice. If it is too far forward ( and it was 3 inches past his foot) it starts left. His take was that 2 inches makes a world of difference on setting up for the driver. So he hits one inside his stance, it goes way right, then outside his foot and it goes way left. He says "now I only moved the ball 5 inches but you can see the difference in those shots is 80 yards right to left. "

He stated that there are 2 arcs in the swing not 1. There is the swing arc (think the plane of glass theory), and then there is a arc on the ground that the club covers, (imagine a hula hoop around your ankles) Not only is the swing arc important but to understand how to place the ball for a T shot, you must know the path of your lower arc as well. Then you can find where your club comes into the hitting zone and where it leaves.

If your arc doesn't parallel to the target (down the line) by the time your club gets to the ball T'd up inside your left heel, you will hit a block or a slice. I was always taught the exact opposite, and all I could think watching this was "well no s***"

[wolfpack]

[quote name='hogans71' timestamp='1358309707' post='6237425']
I'm sorry I missed that episode.

Story is, he learned the game from Hogan's Five Lessons.

Always liked him and his game...
[/quote]

Yes and some from Mr Hogan himself, they covered quite a bit of that in the iron episode yesterday.

[iteachgolf]

If the ball is further back the path will be more to the right and if the ball is further up the path will be more to the left. Neither has a thing to do with where the ball starts. If the face were square to the target at impact the ball back would draw and the ball up would cut. Moving the ball back makes it the most likely to draw and up makes it the most likely to cut.

[Wedgefromhere]

I just kept wondering what Michael Breed was thinking when Larry said your weight should be on the balls of your feet. I know Breed is pretty adamant about the weight being over the arches.

[Ajlepisto]

[quote name='Wedgefromhere' timestamp='1358350395' post='6239183']
I just kept wondering what Michael Breed was thinking when Larry said your weight should be on the balls of your feet. I know Breed is pretty adamant about the weight being over the arches.
[/quote]

Potato, potato, tomato, tomato. Right?

[geesecougar2]

[quote name='iteachgolf' timestamp='1358346000' post='6238781']
If the ball is further back the path will be more to the right and if the ball is further up the path will be more to the left. Neither has a thing to do with where the ball starts. If the face were square to the target at impact the ball back would draw and the ball up would cut. Moving the ball back makes it the most likely to draw and up makes it the most likely to cut.
[/quote]

I'm thinking that often what happens with great players giving swing advice is that they give it in a vacuum, assuming that the student does everything else properly. So Larry's take on ball position probably assumes that everyone's hands and clubface behaves like his.....

[iteachgolf]

That still wouldn't change that as the path gets more to the right of your stance it's easier to draw and as it moves left of your stance its easier to cut. Won't even get into how aoa affects path. I think he's going off of the belief that if your path is right your ball will start right and if your path is more left the ball will start left. It's about feel and real and what many players think/feel they are doing isn't actually what's going on. When playing this isn't an issue assuming it works. Problem is when they try to give advice and have the cause and effect wrong, they'll do more harm then good

[Crab Daddy]

[quote name='iteachgolf' timestamp='1358354906' post='6239693']
That still wouldn't change that as the path gets more to the right of your stance it's easier to draw and as it moves left of your stance its easier to cut. Won't even get into how aoa affects path. I think he's going off of the belief that if your path is right your ball will start right and if your path is more left the ball will start left. It's about feel and real and what many players think/feel they are doing isn't actually what's going on. When playing this isn't an issue assuming it works. Problem is when they try to give advice and have the cause and effect wrong, they'll do more harm then good
[/quote]

I think the way Nelson framed it was changing ball position relative to a neutral position, where your alignment remains the same - square to the target at the neutral position. So, with the ball farther back, the club face has not yet squared, and, with the ball farther forward, the club face has gone beyond square. At least that's how I interpreted it.

[iteachgolf]

Yes but if the ball starts further back and you still have face square at address (face is effectively now more closed in relation to the path) that's not what will happen. The face would only be more open as ball is moved back if it was more open at setup. If you keep everything the same and just move ball back path will be moving right and you'll be hitting down more further moving path right. I'm talking everything neutral too. Ball further back makes it easier to draw. Ball up is way more likely to cut and if you keep face square to target and move ball up it is now effectively more open to the path.

[citizencage]

Anybody catch the little hitch in his swing just as his club reaches the top of his backswing? I would say it was a little bit idiosyncratic, but I'm not qualified enough to suggest a proper term to describe it. I do think he has nice tempo during his transition.

