Rounds with a Vintage Bag

[Kathy Marie]

[quote name='teevons' timestamp='1408818127' post='9993885']
KM, I played fast because of the lightning I saw in the distance!! It helped too I was playing ok and kept the ball in the short stuff, did not pull the pin when putting and did not keep score on a card, all time savers.

<snip>

Regarding your ankle issues, I have had 3 surgeries on my right ankle, I have 13 screws in it, and a metal plate on the side, I try to walk also but use cart when I want to play fast or feel like it hurts too much that day, since I moved to the desert I have several swimming pools where I live and swim every day, use the hot tub,great for circulation and ROM, low impact. I can tell you w from my experience once you screw up your Achilles tendon it never feels right again, I have to stretch it constantly to keep it from tightening up, I also had surgery on my calf muscle where they cut the tendon to take pressure off the Achilles tendon,

Good luck!!
[/quote]

Oh my GOD, Teevons--WHAT happened to your ankle?!?!?!! <shiver> I'm not that bad, thank goodness--no surgeries, just physical therapy--but my condolences. Wow, you must live with pain every day...

Yes, I've got to stretch it doing my PT exercises and when I get real neglectful it bites me, but if I stick with it I improve. I couldn't walk more than 2 holes when I started late last year and now I'm wondering how to make the jump from 9 to 18! That's REAL progress for me!

About staying in the short stuff, well... I get a couple Great-For-Moi rounds and then I crash and burn, I'm not consistent. I get schooled weekly by two women in league: one games an Eye2 knockoff set by Spalding and the other games the Original TM Burners--you know, the ones with the orange paint? I asked Gracious & Gorgeous about her clubs and she said, "My clubs are old. But you know what, they just keep working!!" And Rules Lady Of The Orange Burners trounced me by [b]22 strokes [/b]last week--she shot 36 with [i]12 putts![/i]

So, I've made an Executive Decision: No More Clubs. I'm buying LESSONS instead!!! Had my first playing lesson last week & wow, what a revelation *that* was!!! I need to make a course book so I have the info with me for league tomorrow, I've been consistently aiming at the wrong areas when I play.

And while it doesn't get as hot here as where you are, it's HUMID. That reduces your body's ability to cool off since sweat doesn't evaporate quickly (or at all.) On that walk I mentioned, at 10 PM it was 79 degrees with a relative humidity of 91%. We walked for about an hour & I had to change when I got back.

And Good Luck To You, Sir Teevons--I think I'm going to call you My Achilles Twin!!

Have a Good One,

Kathy
editted to add: All Clubs Still Enroute Are All Good!!

[teevons]

Good plan on the lessons, start off with good solid advice and you wont have bad habits that are really hard to stop.

Only lived in Minneapolis area for 3 years, humidity was terrible.!!

We played this am and it was 95 with little breeze, very comfortable and had ice water with us.

Dont over think the game, keep it simple and have fun no matter what

If I was starting over from scratch knowing what I know about golf now I would spend all my time practicing Moe Normans swing and fundamentals. Just my 2cents

[birly-shirly]

Dammit, if there's not a chance that I might have finally learned to curb my ho'ing ways. All it took was some halfway decent golf.

The last good round that I posted up on this thread was with a very rag-bag set of Mizuno tp9 irons. I found 3,6,8,9, PW in a charity shop for about £10. The shafts on the short irons are badly rusted, but the heads are in good shape. I hunted down single irons on ebay to fill the gaps. The 4 iron has an old victory green grip that's in as new condition and a reminder of how great those grips felt back in the day. I had an old stiff tp9 1 iron that I bent and reshafted to make a regular flex 2 iron. The 7 iron has had an overlength 9 iron shaft jammed in it.

SW is from a set of TP Originals around the same vintage - it's flat out the best wedge from sand, for me, that I've tried, including Vokeys, Hogans, R90 and 58 Dynapower reissues.

All the irons are now regular rather than stiff flex - feel sensational - and have just enough bounce and camber to glide rather than bite through the turf (or driving range mat for that matter).

