Country Club Gift Certificates....and the law

[eagles1]

In March 2013, my buddy presented my with a gift certificate good for a round of golf at his country club (private). He paid what a normal guest fee rate would be for the certificate. On the bottom of the certificate, there is an expiration date of 12/31/13. As you can guess, I did not have an opportunity to utilize the certificate.

 

ASSUMING the country club refuses to honor the certificate in 2014 based upon the expiration date, am I covered under both federal and state law (assume my state law mirrors the federal law) which provide for consumer protections against "early expiration dates" for unused gift certificates/cards? For sake of argument, I plan to use the certificate within 24 months from date of issuance.

 

Thanks.

[dennis4190]

Google is your friend, different laws for different states

[eagles1]

[quote name='dennis4190' timestamp='1388430819' post='8368595']
Google is your friend, different laws for different states
[/quote]

Once again (as bolded in my OP), assume my state law mirrors federal law. They are the same.

My sense would be I am protected based upon my review of the federal law, but for all who practice law know, it's not the law that's important, it's the exceptions to the law.

[diabolo]

[quote name='eagles1' timestamp='1388430186' post='8368549']
In March 2013, my buddy presented my with a gift certificate good for a round of golf at his country club (private). He paid what a normal guest fee rate would be for the certificate. On the bottom of the certificate, there is an expiration date of 12/31/13. As you can guess, I did not have an opportunity to utilize the certificate.

ASSUMING the country club refuses to honor the certificate in 2014 based upon the expiration date, am I covered under both federal and state law ([b]assume my state law mirrors the federal law[/b]) which provide for consumer protections against "early expiration dates" for unused gift certificates/cards? For sake of argument, I plan to use the certificate within 24 months from date of issuance.

Thanks.
[/quote]

Why not call the club and see what they have to say about it? most places will work something out (as long as you have the right attitude when discussing the issue).

[MiniJ83]

[quote name='diabolo' timestamp='1388432430' post='8368753']
[quote name='eagles1' timestamp='1388430186' post='8368549']
In March 2013, my buddy presented my with a gift certificate good for a round of golf at his country club (private). He paid what a normal guest fee rate would be for the certificate. On the bottom of the certificate, there is an expiration date of 12/31/13. As you can guess, I did not have an opportunity to utilize the certificate.

ASSUMING the country club refuses to honor the certificate in 2014 based upon the expiration date, am I covered under both federal and state law ([b]assume my state law mirrors the federal law[/b]) which provide for consumer protections against "early expiration dates" for unused gift certificates/cards? For sake of argument, I plan to use the certificate within 24 months from date of issuance.

Thanks.
[/quote]

Why not call the club and see what they have to say about it? most places will work something out (as long as you have the right attitude when discussing the issue).
[/quote]

Agreed. A positive attitude and a smile goes a long way.

[ClarkGrswld4]

are you for real? first of all, why didn't you just use it this year? you had 9 months to do so. Secondly, you are considering legal action if they don't honor it?

[SHIVAN]

What is the value? Are you considering legal action if they do not honor it? Seriously?

[DixieMafia]

Make sure you toss in your buddies name when you call them threatening to sue….so he'll look like a tool to.

[Pert1862]

[quote name='diabolo' timestamp='1388432430' post='8368753']
[quote name='eagles1' timestamp='1388430186' post='8368549']
In March 2013, my buddy presented my with a gift certificate good for a round of golf at his country club (private). He paid what a normal guest fee rate would be for the certificate. On the bottom of the certificate, there is an expiration date of 12/31/13. As you can guess, I did not have an opportunity to utilize the certificate.

ASSUMING the country club refuses to honor the certificate in 2014 based upon the expiration date, am I covered under both federal and state law ([b]assume my state law mirrors the federal law[/b]) which provide for consumer protections against "early expiration dates" for unused gift certificates/cards? For sake of argument, I plan to use the certificate within 24 months from date of issuance.