[MizunoJoe]

[quote name='hogans71' timestamp='1358309707' post='6237425']
I'm sorry I missed that episode.

Story is, he learned the game from Hogan's Five Lessons.

Always liked him and his game...
[/quote]

And he didn't start playing golf til he was 21.

[Jim Waldron]

[quote name='Wedgefromhere' timestamp='1358350395' post='6239183']
I just kept wondering what Michael Breed was thinking when Larry said your weight should be on the balls of your feet. I know Breed is pretty adamant about the weight being over the arches.
[/quote]

I was thinking how many new students will come to see me this summer who cannot hit the ball solid because their balance point is shifting toward the toes. "Weight on balls of feet" has ruined thousands of golfers over the years. I checked out Larry in that show from down the line view and his weight is perfectly balanced in the middle, toe to heel - nowhere near the balls of his feet.

[TheDarkOne]

Nelson is one of those guys missed in most people's thoughts for whatever reason. MANY people would find a lot of things to like about what Larry says.
Then again only on WRX would you find a man who has won 3 Majors being openly accused of not knowing what he is doing.

[ramradhakri]

[quote name='Jim Waldron' timestamp='1358358642' post='6240115']
[quote name='Wedgefromhere' timestamp='1358350395' post='6239183']
I just kept wondering what Michael Breed was thinking when Larry said your weight should be on the balls of your feet. I know Breed is pretty adamant about the weight being over the arches.
[/quote]

I was thinking how many new students will come to see me this summer who cannot hit the ball solid because their balance point is shifting toward the toes. "Weight on balls of feet" has ruined thousands of golfers over the years. I checked out Larry in that show from down the line view and his weight is perfectly balanced in the middle, toe to heel - nowhere near the balls of his feet.
[/quote]

I start to sh@nk the ball if my weight starts creeping towards my toes (and I have an arms only backswing as well when that happens). When he talked about weight on the toes in the show, I covered my ears and looked away.

[citizencage]

[quote name='TheDarkOne' timestamp='1358358910' post='6240139']
Nelson is one of those guys missed in most people's thoughts for whatever reason. MANY people would find a lot of things to like about what Larry says.
Then again only on WRX would you find a man who has won 3 Majors being openly accused of not knowing what he is doing.
[/quote]

I don't think that's what people are saying at all. The guy won three majors, that speaks to itself. However, what Larry advocates as correct fundamentals may in fact be right for Larry. That doesn't mean it's right for everybody. Also, as Jim Waldron astutely pointed out, what Larry thinks or feels as the correct weight distribution in the feet is not necessarily what's happening in actuality.

[Jim Waldron]

This is the age-old problem of tour players playing the role of teacher. What they think or feel that they do is often not at all what they are actually doing. And then there is the actual teaching experience factor - you spend a few years on the lesson tee and you start to understand many recurring issues that average golfers especially face on a daily basis. You discover what fixes work and the ones that don't work. Setting up with your weight on the balls of your feet is setting up in an out of balance position and once your swing motion starts, it will only become even more out of balance. The Vertical Balance Line runs through the middle of your feet, toe to heel, and stays there all the way to the Finish. That means the body is not "rocking" toward the toes or towards the heels during the golf swing.

[3eagles18]

Great show on driving. I wish that I had recorded it.

[wolfpack]

[quote name='TheDarkOne' timestamp='1358358910' post='6240139']
Nelson is one of those guys missed in most people's thoughts for whatever reason. MANY people would find a lot of things to like about what Larry says.
Then again only on WRX would you find a man who has won 3 Majors being openly accused of not knowing what he is doing.
[/quote]

You said it TDO

[iteachgolf]

[quote name='wolfpack' timestamp='1358388117' post='6242887']
[quote name='TheDarkOne' timestamp='1358358910' post='6240139']
Nelson is one of those guys missed in most people's thoughts for whatever reason. MANY people would find a lot of things to like about what Larry says.
Then again only on WRX would you find a man who has won 3 Majors being openly accused of not knowing what he is doing.
[/quote]

You said it TDO
[/quote]

He knows how to play golf. And he knows what he feels like is happening. What he feels is happening isn't necessarily so. Again moving the ball back makes it more likely to draw, not slice. Moving the ball more up makes the ball more likely to fade, not draw. The clubface is primary determinate of start direction not the path of the club, especially with driver.