Driver and 3 wood were r-flex Hogan Apex - from early 90s, I believe. The ones with brass backweights. Then I came into some of the redline persimmons that look WAY sexier - dark stain, Hogan signature etched on the crown, bore-through. As excited as I was to get hold of them, I found I couldn't hit them - even though they're still the same regular flex. I think it was Ol_Pardner on here found something similar - that the backweighted, non-bore-through clubs just play that bit easier. I suspect that the bore-throughs play a little stiffer- although I also think they might sit a little more closed. So back to the ugly sisters.

And I think I've found my bag for all seasons. I'm enjoying hitting these so much that I don't WANT to change my bag. I swapped out the woods and I suffered. I bagged a set of Muirfields for a night and I shanked myself off the course. The only change that's stuck is that my new TPM is staying in the bag for the foreseeable.

My mind was made up last night. Played late in the afternoon and scored 75. I broke 80 for the first time 2 weeks ago with the same kit, give or take the putter. I'm telling myself now that I can repeat in the 70s. I also drove the ball much straighter than my last couple of outings with metalwoods.

Regular flex shafts? Swing speed wise I think I can justify stiff shafts - but I don't see any benefits. I'm finding that the clubs I enjoy hitting the most are the ones that are softer, and in the case of the woods, a bit livelier in the tip as well.

For the first time in years, this has me thinking seriously about clearing out my other sets of clubs and only keeping one bag in the house. The rest can go live in the shed, out of the way of temptation. I'll be sad to see the back of the Hogans - they're probably the clubs I most want to like, but I'm just finding it hard to say no to the mizzies.

Actually the one club that I'm still unsure about is the 3 wood. Not sure I've found one I can count on yet. So there's that to work on...

Maybe the Stan Thompson Ginty that arrived last week might step up....

And there are still those Pings in the shed...

[oldschoolrocker]

Simply brilliant posts Lady and Gentlemen. Does my soul good to read of others exploits when I am on assignment and unable to play.

[MoaningM]

"Hi. My name is BirlyShirly and I am a 13 handicap.

This year, I have tried 2 things different. One is playing vintage woods much more often. The other is going to see a physio for a golf fitness screen and some remedial stretching exercises.
"

Birly, do you mind me asking what excerises you are doing, i have had problems with calf and hamstrings for a few years since i popped a calf playing golf 18 months back. I go to sports therapy guy and osteopath but still have a few problems.

Cheers

[birly-shirly]

[quote name='MoaningM' timestamp='1408990849' post='10004713']
"Hi. My name is BirlyShirly and I am a 13 handicap.

This year, I have tried 2 things different. One is playing vintage woods much more often. The other is going to see a physio for a golf fitness screen and some remedial stretching exercises.
"

Birly, do you mind me asking what excerises you are doing, i have had problems with calf and hamstrings for a few years since i popped a calf playing golf 18 months back. I go to sports therapy guy and osteopath but still have a few problems.

Cheers
[/quote]

I had 2 obvious weaknesses - restricted ability to rotate my shoulders relative to my hips (thoracic spine mobility), and very tight calves/limited ankle mobility.

Only the ankle stuff seems directly relevant to you. I didn't have your history of injury - so that simplified things a bit, but it's still work in progress.

What progress I've made has been based on 3 elements. I got some "manual therapy" - basically a couple of sessions of tissue massage, which loosened things up a bit but not dramatically. I get the impression that the physio would have expected a better response than we got from my manual therapy.

I've also been using a foam roller, and I've been doing pretty conventional calf-stretches.

Foam rolling seems pretty safe - I don't think I've seen any warnings about overdoing it. Alternatively, you can use a massage stick to roll your calves - its the same principle of trying to find sore pressure points in the muscles and squashing them. I've also been told (albeit by a pal rather than my physio) that you can escalate from an ordinary foam roller to the Grid products from Trigger Point Therapy.

Stretching is really any sort of stance that keeps your bare foot flat on the ground and moves the knee out beyond the toe. The catch for me has been understanding just how much ankle movement is required. The benchmark seems to be getting your knee 4" beyond the end of your toe - when I started I couldn't achieve half that. When I stretch I use a ruler to put my toe 4" from a wall then I try to get my knee to touch the wall. This takes me ages - and it takes a bit of grabbing and pulling on the wall to force some gentle downward pressure into flexing the ankle. It actually takes a minute or so of this to get my knee to just touch the wall - and I then repeat that a couple of times to try and actually put some pressure on the wall, whilst my heel (barefoot) remains on the ground. I've been doing this for 8 -10 weeks now. Apparently stretching twice a day is optimally efficient in terms of results relative to time and effort.