Thanks.
[/quote]

Why not call the club and see what they have to say about it? most places will work something out (as long as you have the right attitude when discussing the issue).
[/quote]

+1 here. Had the same thing happen to me and I called the proshop. I explained the situation and the guy on the phone said without hesitation no problem when you wanna play? Kill um with kindness my friend.

Also can you name the club?

[SHIVAN]

[quote name='DixieMafia' timestamp='1388434003' post='8368887']
Make sure you toss in your buddies name when you call them threatening to sue….so he'll look like a tool to.
[/quote]

I bet the cert references the member already. Should be epic....

[eagles1]

WOW!

Didn't expect the flame. No one is suing anyone. I was just curious about the law and how/if it applied to purchased golf certificates at a private country club.

Sorry if I offended.

[poppyhillsguy]

Better call Saul.

[Carolina Golfer 2]

I wouldn't call it a flame, but I think most would think a certificate has an expiration date for a reason, and that under most circumstances a reasonable approach to the issuing company is the right way to go.

I would have never thought of considering legal action. But you mind find this link more helpful than this thread.

[url="http://chat.lawinfo.com/forum.php"]http://chat.lawinfo.com/forum.php[/url]

[ckay]

People are funny. You're on a golf forum asking for legal when all you have to do is call the club and ask them if they will honor it. You are making a bigger deal out of this than you have to.

[mwkbmw]

Your buddy is probably ticked that you didn't appreciate his gift enough to use it.

[DixieMafia]

There's probably a reason your buddy gave you a gift certificate as opposed to another invite with him…Jus Sayn

[martinbns]

The expiry date is probably there for tax reasons. 12/31/13 is probably the courses year end, if they allow the certificates to stay open forever, they would have to keep track of them and report them as a liability.

Call the course, they will probably be quite reasonable.

[Socrates]

It's a private club, I don't think that they would have to honor anything if they chose not to. It's not like you bought a gift card at Target. The member bought it with the expectation you would use it in the same year and the club sold it to him with that understanding. If it is a really private club, you may want your friend to enquire as it may be not your place to do so (I assume you would have had to play with him). If they say no, it should end there.

[Hawkeye77]

[quote name='eagles1' timestamp='1388431811' post='8368697']
[quote name='dennis4190' timestamp='1388430819' post='8368595']
Google is your friend, different laws for different states
[/quote]

Once again (as bolded in my OP), assume my state law mirrors federal law. They are the same.

My sense would be I am protected based upon my review of the federal law, but for all who practice law know, it's not the law that's important, it's the exceptions to the law.
[/quote]

What review have you made? What definitions are you relying on?

This card isn't marketed to the general public, and my money is on you being out to lunch legally.

If you haven't asked the club I still don't get the point of this thread. If the club says no, not a lot you will be able to do.

There is a forum for these questions, I think most of the discussions go like this one.

Have your buddy ask you back, he can probably arrange to have it honored.

[eagles1]

So anyway....

I am an attorney by profession. Defense side. I have seen my share of lawsuits with frivolous claims and unfortunately had to defend them nonetheless. The last resort of any dispute should be litigation. While many have jumped to the assumption that litigation was my intent, I can assure you that it is not.

I posted the question on this forum because I saw a report about it a few days ago on the news in context with Christmas and the explosion of gifting certificates. They spoke about how the major retailers in the past used to accept payment in exchange for gift certificates while putting expiration dates on them, sometimes aggregrioulsy short. People complained. The store got their money for selling the gift certificate, then were denying the recipient from redeeming it. Congress got involved, enacting legislation which put restraints on the restricted time frames retailers can utilize for certificate redemption.

It got me thinking about my certificate and didn't know if the same protections were afforded. I erroneously thought this forum would have been a good place to pose the question. Yes I realize this is "General Forum" and the question posed is legal in nature, but I thought maybe someone might have the answer. I also erroneously thought that if they didn't know the answer, they would simply move on to another topic. I really didn't expect the barrage.