[butch33611]

The big thing I got aout it was him saying the first 6 inches of the downswing are the most important. I do a nice slow controlled backswing. When it reaches the top it pushes some kind of button in my brain that says. QUICK!!! NOW SWING AS HARD AS YOU CAN!!!! Its like 2 different people swinging the same club. I know your supposed to start the downswing and let it build up speed but I cant seem to get my brain to grasp that concept.

After watching him sitting by my net I went back to hitting some balls trying to slow it down. It really does work for me if I can just somehow work it into my swing.

[tradekid]

[quote name='iteachgolf' timestamp='1358389332' post='6243015']
[quote name='wolfpack' timestamp='1358388117' post='6242887']
[quote name='TheDarkOne' timestamp='1358358910' post='6240139']
Nelson is one of those guys missed in most people's thoughts for whatever reason. MANY people would find a lot of things to like about what Larry says.
Then again only on WRX would you find a man who has won 3 Majors being openly accused of not knowing what he is doing.
[/quote]

You said it TDO
[/quote]

He knows how to play golf. And he knows what he feels like is happening. What he feels is happening isn't necessarily so. Again moving the ball back makes it more likely to draw, not slice. Moving the ball more up makes the ball more likely to fade, not draw. The clubface is primary determinate of start direction not the path of the club, especially with driver.
[/quote]

Did you actually watch the show, or are you relying on what people are describing on this thread?

[iteachgolf]

[quote name='tradekid' timestamp='1358398623' post='6244041']
[quote name='iteachgolf' timestamp='1358389332' post='6243015']
[quote name='wolfpack' timestamp='1358388117' post='6242887']
[quote name='TheDarkOne' timestamp='1358358910' post='6240139']
Nelson is one of those guys missed in most people's thoughts for whatever reason. MANY people would find a lot of things to like about what Larry says.
Then again only on WRX would you find a man who has won 3 Majors being openly accused of not knowing what he is doing.
[/quote]

You said it TDO
[/quote]

He knows how to play golf. And he knows what he feels like is happening. What he feels is happening isn't necessarily so. Again moving the ball back makes it more likely to draw, not slice. Moving the ball more up makes the ball more likely to fade, not draw. The clubface is primary determinate of start direction not the path of the club, especially with driver.
[/quote]

Did you actually watch the show, or are you relying on what people are describing on this thread?
[/quote]

Didn't watch show and don't watch golf instructional shows. No point for me to do so. But did he not say that if the ball is inside your left heel the ball will start to the right and will cause most people to slice? Did the OP lie about what was said?

I don't need to watch the show to know that the above simply isn't true and in fact moving it back would make it more likely to draw if face angle at address is left unchanged.

[tradekid]

[quote name='iteachgolf' timestamp='1358399053' post='6244083']
[quote name='tradekid' timestamp='1358398623' post='6244041']
[quote name='iteachgolf' timestamp='1358389332' post='6243015']
[quote name='wolfpack' timestamp='1358388117' post='6242887']
[quote name='TheDarkOne' timestamp='1358358910' post='6240139']
Nelson is one of those guys missed in most people's thoughts for whatever reason. MANY people would find a lot of things to like about what Larry says.
Then again only on WRX would you find a man who has won 3 Majors being openly accused of not knowing what he is doing.
[/quote]

You said it TDO
[/quote]

He knows how to play golf. And he knows what he feels like is happening. What he feels is happening isn't necessarily so. Again moving the ball back makes it more likely to draw, not slice. Moving the ball more up makes the ball more likely to fade, not draw. The clubface is primary determinate of start direction not the path of the club, especially with driver.
[/quote]

Did you actually watch the show, or are you relying on what people are describing on this thread?
[/quote]

Didn't watch show and don't watch golf instructional shows. No point for me to do so. But did he not say that if the ball is inside your left heel the ball will start to the right and will cause most people to slice? Did the OP lie about what was said?

I don't need to watch the show to know that the above simply isn't true and in fact moving it back would make it more likely to draw if face angle at address is left unchanged.
[/quote]

Watch the actual episode and don't rely on other people's description of the episode. If you did you would realize that you would agree with what he was trying to convey.

[iteachgolf]

Why would you assume that? Again I'd never agree that moving the ball back so its inside the left foot will make the ball more likely to slice.

I'm responding based on the post in this thread, clearing up the misinformation in this thread. Even if the post in this thread isn't what Larry actually said, which I'd find hard to believe, it would still warrant clarification.

[toadlake34]

I only saw bits and pieces and didn't hear the dialogue, but it seemed like he was hitting more of pulls with the ball left and pushes with the ball right with the face square to the path