Especially if you've been injured, you'll want to be careful about this. I've been reassured by my physio that so long as I move slowly and gently, the pain I'm feeling is not the result of damage being done - but I took care to check this out specifically with him. The usual guide to stretching is to relax and not force the range of movement, but I'm not sure I'd have seen any progress at all following that instruction.

Amazingly, I tested OK for hamstring flexibility.

The screening I went through was done by a TPI-certified physio. This was good from a golf point of view - as the focus was on what specifically was a weakness in terms of making a good golf swing. A TPI screen would tell you whether your calves and hams are actually holding you back - or if your main golfing issue lie elsewhere.

I'm utterly convinced of the benefits to me in golfing terms already. The follow up, which should be interesting, is that the increased mobility should allow me to do some resistance training which (being heavily reliant on squat based movements) I could never have managed before. I've just started a TPI strength-training programme now with a heavy emphasis on simultaneous squatting and rotating movements. I've never done any exercises like this before - which leads me to hope that there are some easy gains to pick up along this route!

[Kathy Marie]

Played last night & hurt right wrist & elbow hitting from just into tall rough, couldn't see ground was uneven. Should have quit and like a dummie I didn't, hurts this AM more than it did then & swollen into top of hand. Will be reading board but typing hunt-&-peck left handed, no more posts till better. One handed makes EVERYTHING tough, playing by the rules of golf IS NOT WORTH IT for this kind of injury!!! >:<

Hope this will clear up soon, this is scarey... Trying to figure out how I will open a can of soup, button a shirt, tie a shoe.

If I get back out there I am [size=5][b]NEVER[/b][/size] hitting out of rough like that again it's mowed or I don't hit.

I wish I'd taken a <censored> Foot Wedge,

KM

[dbuck47]

KM,

I did the same thing once trying to hit out of some sort of Mondo once, though not as severe.

The Golf Channel has been promoting relaxed rules for casual play, and this is one of the reasons. I won't hit the ball off a tree root or ant bed either.

I think for league play, leagues should adopt a drop with 1 stroke for these kinds of lies anyway as a condition of competition, just standardize so everyone does it the same.

Even if playing by strict USGA rules, in competition or round for handicap purposes, a penalty is better than an injured wrist.

[dbuck47]

BS and MoaningM,

I concur with the benefits of stretching. I have also used a foam noodle to lay on and stretch arms/shoulders. My therapist did warn about being careful to just push/stretch steadily and not "bounce" trying to increase range as this may cause tears.

I am amazed at how much better I feel if I do the stretches.

[teevons]

Great article on foam rollers with instructions and pics
[url="http://www.mensjournal.com/expert-advice/11-foam-rolling-exercises-to-prevent-injuries-20140730"]http://www.mensjourn...juries-20140730[/url]

[MoaningM]

Great replies guys, foam roller bought!

[birly-shirly]

Did I really neglect to mention that the foam roller - if it's what you need - is, whilst very safe, also very sore?

In my experience, it's likely to take a couple of weeks of steady rolling before you stop wincing.

[teevons]

Another round with vintage today, Weather was gorgeous, 105 when I finished, very nice with cart, would not have walked on this course, resort course, so long walks in between the housing, ok with cart. Only saw one other 4some so was able to play in 2 hours.
Played with Hogan Round sole,2-E rechromed and newer Apex 4 shafts. Hogan Kite 56 special sw, Macgregor M85w 3wood reshafted with s300 , Hogan Apex 5 wood and a Wood Bros 10 degree All American, with X100 shaft. The driver was a beast to get air borne with the x100, Did ok with it towards the end of day teeing it up a bit more, aimed left side of fairway everytime and it would fade to the middle, low ball!!
Hogan 1490 Conde Rose putter

[Soloman1]

My first wife was a wincer. Wincing was her middle name. She winced at everything and everybody for no reason. I'm sure she's wincing somewhere right now.