I am friendly with Pro Shop staff and I am sure they will be more than accommodating to me using my certificate in 2014. My post was more informational based. The law described above is used broadly in the retail sector. I didn't know if applied to private golf clubs. If I were told that the law DOES apply, I'd be more prone to provide that information to the Pro Shop for their future planning. The information would be used as a shield, not a sword.

Maybe in 2014, we can all focus more on replying to questions posed. If you can't add anything of value, it would be a bit more civil to just move on to the next topic versus replying with baseless assumptions and insults.

Cheers

[TJCDAS]

I would say if you have enough time to setup a thread and debate the issue there is enough time run down to the shop in the next day and a half.

[url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wwUxhbIxtcc"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wwUxhbIxtcc[/url]


PS: Gift Certificate $50, round of golf $100, attorneys asking for legal help on GolfWrx is priceless.

[xxio]

You are an attorney asking for legal advice on a golf forum?

I hope your practice is going well.

[eagles1]

Hawkeye77

Good point regarding the "public" marketing aspect. Perhaps that makes a difference.

Thank you.

[MtlJeff]

i think "country club gift certificates.....and da law" was an Ali G episode at one point. If it wasn't it should have been

I don't see the point really. If they refuse to honor it and you fight them all you are going to do is make trouble for your friend. As others have said i'd have the friend work it out with the club, i'm sure they'll be reasonable

[Pert1862]

[quote name='xxio' timestamp='1388447745' post='8370243']
You are an attorney asking for legal advice on a golf forum?

I hope your practice is going well.
[/quote]

You beat me to it with this one.

[ddot]

The club I belong to allows members to buy guest passes in January at reduced rates. They expire at year end. I've not heard of anyone being able to use them the following year. My guess is it's a bookkeeping issue as mentioned earlier.

[Graymulligan]

I think you're applying the law for one thing (gift cards) for another. A gift card cannot lose value if it isn't used. A dated certificate entitling you to a service before a reasonable date can be refused after that date, at least in NY.

IIRC, the reason that the "gift card laws" were put into play was because retailers were charging fees if they weren't used after a certain point. Because the gift card is in essence cash, just cash that can only be spent in one place, the fees were deemed illegal.

In the case of a gift certificate,, the cash wasn't exchanged for the ability to make future purchases, it was exchanged for an item/service, in this case a round of golf, and that certificate had a use by date. While the pro shop will likely work with you, I don't think it would be illegal for them not to.

[eagles1]

[quote name='xxio' timestamp='1388447745' post='8370243']
You are an attorney asking for legal advice on a golf forum?

I hope your practice is going well.
[/quote]

No. What I was actually doing was presenting what I though might be an interesting post for discussion on a golf related issue which has unfortunately turned into an epic fail. So sorry you were inconvenienced enough to post your sarcastic remark.

[eagles1]

[quote name='Graymulligan' timestamp='1388449306' post='8370385']
I think you're applying the law for one thing (gift cards) for another. A gift card cannot lose value if it isn't used. A dated certificate entitling you to a service before a reasonable date can be refused after that date, at least in NY.

IIRC, the reason that the "gift card laws" were put into play was because retailers were charging fees if they weren't used after a certain point. Because the gift card is in essence cash, just cash that can only be spent in one place, the fees were deemed illegal.

In the case of a gift certificate,, the cash wasn't exchanged for the ability to make future purchases, it was exchanged for an item/service, in this case a round of golf, and that certificate had a use by date. While the pro shop will likely work with you, I don't think it would be illegal for them not to.
[/quote]

Makes perfect sense.

Thank you.

[Hawkeye77]

[quote name='eagles1' timestamp='1388447825' post='8370253']
Hawkeye77

Good point regarding the "public" marketing aspect. Perhaps that makes a difference.

Thank you.
[/quote]

Actually, the whole gift card vs. gift certificate question is interesting, and it appears there is quite a variety in state laws. Maybe the full disclosure at the beginning of the thread would have avoided some of the unintended results. Sometimes starting a thread is like cliff diving without knowing for sure how deep the water is.