Pardon my intrusion. Carry on.

[MoaningM]

I played yesterday afternoon with 2 others from the club, they had a good ole chuckle on the first tee, me with my retro bag, with
Peter Broadbent driver
Joe powell 3 wood
Macg 68 4 wood
71 wilson buttonback 2-pw
Hogan sand wedge special
Ping karsten co anser 1968
Weather was v windy at least a 3 club wind if not more, as an example i hit driver 3 wood into the 420 yard par 4 11th then driver 7 iron into 505yd par 5! Links golf for you! Lol.
Plan was using the old balls again, after 8 holes i was 9 over par having a nightmare lost 2 balls, couldnt hit a cows ar£e with a banjo, 9th tee i changed to a srixon soft feel, from there i played some decent golf and was 1 under for the last 10, including almost holing my tee shot on 17 with. A 4 iron! Ended up with an 80 which was quite a result! Its a funny ole game. Have a game lined up for tommorrow hopefully continue where i left off.

[dbuck47]

I had a very enjoyable 9 yesterday evening. I played with Wilson Staff Tour Blades, Joe Powell DSP J1 driver and 3 wood, Wilson JP pw, Wilson Geo Low Original 600 putter, and Wilson Duo balls. Weather was decent, and the course was abnormally empty.

I wish I could report good results like Teevons and MM, but only a mediocre 45. The first hole however was perfect, and the last four pretty good. There was a four hole section in the middle where my full shots went test pattern off the air. I had 16 putts which sounds bad, but a lot were literally a hair's miss, and the JP was performing admirably.

Sam Snead said, "You gotta dance with who you brung." That was contrary to my game plan yesterday, which called for a draw off the tee on most holes. The first hole sets up perfectly for a draw; the tee box is angled toward the right side of the fairway, and it is easy to set up and that is just what I planned and did. When I came to the second hole, the tee was moved from its normal place, and even though it is a dogleg left, the shot for me from this tee should have been a fade. Stubborn me tried to hit a draw anyway, missed it and got out of rhythm. Stubbornness continued until hole 6 when I switched to a fade and hit four pleasing tee shots, two of which were right down the middle. Evidently my date for the day was really a fade.

[MoaningM]

Dbuck with normal new fangled gear i hit a fade all day, since im back using persimmon im finding already im naturally hitting a draw especially with the driver, which very much against my nature. Its quite strange but even setting up on the tee it just feels right to hit a draw and sure enough as long as i hit it solid i do. Got a game tommorrow with a +4 handicap guy who is also going retro for the first time ever! Going to be interesting!

[HoldenCornfield]

[quote name='MoaningM' timestamp='1409349572' post='10033117']
Dbuck with normal new fangled gear i hit a fade all day, since im back using persimmon im finding already im naturally hitting a draw especially with the driver, which very much against my nature. Its quite strange but even setting up on the tee it just feels right to hit a draw and sure enough as long as i hit it solid i do. Got a game tommorrow with a +4 handicap guy who is also going retro for the first time ever! Going to be interesting!
[/quote]

More pics, please!

[johnnydman]

Had a blast last night and tonight. Instant time machine, playing solo, late in the evening with no GPS, no glove and no golf shoes.
Driver is a blonde Ping Zing
3wd is a Macgregor Tourney Persimmon
Hogan Apex PC 2-4-6-8-9-E
Haven't found a wedge yet so a modern Mizuno MP-R 58*
TP Mills #1
NXT Tour ball

I was smiling quite a bit after I played #1 well, and birdie on #2...just a really fun round with 1 disaster hole. Only had time for front 9 plus 10,11,18 before dark. Oh, and this wasn't a course I would consider "Vintage friendly", long with lush bentgrass fwy's that I thought I might have more trouble with due to irons with a sharper leading edge.

I couldn't wait so I played the same setup tonight, different course. Birdie on #1..."even" through 8 then a triple bogey on #9. Again, darkness and weather cut short my fun.

[HoldenCornfield]

[quote name='johnnydman' timestamp='1409457441' post='10038745']
[b]Had a blast last night and tonight. Instant time machine, playing solo, late in the evening with no GPS, no glove and no golf shoes --[/b]
[/quote]

That is one of the best ways to enjoy the game -- walking nine with the classic half set as the sun sets. Nice!

[rushfan96]

[quote name='teevons' timestamp='1409263087' post='10027187']
Another round with vintage today, Weather was gorgeous, 105 when I finished, very nice with cart, would not have walked on this course, resort course, so long walks in between the housing, ok with cart. Only saw one other 4some so was able to play in 2 hours.
Played with Hogan Round sole,2-E rechromed and newer Apex 4 shafts. Hogan Kite 56 special sw, Macgregor M85w 3wood reshafted with s300 , Hogan Apex 5 wood and a Wood Bros 10 degree All American, with X100 shaft. The driver was a beast to get air borne with the x100, Did ok with it towards the end of day teeing it up a bit more, aimed left side of fairway everytime and it would fade to the middle, low ball!!
Hogan 1490 Conde Rose putter
[/quote]

Beautiful driver!

[teevons]

Took a few Hogans and friends out today for a quickie. Irons were Hogan 1622c offset with pyrotene shafts and leather grips. I adjusted the loft to modern specs before play.
After hitting the 8&9 i thought the lie looked funny and noticed both shafts were bent!! Will make great project for reshafting

The sw was a Spalding Robert Jones super Dynamiter, hated it!! Huge round sole that dug like crazy, cool looking club but not very practical.

Woods were Hogan speedslot persimmon DFD, 43 inches long and original grips and shaft, x stiff shaft. & wood was a Powerbilt Weedeater, had never hit it before, birdied a 200 yard par 3 with it though.

Putter was a Macgregor Hogan Custom Bilt. I bet it had 8 degrees of loft, after a few holes I pictured myself putting like Hogan and Nelson did when they used their wrists and jabbed at,

Bag was an early Hogan red leather made by Burton

[Blade Junkie]

Love the evocatively named "weedeater" ... It's going to get a bit hungry out in the desert though well done on the birdie with it first up!

What did the irons play like ?

[teevons]

I really liked the feel of the irons but shafts were not for me, they were definitley regular and pretty thin leather grips. After a few holes I just aimed right and swung easy and let the ball draw in. I have a couple sets of these heads already pulled so can't wait to try them with better shafts.
Heads are real similar to what Hogan played in the late 40's and early 50's when he won at Merion and the slam in 53.

[Blade Junkie]

[quote name='teevons' timestamp='1409890307' post='10068051']
I really liked the feel of the irons but shafts were not for me, they were definitley regular and pretty thin leather grips. After a few holes I just aimed right and swung easy and let the ball draw in. I have a couple sets of these heads already pulled so can't wait to try them with better shafts.
Heads are real similar to what Hogan played in the late 40's and early 50's when he won at Merion and the slam in 53.
[/quote]

Yes they look nice.

There is a similar set (Parmakers) for sale on UK eBay right now (at a premium price, but supposedly some good provenance)

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Ben-hogan-own-irons-/111453736166?pt=UK_SportsLeisure_Golf_GolfClubs_JN&hash=item19f3290ce6


Same seller has some nice Seve stuff as well:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Seve-Ballesteros-owned-clubs-and-gifts-/111453728995?pt=UK_Sports_Memorabilia_ET&hash=item19f328f0e3

[MoaningM]

[quote name='Blade Junkie' timestamp='1409924805' post='10069483']
[quote name='teevons' timestamp='1409890307' post='10068051']
I really liked the feel of the irons but shafts were not for me, they were definitley regular and pretty thin leather grips. After a few holes I just aimed right and swung easy and let the ball draw in. I have a couple sets of these heads already pulled so can't wait to try them with better shafts.
Heads are real similar to what Hogan played in the late 40's and early 50's when he won at Merion and the slam in 53.
[/quote]

Yes they look nice.

There is a similar set (Parmakers) for sale on UK eBay right now (at a premium price, but supposedly some good provenance)

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Ben-hogan-own-irons-/111453736166?pt=UK_SportsLeisure_Golf_GolfClubs_JN&amp;hash=item19f3290ce6


Same seller has some nice Seve stuff as well:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Seve-Ballesteros-owned-clubs-and-gifts-/111453728995?pt=UK_Sports_Memorabilia_ET&amp;hash=item19f328f0e3
[/quote]

Interesting, he doesnt go into too much detail as to how he knows both hogan and seve. If true he. Must either be someone recognisable who played on tour or who worked for the tour.

[teevons]

Sounds like an older man, probably not too quick on the computer, pictures are pretty bad. You UK area guys need to find out where he lives and help him downsize his 150 sets of irons!!
I wonder if the Seve irons are the Dunlop set that were designed by Tad . Tad said he made him 10 sets, I am sure Seve gave away most to friends before he passed.

[birly-shirly]

[quote name='Blade Junkie' timestamp='1409924805' post='10069483']
[quote name='teevons' timestamp='1409890307' post='10068051']
I really liked the feel of the irons but shafts were not for me, they were definitley regular and pretty thin leather grips. After a few holes I just aimed right and swung easy and let the ball draw in. I have a couple sets of these heads already pulled so can't wait to try them with better shafts.
Heads are real similar to what Hogan played in the late 40's and early 50's when he won at Merion and the slam in 53.
[/quote]

Yes they look nice.

There is a similar set (Parmakers) for sale on UK eBay right now (at a premium price, but supposedly some good provenance)

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Ben-hogan-own-irons-/111453736166?pt=UK_SportsLeisure_Golf_GolfClubs_JN&amp;hash=item19f3290ce6


Same seller has some nice Seve stuff as well:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Seve-Ballesteros-owned-clubs-and-gifts-/111453728995?pt=UK_Sports_Memorabilia_ET&amp;hash=item19f328f0e3
[/quote]

I'd have quite a few questions I'd want to ask about a set of macgregor irons said to have been sent out by hogan in the 70s.

[teevons]

[quote name='birly-shirly' timestamp='1409939063' post='10070951']
[quote name='Blade Junkie' timestamp='1409924805' post='10069483']
[quote name='teevons' timestamp='1409890307' post='10068051']
I really liked the feel of the irons but shafts were not for me, they were definitley regular and pretty thin leather grips. After a few holes I just aimed right and swung easy and let the ball draw in. I have a couple sets of these heads already pulled so can't wait to try them with better shafts.
Heads are real similar to what Hogan played in the late 40's and early 50's when he won at Merion and the slam in 53.
[/quote]

Yes they look nice.

There is a similar set (Parmakers) for sale on UK eBay right now (at a premium price, but supposedly some good provenance)

[url="http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Ben-hogan-own-irons-/111453736166?pt=UK_SportsLeisure_Golf_GolfClubs_JN&amp;hash=item19f3290ce6"]http://www.ebay.co.u...=item19f3290ce6[/url]


Same seller has some nice Seve stuff as well:

[url="http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Seve-Ballesteros-owned-clubs-and-gifts-/111453728995?pt=UK_Sports_Memorabilia_ET&amp;hash=item19f328f0e3"]http://www.ebay.co.u...=item19f328f0e3[/url]
[/quote]

I'd have quite a few questions I'd want to ask about a set of macgregor irons said to have been sent out by hogan in the 70s.
[/quote]Ditto

[CanadianCrippler]

Well you all got me going with playing a vintage set. Have not done that in a while! Went out Sunday, shot 44. My bag was all Toney Penna! Started with a TP Special Edition driver, matched up with my 3 & 4 woods with aluminum inserts, TP 201 Irons (3 - PW, no Six) and my Penna wood head putter (limited edition from Firestone). I had to use my Hogan bag, as I don't have a Penna one..

They all played quite well. Lost some strokes with the fairway woods, just no knowing the carry capability of them and dropped a couple balls in the trash coming up short. The putter was very neat, never thought that a wood putter would feel and putt the ball like it did. Took a while to get the feel for weight of the club and how to roll the rock with it.

All in all, it was a good time, wonderful to feel the feel of ball on Persimmon as always and to a certain degree feel that throwback feeling of a more pure game of golf.

Looking forward to the next time!


CC